Free Iced Coffee and Tea in Center Camp Camp!

solaritea
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Free Iced Coffee and Tea in Center Camp Camp!

Post by solaritea » Thu Nov 08, 2007 6:21 pm

As I make plans for 2008, I thought I’d discuss my plans and see what kind of feedback I get. It seems that this subject generates strong feelings from a lot of people.

In 2001, I had a few extra suitcases of water at the end of the week, and rather than taking them home I threw a handful of teabags in each, brewed them up in the sun, added ice and headed off to center camp to give it away. I had no cups and this was before the big push to encourage people to carry their own cup, so I mostly just poured the tea directly into people’s mouths. It went over so well that the next year I brought a 5 gallon water cooler and stepped things up. In 2006 I got a partner and we added iced coffee to the menu, which has been very popular. Now, I don’t really have strong feelings about coffee sales in center camp. I wasn’t doing this as some kind of protest or in a futile attempt to shut them down. I was just having a good time and everyone seemed to enjoy it.

In 2007, things were going well in the beginning of the week. 15-20 gallons each of iced coffee and tea had been given out so far and on Friday we brought down the last 5 gallons of each to finish up. Shortly into the service, a woman walked up and cheerfully said, “Hi!â€

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BitterDan
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Post by BitterDan » Thu Nov 08, 2007 7:47 pm

Don't do it to spite the coffee folks in center camp. That person was only doing what she thought was best (considering that she was right about the health permit thing). On top of that, the proceeds from the coffee are not just going into someone's pocket; They are going to charity (namely Gerlach schools).

I mean, do you really want to come to burning man to give people a hard time?
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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:14 pm

Ice sales go to charity. Coffee sales go to the cost of the center camp tent and the cafe.

The OP might want to talk to Chai Guy. As far as I remember the Free Chai Revolution is every Friday at noon.

And I think if he actually did it in the tent, he'd get evicted.
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Post by Toolmaker » Fri Nov 09, 2007 8:12 am

This is a great idea. Except for a few things.

As I understand it you DO need a permit, but this is not expensive compared to the cost of tea. You CANNOT setup inside Center Camp. BUT you can set up shop anywhere else. ED had a really nice location in 07 for his espresso. Many bar camps give up the booze all week long. Good luck with your camp in 08.
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Teo del Fuego
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Post by Teo del Fuego » Fri Nov 09, 2007 8:41 am

sounds like a cool idea to me, just don't do it in or around Center Camp Tent. Conforntation with Center Camp is not necessary to pulling off your great idea.

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Post by lurker » Fri Nov 09, 2007 10:14 am

I would do Covert Coffee Camp and have people dressed like spies with concealed camelbacks of iced coffee, tea, and chai wander around center camp handing out drinks to people who look like they're about to buy a drink.

People hand out food and drink all over BRC without permits.
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Dork
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Post by Dork » Fri Nov 09, 2007 10:38 am

Toolmaker wrote:You CANNOT setup inside Center Camp. BUT you can set up shop anywhere else.
Why not? Are there actual rules about what you can and cannot do inside center camp (other than drive or bring bikes inside) or is it a matter of ettiquitte?

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Post by Toolmaker » Sat Nov 10, 2007 5:42 am

Dork wrote:
Toolmaker wrote:You CANNOT setup inside Center Camp. BUT you can set up shop anywhere else.
Why not? Are there actual rules about what you can and cannot do inside center camp (other than drive or bring bikes inside) or is it a matter of ettiquitte?
Center Camp is one of the big money makers for the ORG. You can get evicted from the entire event for trying to pull certain stunts. I don't know if there are any rules in print, rather they are a fluid set of rules dictated by the Commerce Coffee Camp Cronies.

Other things that may get you in trouble in center camp..

Setting the camp on fire (someone tried this with the pavilion and found out that laws do apply on the playa)

Public masturbation (sometimes acceptable if done by females)

Public ejaculation (very bad since its MOOP)

Public sexual intercourse (this has a 50 / 50 as some folks get away with it)

Setting up your camp inside (a place for homeless campers to try and camp in 2008)

Flamethrowers (roasting the hippes is fun to talk about but not cool to try and do)

Sales of homemade jewlery (with the right bribe jewlery and art sales are often overlooked)

I think as long as your commerce via bribe or gifting doesnt have to do with beverages they leave ya be. The OPs story is not the first time I have heard of someone gettin tossed for giving away drink to offset the commerce at burningman. Don't get me wrong.. I would love nothing better than to hear about an army of folks with 3 liter camelbaks dispensing drinks for free, esp. chai or earl grey. I am also sure I missed some of the things that you can't do in Commerce Camp. I also left out some commerce that is OK at BM because it is done outside of Center Camp.

If anyone finds an actual set of rules please share them.. I couldn't find anything in print other than this:
http://www.burningman.com/participate/cafe.html
http://www.burningman.com/participate/schedguide.html
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solaritea
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Post by solaritea » Sat Nov 10, 2007 9:52 am

Confrontation with Center camp staff is not necessary for my idea, doing this in Center Camp is an integral part of the idea. Afterall, it's called Free Iced Coffee and Tea in Center Camp Camp! There are plenty of places to go for free coffee and tea already. I have no interest in being another neighborhood coffee camp.

The advantage of doing this in center camp is that I can serve the maximum number of people in a minimum amount of time. Why go somewhere and hope the people that want some coffee/tea will come to me, when I can go to them? And the Camelback idea is unworkable for me. There are only two people involved in this and I have no interest in trying to raise an army. I'm trying to improve my original idea each year and while 3L Camelbacks is a step up from the original incarnation, it's a couple steps back from 5 gallon coolers.

50 gallons is only about 500 servings. If all 500 of those people were otherwise going to buy something and don't, the Center Camp Cafe stands to lose $1500. Not much.

Unless I see an official rule that this is not allowed, I plan to go through with this. Last year I wasn't told that I cannot serve beverages in Center Camp. I was told that I couldn't serve in Center Camp without a permit.

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Post by Rat Bastard » Mon Dec 17, 2007 6:20 am

First off is a permit really needed for beverage? I don't think bars have food permits. Worth a check.

You most likely could setup just outside of the center tent. In '06 some friends in my camp had a tiki car serving sno-cones. They we allowed to park right out side Artica a couple different days. They went through 5000 cones!

Now they don't sell sno-cones in centercamp so maybe the powers that be didn't see any loss in profit. However they do sell coffee and tea. And they know that they are the only shop out of many that actually charges for it. Ya, great fundraiser but... what happened to the proliferation of our "gifting" society?

I like your idea and I strongly suggest you take your questions to the top and find out what is ok. Word it like your gonna set a record or something other then giving out free coffee infront of Starfucks. I'd hate to see your efforts get you in trouble. Find out who the director of CC is. I'm sure the person who said they were the "manager" was only a 2 or 4 hour volunteer that hadn't gotten their head out of the default world yet and felt threatened in their "business". Had they actually been a volunteer with enough experience to be a "manager" I'm sure they would have a lot more tact then "Hi, bye.".

Heck, do it outside of Center Camp and make a trail of signs. Put signs everywhere around and in centercamp. Then park your butt at the statues in front of it and have at it. Then tell everyone you serve to say "the free coffee tasted better" when they go buy some the next day. (ok, I know I'm a smartass)

There's lots of gifting that goes on in CC. I don't see why you would be any different unless CC is now a business and plans to crush the competition. Nah, that wouldn't be burner-like!
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Post by MikeVDS » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:24 pm

I mean, do you really want to come to burning man to give people a hard time?
Yes. :twisted:
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Post by theCryptofishist » Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:17 pm

MikeVDS wrote:
I mean, do you really want to come to burning man to give people a hard time?
Yes. :twisted:
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Post by MikeVDS » Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:36 am

Bullhorn? Those are too quiet. Train horn or air-raid sirens are the way to go.
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:00 pm

I hear that there is free beer on the playa right now.

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Post by moshe! » Wed Feb 13, 2008 2:40 pm

Toolmaker wrote:
Dork wrote:
Toolmaker wrote:You CANNOT setup inside Center Camp. BUT you can set up shop anywhere else.
Why not? Are there actual rules about what you can and cannot do inside center camp (other than drive or bring bikes inside) or is it a matter of ettiquitte?
Center Camp is one of the big money makers for the ORG. You can get evicted from the entire event for trying to pull certain stunts. I don't know if there are any rules in print, rather they are a fluid set of rules dictated by the Commerce Coffee Camp Cronies.

Other things that may get you in trouble in center camp..

Setting the camp on fire (someone tried this with the pavilion and found out that laws do apply on the playa)

Public masturbation (sometimes acceptable if done by females)

Public ejaculation (very bad since its MOOP)

Public sexual intercourse (this has a 50 / 50 as some folks get away with it)

Setting up your camp inside (a place for homeless campers to try and camp in 2008)

Flamethrowers (roasting the hippes is fun to talk about but not cool to try and do)

Sales of homemade jewlery (with the right bribe jewlery and art sales are often overlooked)

I think as long as your commerce via bribe or gifting doesnt have to do with beverages they leave ya be. The OPs story is not the first time I have heard of someone gettin tossed for giving away drink to offset the commerce at burningman. Don't get me wrong.. I would love nothing better than to hear about an army of folks with 3 liter camelbaks dispensing drinks for free, esp. chai or earl grey. I am also sure I missed some of the things that you can't do in Commerce Camp. I also left out some commerce that is OK at BM because it is done outside of Center Camp.

If anyone finds an actual set of rules please share them.. I couldn't find anything in print other than this:
http://www.burningman.com/participate/cafe.html
http://www.burningman.com/participate/schedguide.html
No one is gonna get kicked out of the event for giving away iced tea at centercamp.

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Post by CLARKcon » Sun Feb 17, 2008 9:23 am

Hmmm...I usually bring a couple thermos's of coffee to Center Camp when I draw (for my personal use/share if folks like.) This last year had 3 stainless steel thermo's that gifted out each night and had camp name and location on them, or get recipients address to pick up to reload them. I never encited/announced that I was giving coffee away in C-Camp, but just gave to folks sitting nearby or would offer when conversing. It'd be interesting to see if you could get a permit, but I wonder how inviting the BMorg would be to having set-up under the tent...
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Post by Gravity Mike » Sun Feb 17, 2008 9:56 am

Rat Bastard wrote:First off is a permit really needed for beverage? I don't think bars have food permits. Worth a check.
My old camp applied for the county food permit several years back. There is a big difference between removing the cap of a beer and preparing food (mixed drinks being somewhere in between). We were juicing lemons, so it was the same a food prep in their eyes. We needed to have a prep sink right where we were juicing the lemons. We did not (no RVs, just dome campers), so we were shut down - but we can give away drinks to our 'friends' still, not 'strangers,' so we worked that loop hole with introductions (restaurant vs. having friends over for dinner).

I don't know what all of the requirements will be for sun tea. I can tell you this - if you apply, you're on their radar, they'll look for you and make sure you comply with the requirements, whatever they may be = little chance of not being noticed. If you're in center camp, I think there's little chance of that anyway, so if the Center Camp location is not negotiable in your vision, I would apply for the food/drink permit - and find out ahead of time what they want you to do. If you gave away drinks elsewhere, you can probably fly by un-officially (which is how I would do it).

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Post by lonestoner916 » Mon Mar 17, 2008 10:17 am

Rat Bastard wrote:First off is a permit really needed for beverage? I don't think bars have food permits. Worth a check.

You most likely could setup just outside of the center tent. In '06 some friends in my camp had a tiki car serving sno-cones. They we allowed to park right out side Artica a couple different days. They went through 5000 cones!

Now they don't sell sno-cones in centercamp so maybe the powers that be didn't see any loss in profit. However they do sell coffee and tea. And they know that they are the only shop out of many that actually charges for it. Ya, great fundraiser but... what happened to the proliferation of our "gifting" society?

I like your idea and I strongly suggest you take your questions to the top and find out what is ok. Word it like your gonna set a record or something other then giving out free coffee infront of Starfucks. I'd hate to see your efforts get you in trouble. Find out who the director of CC is. I'm sure the person who said they were the "manager" was only a 2 or 4 hour volunteer that hadn't gotten their head out of the default world yet and felt threatened in their "business". Had they actually been a volunteer with enough experience to be a "manager" I'm sure they would have a lot more tact then "Hi, bye.".

Heck, do it outside of Center Camp and make a trail of signs. Put signs everywhere around and in centercamp. Then park your butt at the statues in front of it and have at it. Then tell everyone you serve to say "the free coffee tasted better" when they go buy some the next day. (ok, I know I'm a smartass)

There's lots of gifting that goes on in CC. I don't see why you would be any different unless CC is now a business and plans to crush the competition. Nah, that wouldn't be burner-like!



I agree with the Rat Bastard on this one, you should do it no matter what you have to do. A permit will be required and it doesn't have to be hostile, a lot of people don't have hard currency on the Playa, last year I had about thirty bucks in cash when I arrived and most went to ice I only made three "starfucks" runs the whole week. Or like RB said pitch it to the Borg like it's an event, to try and give away as much free coffee and tea as you can in the shortest amount of time. If we all spread the word properly the cafe would be overrun and those people not wanting to wait in the long free line would inevitably just buy their beverage from the cafe, shit in the long run it might earn them MORE money, it could drum up business during a slow afternoon. I'm working a shift or two at the cafe this year and if I see you I promise to look the other way like little miss "Hi and Bye" should have done! 8)
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Post by neccessity » Tue Mar 25, 2008 11:15 pm

I'm dying to see how this turns out! I agree with the masses thus far in that I see no reason you "can't" do it, but several reasons you "shouldn't"

I'd really like to know how the "fluid set of rules" Toolmaker referenced is applied because that sounds a lot like "what we don't like we have a rule against at the time that we don't like it"." But unless someone can produce evidence of an offense - IN ADVANCE - I'm totally behind this idea! In fact, if it turns out that the camelbak army is your best option, I'm enlisting!

If it's not illegal (check), not on your ticket (check), and not supported by any actual, enforcable rules (question mark), then.... go!
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Re: Free Iced Coffee and Tea in Center Camp Camp!

Post by thirt33n » Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:36 am

solaritea wrote:Should be fun!
hello solaritea

My name is Crux.
I'm going to comment on your idea having not read any of the responses yet. I'm very looking forward to reading them after my response.

If this is your idea of radical self expression I feel sorry for you.

To me you are flies in a horses eye in the horse pasture on a horse farm. You may be able to rationalize being there but you're basically still just a pain in the ass.

Why don't you just make your own coffee/tea for free spot to give it away?

Go out to the playa and set it up,...why make waves and take part in creating ANY bad vibes?

...I guess that's you though huh?

Whatever.... :roll:
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thirt33n
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Post by thirt33n » Wed Mar 26, 2008 2:01 am

...i love Black Rock City.
I actually love all of you anti-establishment fucks.
Even though I can't stand you anti-establishment fucks.

We're SO different.

I am the kind of person who would not dare bring food or drink into another food or drink establishment. (no sitting down at a restaurant with a slice of pizza. yes walk through center camp with my own drink. stand outside of coldstone giving out baskin robbins?? duh?) To me it's just wrong. I'm talking in the default world OR center camp. You are in essence STEALING from someone and to rationalize that the ORG is ripping you off through some other avenue eg. ticket prices or whatever is so tired and,....oh, like, my god, OK?


so,...gimmie some fuckin' free coffee and I'll, like, shut up OK? :evil:
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Re: Free Iced Coffee and Tea in Center Camp Camp!

Post by Teo del Fuego » Wed Mar 26, 2008 8:25 am

thirt33n wrote:To me you are flies in a horses eye in the horse pasture on a horse farm. You may be able to rationalize being there but you're basically still just a pain in the ass.why make waves and take part in creating ANY bad vibes?
but making bad vibes on the ePlaya, that's A-okay? :?:

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thirt33n
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Re: Free Iced Coffee and Tea in Center Camp Camp!

Post by thirt33n » Wed Mar 26, 2008 11:13 am

Teo del Fuego wrote:
thirt33n wrote:To me you are flies in a horses eye in the horse pasture on a horse farm. You may be able to rationalize being there but you're basically still just a pain in the ass.why make waves and take part in creating ANY bad vibes?
but making bad vibes on the ePlaya, that's A-okay? :?:

I think if you preface stuff with I love you all
And finish up with, like, valley girl speak then it means, like, everything should be A-ok.

I would greet anyone here with a hug even if I thought they were a nug.

I'm just one who doesn't feel the need to "stick it to the man" and i generally find those kind of people annoying....they probably find me annoying too and that's OK.



...apologies if i've offended anyone here.




:?
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Post by Teo del Fuego » Wed Mar 26, 2008 12:03 pm

Ahh, Thirt33n, Im just an old fart from the South and Im hardly offended, just not used to the rough handling we give each other here on ePlaya.

But, I do agree with you about the merits of your post. I think I posted in this thread earlier questioning the need to alway "stick it to the man." Seems a gift without a political agenda would be more worthy gifting.

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Post by thirt33n » Wed Mar 26, 2008 12:13 pm

Teo del Fuego wrote:Ahh, Thirt33n, Im just an old fart from the South and Im hardly offended, just not used to the rough handling we give each other here on ePlaya.
old fart north and south unite!
is 37 old?? next week that's me.

I actually figured i didn't offend you but maybe solaritea...you're a pretty level, informative and kind feller here on eplaya. i tend to fall somewhere in between you and jewboy or sensei or one of the other sarcastic yet piss and vinegar filled eplaya family members. Just wait till i come home wasted drunk and go on an eplaya tear.

it all comes down to opinionated LOVE for me,...in the burningman world

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Post by Teo del Fuego » Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:16 pm

37 is YOUNG, 45 is OLD! :)

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Post by thirt33n » Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:23 pm

Teo del Fuego wrote:37 is YOUNG, 45 is OLD! :)


phew. good. :lol:
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Post by ibdave » Wed Mar 26, 2008 4:21 pm

50 is the new 25....... 8) 8) 8)
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Post by lonestoner916 » Wed Mar 26, 2008 7:23 pm

:P

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That's fucking cool! 8)
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Post by pinemom » Thu Mar 27, 2008 7:44 am

ibdave wrote:50 is the new 25....... 8) 8) 8)


WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!
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