Help! I need a good GLUE for reflectix to tent rain cover!

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:19 am

I went from asking for a good shade "To buy not build" to covering my tent in reflectix. I have this one last issue left, which I decided to post separately, the glue. I'm gluing reflectix to the tent's rain cover, which has been extended & will engulf my whole tent to the ground. I'm also gonna stitch a little, but I was counting on the glue to do the holding.

I was recommended "a heavy duty spray adhesive", so I got the only kind the store had: www.carinapictureframe.com/maxp....html I tried w/little pieces, but though it kind'a held, I could pull it off easily. I have to get something really strong, once & for all, dead-grip. It doesn't really have to be a spray, although that's more convenient for this much material.

So far I was recommended 3m spray adhesive which I goggled & got the lightweight version which sounds like the same thing I used, and the heavyweight version. Here's the heavyweight w/quick description: www.google.com/products

Here's the many, many, many 3m choices: http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/e ... 2785KN7Pgl

Any advise? I'll have to order this stuff online, my stores don't have any selection, so I wanna be sure I'm getting the right stuff. I posted in tribeâ€™s shade-geeks & Stag as well.. I need to get something quick & start gluing! Thank you!

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:27 am

why spray??

why not regular brush on contact cement?

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:38 am

One of the best, IMHO, but, is "Sub floor adhesive", several companies make it.
BUT:
it comes in tubes, like caulking, so, may be difficult to deal with. I'd maybe put little dabs in a grid pattern........

It's good since it stays a little flexible, resists water and chemicals, as well as temperature changes.

Maybe you could put the tent flat, and, do sections at a time, pressing the dabs down?

It'd also probably make the tent somewhat "rigid" depending on how close the spacing is,since it cures like plastic.......

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:44 am

3M Spray 90 is the stuff for a wider variety of plastics than Spray 77.

StevenGoodman · Post by **StevenGoodman** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 4:20 pm

If you don't want it coming off, ever, try Barge Cement? (A good brand of contact cement).

Martini Steve

Cassidy · Post by **Cassidy** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:17 pm

Here's a Most Helpful link:

www.thistothat.com

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:00 pm

Alright, some choices! I like the sound of cement, I might be able to find this even at my hardware stores. ThisToThat.com recommended a glue like Sub floor adhesive, sounds pretty good too. You think the cement would make the surface hard & unbendable?

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:04 pm

geeze, that "thistothat" sure is smart...........

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Wed Jul 30, 2008 7:38 pm

I see the heavyweight link didn't work. This is actually the only one that says it's heat resistent "designed for bonding vinyl tops, heavyweight headliners and hood silencer pads where high strength and heat resistance are needed" This must be the one Gyre originally mentioned, but then said it might damage the reflectix.
http://www.tcpglobal.com/AutoBodyDepot/ ... o=MMM+8090 I'm trying out a contact cement, let samples dry for diffeent lengths before bonding, the hour & a half holds noticibly strongest. I'll leave it overnight then leave out in the sun to make sure it's good. Once again one of my two hardwear stores had that one & only brand... I'm thinking of ordering the Barge brand, is it really stronger than most? I'm pretty sure I'm using this one right now: http://www.drillspot.com/products/32195 ... act_Cement Oooh, I can't wait till I can set up my tent in my living & start getting sticky. Hope it's worth it out there...

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 1:08 am

Any adhesive may be at risk for damaging plastics.
The ones designed for weatherstripping and upholstery are usually the safest and tubelite has specialty that is the safest I know, but something should work.

Since the slick surface is part of the way reflectix works, you will want minimal damage to the surface.
A spray should minimize any damage by controlling the amount of material.

Did you call reflectix and ask them?
After that I would ask 3M tech.

It may be that the best way is to oversew or attach something over the edge and then glue that down.
It is very slick material.

There are adhesives made specifically for mylar, but they are rigid.
It can be glued though.

I have glued things like this with rubber cement, that are not supposed to adhere.
It takes great care and works, but I don't think it would take the violence of wind.

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:04 pm

To think of it, I don't really care about damaging the side of reflectix I'm gluing to the rain cover, as long as it holds. If the glue ate through the rain cover, thatâ€™s another story. The top side of reflectix will be fine, free of any glue. I'm still pondering about 3M cause it says heat resistant. I was looking at the placement cement I got & it says to keep away from heat & doesn't actually clarify weather thatâ€™s only for the bottle or the finished product. I'll leave the glued piece on the roof tonight & see what happens. But I do like how it took, even better this morning. Can barelly begin to pull apart. If it was ok to expose to the sun, it'd be pretty perfect.

P.S. The cement has a pretty dramatic warning about toxicity of vapors causing birth defects... I would likely get vapor in the tent, though I'll sow shut my roof's mesh. Should I be worried?

EspressoDude · Post by **EspressoDude** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:13 pm

Free2B wrote: P.S. The cement has a pretty dramatic warning about toxicity of vapors causing birth defects... I would likely get vapor in the tent, though I'll sow shut my roof's mesh. Should I be worried?

Just don't give birth in the tent!!!!

With only a few weeks left the glue will probably still be stinky. It's a high that rots brain cells and causes nerve damage.....like most things at BRC

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:53 pm

Those warnings are usually about the volatiles that are gone when it cures.
Curing time varies.
It is hard to avoid having good ventilation with the wind out there.
If it seems to have a long curing time, you can check with the company tech folks.
Thin layers usually cure faster.

One exception I found is a monoepoxy paint I use.
It stinks for a long time.
They tell me it is lessened by doing thinner multiple layers and is non-hazardous after the first day or so.
Very annoying though.
The smell is the components continuing to link together into a solid layer.

How's your flexibility so far?

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:27 pm

If you mean flexibility of the material w/the cement, it's absolutely perfect! Not hard at all, very very flexible like it wasn't there at all. I do like how it holds right now, so I'll post the final "test results" tomorrow evening after the sample spends a day in the hot sun. The can said let dry until glossy for 15 - no more than 2 hours before bonding. It went glossy fast enough, the 1 hour & 1.5 hour samples weren't sticky at all by that time, but I bonded anyway & they stuck the best. The 15 minute & Â½ hour were ok but pulled apart without too much effort, they all spent a few hours in sun today & these samples pulled apart noticeably easier than before, so Iâ€™m not sure how a whole day of sun will effect the stronger bonds. What you said does sound right about the warning, I'm not paranoid about things like this, but w/new elements it's always better to ask. It's gonna be cooking out there!

robotland · Post by **robotland** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 6:52 pm

Uh....GOOP.

Just try it, already.

No, they STILL aren't paying me.

Make sure that all surfaces are DRY before gluing. Reflectix is made of Mylar, which is about as non-porous as it gets...if you encounter bonding issues, you might want to try popping some of the "bubble wrap" blisters from the backside and actually doping 'em with a little blob of GOOP. Lightly roughening the tent material with sandpaper could help, too. Clamping it while it cures is going to be "interesting".

Or Velcro. Snaps. Sewing. How about just securing the 'Tix to the tent with spring clamps? Adjustable, that way...

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:02 pm

I wonder if I could make a tent out of reflectix?

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 7:55 pm

Is the any real difference between all the goops they have? http://www.amazinggoop.com/amazinggoop/index.html

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:33 pm

I like RV, plumbing & automotive which is the only one to declear "withstands heat up to 150 F". I still have a feeling they're all the same...

Free2B · Post by **Free2B** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 10:12 am

The contact cement was just as good after a day in the sun, so I'm off into the gluing faze. Finally. I also got Household Goop as it's all they had, and so far it's the worst of all my glues. I'll have to try again giving more than 15 minutes of drying time before bonding. The tube told me 2-10 minutes. THanks again for everyone's help, you're a big, BIG help.

StevenGoodman · Post by **StevenGoodman** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 10:54 am

gyre wrote:I wonder if I could make a tent out of reflectix?

Why not, I made an Oven Mitt! A really big Oven Mitt. It was at BM07.

It is lined with wool emergency blanket glued with spray adhesive to the reflectix. Stitched along the edges and then stitched together. If I am ever in a blizzard I am going to climb inside, it is really warm!

Martini Steve

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:04 pm

Did you use the bubble style or the scrim?

Do you remember what kind of adhesive you used?

StevenGoodman · Post by **StevenGoodman** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:50 pm

The reflectix is bubble stuff with reflective stuff on both sides (mylar?). I got a big roll of it at Lowes (4' x 25'). I have bunch left over, so I can take a picture.

I think the adhesive was 3M, I can check when I am at home.

Martini Steve

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 2:12 pm

They make a version without the bubbles.
I haven't seen it yet.
I'm pretty sure the silvered part at least, is mylar.

StevenGoodman · Post by **StevenGoodman** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:39 pm

[quote="gyre"]Do you remember what kind of adhesive you used?[/quote]

I used 3M 77 spray adhesive.

Martini Steve

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:49 pm

Thanks.
Did it seem to adhere to the reflectix well?

robotland · Post by **robotland** » Sun Aug 03, 2008 6:48 pm

Free2B wrote:The contact cement was just as good after a day in the sun, so I'm off into the gluing faze. Finally. I also got Household Goop as it's all they had, and so far it's the worst of all my glues. I'll have to try again giving more than 15 minutes of drying time before bonding. The tube told me 2-10 minutes. THanks again for everyone's help, you're a big, BIG help.

A REALLY thin layer of GOOP might dry in ten minutes...on a warm day, in the sun. Otherwise, you're looking at OVERNIGHT. It needs air to cure, so if it's deep in the crevices of a project without air circ it'll take longer. And a thicker application needs lots of extra cure time...I've had projects where objects without predrilled airholes had trouble bonding and the GOOP was still wet DAYS later.
Consult the "The POOP about GOOP" thread for more Helpful Tips...don't give up on the GOOP!

...STILL not paying me.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Sun Aug 03, 2008 7:07 pm

That's why 3M makes different sprays for different plastics.

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Wed Aug 06, 2008 11:41 am

Reflectix says 3M 77 should work fine.
Also Liquid Nails.

Not certain i talked to someone in tech, so may not be the final word.

robotland · Post by **robotland** » Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:10 pm

I have learned that When In Doubt, try to have BOTH a mechanical connection (i.e. sewn, riveted, screwed, nailed) AND a chemo-physical bond such as GOOP (*smooches!*) or other adhesive. You COULD whip things together with some high-test fishline...

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:41 pm

Or stick to ordinary camping gear and not house insulation or packing material...