dry ice

Swamp Coolers, Cooler Management, Dry Ice, Misting Systems, and just plain how to beat the heat.
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FIGJAM
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Re: dry ice

Postby FIGJAM » Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:21 pm

It will last about 5 days and the frozen items will take a couple of days to thaw.
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Swope904
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Re: dry ice

Postby Swope904 » Mon Dec 30, 2013 9:32 pm

really only 5 days? I figured 75p would cover 7 days. How much for all 7 days?

So meat and such takes about 48 hours to thaw?

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Re: dry ice

Postby FIGJAM » Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:20 pm

I've read 10 pounds of dry ice per day, but I've never achieved that.

Dry ice is a lot colder than a freezer, so it takes longer for things to thaw.

Plus you are moving stuff from the frozen cooler to the daily ice chest.

I have a 120 gal. igloo extreme and I use 70 pounds to get me through the burn. 8)
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GreyCoyote
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Re: dry ice

Postby GreyCoyote » Tue Dec 31, 2013 4:49 am

The strength of dry ice is also its weakness. It is COLD.

Heat transfer is a function of the difference between two temperatures. If you have a 100F ambient and a -40 cooler temp, a lot more heat will be transferred than if you had a 100F ambient and a 33F cooler.

So yeah, you can super-freeze your otter pops, but the price is steep due to the extreme thermal gradient.

Three best strategies:

1). Pre-freeze everything at home. Put your freezer to the coldest setting and let your stuff freeze for a week before BM.

2). Double-insulate the cooler and get it off the playa floor in a shaded spot. Assign a Cooler Nazi to eliminate in-and-outs. Keep it closed.

3). Wrap the dry ice in newspaper. This prevents the cooler from going -40. All you really want is about +25F. remember that frozen is frozen. You dont need ultracold. In doing so you save a lot of dry ice.

FWIW, one resourceful burner had access to liquid nitrogen and put a dribble into his cooler for a few hours before leaving to prefreeze everything. Worked nicely but he still needed a trip to Arctica the last day.
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FossaFerox
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Re: dry ice

Postby FossaFerox » Tue Dec 31, 2013 11:07 am

We were the last ones on our block to have Dry Ice this year. This was awesome since regular ice isn't sufficient to freeze Otter Pops, you NEED the dry ice for that. We were gifted several hundred melted otter pops on Thursday or Friday which we spent an afternoon regifting to random passersby. It was hilarious, we had to heckle people to get them to take them half the time.

Seriously, my buddies and I were sitting in front of our camp in camp chairs with frozen otter pops jammed in the cup holders of the chairs shouting at people "This guy doesn't want a free otter pop. Who in their right mind would want a frozen desert treat in this unbearable heat? He's way happier without something frozen and delicious, clearly. See? He's not even looking over here." It was awesome fun. Met some great people including a camp mate's college roommate from freshman year who he hadn't seen or talked to in years.

Anyway, to drift away from the drift. The biggest tricks are the simplest. Keep the cooler in the shade, wrapped in a blanket, and off the playa floor (cinder blocks work great for this). The single most important thing, though, is that you ONLY open it once a day. No exceptions. It also helps to do it in the coolest part of the day. We wound up losing about 9 lbs a day if memory serves.
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Swope904
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Re: dry ice

Postby Swope904 » Wed Jan 01, 2014 4:34 pm

-Around 10 pounds a day
-Insulate the cooler, Keep it off the ground and in shade
-Keep the cooler closed and taped, only once a day access NO EXCEPTIONS
-Wrap the Dry Ice in news paper to protect the cooler and keep temps from getting to cold

Anything else I am missing?

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Re: dry ice

Postby GreyCoyote » Wed Jan 01, 2014 5:31 pm

Swope904 wrote:Anything else I am missing?


Bacon. Lots of bacon. And of course a ticket. These are the only two FIRM prerequisites for Burningman. :mrgreen:
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Swope904
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Re: dry ice

Postby Swope904 » Thu Jan 02, 2014 2:19 am

I will bring lots of bacon for everyone <3

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AntiM
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Re: dry ice

Postby AntiM » Thu Jan 02, 2014 5:13 am

We used dry ice one year, it carbonated our cream puffs. We just bring the shave ice machine and use block ice from Arctica.

For the record, I turn down Otter Pops. They have just enough sodium benzoate in them I'd feel poorly the rest of the day.

Bacon? Now we're talking.

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Canoe
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Re: dry ice

Postby Canoe » Thu Jan 02, 2014 9:45 am

Swope904 wrote:Anything else I am missing?

Yup.
Go find the treads that detail how to maximize the performance of your cooler.
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Swope904
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Re: dry ice

Postby Swope904 » Thu Jan 02, 2014 11:22 am

Canoe wrote:
Swope904 wrote:Anything else I am missing?

Yup.
Go find the treads that detail how to maximize the performance of your cooler.


:)

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Re: dry ice

Postby BeeWeeDee » Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:46 pm

These are plans for a home built freezer that has 12 cubic feet of freezer volume.

I used 3 sheets of 2" thick structural foam insulation, insulation adhesive and cardboard with lots of duct tape. Everything that went in this box was pre-frozen including several 1 gal. jugs of ice. From a separate design sheet I predicted about 10 lbs/day of dry ice and that is in line with other reports in this areana, however, this freezer/box/chest is a bit larger (12 cu.ft or 90 gallons).

I probably could have done better by shading it, raising it up off the bed of my truck etc. etc., but 100 lbs of dry ice in the center compartment lasted from Wednesday night pre burn through the Man burn. I only opened the chest/box/freezer once a day and having a three section top minimized losses. After the dry ice evaporated, the remaining gallon jugs of ice were left to keep a separate cooler stocked.

Price of materials for the freezer ran to about $150 and I paid about $1/ lb for the dry ice. Price for dry ice varied A LOT - e.g. the DI in Winnemucca was outrageous. Best thing was handing out rock hard icecream bars on Thursday and cooking egg bakes throughout the week.

If I get ambitious, I will post some photos of the box and the design calculations.
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Canoe
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Re: dry ice

Postby Canoe » Fri Apr 04, 2014 5:40 pm

Cool!

Shade would definitely help, as would a radiant barrier.
Video games are giving kids unrealistic expectations on how many swords they can carry.
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... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

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Re: dry ice

Postby BeeWeeDee » Mon May 19, 2014 12:57 pm

I finally took the pictures to finish this post.

I partitioned the "freezer" space into 3 sections with the dry ice in the middle. It works better if the dry Ice is high up in the section because the carbon dioxide is heavier than air and sinks. Pretty much everything stored above the level of dry ice is going to be warmer (read: melt sooner).

Box1.jpg shows the completed box with the 3-part lid inverted.

Box 2.jpg is a picture of the 3-part lid in place. Originally I had a top made out of cardboard as well but rain on the trip home wrecked havoc with that idea.

Box3.jpg gives a glimpse of the interior of the box with the 3 compartments.
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Re: dry ice

Postby BeeWeeDee » Mon May 19, 2014 1:00 pm

Box 1 - showing lid construction
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Re: dry ice

Postby BeeWeeDee » Mon May 19, 2014 1:02 pm

Box 2 - showing the lid in place.

To keep the lid in place I used a pair of cinch straps
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Re: dry ice

Postby BeeWeeDee » Mon May 19, 2014 1:05 pm

Box 3.jpg - Shows the 3 compartments and a handy storage area for the trip home for monkey hut parts. I think the non recyclables fit in here as well.
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Re: dry ice

Postby BeeWeeDee » Mon May 19, 2014 1:45 pm

Finally some design data. It seemed to be pretty close to reality...
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Re: dry ice

Postby stern_beaver » Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:47 pm

If you've got the time, freezer space at home, and are bringing a big-ish cooler to the playa, freezing 2-3 of the 2.5 gallon plastic water containers lasts even longer than freezing single gallons, and they make nice little partitions to keep your beers, (frozen) coconut waters, and foodstuffs neatly organized.

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Re: dry ice

Postby theCryptofishist » Fri Jul 18, 2014 10:46 pm

This thread is over 10 years old, and going strong.
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MigsyD
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Re: dry ice

Postby MigsyD » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:19 pm

Still unsure if loose ice placed on top of newspaper - wrapped dry ice should be in bags or just poured on top. Anyone?
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StevenGoodman
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Re: dry ice

Postby StevenGoodman » Tue Jul 29, 2014 1:39 pm

Wrap your dry ice in a towel. At the bottom of the cooler will last longer, at the top will keep things colder.

Do NOT let anything wet touch your dry ice. If you want ice in with the dry ice make sure it is in bottles.

Absolutely make sure any cooler is not directly on the playa (and in the shade). During the day the playa will transmit lots of heat. Air is crappy at transmitting heat. (Remind self to pack reflectix.)

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playalynn
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Re: dry ice

Postby playalynn » Wed Aug 06, 2014 1:26 pm

For those passing through Sacramento, the cheapest dry ice is $1.20 as of this date at American Ice Company http://www.americanice-sacramento.com/. They will be open Sunday the 24th between 10 and 2 for those that are concerned about picking up ice that day. Nice guy there, Chris, asked people to call the day before to make sure they have supply before coming in. They have ice in slabs, not crushed. Grocery stores in Sac are all at least 30 cents per pound more.

Also kind of "cool" (ouch): They are the oldest ice plant on the west coast and give tours to show how ice was made 90 years ago.

I hope that sharing this kind of info is allowed, it shows up regarding Reno and Fernley dry ice sales elsewhere on the thread. If not, please accept my apology and remove it. Seems a waste to have everybody do all the same research.

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FIGJAM
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Re: dry ice

Postby FIGJAM » Fri Aug 22, 2014 1:23 pm

Just picked up my dry ice.

80 pounds for $32.

Locate your local wholesale ice cream dealer.

Look for big boy or excel ice cream wholesalers. 8)
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Re: dry ice

Postby snardy » Sun Aug 24, 2014 10:59 am

FIGJAM wrote:Just picked up my dry ice.

80 pounds for $32.

Locate your local wholesale ice cream dealer.

Look for big boy or excel ice cream wholesalers. 8)


This was such a brilliant idea, Figjam. All the dry ice wholesalers in Los Angeles want $1/pound + tax. And they require a 45 minute roundtrip drive.

The local ice cream wholesaler 1 mile from my place in Culver City is selling at 70 cents/pound. I just need to pick it up before 230pm tomorrow :D

Check out M&M Wholesale Ice Cream Company in Los Angeles on W Washington Blvd :P

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Re: dry ice

Postby ChicoTerri » Tue Aug 04, 2015 4:12 pm

Have any of you used dry ice pellets? They are by far the cheapest per pound locally, .54 a pound versus 1.99 for slabs. My concern is that the increased surface area will mean they will sublimate MUCH faster. :( My hubby's concern is that we will be overcome by CO2 on the way to the playa by leakage from the ice chest in the back of the RV. :shock: Has anyone used these with success? Thoughts? Thanks!
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Canoe
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Re: dry ice

Postby Canoe » Wed Aug 05, 2015 7:43 am

ChicoTerri wrote:Have any of you used dry ice pellets? ... My concern is that the increased surface area will mean they will sublimate MUCH faster....

Correct.
Note that bricks usually come wrapped and sublimate slower when left wrapped.
ChicoTerri wrote:... My hubby's concern is that we will be overcome by CO2 on the way to the playa by leakage from the ice chest in the back of the RV. ...

Possibly. Depends on the rate of sublimation and the fresh-air flow in your RV. Doesn't your RV have a low O2 sensor in the living space?
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... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

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Re: dry ice

Postby ChicoTerri » Wed Aug 05, 2015 1:41 pm

The new plan is to buy big chunks of dry ice in Reno. Thanks for the input, Canoe!
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usurpedus
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Re: dry ice

Postby usurpedus » Sat Aug 15, 2015 6:19 pm

per another thread:

Crystal Ice on 4th St, just west of Keystone Ave, in Reno they are very burner friendly

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Re: dry ice

Postby lucky420 » Sat Aug 15, 2015 6:22 pm

Where do you think the ice at Arctica comes from? :)
Oh my god, it's HUGE!


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