2009 placement

[Token]

I'm going to venture a wild ass guess that the average themecamp headcount is 30. With 130 camps rejected, the BMORG just managed to piss off 10% of the population, maybe more.

You should all organize like Borg2 did and pull of a coordinated stunt.

Maybe line all the reject camps into a district on L street right at walk-in camping and call it the Esplanade 2.

[H.G.Crosby]

be prepared philistines, for we are coming, and we will take only the really cute prisoners, prisoners.


NERDS RULE, DEAL WITH IT YOU MONKEYS!


now shut the fuck up, and go suck on a banana, we have important work to do, like scaring the living crap out of hippies.


i enjoy what i do way too much.

[Simon of the Playa]

midianites, like locusts upon locusts, shall feel the mighty wrath of the DDT from G-D.

the exterminators are suiting up, and sniffing some serious bug powder.


be afraid, be very afraid.


there is nothing more dangerous than a bunch of dorks on acid with a score to settle.


oh yeah, we want the hotties, we want ALL OF THE HOTTIES!!!


this is our year frat boys, take that fucking baseball cap off and show some motherfucking respect.


























or be doomed.

[Sensei]

Maybe line all the reject camps into a district on L street right at walk-in camping and call it the Esplanade 2.

As an 8 year resident of the outer road / next to walk-in area, a most excellent suggestion, I must say.

Then maybe our 'hood wouldn't look exactly like a fucking Walmart parking lot.

[flashingjanet]

I like the idea of a reject camp district, or for those of us in scattered locations we could post matching signs: "WARNING - THIS AREA NOT DEEMED THEME-CAMP WORTHY BY THE PLAYA PLACEMENT COMMITTEE - ENTER AT OWN RISK"

[Token]

Grab the two blocks on each side of the entry road and L, call it Reject Village on the Assplanade. Everyone arriving or leaving will have to go through.

[oneeyeddick]

That's a great idea Token.
Right when people are coming in after going through both gates is the
perfect opportunity for highly interactive roadblocks and interrogations.
Everybody would love that.

I know I would.

[theCryptofishist]

I'm in one of the rejected camps, and I think the placement team has a lot of explaining to do to justify this jump in the number of rejects.

Oh dear. I'm afraid you are attending the wrong event. The LLC doesn't owe anyone an explanation ever. I have no idea why you think otherwise.

[Ugly Dougly]

Your theme isn't rejected, it's just your location that is rejected.
You can have your "theme" anywhere, same as it ever was.

[retropsycho]

I'm in one of the rejected camps, and I think the placement team has a lot of explaining to do to justify this jump in the number of rejects.

Oh dear. I'm afraid you are attending the wrong event. The LLC doesn't owe anyone an explanation ever. I have no idea why you think otherwise.

So, if I don't like the explanations given, I guess I'll just say they never were offered?

A summary of the notification to unplaced camps:

In 2008, Black Rock City was approximately 39,300,000 square feet. This year it's 37,500,000 square feet. A loss of approx 1,800,000 square feet. This greatly affected the amount of space available for registered theme camps and villages, as we did not change our ratios of reserved area to open area.

The city footprint in 2009 is pretty much the same as 2007. So for a visual you can download the comparison of 2007 vs 2008. http://www.burningman.com/whatisburning ... c_map.html
The lack of space means in addition to the camps that did not meet the criteria here: http://www.burningman.com/themecamps/th ... teria.html, there wasn't enough space for camps that did meet the criteria.

[The Drifter]

Although I personally think all contributions should be placed I have to play devil's advocate here. Last year there was a big outcry from Burners (apparently via the exit poll) that the event had gotten too large geographically. Burning Man reacted to this outcry by making it smaller. This is inevitably going to affect some of the larger space-consuming camps especially if their plan is interpreted by the reader as somewhat ambiguous or lacking.

Again I would rather see limitless space for all creative projects. But as the old cliché goes "you can't have your cake and eat it too." Hopefully we can work together as Burners and find a way to give our fellow contributers the space they need.

[Ugly Dougly]

I'm going to venture a wild ass guess that the average themecamp headcount is 30.

Wow, we only got 5-7 depending on how you count em.

[The Drifter]

I'm going to venture a wild ass guess that the average themecamp headcount is 30.

Wow, we only got 5-7 depending on how you count em.

No kidding. We're at five confirmed with an additional four possible. I really wouldn't want it much larger than that. Knowing how wishy-washy some burners can be as far as active participation it's hard to imagine some of the larger projects working. Organizing a hundred person camp would be a friggin nightmare. I'm sure that's a consideration for the placement team as well. The last thing you'd want to do is dedicate a large section of theme camp space to a camp that may not materialize as advertised.

[flashingjanet]

I understand the reasons why some theme camp proposals would be rejected on merit, and I'm not trying to say that everything should be accepted.

The question I'm asking the placement team (in a personal letter as well as here) is this: if there were so many worthy applicants, and they were facing a 10-fold increase in rejections, why they would choose to not increase the space allocated to theme camps to come closer to meeting the demand? Or, at the very least, it seems like they could have offered some of us a compromise of early entry, but without placement (as if we were installing an art project, which we consider our camp to be - we just apparently applied in the wrong category, and we won't be making that mistake again).

Yes, we know that nothing is guaranteed, and we will roll with the punches. But the magnitude of some installations requires that a lot of our design and construction work has already been done by the time we find out if we have placement/ early access. Now we have to spend the next month figuring out how to cut back our plans for a shorter install phase, with half of it being left at home, and I imagine many other rejected camps are facing similar issues.

[The Drifter]

I understand the reasons why some theme camp proposals would be rejected on merit, and I'm not trying to say that everything should be accepted.

The question I'm asking the placement team (in a personal letter as well as here) is this: if there were so many worthy applicants, and they were facing a 10-fold increase in rejections, why they would choose to not increase the space allocated to theme camps to come closer to meeting the demand? Or, at the very least, it seems like they could have offered some of us a compromise of early entry, but without placement (as if we were installing an art project, which we consider our camp to be - we just apparently applied in the wrong category, and we won't be making that mistake again).

Yes, we know that nothing is guaranteed, and we will roll with the punches. But the magnitude of some installations requires that a lot of our design and construction work has already been done by the time we find out if we have placement/ early access. Now we have to spend the next month figuring out how to cut back our plans for a shorter install phase, with half of it being left at home, and I imagine many other rejected camps are facing similar issues.

It really is unfortunate to put in that level of money and creative energy and then not be able to share it as planned with the community. I think EVERY contribution should be encouraged and placed in a way that that allows the most relevant exposure. Hopefully the smaller size idea will be reconsidered next year.

[Prometheus]

I suspect that the primary criteria was the RATIO of public interaction space and activity to the gross size requested. They could have increased the reserved area to place all the camps, but that might let some "bedroom" camps in with more space than they could otherwise command. Also, if only 70% of a large camp shows, they would have some large expanses of empty or sparse occupancy in the theme camp areas.

That being said, they should think about having a "bedroom" camp category, so large groups could apply and be placed intelligently, just not in the theme camp area. The primary value - having pre-placement - would be achieved, without filling the theme camp area with vast wastelands of tents and campers. These areas could be located at less-traveled locations.

This would all make for an interesting community planning study.

[AntiM]

Bedroom camps? You mean villages like Hushville?

[StevenGoodman]

Camps that put one "chill space" dome out front, and then have 30 people and a couple of RVs in the back (walled off from the rest of the world).

martii Steve

[The Drifter]

Camps that put one "chill space" dome out front, and then have 30 people and a couple of RVs in the back (walled off from the rest of the world).

martii Steve

Indeed that's a bunch of garbage. It's contrary to the whole "radical inclusion" idea which is what makes Burning Man unique. If this is what the planners are trying to eliminate I completely support the effort.

[The Drifter]

I suspect that the primary criteria was the RATIO of public interaction space and activity to the gross size requested. They could have increased the reserved area to place all the camps, but that might let some "bedroom" camps in with more space than they could otherwise command. Also, if only 70% of a large camp shows, they would have some large expanses of empty or sparse occupancy in the theme camp areas.

That being said, they should think about having a "bedroom" camp category, so large groups could apply and be placed intelligently, just not in the theme camp area. The primary value - having pre-placement - would be achieved, without filling the theme camp area with vast wastelands of tents and campers. These areas could be located at less-traveled locations.

This would all make for an interesting community planning study.

It would be a better way to showcase art. It seems these days when travelling through supposed theme camps all you see is RVs and crap. The Black Rock Desert would be a much better work of art if they weren't there at all. People have taken advantage of the theme camp idea to give themselves a better spot, and this has resulted in little more than gated community suburbias on the playa.

If it were organized accommodate these camps the inactive art would seem more prevalent.

[oneeyeddick]

Amounts of RVs have nothing to do with camps being rejected, and neither do they have anything to do with a theme camp being less interactive, as has already been covered.

http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic.php?t=26827

sometimes a dome with 30 people behind it can be lame, sometimes it can be the greatest thing, it all depends on the people.

what would make a better Burning Man to you, if we all dressed up like Mad max and slept under the great wide open ?

[Prometheus]

Bedroom camps? You mean villages like Hushville?

Larger camps that appear to be blossoming bedroom communities that are simply adding space to accommodate more campers, but no more interactivity have become very difficult for us to place.

OK, so the term they used was bedroom "communities," but that paints an image of local stores, schools, commuter parking, playgrounds, and a church or two. You know, like the "intelligence community."

[Prometheus]

what would make a better Burning Man to you, if we all dressed up like Mad max and slept under the great wide open ?

Frack no! We should all sleep under our cars; that morning sun sucks.

BTW, RVs suck. Did that one year. Not the same experience. Never again.

[The Drifter]

Amounts of RVs have nothing to do with camps being rejected, and neither do they have anything to do with a theme camp being less interactive, as has already been covered.

http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic.php?t=26827

sometimes a dome with 30 people behind it can be lame, sometimes it can be the greatest thing, it all depends on the people.

what would make a better Burning Man to you, if we all dressed up like Mad max and slept under the great wide open ?

Ummm... Ya kind of lost me there partner. Mad Max sounds like fun though. Just like the good old days. Sigh.......

[oneeyeddick]

Look at your post above mine, that's what I responded to, now connect the dots.

If you are still lost then read the thread I provided you a link to , to ease your beforementioned hatred of RVs.

If, after all that, you are still lost, then I guess it is best if you stay lost.

Sorry if seem blunt, I just wasted my snark allotment for today over on Tribe.

[The Drifter]

Look at your post above mine, that's what I responded to, now connect the dots.

If you are still lost then read the thread I provided you a link to , to ease your beforementioned hatred of RVs.

If, after all that, you are still lost, then I guess it is best if you stay lost.

Sorry if seem blunt, I just wasted my snark allotment for today over on Tribe.

Iconoclast to your beloved RV's I am not. It is the exclusionary communities that I believe are detrimental to the event.

[oneeyeddick]

Krap..... I had to look up Iconoclast.

Thanks for the word challenge.

[The Drifter]

Krap..... I had to look up Iconoclast.

Thanks for the word challenge.

I like to throw around a lot of big words because I'm insecure about my own intelligence and education.

[ibdave]

I'll be arriving early (Thursday). For the highest bidder I'll secure your "Land" for you. I'll drive stakes every 20' and use Yellow Caution tape to keep everyone off until the highest bidder shows up. A $200.00 surcharge will start @6a.m Monday if you have not arrived by then. This surcharge will add $200.00 every 2 hours with no cap to how much is added onto the winning bid.

Please look up Land Grab on E-Bay for more details.

[Skye2kx]

They are making the 12:01am landgrab even worse (while simultaneously asking us to spread out our arrival times). And since we'll be spending Monday and Tuesday setting up the basic needs of our camp, we'll have a lot less time to install the decorative features we had planned. Net result: LESS ART.

Exactly.

Here's what we got back after responding to our rejection:

"I'm sorry to inform you that your camp WAS denied placement. We just ran out of space and many wonderful camps like yours did not get placed. It can still work out fine. You are listed on the website and you can post your address at Playa Info, once you arrive and select a spot. People will still find you!

Unfortunately, since you are not a placed theme camp, we can not accommodate your request for early arrival passes. We have a limited number of passes to allocate and barely enough for the camps that we were able to place.

Sacred Flame
Placement Team"

I'm not worried about people finding us (although we HAVE been in the same spot the past two years), I'm worried about (a) getting in fast enough to secure enough real estate for an 85 person camp, and (b) getting our custom 40' x 40' bamboo dance floor built and 50' x 50' shade structure erected BEFORE mid-week. If we don't then we cancel the events we have scheduled beginning Monday morning (yoga, meditation, ecstatic dance, etc.). And if we have to cancel our offerings, then what's the point?

It seems to me that rejected camps should, indeed, get SOME sort of early entry consideration. I mean, really, what's the big deal? Give 130 rejected camps one early entry pass to get someone in to stake a claim... 130 additional people? BFD. Yeah... it is to us....



From 08, early in the week, early in the day:
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