cooling your tent or van

Swamp Coolers, Cooler Management, Dry Ice, Misting Systems, and just plain how to beat the heat.
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RedPanther
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by RedPanther » Tue Jun 28, 2016 3:54 pm

Thanks for the awesome advice! I'll get right on that.

The humidity was a monkeywrench today; it's usually 8-11% but we have some early monsoons starting to move into the area.

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Jackass
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Jackass » Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:16 pm

My swap cooler in the shop is giving me a 28 degree drop at 43% humidity. It's 101 in the shop and she's putting out 73 degrees, works like a champ. Using about 2- 2.5 gallons per hour.

Perhaps my humid o meter is lying
Sooner or later, it will get real strange...

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by EGAZ » Tue Jun 28, 2016 10:11 pm

Wolfraider:
Has anyone ever tried a "four walled open air" cooler? ..........
Yup....
Image

Red Panther, you need something more like this. Or just flex on the fan. Don't go smaller diameter than the fan.
Image

Jackass, I think your humidity sensor is incorrect, and maybe your thermometer too. Those are some impressive numbers for evap cooling..... ;)
2nd time better than the first. And the first was pretty Freakin' Great!
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by wolfraider » Wed Jun 29, 2016 10:46 am

Yup....
Awesome. Thanks, Elder. Do you have a link for where that design came from?

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FIGJAM
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Wed Jun 29, 2016 1:35 pm

That's a picture of a down draft swamp cooler for a house.

I made a 12 volt side draft version that you can also keep a case of beer chilled in the bottom!!!
403487559.jpg
403577514.jpg
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by wolfraider » Wed Jun 29, 2016 2:27 pm

Well look at that pretty thing!

I'm going to go back to the drawing board with some longer legs and blue pads and hopefully that will increase my fan's output.

Thanks everyone and THANKS FIGJAM! Here's to a cooler burn. ;-)

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by EGAZ » Wed Jun 29, 2016 7:11 pm

Wolf, its just a basic design for a home evap cooling unit, or swamp cooler. See these links.

Wikipedia

Details of operation

2010 eplaya post, 4-sided RV evap for inspiration....
2nd time better than the first. And the first was pretty Freakin' Great!
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by knobdyspcl » Wed Jun 29, 2016 7:43 pm

wow, that's a nice set up. I'm going with the standard FIGJAM SBC™
(FIGJAM Swamp Bucket Cooler™)

but I do like the vibration absorber in this image http://removeandreplace.com/wp-content/ ... cooler.jpg
evap-cooler.jpg
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FIGJAM
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:04 pm

FIGJAM wrote:Well that calls for a RECAP then!!!!!!!!!!
FIGJAM wrote:
The basic idea for the bucket cooler is just a smaller version of Yellowdog's cooler made from a rubbermade garbage can.

An evaporative cooler will reduce the tempature by 20 to 30 degrees.

Keep in mind that there is more than one way to skin a cat. (WARNING! DO NOT SKIN A CAT, IT WONT HELP THIS PROJECT AND WILL IRRITATE YOUR PUSSY!!!)

All the ideas that people came up with on this thread are a perfect example of radical self relience! (Bravo!!!)

Get a 5 gallon bucket and lid.

Have your trained mice naw some holes in the bucket, or use a hole saw, or 50 caliber sniper rifle. (Honey badgers wont work, they don't give a shit!)

Image


Find some cooler pad.

I like duracool pads.

http://www.simsupply.com/Items/426741

If your area does'nt have them, find a national chain DIY hardwear store and see if they will order some for you.

This may save you shipping cost. I use home depot.

Cut the first pad 30x13 inches.

Roll this pad into a tube and silicone or hand stitch the seam.

This will give you a tube 13 inches tall.

Image

Because the bucket tapers out towards the top, you will not need to line the bucket with shade clothe.

Image

Image

Cut a second piece of pad 24x13 inches and roll into a tight tube.

You wont need to seam this one.

Image

Sleeve this inside the first tube.

The reason for the double pad is to have a wide space to set the drip line on and adds more evap surface.

Image

1/2 inch Drip irrigation line works ok to soak your pads, but poly hose is more flexible and you can buy it by the foot.

I like the T connectors that fit inside the line. I cut the ends of the T shorter so I could keep the holes in the line close enough together so there wont be a dry strip on the pads.

This hose is 3/8 inch.

Image

Image

The holes in the line need to be uniform for an even flow on the pad.

Drlling holes works, but I found that heating a piece of wire melts a nice, more uniform hole.

I used a piece of 10 gauge copper wire.

Heat the wire with a torch, or the burner on your stove, then press through the line.

Sliding the wire in and out till it cools will make a happy hole! (Don't even think about it Yggy, this is serious!)

Image

Image

Image

To pump the water through the line, buy a pump.

This pump works very well for how cheap it is....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ultra-Quiet-Min ... 3cd9bd0e15

There are U.S. shippers for a couple of dollars more.

I like this pump instead because it's been working for five years.

https://www.greenlivingforu.com/products/fountains

Image

The 3/8 inch line fits this pump perfectly.

Nice even flow of water.

Image

Image

Image

When the lid is put on, the line will be pinched between the lid and the pad, so it wont move around.

FANS!

The key to a good cooler is a powerful fan.

CFM=cubic feet per minute.

http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l2/g36/c43 ... y_CFM.html

I used this one.

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/8556/ ... d=TMxuD2fh

It uses more power, but makes the bucket cooler very effective.

Calculate the cubic footage of the space to be cooled, then get a fan that will replace the air inside the space every 3 to 5 minutes.

I use a single fan cause it suits my design perfectly.

Cut a hole in the lid of the bucket to mount the fan.

I put mine on the bottom of the lid to keep the unit compact and to make ducting easier.

Image

Any 120mm fan will fit inside the top of the pad tube.

I spliced the wires from the fan to the wires from the pump. (both are 12volt)

Then ran the wire out through one of the holes in the side of the bucket.

Now with the lid on the bucket, I used a 4 inch septic line connector gooped to the lid over the fan.

Image

Image

Image

Now you can use 4 inch septic line to duct the air into the space to be cooled. You don't need to glue these piceces together.

Image

These parts are at the hardwear store.

Outside temp!

Image

Air temp coming from the cooler!

Image

Water temp inside the bucket!

Image

This cooler uses 2 gallon of water every 5 hours.

It uses about 1.45amps per hour.

My 105AH deep cycle battery will run this cooler for 47 hours before needing to be recharged.

So running 4 or 5 hours a day, it will let you nap in the hottest part of the day, all week without recharging the battery.

If you need more cooling than this, build the box cooler.

You will need to vent the air out of the space for circulation.

HAPPY NAPPING!!!
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FIGJAM
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Re: Re:

Post by FIGJAM » Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:04 pm

FIGJAM wrote:
FIGJAM wrote:Last year people tried to make the bucket cooler do more than it was ment to do, with moderate success.

The main problems seemed to be a powerful enough fan and how to duct the air into the space.

My box cooler worked great and I never use anything but the low speed on the fan.






NOW INTRODUCING THE UNICOOLER!!!!!!!


No duct work needed!!!

Build a box 17wx30hx9d.

Image

If you cant build a simple box, try to find something waterproof with roughly the same dementions or this.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/ ... ce2010a-20

If you can find something that does'nt have tapered sides it will work better.

Cut a hole for the vent cover. ($11.00)

Image

Image

Cut a hole for the fan. (Endless breeze fan $60-$80)

Image

I used 100% clear silicone caulk to stick these to the box.

Image

The vent louvers are facing down and into the box to keep the water channeled toward the inside.

I got some angle trim and siliconed pieces to the inside of the box to act as a pad retainer.

Image

Image

This cheap pump works well and ships faster if you find a U.S. dealer.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ultra-Quiet-Min ... 3cd9bd0e15

This is the pump I use.

https://www.greenlivingforu.com/products/fountains

Image

The pvc just lays on the top edge of the pads.

Then I went to the bin (16489-j "junk" subheading A "awsume") and found some handles.

Image

8)

Then make an air tight lid.(figure it out)

Finished cooler looks like this.

Image

Image

I call it the universal cooler cause you just shove the pad side against any opening in a tent, bus, travel trailer, yurt, or playpod and it will cool up to 3000 cubic feet of space. You can even set it on a table outside for use.

Add some foam stickon wheather stripping for a good seal around a window.

Fill it with 7gals. of water for 8hrs. of cooling. So once a day depending on how much you use it.

105ah battery will run this 5hr. a day, all week on low.

You may have to recharge if you use medium or high speed on the fan.

I'm confident that this will cool even a school bus without useing a genny and its a lot quieter than an air conditioner.

As always I'll try to answer any questions you may have.


HERE'S TO A MORE COMFORTABLE BURN!!!

That being said, scroll down to garyt's design on this page.

http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... start=1590

By making it wider, he can take full advantage of the endless breeze fan on high.

The unicoolerI designed tended to restict air flow due to not enough intake area.
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FIGJAM
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:05 pm

FIGJAM wrote:
FIGJAM wrote:This is the box cooler made of wood instead of FRP.

Image

Image

After the box is glued and screwed, I used regular painters caulk on the interior joints before putting a heavy coat of the Henrys elastomer roof coating on the whole thing to seal it inside and out.

Then spray the inside with epoxy paint, just to be sure it doesn't leak.

Image

To install the intake panels, I ran a heavy bead of 100% silicone caulk on the registers and screwed them in place.

Make sure these are all the same distance from the top as they will support the pvc for the water, and to get an even flow you'll want them the same height.

Image

Image

When I installed the pads, I added some wire to secure the pads to the registers.

14 gauge copper or bailing wire will work for this.

It will make sure that ALL the air has to pass through the wet pads.

Image

The wire goes through the pad at the corners of the registers and bends up on the outside of the cooler.

Image

The lid is hinged on the side away from the fan for easy filling.

I added some weather stripping (siliconed) for a good seal, and a small chain so the lid would'nt tweek the small hinges.

Image

Image

Image

Once the endless breeze fan and the pump get here I can finish this cooler.

This is my favorite pump.

https://www.greenlivingforu.com/products/fountains

OR this one is cheaper.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ultra-Quiet-Min ... 3cd9bd0e15

Faster shipping if you use a supplier inside the U.S.

It will hold 12 gals of water and there's room for a case of beer in the bottom.

It will use about 3/4s of a gallon of water per hour on the low fan speed.

It will cool a space up to 3000 cubic feet on high.

Power needed will be...

12 volt DC

1.5amps on low speed (250cfm)

1.92amps on medium speed (500cfm)

2.82amps on high speed! (900 cfm= to 10mph breeze)


Hope this helps you enjoy your BURNNNNNNNNNNN!!! 8)
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FIGJAM
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:05 pm

FIGJAM wrote:
FIGJAM wrote:POWER!!!

These designs are all 12 volt DC.

So any 12 volt DC source will run them.

The costco 115AH marine battery should run any of these designs 5 or 6 hours a day for the whole week without having to recharge.(price, $90)

I use a Deka 105AH AGM deep cycle battery. (price $240, but I get factory seconds for $140)

You can also go solar!

From what I've read, a 50 watt panel is what you'll need, but I don't have any practical experience with solar.

And finally, keep it simple!

This is an easy project, and although there is a lot of good technical information in this thread, you don't need all of it to build a cooler.

I'll be refering interested Burners to this page so that they won't have to start at the beginning! 8)

Big thanks to Yellowdog and everyony who has contributed to this monster thread!
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Elorrum » Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:45 pm

my dc version was a life saver today, in a non-air conditioned apartment with temps over 100 outside... even though it got over 90 indoors, I was sitting with my DC version fan and pump beside my chair, getting a little bit of cool all afternoon. I just taped and caulked a basic bathroom fan inside it's mounting box on the top of the bucket. I doesn't change the temp in the room, but just sitting near it is a help.
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by AntiM » Thu Jun 30, 2016 6:59 am

Elorrum wrote:my dc version was a life saver today, in a non-air conditioned apartment with temps over 100 outside... even though it got over 90 indoors, I was sitting with my DC version fan and pump beside my chair, getting a little bit of cool all afternoon. I just taped and caulked a basic bathroom fan inside it's mounting box on the top of the bucket. I doesn't change the temp in the room, but just sitting near it is a help.

MyLarry takes ours out on his semi so he doesn't have to idle his truck for hours and hours. Even with the "environmental controls" it gets damn hot in the cab in those lots.

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Leap
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Leap » Thu Jun 30, 2016 7:54 am

Does a second row of holes in the bucket add any value or am I just loosing real estate to hold water?

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Roundabout » Thu Jun 30, 2016 10:33 am

FIGJAM wrote:The costco 115AH marine battery should run any of these designs 5 or 6 hours a day for the whole week without having to recharge.(price, $90)
The marine/RV batteries at my Costco are no longer rated by amp hours, but by fitment code or group size. Does anyone know the correct fitment code #, or group size #, for the matine/RV battery to be at least 115AH?
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jun 30, 2016 11:08 am

Leap wrote:Does a second row of holes in the bucket add any value or am I just loosing real estate to hold water?
If your holes are 2", and the recommended fan is roughly 4", then 2" holes one inch apart will give you about 3X the intake as the fan puts out.

I have one row of 2" holes. 8)
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Leap » Thu Jun 30, 2016 2:23 pm

Thanks!

chucked
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by chucked » Fri Jul 08, 2016 2:56 pm

hey there!

so im building my first swamp cooler. will be using a 5 gallon bucket.

ive just spent the past hour selecting a fan on amazon and i think this is the one i like the most.


its a standard 120mm pc fan, but can put out 252 cfm!

im concerned that its going to be too loud (one place listed it at 66dBa), so id like to add a way to control the fan speed on the cheap.
whats the easiest (and very cheap) way to do this? seems like most pc fan controllers (esp cheap ones) cant handle the 3.9A that this thirsty fan requires.
im hoping i can just add a potentiometer in line with a cheap 12v power supply. ill be drawing from a BIG generator, so i dont need to worry about that (but have been told that a wal-mart AC unit would be frowned upon)

im a mechanical engineer, so im really not very experienced with electronics.

what do you all suggest?

Thanks! )'(

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by LowePro » Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:04 pm

Best bet is to use the fan as recommended in this thread. Subbing out fans is why some swampies don't work as well as others.
And 65 dba isn't really that loud, esp since the swampie will be outside your structure. What's the point of getting a powerful fan and then throttling it down with a controller? Earplugs are good solution (You'll want them anyway). The noise from the fan will be the least noise out there.
As for a walmart AC, who cares if people frown on it? Some people frown on everything. I'd bet you get more frowns from the BIG generator running than from an off-the-shelf AC. That's just my 2c, take it or leave it, as a successful swampie user. 8)

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by EGAZ » Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:23 pm

Agreed, And if you are going to slow the fan down for noise reasons then maybe go with a quieter, lower cfm fan. That said, let her fly. I doubt it will be much noticeable over the background noise. My grey water removal unit has two 200cfm fans. Not cooling a tent but it does move some air and evap some water!!
2nd time better than the first. And the first was pretty Freakin' Great!
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Captain Goddammit » Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:30 pm

No one frowns on A/C, but sometimes they frown on someone drawing that much current from a generator that isn't their own.
65dB is louder than a Honda generator.
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by chucked » Mon Jul 11, 2016 9:24 am

ok well our camp is kindly allowed to draw from the BMorg power grid in center plaza, so i dont want to use an AC unit until ive asked in person, so swamp cooler it is for now.

can you guys confirm i can use a simple PWM controller with this fan. these two items will be happy together?

https://smile.amazon.com/HiLetgo-Motor- ... XQ3WY2G5AP

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00 ... 1SQ2R9Q7PX

will these 252cfm require a much more powerful water pump to keep up? im only planning on running it at full speed during the initial cooling moments, and then turning it down and going to sleep.

my concern with noise is more to do with neighboring yurts than it is for myself.

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by KennyReff » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:56 pm

Hi all. Question: Do I need to be concerned about this fan not providing enough pressure?

I'm doing the 5-gallon cooler, and I found this fan, which seems really good. Quieter than most (25db), lower amperage than most (.41 amps) and decent CFM (156). However, it's 230mm, not the standard 120. And the RPM is only 900, not the normal 3600. I assume the larger size allows it to spin slower and use less energy. It *seems* like it will fit in the lid of the bucket (which I think is 12" across)

I'm going to go pure solar - no battery - so I like the idea of low amps (because the solar panel will also have to power the pump).

But... do I need to be concerned about there not being enough pressure with this fan?

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/14441 ... 6c435s1106

PS: I'm guessing at my cubic footage. I'm building a pentayurt with specs that says is 110 sq feet. With five 4x8 panels and the typical roof made of 5 other panels cut into 10 triangles, I'm assuming it's 880 cubic feet. Can't find a way to verify this though. I'm just doubling what it would be without the roof, since the roof is made of the same number of panels as the base. Did I get this right? Thanks!!

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by EGAZ » Mon Jul 11, 2016 8:34 pm

PC Modders used these large diameter fans to move more air, at slower rpms, thus quieter than high speed fans. QuietBut there is a caveat. Low operating pressure.

When these are mounted on a computer case, they pull air 'from' the case and blow it out the side with no duct work on the discharge side. Was a thing a few years ago but they are not used much anymore as there are better ways to cool a PC tower.

Given the very low air pressure rating I would not go this direction. For a box/wall unit, maybe. Remember, the FIGJAM bucket cooler is a compromise of a proven design. We are compromising from a relatively perfect, proven manufactured design with every component in the bucket giving up something.

If one is steadfast on going solar, you compromise on fan and pump size due to amp draw requirements.
If your living space is getting to the larger size you may need to ditch solar and get a deep cycle battery for power.

See my post on page 118 of this thread, (link above) for another link on calculating your Pentayurt cubic feet.
2nd time better than the first. And the first was pretty Freakin' Great!
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Mon Jul 11, 2016 9:32 pm

If your cubic footage is correct, the cooler isn't big enough for that space.

R&D for the first cooler: I tried to keep the power consumption below 1 amp.

105cfm fan and a $20 solar fountain pump SEEMED like the ideal combo.

The pump was only good enough under perfect conditions, and the fan ok if you sat right in front of it with NO breeze blowing.

GOT to move enough air and enough water for the cooler to work effectively.

The bucket cooler as designed is good up to about 600 cubic feet.
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by LowePro » Mon Jul 11, 2016 11:31 pm

Your pentayurt is closer to 600 cf. But switching fans from the recommended product is bound to make your cooler less effective. Add a deep cycle battery to your kit, you will not regret it. You can use the solar to recharge. Passive solar for the swamp cooler has proven elusive. Unless you have a very large panel and only use the cooler during mid day. For me the cooler is best in the morning to sleep in. Use that fan at your peril, I think you'd be disappointed.

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by KennyReff » Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:59 pm

Thanks to all for all the quick responses. After some work, I’m now confident that my pentayurt is 747 cubic feet. To replace the air every 4 minutes (the average of the suggested 3-5 minutes), would require a fan putting out 186 CFM.

I understand the advice to stay with the smaller fans pushing more pressure. The FigJam suggested one is not in stock but this one looks right. 120mm, 190 CFM, 1.6Amp, 4100RPM, 17.74 air pressure
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/8556/ ... 6c435s1108

I’m planning to get this pump. .55Amp, 105 GPH
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-12V-Submersi ... 7675.l2557

And I am also taking the advice to add a battery. Rounding up, I’ve got 2.5 amps of 12v power to provide. This deep cycle 18AH battery will give me 7 hours of runtime, correct?
https://www.amazon.com/ML18-12-CB19-12- ... 2661619011

Lastly, will this 20 watt solar panel do the trick to charge the battery daily?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00W8 ... 6HZDTPF1LD

I have to say that I envision running the system on playa only between 10a and 5p or so.
Thanks again for all your expertise!

LowePro
Posts: 653
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 2:58 pm

Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by LowePro » Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:14 pm

Bigger battery. That solar panel will do you fine. But you'll want more amp hours.

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FIGJAM
Posts: 10221
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:39 am
Location: apache junction az.

Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Tue Jul 12, 2016 10:46 pm

Kind of important to NOT discharge your battery below 50%.

It will shorten it's life span and may damage it!!!
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

"If I can't find an answer, I'll create one!!!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me

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