Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

What to wear? What not to wear? Come here to find and how to make anything you'd wear on your body - from goggles and playawear to bodypainting and adornments.
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Aurelia
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Aurelia » Sun Aug 09, 2015 7:06 pm

silly, lbri !

you are indeed a fortunate one if that is the cause of you being offended

xoA.

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Joeln » Sun Aug 09, 2015 8:09 pm

Fucking awesome thread this is eplaya at its best!
Collapse first and avoid the rush

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby tatonka » Sun Aug 09, 2015 8:39 pm

I wore a sombero last year , and people were calling me Barbarosa !! and I dont even have a red beard .

Guess mexicans will be offended now :(

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby maladroit » Sun Aug 09, 2015 9:44 pm

I think it works because if you proudly wear a sombrero, maybe you become an honorary Mexican. Seems to be working for you!

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby DerbyDave 18 » Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:06 pm

Boy, I thought I worried about things too much. Solardor has me beat by a mile. So what if someone wears a Native American headdress who isn't a Native American? I may be bringing a kimono with me. Will I be disrespecting Asians if I do? I have some wings I'm bringing too. Hope I don't offend any angels or christians.

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby some seeing eye » Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:25 pm

To wear Native American feathers and garb is a debate within teens and twenties individuals wih disposable income obsessed with fashion, festival fashion or are Native American cultural activists. ePlaya is completely irrelevant to most all of them.

This particular Native American cultural appropriation discussion is not subject to reductio ad absurdum, to every element of the mixing pot or cultural sampling, to disprove it. That is because digressions have resulted in major apologies and banning it at some festivals.

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(Nope does not apply to other cultural sampling, dreds, sombreros, whatever)
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Bless
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Bless » Mon Aug 10, 2015 2:36 am

My ancestors were brutally murdered in the holocaust. Therefore any appropriation of European Jewish culture is strictly verboten. Passover Seders are cancelled this year! No more latkes for you! Take off that kippah and throw it in the trash. And don't let me hear you call anyone a schmuck! If I see another dirty hippie wearing a hamsa, I'm gonna scream oy vey!




Oh, wait... I forgot this only applies to Native Americans. Never mind.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Bless » Mon Aug 10, 2015 3:40 am

Now I know memes aren't generally intended for rigorous factual analysis, but "my ancestors" never killed a single Native American. The same can be said for the majority of Americans who are descended from immigrants who arrived in this country at the beginning of the 20th century.

Every European alive today isn't guilty or culpable for the Nazi holocaust. Nor is every American responsible for the Iraq war. Why don't we ban keffiyehs while we're at it.

And god bless Glastonbury, which in its eternal wisdom, has banned Native American war bonnets. Now if only they could get their LNT game together.

This whole discussion is specious at best.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Simon of the Playa » Mon Aug 10, 2015 3:55 am

did someone say latkes?


i love latkes.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby some seeing eye » Mon Aug 10, 2015 6:53 am

Some of my ancestors probably did kill them. We all live on land they were killed for.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Simon of the Playa » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:07 am

ok Marlon Brando, we get it...

your position is that as a white man you have the right to tell other white men what to wear because of a shared "history".








don't get me started on this slippery slope, it will only get ugly.

honestly, i would never wear a head-dress unless I MADE IT MYSELF, but this thread actually makes me want to wear a store bought one now just to prove a point.




you are not my playa mommy, and you can not tell me what to do.

suck it.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Simon of the Playa » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:09 am

btw.



stupidest fucking thread, ever.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby ygmir » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:11 am

find or show me a "culture/people" who have not killed, or been killed in some historic war/invasion/takeover.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby tamarakay » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:21 am

Pretty sure my ancestors DID kill some native Americans. Also pretty sure it went the other way too. AND there was that great great great grandma that was kidnapped, then recovered years later with a couple kids in tow. From there it gets kinda gray. Then the French great great from the other side of the family that killed an Irishman. Fled to America and ended up hanged for horse theft. Also somewhere in there the dalton gang was somehow related to me. I wanted to name my first son dalton, but my Grammy said no. Only time I shouldn't have listened to her.

Anyway, a long way of saying I proudly come from a long line of dysfunction and don't give too many shits about offending someone. Just ask old dd.

*edited to fix their, there, they're*. Yeesh.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Aurelia » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:37 am

my was husband's kilt indicated that an ancestor raped a..
but he wore it with that stripe anyway

I come of an age when I whistle at you and call you all

CUTIE PIE

xoA.

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Ratty » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:44 am

My Father moved to Eureka, discovered that our ancestors were explorers, I lost 2 friends in the Hoopa and Yuroc tribes. Honestly. They never spoke to me again. Sheeeesh. I thought it would bring us closer together, (being blood related and all).
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby AntiM » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:53 am

I know my ancestors killed Native Americans, I have vague memories being told family history, a great-great(??) grand uncle's profession was "Indian Killer". I heard the story much less as the great aunts passed away in the 70s. But my Mormon ancestors faced some pretty steep oppression and along the way, which my mother hammered into me. Driven from every land. Yeah, I didn't learn about Mountain Meadows until I was an adult. A damn lot of killing every which way.

I pretty much try not to kill people.

I'd feel offensive if I wore a headdress, but not because I am all that sensitive, more like I hate MOOPtastic feathers. If I have snarled about headdresses in the past, it would be for that reason, not cultural correctness.

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby some seeing eye » Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:19 am

I told a likely 20-something virgin that they probably would not see much of it and in any event not to worry about it. And as a bleeding heart liberal I think it is a stupid fashion trend. Many people agree with me. Fashion is trendy. Someone wears one to Coachella, then all of a sudden they are being mass produced in China.

It's all signalling. If you wear one you are signalling that you are up on trends but didn't get the latest message (or are defying the message). The people around you will respond to that message based on their own information. Festival goers in their teens and 20s are almost exclusively signalling to their peers.

BM was spared from the headdress trend by the feather ban, lifted last year. So we may be subject to it until the trend plays out. But hey, if you want to make feather headdresses mandatory for the M&G, maybe you can invite Donald Trump too, he thinks the world of Indians. It could be like the intentionally embarrassing Bohemian Grove, fraternity or sorority photos.

I like this thread, it's old school ePlaya, which we need a dose of periodically!
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby tatonka » Mon Aug 10, 2015 3:09 pm

My great grandpa Sam ( full blooded Cree ) was a sheriff on the reservation , he kill three indians ( his own people ) two of them were murders , and he waited up in a tree and shot them in the back. The other was a rare gunfight , they saw each other and started shooting ( no waiting in the street ) . He got him before the bad guy could do any damage.
Those who are able to see beyond the shadows and lies of their culture will never be understood, let alone believed by the masses.
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby chiefdanfox » Mon Aug 10, 2015 4:17 pm

it is ImageEVERYWHERE!

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby tatonka » Mon Aug 10, 2015 5:44 pm

Image
Those who are able to see beyond the shadows and lies of their culture will never be understood, let alone believed by the masses.
-Plato

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby BurnLiker » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:23 am

SolarDor wrote:Dear Burners: This is going to be my first Burn. When I first wanted to go, many years ago, I had a broader concept of what I found to be socially acceptable and unacceptable... Each year that I have not gone, however, my taste in what I expect from human expression has become more greatly focused, due to social and cultural advancements that are current HOT topics. I understand that the event exists for individuals who practice radical forms of artistry mixed with individuals who pretend to do this.

Though I understand the Burn is whatever experience I make of it, I also find myself searing every time I witness a white person donning a Native American War Headdress.

I know loud Cultural Appropriation is going to be highly prevalent, and I need to just find a way to deal with it for 7 days to avoid having an experience that further sours me to privileged people who, in an ugly fashion, warp the historical meaning of cultural objects and traditions. I am personally attending for lasting artistic inspiration, not 7 days of partying.
At this point, I'm feeling that the easiest way for me to do this is to just completely disassociate with the community and observe from the background; but, I feel like I might miss out on a lot with this perspective.

My question for you burners is: how do you personally navigate around this very real societal issue to find that which you are looking to experience at the Burn? I need answers from people of multiple cultures and ethnicities on this one. It simply won't do to hear only answers from white persons.

I honestly wish Cultural Appropriation wasn't a thing. I would love to be able to celebrate cultures [that I first research and honor] through costume mimicry. However, in recent years, because of the deeds of truly prejudice people, any form of cultural mimicry is seen as a systemic form of prejudice/racism.

It's not just N.A. Headdresses...it's about any cultural artifact worn by a person who by ethnicity or birthplace does not belong to that culture.

I've been irritated with this subject, as a person who wants to celebrate culture through a lens of love and wonderment. But, I do my best to honor the system in place...that this way of celebrating culture is not currently acceptable.

How do we navigate this at Burning Man? How do an array of ethnicities navigate this issue at Burning Man?
look, I get your point but like, Burning Man is ultimately about absolute freedom and coexistence as I understand it. If there is any place that should be free from worried about political correctness these days, honestly, it should be Burning Man. It's one of the reasons I'm so excited about going. the whole PC crowd and SJW are probably the biggest porblem facing our society today in addition to wasteful spending.

I'm not trying to start a fight or anything, that's not what this is all about, but I was kinda hoping this kinda self conscious crap we could leave in the real world. Let's party. :twisted:

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby maladroit » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:32 am

BurnLiker wrote:look, I get your point but like, Burning Man is ultimately about absolute freedom and coexistence as I understand it. If there is any place that should be free from worried about political correctness these days, honestly, it should be Burning Man. It's one of the reasons I'm so excited about going. the whole PC crowd and SJW are probably the biggest porblem facing our society today in addition to wasteful spending.

I'm not trying to start a fight or anything, that's not what this is all about, but I was kinda hoping this kinda self conscious crap we could leave in the real world. Let's party. :twisted:


I thought that when we finally decided what Burning Man was about, it would be shut down for good? That was the agreement, right?

Absolute freedom is a bit at odds with coexistence. And it's also a great place to become more conscious of one's self, examine your opinions and use the city as both a petri dish and microscope to test ideas. Many, many people go out there and don't party at all.

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby BurnLiker » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:38 am

absolutely. I guess i probably phrased that wrong. That's kind of my point actually, that people can do whatever they like there! Regardless of what someone else thinks or without the blowback from the whole PC crowd.

I for one will be partying though. :twisted:

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby Simon of the Playa » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:46 am

thats nice...
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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby maladroit » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:49 am

BurnLiker wrote:people can do whatever they like there! Regardless of what someone else thinks or without the blowback from the whole PC crowd.


So if you do something really offensive, and someone starts yelling at you about it, what are you going to do? Are you going to be one of those "I can do whatever I want! You can't tell me what not to do, this is Burning Man! You aren't allowed to voice your opinion here! Only I can!"

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby BurnLiker » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:55 am

umm that's pretty much the opposite of what I said, I think anybody should be able to express themselves however they see fit, free from judgment. that's a part of the core burning man ethos as I understand it. burning man is not the place for others to police how we express ourselves, that's one of the big problems in our society today in my view and one of the reasons I'm so excited for my first burn.

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby StrepThroatHaver » Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:01 am

its almost 2017 and white people still wear Native american Headdress? holy shit

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby maladroit » Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:08 am

BurnLiker wrote:umm that's pretty much the opposite of what I said, I think anybody should be able to express themselves however they see fit, free from judgment. that's a part of the core burning man ethos as I understand it. burning man is not the place for others to police how we express ourselves, that's one of the big problems in our society today in my view and one of the reasons I'm so excited for my first burn.


How do you plan to enforce the "free from judgement" part though? There is PLENTY of judgement and antagonism on the playa. Those are also valid forms of expression. I just have heard all this before, and it sounds like you don't understand that while you can do whatever the fuck you want, as long as you do it around other humans they are also free to express their displeasure.

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Re: Cultural Appropriation and Burning Man

Postby BurnLiker » Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:14 am

that's exactly the problem I'm talking about, everyone is so sensitive anymore. it's like your looking for ways to be offended. political correctness limits expression, it is a cancer on our society. I'd like to think burning man is a little sanctuary from all that bs, maybe that makes me an idealist but so be it,


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