Conduit Bangers of The World, Unite!

Ideas, advice, tips, and tricks regarding shelter, shade, tents, and camping. Yes, this includes RV's too.

To DOME, or Not To DOME?

3/4" EMT, Frequency 2
6
8%
3/4" EMT, Frequency 2
6
8%
3/4" EMT, Frequency 3
6
8%
3/4" EMT, Frequency 3
6
8%
Bigger Conduit! Bigger Frequency!!
11
14%
Bigger Conduit! Bigger Frequency!!
11
14%
PVC for ME.
5
6%
PVC for ME.
5
6%
You people sicken me. Buy a tent!
12
15%
You people sicken me. Buy a tent!
12
15%
 
Total votes: 80

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LeChatNoir
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Post by LeChatNoir » Tue Apr 26, 2005 7:51 am

I like the jagged edge of the cut setting atop this nice, clean geometric base.
an old belt nailed in loops around the top of the wood base to hold hammers.
Yeah, I have an old belt around the stump, but I built a hammer rack last year sometime. They’re like rabbits... just keep getting more and more of ‘em.

Man... I gotta find a way to upload and post some pics. Dial-up sucks...
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robotland
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Post by robotland » Tue Apr 26, 2005 8:24 am

You'd laugh at my shaping anvils....The smaller is a welding-gas tank cap on a heavy metal pedestal, (curbside find) and the bigger is a bowling ball nestled in a railroad car brake ring!

Your analogy sound familiar....The Code of Hammerrabbits, perhaps?
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Martiansky
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Post by Martiansky » Tue Apr 26, 2005 8:31 am

Robo, you pound on a bowlingball? How does it not crack?

robotland
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Post by robotland » Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:03 am

I don't use it for any serious smithying- just to impart a roundness to flat aluminum stock. I use a big, soft rubber mallet or plastic-faced hammer.
I used to have one that had steel "stakes" screwed into it for making textures, but I put too many in and eventually the ball cracked. Thankfully, it's illegal for a thrift store in Michigan to NOT have an abundance of one-dollar balls! The old ones get painted and put into the garden, much to my wife's dismay.....
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preburnkentucky
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Vinyl Covering

Post by preburnkentucky » Fri Apr 29, 2005 2:59 pm

Posted this on the other thread as well.
preburnkentucky wrote:O.K. I have the frame completed. 3v 8ft R 5/8.
The Vinyl i am using for a cover is discarded Billboard covers.
Anyone got the skinny on how to seam this stuff without a
needle and thread?
Two options I see are
chemical weld (but what solvent works best)

and Heat weld (how hot and how large a butt seam)

All suggestions are appreciated
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mamagrrl
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Post by mamagrrl » Fri Apr 29, 2005 9:19 pm

Presses have their place, but the hammer/anvil will be much faster if you can do without the curve.
(chuckles)
Unless you're trying to squish 1" thinwall.
That stuff needs 5.3 tons to go flat - and this girly-girl's not gonna achieve that with a hammer. ...nevermind I can't aim worth a darn. More likely to hit it in the wrong spot, too. Better for me to place, pump, squish and bend!!

I thought I saw some dies at Harbor Freight, but could've been wrong.
Someone should go check and then bring them here, to my house.
(crooked grin)

Worth a try. :roll:

kampkalamazoo
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Post by kampkalamazoo » Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:15 am

Okay, 1" EMT was A LITTLE harder to bang flat....but still do-able, says I. However, I manipulate lead-alloy blocks for a living, and am bending or smithying aluminum when I'm not doing that....It's hard work if you're not used to it.
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falk
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10% off at Home Depot

Post by falk » Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:32 pm

Hi all; a quick heads-up: I was shopping for conduit today, and discovered that they have a 10% "friends and family" discount. Tommorrow (Sunday May 1) is the last day.

-ed

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sputnik
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Post by sputnik » Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:34 pm

Cool. I need to buy plywood for our project.

upriver
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Why bang?

Post by upriver » Fri May 20, 2005 8:18 pm

Maybe I haven't thought this through enough, but couldn't I just leave the ends of my 3/4" conduit round, drill holes, and use longer bolts and skip the whole namesake of this thread? Just an idea. I just found mountains of conduit at my local scrapyard far cheaper than Dome Depot.
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LostMachine
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Post by LostMachine » Fri May 20, 2005 8:35 pm

The short answer is:
No, not really

The long answer:
In order to make a strong structure you need the ends of the conduit to end up at the same spot. By the time you stack 6 pieces of 3/4” conduit with the proper angles it will be over 8” thick from the top piece to the bottom one. All the “correct” strut lengths will be thrown off a great deal. All your holes will need to be drilled at the correct angle through the conduit. Then once they are stacked, tightening the bolt will squish the conduit some further screwing up the geometry.
You’ll end up with a mess. There are a lot more reasons but I think you can get the idea.

On the other hand if you are only doing an icosahedron you can get away with the lashing method (if you are extremely opposed to hammering the ends).

If you got the material go all out. You can find people local to your area to help you out.


LM
www.LostMachine.com

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Post by upriver » Sat May 21, 2005 8:54 am

I figured that if it could be that easy people would be doing it already.
'nuff said. Time to go find/make an anvil.
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robotland
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Post by robotland » Mon May 23, 2005 5:44 am

There IS a way around flattening the ends, but it's more work in other directions.....Using junctions. Remember those geodome playground things from the sixties? They have discs at all of the vertices that the struts bolt to....BUT- They flattened theirs, too. That way they could put the 18-or-so-degree bend into the end of the STRUT and not have to angle the junction. I've seen nifty couplers for stickbuilt geodesic houses, that accept 2x4"s and have the correct angle bent in, but so far no giant kit pieces for conduit structures. You could make your own, if you can weld.....

For that anvil, ask your local scrap merchant for a hunk of railroad rail. They might even burn off a proper length for a small fee, if on isn't handy. A walk down the tracks will usually yield a tieplate or two, which can be screwed to a post for bangin' on. Good luck!
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falk
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Improved hydraulic press jig

Post by falk » Sun Jun 05, 2005 2:03 pm

First, I just thought of something: If you use a hydraulic press, then you're not banging on the pipes, you're mashing them. This thread should have been entitled "Bangers and Mash"

Second, y'all ought to know that Harbor Freight is having a sale on 12-ton presses. Normally I'm not a big fan of chinese-made tools, the the price is right.

Third, anybody who's ever worked with one of these puppies knows what a hassle it is to manage the press plates. At one place I saw the upper plate held in place with bungie cords. I used straps myself.

The next problem is keeping the plate from shifting around.

This jig is a small bit of wood with four pegs to keep it centered over the press plate, and a hole to keep it centered around the actual presser.

http://www.efalk.org/OasisDome/photos/bigs/dsc_0818.jpg
http://www.efalk.org/OasisDome/photos/bigs/dsc_0820.jpg

This lets me center the pressure right over the piece of pipe that's getting flattened, and keeps things from shifting around. Mashing goes much faster this way.

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Re: Improved hydraulic press jig

Post by robotland » Mon Jun 06, 2005 5:29 am

falk wrote:First, I just thought of something: If you use a hydraulic press, then you're not banging on the pipes, you're mashing them. This thread should have been entitled "Bangers and Mash"

.
BRAVO!!!!

Since we discuss bungees and flattened-conduit-sections, we should also subtitle our discussion "shocks and struts".
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LeChatNoir
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Post by LeChatNoir » Mon Jun 06, 2005 7:59 pm

Bangers and Mash... makin' me hungry.

Hey robot!!!

I’ve got to brag on what was accomplished in my shop just a few weeks ago.

With 6 people we smashed, punched the holes in the ends, and deburred all the (pre-cut)sections of 1" conduit needed for a 20' dia. Dome in 42 minutes. 220 odd pieces... 42 MINUTES!!!!

Well... we did have the help of the power hammer and a 50 ton Ironworker, but hey... it’s the team work I’m bragging on here!! Like a well oiled machine, we were. Amazing what can be done with a fine crew of burners.

And it went together at Interfuse the very next day. Whooo HOOO!!! Sad to say I wasn’t there to be a part of the construction, but I saw the pics, and a fine piece or work it was!

And with any setup, be it bangin, or mashin... as falk as shown, jigs and fixtures are the key to consistant, quality work.
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LeChatNoir
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Post by LeChatNoir » Mon Jun 06, 2005 8:09 pm

Hey falk, by the way...

For my arbor press, I’ll cut several sections of pipe, say about 3" long or so, sized big enough to slide over the post of my press. Drill or torch a hole along it’s length somewhere. On the outside of the pipe, over this hole, I weld a nut and in the nut I put a bolt. Now I have a sleeve that I can weld to any upper die fixture I make. Slide this onto the post, tighten said bolt , and it clamps in place.

This is, of course, assuming you have access to a welder.
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falk
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Post by falk » Mon Jun 06, 2005 11:08 pm

LeChatNoir wrote:Hey falk, by the way...

For my arbor press, I’ll cut several sections of pipe, say about 3" long or so, sized big enough to slide over the post of my press. Drill or torch a hole along it’s length somewhere. On the outside of the pipe, over this hole, I weld a nut and in the nut I put a bolt. Now I have a sleeve that I can weld to any upper die fixture I make. Slide this onto the post, tighten said bolt , and it clamps in place.

This is, of course, assuming you have access to a welder.
Hmmm, I like it.

Now here's what I can't figure out -- howinthehell did the manufacturer of this press intend us to use it? Did they picture that someone would just be standing there holding the upper press plate in position while someone else pumped the handle?

mamagrrl
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Post by mamagrrl » Tue Jun 07, 2005 2:39 am

They probably assumed you'd weld the plate onto the rod.
We would have welded it on, except our set-up was borrowed from other burners.
Burners don't weld on other burners gear unless the other burners request it - and they didn't... so... we hold. and squish.

robotland
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Post by robotland » Tue Jun 07, 2005 5:28 am

LeChatNoir wrote:With 6 people we smashed, punched the holes in the ends, and deburred all the (pre-cut)sections of 1" conduit needed for a 20' dia. Dome in 42 minutes. 220 odd pieces... 42 MINUTES!!!!

.
YOW. I'm impressed! My personal best was about 6 hours from hardware store to finished 2V....I wanted that sucker done like nobody's business! My hands were about useless the following day.

Thinking about the speed with which components can be produced reinvigorates my daydream of Fuller City, a playa community of interlinked geodesics....Dang, only 446 days until BM '06!
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LeChatNoir
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Post by LeChatNoir » Tue Jun 07, 2005 4:19 pm

robotland wrote:Thinking about the speed with which components can be produced reinvigorates my daydream of Fuller City,
Yeah, it was quite a thing to witness and shows that with teamwork and tools, much can be accomplished. Now that 42 minutes didn't include the setup time for fixtures, which was about 30 minutes, or unloading/loading the conduit into the vehicle... but still.

Me on the power hammer, one person on the ironworker punching the holes in the ends, two people (each with a grinder in hand) deburring opposite ends of the finished tube simultaneously, and two more people between each of the three work stations, passing the pieces along.

And we even traded jobs from time to time, so as to make it more fun for all involved.
falk wrote:Now here's what I can't figure out -- howinthehell did the manufacturer of this press intend us to use it?
Technically, those plate were meant to be used laying flat on the lower cross member. The different size semi-circles are to let something pass through. Picture needing to press a bearing off of a shaft. Pick the proper sized half circles, put them together so that the shaft passes through, but the bearing does not. With the plates now supporting the bearing, you can press the shaft out of it.

But... there’s no reason that you can’t use them the way you are, as long as they don’t fall and squish fingers.
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robotland
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Post by robotland » Thu Jun 09, 2005 8:31 am

When's the quilting bee to make the cover?
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LeChatNoir
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Post by LeChatNoir » Thu Jun 09, 2005 9:29 am

Maybe I should be on the lookout for several late 19th century industrial sewing machines that we could hook up to an overhead, open leather-belt pulley system...

powered by a water wheel of course.
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robotland
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Post by robotland » Thu Jun 09, 2005 9:35 am

EUREKA!!! THAT'S what the Revolving Man is for!!! We just have to arrange for a PTO!
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falk
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Post by falk » Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:00 am

LeChatNoir wrote:Maybe I should be on the lookout for several late 19th century industrial sewing machines
I had a girlfriend who had one of those puppies, but converted to use an electric motor. It only had two speeds: off and Way Too Fast. Scared the crap out of me. I swear if you screwed up it would run a line of stitches up your arm to the elbow before you could stop it.

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Lassen Forge
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Post by Lassen Forge » Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:40 am

Love those treadle machines, always wanted one for myself, but could never find (or afford) one... however... a few months ago I got the idea it'd be cool to bring a sewing machine to BRC as a way for someone to be able to fix a blownout tent...

About a month later, someone on a mailing list I'm on offered one that'd been sitting around... I called the woman who owned it, telling her my udea about making it available at BRC, etc... She says come on over...

So I go look at this machine, which is in surprisingly good shape. dusty and dirty, but not too bad. Then the woman tells me, as long as I do bring it out for others to use, I can have it. (BBS fell on the floor over that one!!)

What's nice was other than a belt and a bobbin cover (since replaced) it's all there. And after a little oil and cleaning and running in it sews better than "Betsy", my model 66 electric (also from the 20's). Now... if the generator happens, I *might* bring both, use Betsy as the main machine (stronger) and keep Trixie (the new old machine) for a backup.

WHo says miracles don't happen? Must be some magik in that Playa dust!!

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Post by robotland » Thu Jun 09, 2005 12:19 pm

I'm working on a multiple-use treadle for my studio, after seeing a BEAUTIFUL treadle-powered jigsaw at an art fair a while back....And a practical PTO for a bike would be VERY cool for running my buffing wheel on-playa. My sewing machine's a 50's-60's Elna, a real beauty that'll cruise through garment leather and is a lovely Russian Nuclear Plant Green.
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falk
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Post by falk » Thu Jun 09, 2005 1:49 pm

robotland wrote:I'm working on a multiple-use treadle for my studio, after seeing a BEAUTIFUL treadle-powered jigsaw at an art fair a while back....And a practical PTO for a bike would be VERY cool for running my buffing wheel on-playa. My sewing machine's a 50's-60's Elna, a real beauty that'll cruise through garment leather and is a lovely Russian Nuclear Plant Green.
Ooooh, I love those. I have three of them (don't ask). A piece of advice: When storing the machine, get a screwdriver and remove the big flywheel from the end of the machine. Otherwise, the rubber drive wheel will develop a flat spot in storage and the machine will go thumpthumpthump... forever after.

Image

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LeChatNoir
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Post by LeChatNoir » Thu Jun 09, 2005 6:57 pm

robotland wrote:EUREKA!!! THAT'S what the Revolving Man is for!!! We just have to arrange for a PTO!
Zounds!!! With a little lumber and some sort of belt... just think of all the rpms that could be generated with such a thing!! You could really step it up too, with a smaller pulley opposing the larger one (base of the man). This assuming that the rotating base of the Man is both big and round.

I'm remembering Conan pushing the grist mill here...

Oh and BBSue... you'll be pleased to note that if your gifted machine is a Singer, you can date it here

Sometime back I resurrected the little treadle machine that was in my barn when I bought the place I'm at now. She's a beauty and sewed up my canvas truck camper top for last year. I just love her. If she weren't so old (1886), I'd bring her to the playa. I'm on the lookout for a "beater" treadle machine for such a purpose.
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LeChatNoir
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Post by LeChatNoir » Thu Jun 09, 2005 7:00 pm

Oh, and when you’re done sewing, pop the leather belt off the machine pulley, else it’ll stretch out on you.
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