Anybody ever build a hush box?

A place to discuss all things involving power and technology (including cameras). Generator tips, alternative energy, lighting your camp/bike/art/self, sound systems and more.
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Captain Goddammit
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Sat Nov 04, 2017 10:19 am

You’re way off, yes.
Bbadger’s right, high heat paint has nothing to do with protecting a surface or material from heat. It’s simply paint that withstands high heat.
A dog igloo as a generator cover bears a remarkable resemblance to a pizza oven.

Even if the foam didn’t melt or ignite, the generator inside will overheat. Portable generators are air cooled.

It’s a whole lot more effective to not bring loud as hell lawnmower-engine generators.
The off-brand sets like Champions and such are getting pretty cheap.
But read my post a few spaces down about the long-term super cheap cost of Hondas.
Often it’s cheaper in the big picture to not buy junk.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:06 am

I've been using an awesome hush box for the last few years. It's 2 x 100 W solar panels & some deep cycle batteries that surround the generator that I no longer have.

You can barely hear it.

:shock:
In your wildest dreams you can not imagine the marvelous SURPRISES that await YOU.

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Sun Nov 05, 2017 11:54 am

Can’t hear your A/C either :)
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:30 am

Captain Goddammit wrote:Can’t hear your A/C either :)
Those sign waves do make a little more noise than a flat 12v but that's totally understandable (yeah, duh!).

The mister we had set up in our carport provided all the cooling I needed and it did away with all the melted ice from my jockey box. Cool air & cold beer (Win Win!)

Embrace the Dust, the Heat, and the Cold of night. If I cared about A/C I would probably just go to Hawaii.

-Your doing it wrong! :D
In your wildest dreams you can not imagine the marvelous SURPRISES that await YOU.

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Mon Nov 06, 2017 12:15 pm

FlyingMonkey wrote:
Captain Goddammit wrote: If I cared about A/C I would probably just go to Hawaii.
The more BM “progresses” the better Hawaii is!
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:54 pm

Captain Goddammit wrote:
FlyingMonkey wrote:
Captain Goddammit wrote: If I cared about A/C I would probably just go to Hawaii.
The more BM “progresses” the better Hawaii is!
Dammit! I just can't argue with your logic.
In your wildest dreams you can not imagine the marvelous SURPRISES that await YOU.

maladroit
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by maladroit » Sat Nov 11, 2017 1:47 am

The appeal of Burning Man has always been how much it sucks. We just have an steady influx of people with new, creative ways of making it suck.

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Sat Nov 11, 2017 9:19 am

maladroit wrote:The appeal of Burning Man has always been how much it sucks. We just have an steady influx of people with new, creative ways of making it suck.
I find it hard to argue with that logic!!
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by lucky420 » Sat Nov 11, 2017 10:01 am

Hush box? Oh I thought this might be a solution to an annoying campmate...

Carrion
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Sat Nov 11, 2017 11:25 am

It would be more effective in that application. Just put the offending camper in the box. They rarely make as much noise as a cheap generator.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:22 am

lucky420 wrote:Hush box? Oh I thought this might be a solution to an annoying campmate...

Carrion
Oh, that would have come in handy this year.

A small (depends on the head) hush box that can be secured around ones head.

Not as drastic as the garbage bag & zip-ties that I was considering.

I hereby commission FIGJAM to design one. :D
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by lucky420 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:13 pm

FlyingMonkey wrote:
lucky420 wrote:Hush box? Oh I thought this might be a solution to an annoying campmate...

Carrion
Oh, that would have come in handy this year.

A small (depends on the head) hush box that can be secured around ones head.

Not as drastic as the garbage bag & zip-ties that I was considering.

I hereby commission FIGJAM to design one. :D
Oh I like this “secured around the head” idea. Much easier to transport/store...
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Fri May 04, 2018 8:45 am

i know i bringing this thread from the dead but i just want to say something becuase these questions keep poping again and again and again

i been using generators alot in the past years
if you dont want noise as mentioned befor inverter generator are the way to go .

the problem is that they are $$$ and weak at least for me becuase anything below 2000 watt you could just buy one of those 12v to 110 or 220v hook it to your car and thats it

A- Diesel silent genertaors , the box types 186f they call them .
1- the use the same amount of fuel as 3000 watt but they provide you with 8000 to 10000 watt
2-they are designed much much better because in china that extra 100$ big diffrance between $hit and good.
3-you can make a phone call while standing beside it .even they sound cooler
4-they live well ,only when you are not using keep the tank filled to avoid rust.
5- easy to start with a push of a button and since its a diesel cold weather and rusbish fuel wont effect them .
6-no need for any DIY .
7-much safer no back fire no leaking from the carb .
8-use less oil and burn clean ,
a have one which costed me a 1000 $ and am very happy about it .


i had a friend that filled the tank with water and it only sufferd a minor damage to the piston so i put in a new piston and it was good as new .


B- Build an inverter type which am also doing right now just grap an alternator from the junk yard and hook it up to an engine of your choice and set the engine to 1500 rpm and hook a battery and an inverter .

keep away from those cheap crap they will die soon than later , you cant use them when you need them

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Fri May 04, 2018 12:05 pm

You posted quite a bit of misinformation bordering on rubbish.
someone wrote: the problem is that they are $$$ and weak at least for me becuase anything below 2000 watt you could just buy one of those 12v to 110 or 220v hook it to your car and thats it
You’ve obviously never done this. To even pull 1000 watts 120VAC you need a large inverter and extremely heavy cables connected to at least two, preferably four large batteries. And it won’t do it for very long. You’d be drawing 100 amps to make 1000 watts. (You have to figure in some losses). I know, I have a multiple-alternator and multiple battery system on my mutant vehicle and I draw 1000-1100 watts from it and I know what it takes to actually work.
someone wrote: Build an inverter type which am also doing right now just grap an alternator from the junk yard and hook it up to an engine of your choice and set the engine to 1500 rpm and hook a battery and an inverter
Just any junkyard alternator isn’t going to have enough output to make much power.
You don’t set the engine to 1500 rpm. You set the engine to where it runs best and gear the drive arrangement to make the alternator spin at about 5000 rpm.
Alternators are generally geared to spin at 2 to 3 times the engine speed in cars.
A single battery and inverter won’t let you draw much power from this setup.
This will work, don’t get me wrong, but it’s not gonna make 5000 or 2000 or even 1000 watts.

Diesel generators are nice, but heavy.
Are there any 45-pound 2200-watt diesel generators?
I don’t know where you got the idea diesels are less affected by cold vs. gasoline. I’d say the opposite is true.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Sat May 05, 2018 1:41 pm

sorry sir but your wronge am not talking rubbish

A- I did the time (study) you know engineer not bragging just stating a fact
B-Am doing the time am working engines day in and day out all kind you know CAT , Yanamar , and my Favorite detroit diesel
C-English is not my first language so if you gonna attack me for any incorrect words

1000 watt is 12 volt x 100 amp DC or 4 amp @ 240 volt ac

my oven and your oven draw 1000 watt day in and day out . yes check the sticker in the back maybe even more dependes on the size

car alternator are rated at 65 AMP DC charging , so 65 amp x 14.4 = 936 watt so please dont just make a big deal over 44 watt less


"You’d be drawing 100 amps to make 1000 watts"

if you gonna target me for and be all scientific and $hit an altreantor works at 14.4 at 1000 rpm not 10 VOLT


"you need a large inverter and extremely heavy cables '

Again your wronge

DC need Thick wires becuase high amp = high heat so yes you need 4mm wire from alt. to the the inverter but after the inverter a 1.5mm wire will carry up to 2000 watt at 240 vac and i dare you to proof me wronge.

Generators are rated at peak Load not continous load .

so 1000 watt is what the "setup" can provide the load to startup in cases of loads that require extra power such as motors .

"This will work, don’t get me wrong, but it’s not gonna make 5000 or 2000 or even 1000 watts."

i never said 5000 watt you didnt even read what i wrote i said if you need small setup you know the portable type you know sub 1000 watt which is 70 amp DC !!


"I don’t know where you got the idea diesels are less affected by cold vs. gasoline. I’d say the opposite is true."
DID YOU EVER SEE A CHINA Small engine? or a generator
IN our case portable Petrol Genartors and diesel generators .

Diesel ones have bigger flywheel and are compression engines where they dont require the fuel to evaportae like petrol and they dont gunk up as fast as the carb engines]

NO THERE is NO 45 lb diesel engine becuase they have to use REAL metal not ZINC (look up ZINC ) if you dont know what it is .And i dont know if you do carry your generator behind your back or something .


a simple design for portable inverter generator
a 5hp engine will provide around 3000 watt of power at 3600 rpm so at 1800 rpm it should be around 1200 watt approx
the sound will be also reduced aloot.

a crown vic alternator 95 amp DC =1300 watt easy to find cheap as dirt
55 amp battery

and a 2000 watt sine wave inverter
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Sat May 05, 2018 1:53 pm

1-SO if you gonna attack Someone and be all scientific and $hit AT LEAST GET YOUR NUMBERS RIGHT.

2- Am trying to save some people some money and time on my time , if you have a better ideas and doesnt envlove buy a new honda be my guest .

3- hush box , car mufflers , any DIY wont work on wallmart generator or equvliant DONT work.

4-i might not be a captian who is a very good investor that i even think the genertor as an investiment and take accound of Inflation but i know my stuff.

do you want to hear my other project which i know you hardcore sailers just hate
a fiberglass boat with 2x 4.6 engines from crown vics with mufflers and everything .

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Sat May 05, 2018 7:30 pm

There’s so much wrong with everything you said I haven’t got time to correct it all and no one would want to read through it all.

Your English is fine. What matters is electricity and automotive charging systems aren’t your best subject.
You’ve got some real world practice and experience to learn from still.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Sun May 06, 2018 2:35 am

"There’s so much wrong with everything you said I haven’t got time to correct it all and no one would want to read through it all. "

no sir please correct me . or the laws of physics are wronge so i will break it down to you

Watt = volt x amp

1 hp = 745 wattt

modern vechiles opreate at 14 volt anything less than 12.8 will cause the vechile not to opreate properly .

But the battery of the vechile opreates at 12.4 to 12.8 .

Engine power is not linear with rpm

but sound is linear with rpm

diesel provide more torque at low rpm .

Petrol need to evaportae in a carb in order for the engine to work .

or you {{{{{ CANT }}}}} because what i said is correct and what you said is wrong. the carbs on these things are crab , they are set to run rich (air/fuel ratio)

Anyway if you are on a budget and need a genrator looks for a portable diesel silent
it comes with the hush box coverd with acoustic foam in the inside and good exhaust system and intake and overall good engine.and with a 5kw to 15kw range

Image

And Mr.Captain

Its ok to be wrong some times , and there is no problem with learning , and i dont think am wrong being working for the past 10 years with electrical company and passed so many tests and was even was responsible for building substations and recently into large solar power setup 60kw and above.

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Sun May 06, 2018 5:39 am

Alright professor I’ll bore everyone else (and myself) and explain a few things to you.
Those textbook things are mostly (but not all) correct. I’m not confused about any of the textbook math.
The parts you don’t understand because you’ve clearly never done this are many.
What I told you is that you will be pulling about 100 amps for an inverter to put out 1000 watts of 120VAC. No, that isn’t what your oversimplified math says, because you aren’t accounting for inefficiencies in the inverter and cable losses.

Very heavy and very short cables are required or you’ll never get that much current through them, and a single car-style battery will be hard-pressed to handle such a load. Usually they just can’t do it.

Setting “the engine of your choice” to 1500 rpm is meaningless, the ideal RPM depends on what that engine is.

A 65-amp alternator will theoretically make almost 1000 watts... it’ll also overheat if it operates at absolute max for very long.
It also needs to be spinning at high RPM.

Gasoline does not evaporate in a carburetor. It’s atomizes into very small particles because it sprays through a small orifice. Gas engines do better at cold temperatures because of the spark ignition.

Your home made generator with a small engine, car alternator, a battery and an inverter WILL work. It just won’t make as much power as you think it will going by your calculations that leave out even more variables than I’ve already mentioned.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Popeye » Sun May 06, 2018 9:35 am

Someone: Welcome to Eplaya, stop over at the Greeters Station and tell us a little about yourself, what brings you to the burn and what you intend to contribute.

The Captain is correct, on paper your ideas look good but in the Real World they will not work for all the reasons (and more) the Captain lists. Suggest you build one, bring it and show us we are wrong.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Sun May 06, 2018 3:50 pm

Dear Sir ,

Am not a prof. but i hope to be one near soon , they get $hit load of money

"i have never done this "

what do you call this or that .

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Popeye » Sun May 06, 2018 4:04 pm

That looks like an off-the-shelf Yanmar. Is it? Certainly not an alternator off a car.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Sun May 06, 2018 4:57 pm

Ok Mr captain .

I said am not an native english speaker so when i said evaoprite you know the rest .

All these engines are mine expect the new @hit on wheels its for a friend New and wouldnt start big news.

wronge valve clearnce , dead battery and bolts are not tight.

so again i have done this . and i was simplifing things for you.So all what you said am aware off.


The whole idea came to me from a cheap friend of mine , we where talking about camping and he told me that he is not using a generator at all just one of those cheap 12 to 220 inverter hooked to his camry and powering his whole camp i was like what and yes 3 months camping not a single problem.

searched google its not an invention lots of people hooked vechile alt. to engine and used it for making power .

Sorry sir i will not carry this rabbit chase anymore .

I was tring to be as respectful as i can even when you are not.

Its your right to belive in whatever ,hell the earth can even be flat .

i dont know whats your angle , well i provided my information/experince for anyone who is intersted
IF you want to get even more owned just ask for it

btw these are water pumps that we rent them to oil drilling company along with the service and pipe line
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Sun May 06, 2018 5:14 pm

Popeye wrote:Someone: Welcome to Eplaya, stop over at the Greeters Station and tell us a little about yourself, what brings you to the burn and what you intend to contribute.


The Captain is correct, on paper your ideas look good but in the Real World they will not work for all the reasons (and more) the Captain lists. Suggest you build one, bring it and show us we are wrong.


Thank you popeye , i will , actully i was searching something and dropped here when i saw what effort people are trying to do to those cheap crap i regeister in order to save some people some time and money.


well i dont even fully understand the whole burning man event but it look like something i would love to visit when i come to the US


well its a yanmar L100 clone but oversized 500cc engine its called 188F the one that are popluar are called 186f

Its made in china but i bought from a guy because he orderd a few custom build for him with higher quailty materials.

The one in the corner with small wheels PRC JUNK i done everything anyone ever sugessted to reduce noise and make work properly even after replacing the engine with a honda engine and is still as crap as befor


I dont know if you can see the other attachments but there is a picture of 73cc two stroke engine from a 2 stroke genrator converted to run a belt.

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Mon May 07, 2018 5:16 am

I said several times it WILL work. It just won’t make as much power as you think it will.
“Powering a whole camp” means nothing.
Some camps use 100,000 watts. Some use none.

What I have tried to tell you several times is you won’t hold a continuous load of even 1000 watts with a setup like you describe.

The reason I mentioned that is so some guy doesn’t read your stuff and think it’s accurate. It will work but not well.
It will be heavy, loud and use too much fuel for the power it does produce. Kind of a shitty setup for Burning Man, where you have to bring absolutely everything with you.

Simplifying for me implies you think I don’t understand this stuff. That’s another mistake.

If you’d like to know what WILL make and hold a 1000 watt AC load, two alternators in parallel and a three-battery bank of automotive-size deep cycle batteries connected by three pairs of very short 2-gauge cables to a 2000 watt inverter is able to just barely hold 1000 watts, in actual, real practice.
I have done this type of system with a lot of different setups.
Those two alternators were GM CS130s, rated much higher than the 65-amp junkyard parts you mentioned.
It absolutely won’t put out that much on a single battery, or with any less robust cables. Or one small weak alternator.
If you spin one fast enough to make max output full time it’ll overheat. They aren’t designed for a 100% duty cycle. You have to be conservative or it will fail on the playa.
I know that from years of doing it.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Token » Mon May 07, 2018 8:05 am

I love alternators.

They are a marvel of physics and engineering.

The science behind them is a ballet of magnetic flux densities flowing and intersecting to coax electrons into bouncing their merry way down windings and coils.

Just sexy as hell geek-porn!

My parents got me one of those educational kits when I was 8 years old with the simplified motors, alternators, magnets, inductors and whatnot and I never looked back. Am hooked for life and ended up an engineer.

I’m thinking we should have a tread for this Cap’n, just for schnitz-n-giggles.

I wouldn’t mind finding a 56V marine alternator, or at least a big diesel 28V to fiddle with again. One of them big 300A jobs.

Maxwell was a god amongst insects.

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Mon May 07, 2018 2:00 pm

Oh yeah... I always wanted to really step up the system on the Land Yacht, but that one-week-a-year usefulness prevented it from being practical.
I did it to eliminate the Honda generator I originally had running on the thing, since it already had an engine that could provide plenty of belt-drive power.

Not everything at Burning Man is or should be “practical”... I’d kinda like a super-janky camp power setup that ran a 100 year old “hit and miss” engine and some big alternator. Preferably with a few unnecessary “Jacobs ladders” and such.
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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Mon May 07, 2018 7:02 pm

just for your information generators are rated at peak power not continuous power so a 2000 watt generator will be able to provide those 2000 watt for a few second or even less than a second to provide the devices for engouh power to startup so am following the same rule because its the norm . at least for us in the trade
so it might be my mistake to clearfiy this as we always assume that other people know.



but you are the one that who dont know anything about anything if you want to get a 1000 watt contiunous you should build a 2000 watt system not 1000 watt why ...... read a book or try (trail and error) . to hell with collage degreas and work and all this stuff , google is not a replacment for books and hand on experince .

so your right and wronge in the same time .

Ok so to make things clear yes those 1000 watt is just for a few seconds or even less but am not trying to mislead anyone its a norm among manfuctures and that yanamr L100 clone can provide 10kw for a second or less and its more of a 7kw CONTONIUS power.

this argument remind me of a similar argument of a friend who bought a 3 kw genertor for an 3kw AC unit ,
its should work because both their sticker have 3000 watt power.....


a personal word of adivce for you . dont just attack people and look down on them
a- its not nice or polite .
b- you dont know what your missing .

my manager who is an avation engineer with 30+ plus years experince listen to me and even to the uneducted labour and i aslo listen to those an educted labour and i do that alot.

example we had one of those fancy generators made by a major company 300 kva as i rember with self diagnostic , remote montionrg ,color screen you name it and its a couple months old and every time they turn it on its works for less than an hour then it shuts off , the manfucturer didnt know what to do and a junior mechinic propsed that we load the hell out of it as it might not like to work relaxed (as he said )we took his advice even its werid and load the crap out of it and it seems that partcular set like it this way .

i will end with this with .

A-if you have one of those wall mart generators dont waste your time or your money use it as is until it dies.
B-if you can affrod a honda suit case and your happy with the power it provides get one
C-if you can affrod a yanamr L100 or a clone get one and you never will regert it.
D-if you cannot affrod or you just want to try or enjoy DIY stuff try.... you will never be disappointed
E-Thank you captain its it for you that i learnet about the burning man , i saw it on the TV befor but i didnt get what its really about so if it wasnt for this arugument i would never really know and love what is all about
and am even planning to come .
and if you require any help i will be happy to do it if you see a red and white flag with 973 on it . its me and your always welcome

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Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by someone » Mon May 07, 2018 7:11 pm

lets argue about something else

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Camp Name: First Camp
Location: Seattle, WA

Re: Anybody ever build a hush box?

Post by Captain Goddammit » Tue May 08, 2018 4:54 pm

Yeah you’re right about one thing, this is useless. You would (apparently) be amazed at how much Burners know about generators. We know about the electrical formulas, the continuous ratings and peak ratings, and even how much less power you will actually get at the altitude of the playa.

We know what really works on the playa and how well it works and for how long in the dust and heat.

Diesel sets are great. But not very portable.
If you want to carry one from halfway around the world, go for it.

Personally I’m a fan of the 2000-watt Hondas. They weigh less than 50 pounds and a pair of them makes enough power to run air conditioning, microwave, tons of lights, power tools, etc. All at the same time.
And they use about 5 gallons a day, for the pair, running continuously.

They are the cheapest sets you can buy. How can I say that? I bought two over twelve years ago. I sold them, twelve years later, still working perfectly, for $1400.
Then I ordered myself a brand new pair for $1800. I didn’t need to, I just figured why not freshen up.

So those Hondas cost $200 each to own them for twelve years, and have no troubles with them at all. I could have kept them and still be running them. Someone still is.

That’s big-picture economy. Try to get that much of your purchase price back twelve years later for a well-used generator of almost any other type.
GreyCoyote: "At this rate it wont be long before he is Admiral Fukkit."

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