Are Permits Required for Camps to Give Away Food or Drinks?

Tastes Like Burning · Post by **Tastes Like Burning** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 12:54 am

Hi,

I've heard that theme camps in Black Rock City have been ticketed/fined by the Nevada Health Dept. for serving food or drinks to the masses without a permit... Is this true?
If so, what is required to (legally) give away food or beverages in BRC?
How does one go about getting the proper permits at BRC? (Does it require an on-site inspection, or just filing some paperwork ahead-of-time?)
What are the fines or possible consequences of serving WITHOUT any permits?
How do people keep a kitchen or bar clean in a windy alkali desert?

I've searched the Burning Man website and eplaya archives, but I can't seem to find the answers I'm looking for. Can someone please enlighten me? Any info or relevant links would be greatly appreciated...
Thanks!!!

Post by **AntiM** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 5:28 am

From the main site:

Health Regulations

This will not apply to most of you, but it's still good to know the rules. No one wants to see any communal kitchen get shut down or have problems. The Burning Man policy on playa kitchens is as follows: "There are no health regulations that will apply to a 'communal kitchen' as long as you are not feeding people other than those that are a part of this group. Giving food away, or trading for food is the same as a restaurant in the eyes of the health department, and permits and cooking standards will be enforced. Signs for the kitchen are understood to be an indicator of something larger than a kitchen for a pre-defined group of people. Exchanging money on the playa for use of the kitchen also causes suspicion. Make all financial arrangements before you arrive, and serve only those who are part of your camp, or close friends or family of the camp."

To obtain a permit:

http://health2k.state.nv.us/BHPS/ehs/tempevents.htm

Of course I've had no presonal experience with it, our neighbors did pancakes and when the health department shut them down, they moved to the middle of camp and just served campmates. Hope that was helpful, but maybe someone else knows more. Whatcha serving?

trevisty · Post by **trevisty** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 9:36 am

You need a permit and to follow the requirements or you could get shut down. I haven't heard of any fines.
Follow the previously posted link for the permit.

Expect to get inspected. Some of the more active food providers were getting inspected twice a day.

I think the website link will tell you all what you need to do. Basics like, hand wash station, proper food storage/refridgeration, ...

Also check out there presentation at:
http://health2k.state.nv.us/BHPS/ehs/BurningMan2005.pdf

BRC is pretty much a legitimate city now, with all the regulations and law enforcement. Not quite what you would expect.

Post by **trilobyte** » Wed Jul 12, 2006 1:42 pm

I'm not sure of the permits required for operating a bar, but I do recall reading someplace that you and your bartenders will be held responsible if you serve a minor. Basically speaking, if you (or one of your bar staff) thinks someone may be under 21, you need to ask them for ID.

We've only ever had a kitchen/bar for our campmates, and not operated anything for the public.

~Trilo~

Tastes Like Burning · Post by **Tastes Like Burning** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:46 am

Thanks for the info! That's just what I was looking for.

I noticed this breakdown of fees for Temporary Event permits on the Nevada Health Dept. website:
Temporary Food Establishment Per Unit $50.00
*Non-Profit Organization Temporary Food Establishment $25.00
*To qualify for a non-profit permit a tax exempt certification or ID number is required.

Does anyone know what hoops need to be jumped through to achieve "non-profit organization"
status (and, thereby, save $25.00 off the application fee)?

Our camp is planning to offer an adult beverage... which, brings up an issue that I'm sure MANY camps may have to deal with: how to avoid serving alcohol to minors.
The 2006 survival guide says:
"Serving alcohol to minors is a violation of the law. It is a misdemeanor in Nevada to give alcoholic beverages to any person under the age of 21 in a public place. Although Burning Man has some characteristics of a private event, please don't forget that with respect to public
safety laws, most of Black Rock City is considered public space. For example, if your theme camp has a "bar" open to participants where alcoholic drinks are gifted then it is considered a public space in the eyes of the law. Therefore, it is the responsibility of the person serving alcohol to check IDs and ensure that everyone in the immediate vicinity is at least 21 years old."

then, goes on to say...

"It is illegal for minors to consume or possess alcoholic beverages, as well as loiter where alcoholic beverages are being served. A new law in Pershing County prohibits minors from consuming alcohol. Also, it is a misdemeanor for anyone under 21 years old to pass him or herself off as being of age."

I think it's safe to assume that the vast majority of people in Black Rock City don't carry around their ID's... Would posting an age requirement during serving hours, or simply asking questionably-aged people if they are at least 21 years old, be enough? Or, must we actually demand legal proof of age if there is any doubt? If someone (illegally) misrepresented their age when a camp made an effort to verify it, could the camp still be held liable if the person lied, and was actually under 21? ...It seems a shame to have to worry about refusing to serve a young-looking 25 year old because they're not carrying ID, or getting a huge ticket for serving the bearded 20 year old guy...

dragonfly Jafe · Post by **dragonfly Jafe** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 6:24 am

Tastes Like Burning wrote:Does anyone know what hoops need to be jumped through to achieve "non-profit organization"
status (and, thereby, save $25.00 off the application fee)?

Our camp is planning to offer an adult beverage...(snip)... which, brings up an issue that I'm sure MANY camps may have to deal with: how to avoid serving alcohol to minors...(snip)...I think it's safe to assume that the vast majority of people in Black Rock City don't carry around their ID's...(snip) Would posting an age requirement during serving hours, or simply asking questionably-aged people if they are at least 21 years old, be enough?

As far as the non-profit part, that is an IRS thing - lots of forms to fill out, etc. Basically you have to be either a church, school, artsy something, or charity. And be able to prove it. I used to be treasurer for the local SAR unit (a 503c non-profit corp). The paperwork was quite a hassle...not worth it to save $25 in my opinion....

As far as the alcohol thing, LEO's run stings every year (we almost got nailed last year). They send in underage undercover agents to try to get a drink. They leave, and the sherrif's storm in. We posted signs (21 only) last year and trained our bar staff to ask for ID in questionable cases. Luckily an ex-bartender was working at the time the minor came in, and spotted her right off. She tried lots of tricks to get a drink, but couldn't produce an ID and never said she was 21, so maybe asking age would be good enough.

Gravity Mike · Post by **Gravity Mike** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:39 am

Our camp is an afternoon bar camp and we registered a couple of years back. We were using freshly-squeezed lemons in some of our drinks. They told us we needed a prep sink at the bar, which we didn't have, and we weren't allowed to serve drinks. That is, not to strangers. We just made a habbit of making friends fast...

Also, the inspectors took issue with our grey waste management and cited us for that!!

From that experience, we prefer the low-key approach. If your camp is too big, that's hard to do.

Gravity

Ugly Dougly · Post by **Ugly Dougly** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:46 am

I prefer the Loki approach.

Seriously, can nudity and pyromania be very far down on their list?

amblor · Post by **amblor** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:33 pm

I've gotten a health dept. permit for the White Dragon Noodle Bar 3 years running now. You do need a permit if you are serving food to the public. If you want your camp to be advertised in the What Where When, then you should get a permit.

The permit process is pretty easy, but I recommend calling the Burning Man office and talking to someone there about it (I've talked to Harley in the past, but I don't know who's in charge of it now) before you talk to the health department.

The guy in charge of Burning Man permits at the Health Dept. is really nice. His name is Richard Elloyan. I've never had any trouble with him or anyone else from the health department. As long as you jump through their hoops, they are fine with you. They just want you to do the basic stuff that will keep you from getting people sick, like proper handwashing, temperatures and waste disposal. I think their requirements are quite reasonable, given that food places can be a major infection vector.

When they send you the application, the requirements you have to follow will be outlined. Again, they are really pretty simple. Just make sure you have a good handwashing station with a spigot (a round igloo drink cooler works well), warm water, soap, and clean towel, and three basin sinks for washing dishes (wash, rinse, and sanitize with bleach).

When you apply for the permit, make sure you have clearly stated your plans for what you are going to serve, how you are going to hold cold and hot food, how you are going to dispose of waste, and that you are going to have a handwashing station and a dishwashing station, etc. etc.
I usually attach a couple of paragraphs to the permit application explaining what we are planning to do.

It's really not that complicated of a process. As long as you show that you have a reasonable plan and are willing to cooperate with them, they won't give you too much trouble.

You will have to pay the full $50.00 price unless you have tax exempt status with the IRS. Like was said above, the paperwork isn't worth saving $25.00.

I also recommend starting the process as soon as possible, because it can take a few weeks to get the permit.

phil · Post by **phil** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 8:52 pm

make sure you have clearly stated your plans for what you are going to serve, how you are going to hold cold and hot food, how you are going to dispose of waste, and that you are going to have a handwashing station and a dishwashing station, etc. etc.

Hey, Amblor, this is a really great post. Could you be more specific on the plans, though? If we've never done it, we really don't have any plans and no clue how to get any. :-)

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:28 pm

rules:

http://www.leg.state.nv.us/nac/NAC-446.html

in particular sections 446.630 - 660 temporary establishments

ice from center camp is an approved source. Wash/rinse/sterilize is very important. Get some bleach check strips from a resaurant supply house to check sterilizing concentration. A 5 gallan solar shower instead of a water jug also works for washing with warm water as it heated by the sun. If your drinks are served in paper cups, washing is minimized but creats MOOP. If you serve from a pitcher into visitor glasses like center camp does, that minimizes washing glassware also. Giving cans of beer only greatly minimizes a whole bunch of stuff

check list gives you the quick synopsis:
http://health2k.state.nv.us/BHPS/ehs/eh ... lfInsp.pdf

see previous listing for downloadable permit application.

amblor · Post by **amblor** » Thu Jul 13, 2006 9:45 pm

I don't want to misrepresent the health department and cause trouble by giving incorrect information, but here is what (I think) they like to see when looking at a permit application. (I have addressed all of these issues on my application every time, and I have never had any trouble, but you should look at the specifics in the info they send you.)

The application is just a form you fill out with your ingredient and equipment list. I attach a page with an explanation that addresses all of these concerns specifically and directly, because I think it shows that you have thought carefully about it and you have a plan. Here are the basic things you should probably cover in your plan:

-Your kitchen will be enclosed in some type of structure (a tent is fine).
-You will have a handwashing station with antibacterial soap and a clean towel. They like something with a spigot, not a basin of water.
-You will have a three-basin dishwashing station with bleachwater to sanitize.
-You should also have a bucket of bleachwater and a clean rag to wipe off surfaces.
-You will cover the playa surface with a tarp to prevent spills.
-You have a reasonable plan for waste water (evap pond is fine).
-Cold foods should be held below 40 degrees F, and hot foods will be held above 140 degrees F. Have a thermometer handy to check your food temps., and note in your application that you will have a thermometer. Better yet, cook to order and don't hold any foods that are already cooked.
-Don't serve foods that were prepared off-site, because wherever you prepare off-site has to have a permit as well.
-Use water from sealed jugs-- make sure it is clear that the water is potable. We use the 2 1/2 gallon suitcases from the grocery store, just so it's absolutely clear where the water came from. (An unmarked 55-gallon drum doesn't look so good, even if the water is perfectly safe.)
-Buy ice at Camp Artica if you are serving ice.
-Tell them what your plan is for storing perishables.
-Are you supplying paper cups/plates? Reusable stuff? What do you plan to do with the trash/ dirty dishes?

Here are some things we've done at our noodlebar...

All of our noodle ingredients are shelf-stable (except some chopped scallions), and we cook noodles to order, so our camp just doesn't have that much exposure in terms of spoilage or bacteria. I don't know what they would say about fresh fruit or meat or something like that.

We also serve soup in paper cups with wooden chopsticks, so all of our trash is burnable. I highly recommend this. It cuts down on dishwashing and you don't have to worry about the cleanliness of people's personal utensils. People still bring their own cups to the bar for drinks, though. We collect the trash when people finish eating and burn it later on.

Keep it as simple as possible, and try not to serve complicated recipes that require perishables.

I can post the plan I submitted this year if anyone wants to read it, but it's kind of specific to our camp. Anyway, if anyone wants to see it, let me know.

--Amber

Post by **AntiM** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 6:18 am

And very fine noodles they are!

Post by **Eric** » Fri Jul 14, 2006 12:26 pm

AntiM wrote:And very fine noodles they are!

agreed.

We love the Noodle Bar!

Are Permits Required for Camps to Give Away Food or Drinks?

Are Permits Required for Camps to Give Away Food or Drinks?

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