Hard sided A frame trailer

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paulthewookie
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Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by paulthewookie » Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:20 pm

Hi All!

I'm a first time burner but a long time camper, however I've never camped on anything like the playa and I've got a few questions for you all :D

I have a hard sided pop up trailer like in the image below:

Image

Does anyone have any experience with bringing one of these to the playa? How was your experience? I have been reading some posts about covering the windows and vents with foil bubble wrap, like reflectix, to help keep it cool in the mornings. I was thinking if I covered all the interior walls and ceiling with foil bubble wrap that might help keep it cool in the morning for a bit more sleeping but I'm not sure. I would probably do it in a way that I could uncover the windows and vents to air it out if needed. Any opinions or advice would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

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Canoe
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Canoe » Tue Mar 04, 2014 10:08 pm

I haven't seen one of those on the playa, but I looked them over at a show.
  • Unless you want it packed with dust, you won't be setting it up while the wind/dust is blowing. Strong winds, and the tops would rip right off. (Often 25 mph, regular patches of 40 mph, 75 mph possible, rare cases beyond.)
  • To try to minimize the affects of wind, you're going to want to park with the car in line with the trailer facing ENE. This puts the typical prevailing wind at its rear (from the WSW) and the most typical big blows from the front (ENE). This is to try to avoid having a lot of wind coming from the side. NOT guaranteed.
  • White is a good colour to not have an oven, but yes, do cover those windows. The sun on the frames will make them too hot to touch well before noon. If you cover the windows on the outside, use gaffer tape (expensive but worth it) and the reflectix can go over the frames too. More important for the sun side (the door side will get some sun late in the day).
  • Yes, any North facing windows too. Hot outside air both conducts & radiates heat through the window, and the sun-heated ground radiates lots of it.
  • If you want to be able to open the windows, you don't want to have to go outside to do so (are they also emergency exits).
    That means reflectix on the inside:
    • with painter's tape to seal it to the wall (you can peel it off quickly for an exit or to let air flow)
    • you can cut a tiny hole, say 2" x 2", in the middle of the non-sun side to let a little bit of daylight in (or have a scrap to tape over a sun-side peep/light hole, otherwise you'll be amazed how much heat comes in that little hole).
    • This leaves the black frames exposed to the sun. White gaffers or green painters tape over the outside frames if they'll be in the sun. Foil tape carefully applied over the green tape (do not get the foil tape on the white siding, frame or windows or you will regret it). Doesn't matter if some green shows, but you do want foil over everywhere the frame is.
    • With reflectix on the inside, there will be heat buildup between it and the glass (reflectix sealed to the wall with tape to prevent hot air flow). The reflectix will be hot to the touch and will conduct and then radiate some heat. So for reflectix on the inside, multiple layers on the sunside work much better. For the non-sun side, one layer is usual enough.
  • Multiple layers of reflectix on the inside for any skylights.
To protect the playa from black tire "burn" spots, you also want something you set down on the playa to drive the tires on to. Trailer & car. Dollar store thick plastic place mats or cutting boards are a cheap solution. Find your spot, stop. Mats tight to the front of all six wheels, drive forward a foot. You'll want pads for any corner trailer supports; watch as wood can MOOP.
Last edited by Canoe on Tue Mar 04, 2014 10:36 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Canoe
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Canoe » Tue Mar 04, 2014 10:31 pm

Expect to be able to sleep in it through most of the morning in the sun.
Adding some reflectix on the inside walls & ceiling will help, but the most likely heat source will still be the covered windows, particularly if they're not covered on the outside.
If you're going reflectix crazy (or paid for a roll anyway), one layer over windows on the outside in the sun, and a layer or two on the inside. You can start with a single layer, and you'll feel the heat on the windows that need more...

Of course, if vents or windows allow (you can make a rigid foam window adapter and tape it in place with gaffer's tape), make a DIY swamp cooler as a trump card against the heat.
A DIY swamp-cooler will blow air into your shelter that is:
  • fresh,
  • cool,
  • some humidity,
  • dust-free!!!
while replacing the shelter's stale hot dusty air (forces it out of the shelter).

Uses potable water.

Three Playa-Tested©)'( models detailed (proven track record on-playa).
They're DIY, easy to build, rather in-expensive parts, and hand-holding is available upon request... (see the thread)
Latest recap is here: viewtopic.php?f=280&t=33842&start=2430#p990806
4.669
.
That's one word I regret googling during breakfast.
.
Video games are giving kids unrealistic expectations on how many swords they can carry.
.
, but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

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Canoe
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Canoe » Tue Mar 04, 2014 10:38 pm

p.s.
seal the window tracks and seams with painter's tape on the INSIDE.
that way you can easily remove it without having to go outside (fresh air, emergency exit, etc.)
4.669
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That's one word I regret googling during breakfast.
.
Video games are giving kids unrealistic expectations on how many swords they can carry.
.
, but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

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gaminwench
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by gaminwench » Wed Mar 05, 2014 2:03 am

A campmate brings one of these when he comes. It's awesome.
"the prophecies of doom were better last year" trilo

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Jackass
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Jackass » Wed Mar 05, 2014 11:43 am

I believe someone on eplaya has one that's been painted as a gingerbread house, Emily D perhaps?

Looks pretty cool
Sooner or later, it will get real strange...

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paulthewookie
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by paulthewookie » Wed Mar 05, 2014 12:00 pm

Thanks for all the advice everyone! Sounds like with a little bit of work with some reflectix and building a swamp cooler it will work awesome!

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Joeln
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Joeln » Wed Mar 05, 2014 12:02 pm

Canoe wrote:To protect the playa from black tire "burn" spots, you also want something you set down on the playa to drive the tires on to. Trailer & car. Dollar store thick plastic place mats or cutting boards are a cheap solution. Find your spot, stop. Mats tight to the front of all six wheels, drive forward a foot. You'll want pads for any corner trailer supports; watch as wood can MOOP.
Whoa! I hadn't heard this before.
Seems to me this would apply to every single vehicle on the playa.
Collapse first and avoid the rush

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Canoe
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Canoe » Wed Mar 05, 2014 12:15 pm

Do splurge on the gaffer's tape so you don't damage the surface of your trailer, and don't use the 'delicate surface' version of the green painter's tape (doesn't stick enough).
Check through that swamp-cooler thread, or google eplaya, to find out recommendations on making an adapter for feeding your shelter through a window. It has to be able to take the playa winds without banging/rubbing without damaging your trailer. If the conduit is taped to the side it's already in contact and the wind shouldn't bang it against the side.

One thing you may have to do is have a small stand for the swamp-cooler to sit on, so the fan doesn't have to push the cooled air up high to get in a window (too high and this greatly reduced air flow).

I like the gingerbread house idea (washable paint). It would make it somewhat hotter in the sun, so I'd suggest you only do something like that if you also go the swamp-cooler route. The swamp-cooler is amazing to have, as you get respite from the heat, but mainly you get great rest (if you don't, it can really rob you of a great burn), so you can get out and explore BRC more.
4.669
.
That's one word I regret googling during breakfast.
.
Video games are giving kids unrealistic expectations on how many swords they can carry.
.
, but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

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Canoe
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Canoe » Wed Mar 05, 2014 12:37 pm

Joeln wrote:
Canoe wrote:To protect the playa from black tire "burn" spots, you also want something you set down on the playa to drive the tires on to. Trailer & car. Dollar store thick plastic place mats or cutting boards are a cheap solution. Find your spot, stop. Mats tight to the front of all six wheels, drive forward a foot. You'll want pads for any corner trailer supports; watch as wood can MOOP.
Whoa! I hadn't heard this before. Seems to me this would apply to every single vehicle on the playa.
Very much so. I hadn't noticed nor heard about this until reading on the burning blog about the Department of Public Works Playa Restoration Team doing their efforts. Doing so will really open your eyes about MOOP and scaring the playa. Apparently, this is also one of the things BLM is monitoring about the affect of BRC on the Black Rock Playa.

Playa Restoration http://blog.burningman.com/category/environment/
Leave No Trace: http://www.burningman.com/environment/r ... s/lnt.html
4.669
.
That's one word I regret googling during breakfast.
.
Video games are giving kids unrealistic expectations on how many swords they can carry.
.
, but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

paulthewookie
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Mar 04, 2014 9:00 pm
Burning Since: 2014

Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by paulthewookie » Wed Mar 05, 2014 1:57 pm

Canoe wrote:Do splurge on the gaffer's tape so you don't damage the surface of your trailer, and don't use the 'delicate surface' version of the green painter's tape (doesn't stick enough).
Check through that swamp-cooler thread, or google eplaya, to find out recommendations on making an adapter for feeding your shelter through a window. It has to be able to take the playa winds without banging/rubbing without damaging your trailer. If the conduit is taped to the side it's already in contact and the wind shouldn't bang it against the side.

One thing you may have to do is have a small stand for the swamp-cooler to sit on, so the fan doesn't have to push the cooled air up high to get in a window (too high and this greatly reduced air flow).
Thanks for all the info again. I will definitely check out the gaffer's tape. It sounds like a great idea. What is a good place to order it online?

I took a quick look through the swamp cooler thread and that is something I can build for sure. I like to make things and am decently handy so it shouldn't be a problem :wink: From what you are saying it sounds like the swamp cooler sits outside the trailer and blows cool air in. How do people prevent it from blowing away in the winds which I've read can get pretty strong? Build a box around it? Or is the end product heavy enough that you don't need to worry about that?

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Canoe
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by Canoe » Wed Mar 05, 2014 2:39 pm

I've had good luck with goodbuyguys.com.
If you're going to have your reflectix on the inside, then for covering the outside frames (you really really really need to cover frames that get sun), using white gaffer's is easier than using green painters with foil over top. The foil-on-painter's will reflect significantly more heat away - your call. If you don't get around to making the cooler, use the foil. With a cooler available: if the frames weren't black you wouldn't need to cover them (but it would be worthwhile), and white gaffer's would be a good improvement on heat gain.
Make sure you cover the frames wide enough to do the job without having to worry. If there's black frame exposed behind the glass (likely), then get tape wide enough to cover beyond the frame out onto the glass so that all of the frame, outside and behind glass, is protected from the sun, or add an extra strip on the glass to do that job!

Painter's tape is fine for inside. Strong enough to hold, adhesive is no cleanup and doesn't damage surfaces.
Foil tape (the thick aluminum kind; some box stores, all trade stores) is great for joining scraps of reflectix.
If you're covering a large window, rather than have a large piece of reflectix that may try to flap around in the varying positive and negative pressures of wind blowing on and around the trailer, considering covering a window in two or more pieces (depending on size) so the cover is also held in the middle. In your case, cover one half with one piece of reflectix using gaffer's. Slightly overlap a second piece of reflextix to cover the rest. To save on cost, the tape joint of reflectix to reflectix can use foil tape.

As to securing the swamp-cooler, take that question over to the cooling-your-tent-or-van thread. See how others have done the connection through a window, elevated a bucket-cooler and secured all in place.
4.669
.
That's one word I regret googling during breakfast.
.
Video games are giving kids unrealistic expectations on how many swords they can carry.
.
, but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

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JayBobBoy
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by JayBobBoy » Wed Mar 05, 2014 3:11 pm

Thanks Canoe for all the awesome advice. You're on fire!

I found white gaffers tape at my local Guitar Center and used it along with reflective insulation to cover all my sun facing windows. It worked really well!
"It is all very beautiful and magical here - a quality which cannot be described. You have to live it and breath it., let the sun bake it into you" - Ansel Adams

paulthewookie
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Re: Hard sided A frame trailer

Post by paulthewookie » Wed Mar 05, 2014 4:00 pm

Double that Thanks Canoe! All your advice has been awesome! I will definitely check out that thread for more advice on the swamp coolers!

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