Stuff inside a shade structure

Ideas, advice, tips, and tricks regarding shelter, shade, tents, and camping. Yes, this includes RV's too.
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Optic
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Stuff inside a shade structure

Postby Optic » Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:39 pm

Alright, 2010 will be my first burn, and I've been looking at a lot of different pictures of shade structures to find which one will work best for the amount of stuff I'm planning to bring, etc. One thing I've noticed in a lot of the pictures, is that tents within structures don't seem to be secured. They look like they're just sitting on top of tarps (unless people are actually hammering pieces of rebar through their tarps, and I haven't caught it).

My question is, how much securing should the stuff you put within your shade structure be given? I was planning on using one of the open cylinder, quanset hut style structures, and parking my car in front of the east opening to block the wind.

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ygmir
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Postby ygmir » Mon Nov 23, 2009 4:42 pm

a ton of securing.....
winds can gust upwards of 60 mph.
and, the energy is higher with the dust particles suspended.

"tis better to secure it to well, than, to chase it down the street"

IMHO, that is........
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AntiM
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Postby AntiM » Mon Nov 23, 2009 5:11 pm

We don't nail down our tents under the carports, but they are off to the sides and sheltered. We do drop our folding chairs flat and secure any loose items of we're leaving camp.

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phil
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Postby phil » Mon Nov 23, 2009 5:38 pm

how much securing should the stuff you put within your shade structure be given? I was planning on using one of the open cylinder, quanset hut style structures, and parking my car in front of the east opening to block the wind.

Everything under the shade should be secured so it doesn't blow away.

East? I'm not sure the wind comes from the east, generally. I'd say it comes from the southwest to south. Any thoughts on that from others?

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ygmir
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Postby ygmir » Mon Nov 23, 2009 5:49 pm

phil wrote:
how much securing should the stuff you put within your shade structure be given? I was planning on using one of the open cylinder, quanset hut style structures, and parking my car in front of the east opening to block the wind.

Everything under the shade should be secured so it doesn't blow away.

East? I'm not sure the wind comes from the east, generally. I'd say it comes from the southwest to south. Any thoughts on that from others?

I've noted, in the big winds, almost any direction is possible, especially with the "dust devils" or whatever you call those tornado things.......
circular, as such.
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Optic
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Postby Optic » Mon Nov 23, 2009 6:06 pm

What are some good techniques for securing things? Putting heavy stuff on top of light stuff, obviously, but does anyone know some other tricks?

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Postby motskyroonmatick » Mon Nov 23, 2009 6:07 pm

I concur. The wind primarily comes from the south south west. It can and will come at you from any direction and all structures should be secured with that in mind.
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Postby gyre » Mon Nov 23, 2009 7:31 pm

Bungee cords are your friend.

Make things rigid or make them flex together.

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Postby motskyroonmatick » Mon Nov 23, 2009 9:34 pm

If I tent it the first or last night I put at least 5 gallons of water in one corner and my clothes duffel on the other side. I set the tent up right next to one of the wheels of my box truck for a bit of wind protection.

I agree with gyre. Make everything flexible or very rigid and secure. Flapping of any sort is not your friend and will tear a structure apart.
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Postby Bob » Tue Nov 24, 2009 12:38 am

Optic, have you ever gone camping, anywhere? If so, how did you stake your tent, and why?
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Optic
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Postby Optic » Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:43 am

I've been camping before. I usually use rebar to stake my tent because I always hammer the tent stakes too hard, and end up breaking them. As to why, I usually do it because I feel like I'm not done setting up the tent until I've staked it, regardless of whether I actually need them to keep the tent held down or not.

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Postby Sham » Tue Nov 24, 2009 2:09 am

It's best to figure on 50 mph winds blowing. Just think of trying to keep a tent and your gear on the roof of your car while driving 50 mph. Keep flapping of tarps and tents to a minimum. Weight things down with the wind in mind. Water containers work great for this. Cover the mesh areas of your tent to keep the powder fine dust out.

Just keep thinking 50 mph winds and 10 hour dust/wind storms. You're gonna have a great time!

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Re: Stuff inside a shade structure

Postby Bluemandrew » Tue Nov 24, 2009 5:00 am

Optic wrote:(unless people are actually hammering pieces of rebar through their tarps, and I haven't caught it).


That is indeed what I did

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Re: Stuff inside a shade structure

Postby AntiM » Tue Nov 24, 2009 5:38 am

Bluemandrew wrote:
Optic wrote:(unless people are actually hammering pieces of rebar through their tarps, and I haven't caught it).


That is indeed what I did


We use the big landscaping nails/spikes under the shade for the few things which do require nailing down. Like our rugs and floorcovers.

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Re: Stuff inside a shade structure

Postby phil » Tue Nov 24, 2009 11:22 am

Bluemandrew wrote:
Optic wrote:(unless people are actually hammering pieces of rebar through their tarps, and I haven't caught it).


That is indeed what I did

We use a big painter's tarp as our ground cover under the shade, and we cut holes for the rebar to go through. Our tarp extends out past the shade canopy because that's where the shadow falls as the sun sets. (We orient our canopy so that the sides face sunrise and sunset, and we put side flaps on the sunny side.)

EDIT: We stake down the corners of the tarp, then drive rebar through the interior that we tape the shade poles to. So we've got 8 holes in our ground tarp.

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Postby TomServo » Sat Dec 05, 2009 8:41 pm

ygmir wrote:a ton of securing.....
winds can gust upwards of 60 mph.
and, the energy is higher with the dust particles suspended.

"tis better to secure it to well, than, to chase it down the street"

IMHO, that is........


110 mph gusts reported in1999. Thought it was kinda silly, but heard similar reports. It gets windy..and can stay windy. Tie everything, to the bottom of your car. And drive deeeeep stakes!
anything worth doing is worth overdoing..

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Postby Elorrum » Sat Dec 05, 2009 9:25 pm

I lived in a country that had hurricanes from time to time, and saw what can go flying by. I use the same mindset at Burning man. Don't leave things lying around. I put light things inside secured boxes or bags (this last year I used a couple of Trader Joes's zip up cooler bags, as shade shelter "toy boxes" just put everything loose in them, one a kitchen kit, and the other a catch all. Then just crammed them between the coolers when I left camp) I tie a light rope or bungee around and through things as a group like my table, through milk crate, bag handles, through folding chair etc. Nail down shade floor tarp or put heavy stuff like cooler and water on top of it so it doesn't blow away. Mainly I think of what I do not want a deeper layer of dust all over, and bag things up before I head out. I usually have a "I hope it's good enough" feeling as I leave camp. Even camping in the outer rings, I've been lucky to be near, or had time during a windy episode to make my way back and check on my camp and add a few guy lines if needed. I've sat watching, and chased careless neighbors' crap down the road. After your first wind storm, you'll feel better about it, seeing and hearing everything you brought getting battered, but staying intact.

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Postby ygmir » Sat Dec 05, 2009 11:14 pm

my first year, I was looking out the camper window and instinctively ducked as a carport, legs and all, crashed into the camper and side of my truck.
there was a crowd of people chasing it........

I think it was just scared.......
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Postby robotland » Mon Dec 07, 2009 3:50 am

This is why my favorite tent is a big ugly squarish one, made by Honda.

Your car is the heaviest thing that MOST burners bring to the playa- Use it to anchor your tent, or park on top of your tarp edge...but beware of flapping tarps or sliding ropes that can grind through the paint and right into the metal (or fiberglass). Determine the prevailing wind direction and then use your vehicle as a windbreak, as opposed to making it a downwind target for your airborne tent to crash into.
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Postby gyre » Mon Dec 07, 2009 6:12 am

robotland wrote:This is why my favorite tent is a big ugly squarish one, made by Honda.


What kind of mileage do you get with that thing?

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Postby Bling » Sun Jan 31, 2010 9:41 am

What about camp kitchens? Ours is a free-standing Cabela model. I'd think the wind would just pass through it; it's not like there's any surface for wind to catch, really. Do folks stake those down in some way?

I was also thinking of zip-tying a bunch of milk crates together so we could form them into a curved spot for seating/book exchange, maybe (for the drive home--I don't expect anyone to sit around and read while they're there!). Would those be okay as-is, or do they need to be held down in some way. If so, how? Zip-ties and Rebar through it?

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Postby gyre » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:19 pm

Bling wrote:What about camp kitchens? Ours is a free-standing Cabela model. I'd think the wind would just pass through it; it's not like there's any surface for wind to catch, really. Do folks stake those down in some way?

I was also thinking of zip-tying a bunch of milk crates together so we could form them into a curved spot for seating/book exchange, maybe (for the drive home--I don't expect anyone to sit around and read while they're there!). Would those be okay as-is, or do they need to be held down in some way. If so, how? Zip-ties and Rebar through it?

No roof on that kitchen?

If it will travel on a flatbed at freeway speeds, then you don't need to worry about it in the wind.

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Postby Bling » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:22 pm

Nope. Just planning on plunking it under our shade tent. I haven't had any luck with sharing an image, so here's what we got: http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templ ... hasJS=true

We liked the zip "pantries" for storing food, the lantern hooks, and it got great ratings.

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gyre
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Postby gyre » Sun Jan 31, 2010 3:27 pm

Looks pretty stable, especially if it has some windbreak.
It depends on how rigid it is.
Without a windbreak, it might need staking.
The wind varies.

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Postby dragonpilot » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:53 pm

That Cabelas kitchen is nice. Does it come with a cover? If not, I'd get something to completely cover it when it's not in use. Even then, it's going to get a nice layering of dust...you can't eliminate it, but perhaps minimize it.
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Postby epic_elite » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:53 pm

Bling wrote:Nope. Just planning on plunking it under our shade tent. I haven't had any luck with sharing an image, so here's what we got: http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templ ... hasJS=true

We liked the zip "pantries" for storing food, the lantern hooks, and it got great ratings.


i imagine this guy would have little caps to keep dirt from getting stuck in the poles... assuming you could remove said caps you may be able to just set this guy on top of some rebar and call it good. this is of course assuming you don't leave random small objects on top to blow around on thier own.

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Bling
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Postby Bling » Sun Jan 31, 2010 4:56 pm

Um, cover? Caps? Not sure--we haven't taken it out of the box yet! We'll bring it along to Lakes of Fire for a test drive, and then we'll know. :-)

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Postby bauhaus » Tue Feb 09, 2010 1:25 pm

for that free standing kitchen. just drive some rebar stakes down and zip tie the kitchen legs to them.

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Postby Bling » Tue Feb 09, 2010 1:27 pm

Thanks, Bauhaus, that's what we were thinking of (once we thought about this at all) :wink: Clearly, plenty of zip ties will need to come along. A million uses!

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Postby AntiM » Tue Feb 09, 2010 3:17 pm

That's a nice little set up. You will want a drop cloth under it, I'd think. You can easily attach a wet and a dry (burnable) trash container to the sides.

Some thoughts: Zip ties are handy, but be diligent when you snip them at the end of the week, they make great MOOP.

The zipper pantries will likely fill with dust, especially if the entire camp isn't trained to keep them zipped up at ALL times; keep your dry goods bagged. That mesh thingy? Anything in it will be dusty. We try to keep our stove closed when not in use, (try!) and turn everything upside down when not in use. We have three plastic totes/bins. Two for food, one for kitchen items such as dishes and paper towels. I try to keep our coffee mugs turned over covered with a plastic bag if they are left out. We only leave them out after we wash them and sometimes we forget to put them away.


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