Undercity fundraiser- BM ticket lottery

[evil chris]

We are holding a lottery for a ticket to this year's burn! $10 enters you automatically! Please, read on...

"Undead humans and elves freed from the Lich King's control, the Forsaken are a strange and dark force. Led by the Lady Sylvanas Windrunner, their capital is the Undercity, in the royal catacombs beneath the ruins of the City of Lordaeron."

Last year we were known as Orgribbar and have changed the name to reflect our Horde allegiance to the Forsaken of Lordearon. We will have new quests and prizes for you this year and we are also mixing in some of our old Spike's Vampire blood as we transform our territory into the dark, sinister capitol of the Banshee Queen, the Undercity!

Our bar features caged dancing blood elves, goth/industrial/rock music, undead bartenders giving out drinks (21and up, we do card), yoga heckling in the mornings, prizes for completing our quests (group quests and quest-chains also available, depending on your level), a live action on-playa raid, and of course we need more team players for our gnome-mage kick ball tournament. FOR THE HORDE!!!

Please join us at 5:30+D, bring your tankard and share your battle stories with us! Our camp is holding a raffle to help fund our bar, for a min donation of $10 you will be entered in a lottery to win a Burning Man ticket for this year's sold out event. [url] http://www.indiegogo.com/Undercity-BRC-2011 [/url]

[Elderberry]

How opportunistic of you.

[capjbadger]

Spikes? Bishop, is that you? o_0

-Badger

[evil chris]

LOL! We're opportunistic because one of our camp-mates donated her extra ticket to help us raise funds for all the awesome we're going to share with you? If there was no ticket crisis this year, would you still say the same thing? Please, jkisha, enlighten us on what you mean; is fundraising for a theme camp a bad thing in your opinion?

[evil chris]

@capjbadger - This camp will include many past members of Spike's. We're fuzing the sexy goth/industrial/rock vibe of Spike's with the Orgribbar's theme fun geekery based on the World of Warcraft mythos to bring you the city of the undead... Undercity!
and no, I'm not Bishop!

[capjbadger]

@capjbadger - This camp will include many past members of Spike's. We're fuzing the sexy goth/industrial/rock vibe of Spike's with the Orgribbar's theme fun geekery based on the World of Warcraft mythos to bring you the city of the undead... Undercity!
and no, I'm not Bishop!

*chuckle* Spikes + "Chris" + SF Bay area... had to ask.

-Badger

[Elderberry]

Hmmm, well you've certainly opened up a can of worms with that question. My opinions on the topic are all over the board and most of the regulars have been enlightened (or not) by my opinion. I always viewed a theme camp and what they provide as a gift to the community. To me a gift is not all that meaningful if the money you used to buy the gift is given to you by others. It devalues the whole idea of a theme camp. IMHO.

Interestingly enough, I don't have a problem with raffles or fund raising events. The timing of your raffle and the prize was a bit questionable considering the scarceness of tickets and the number of people on the board groveling trying to get a one.

I find fundraising via kickstarter, et.al. disgraceful and demeaning to my vision of a theme camp. I feel the same using said sites for funding art cars as well; but alas it seems to be quite the rage this year.

But hey, each year something or another new crepes into the event; sometimes I just don't like it, sometimes it starts to grow on me, and other times I think the change is great right from the start. Who knows, maybe next year I'll use kickstarter for fund our theme camp.

But primarily, I'm just cranky because of all the buy/sell ticket posts and ridiculous questions and concerns and conspiracy theories regarding the sell out clogging up the board making it difficult to use for playa prep.

LOL! We're opportunistic because one of our camp-mates donated her extra ticket to help us raise funds for all the awesome we're going to share with you? If there was no ticket crisis this year, would you still say the same thing? Please, jkisha, enlighten us on what you mean; is fundraising for a theme camp a bad thing in your opinion?

[capjbadger]

To me a gift is not all that meaningful if the money you used to buy the gift is given to you by others. It devalues the whole idea of a theme camp. IMHO.

Interestingly enough, I don't have a problem with raffles or fund raising events. The timing of your raffle and the prize was a bit questionable considering the scarceness of tickets and the number of people on the board groveling trying to get a one.

I find fundraising via kickstarter, et.al. disgraceful and demeaning to my vision of a theme camp. I feel the same using said sites for funding art cars as well; but alas it seems to be quite the rage this year.

So are you ok with fundraisers or not? Kickstarter is a fundraiser too, the medium is just different.
As far as a ticket raffle, that has been going on every year since I've been going. This is nothing new other than the event selling out this year. *shrug*

But primarily, I'm just cranky because of all the buy/sell ticket posts and ridiculous questions and concerns and conspiracy theories regarding the sell out clogging up the board making it difficult to use for playa prep.

99% of those posts are only clogging up the tickets area. They're not stopping you from doing the normal posting/reading in the rest of the board. Buck up. It's not as bad as you seem to think.

-Badger

[evil chris]

@jkisha My vision of a theme camp always included fundraising because all of my burning man experiences have taught me this is often a necessity for diverse groups with a high level of participation but low income. Many groups aren't able to foot the bill in it's entirety but still have the drive to coordinate an effort that often has marvelous results. To suggest that there is no other alternative for low income participants who want to build and share the fruits of their creative nature is limiting to our culture. I respect your opinion, even if I don't agree with it, and am grateful for all patronage given to the projects I have loved at the burn.

I feel that kickstarter and indiegogo are a wonderful way for artists, theme camps, or anyone with an interesting project to engage people who have the ability and desire to nurture culture. No one is saying you have to give us money, you are welcome to come out to our camp and enjoy what we have to offer with no strings attached.

I have not been surfing the boards here, but I'm truly sorry for those who didn't manage to obtain their ticket for this year's burn. We would have held a lottery for this ticket to fund our camp regardless of the crisis, as incentive to donate. It's not an auction, we aren't selling it to the highest bidder, it is merely a prize for a lotto at the low level of ten bucks.

[Elderberry]

See my answers below inline in blue.

To me a gift is not all that meaningful if the money you used to buy the gift is given to you by others. It devalues the whole idea of a theme camp. IMHO.

Interestingly enough, I don't have a problem with raffles or fund raising events. The timing of your raffle and the prize was a bit questionable considering the scarceness of tickets and the number of people on the board groveling trying to get a one.

I find fundraising via kickstarter, et.al. disgraceful and demeaning to my vision of a theme camp. I feel the same using said sites for funding art cars as well; but alas it seems to be quite the rage this year.

So are you ok with fundraisers or not? Kickstarter is a fundraiser too, the medium is just different.
As far as a ticket raffle, that has been going on every year since I've been going. This is nothing new other than the event selling out this year. *shrug*
I do not have any problem with fund raising events or raffles for funding theme camps. I do not like the idea of kickstarter for funding camps or art cars. I do not mind kickstarter for funding large art projects.

But primarily, I'm just cranky because of all the buy/sell ticket posts and ridiculous questions and concerns and conspiracy theories regarding the sell out clogging up the board making it difficult to use for playa prep.

99% of those posts are only clogging up the tickets area. They're not stopping you from doing the normal posting/reading in the rest of the board. Buck up. It's not as bad as you seem to think.
I have my shortcut to eplyay set to unread posts. I'm a creature of habit and change makes me cranky.
But I'm sure I'll get over it. I'll probably be scalping tickets and using kickstarter myself to fund our theme camp next year. Hell, maybe I'll be able to collect enough money on kickstarter to pay somebody to build me an art car!
-Badger

[capjbadger]

I do not have any problem with fund raising events or raffles for funding theme camps. I do not like the idea of kickstarter for funding camps or art cars. I do not mind kickstarter for funding large art projects.

Kickstarter is fundraising, and you say you don't have a problem with raffles or fundraising for theme camps, so why does Kickstarter (and the like) not sit well with you?

And as for artcars/MV's, it's just mobile art, so what's wrong with fundrasing (KS or otherwise) for that? The fact (unless there was a change in policy I haven't heard about) that the BORG doesn't do art grants for MVs is just a shame. Of course I'm a tad biased as someone who has built a MV from scratch over the last 6 years by myself.

I have my shortcut to eplyay set to unread posts. I'm a creature of habit and change makes me cranky.

Ahhh... thought it might be something like that.
I just use the yellow "unread" notices on the board.

-Badger

[Elderberry]

What do you mean "yellow unread button"? I don't see one.

And regarding the good/bad opinions on the various types of fund raising, I guess everybody formulates some sort of opinion of what burning man is based on their earliest experience with the event. And everybody also formulates their opinion on the interpretation of the principles.

Kickstarter wasn't around when I formulated ideas, so maybe that's why I don't cotton to it.

But though I like being a creature of habit, I don't like to think of myself as being rigid, so there probably was a grain of truth in my comment about figuring our a clever way of using it to fund our camp next year.

I agree that there are some fabulous mutant vehicles on the playa that would classify as art. But many are done very rudimentarily for personal convenience, chick magnetry and the popularity factor. Which is probably why BMORG is hesitant in funding them.

Again, I have to end this with one of my favorite sayings. This is only my opinion. And opinions are like assholes; everybody has one and they are all full of shit.

[capjbadger]

What do you mean "yellow unread button"? I don't see one.

Oh right.. they're red now.