selling real estate on Esplanade

[HeathenWorld]

i was a bit shocked to find area 51 camp selling real estate on Esplanade for $400. http://173.254.10.238/?page_id=792 maybe bm.org things this is all spiffy and right(?) i thought camps were supposed to know the count of their members when they applied to be a camp.. any camp selling $400 memberships 30 days ahead of the event is not following that model

[Roberto Dobbisano]

[junglesmacks]

WAIT.. Did you say Alex and Allyson Grey will be there?!

[junglesmacks]

I'm really getting tired of this lame ass shill camp..

[Jackass]

Those are called camp dues...It's what you pay if you want to camp, eat and enjoy their amenities.

[VultureChow]

Meh. The only thing that really gets me is this posting on their FB Page:

ATTENTION!!!! Area 51 has been directed 20 additional BM tickets!!!! I need non changeable name and emails by July 30th !!! First come first serve and we require $300 from each person for camp dues.
Area 51 Theme Camp Member Info Burning Man 2012

Directed distribution was supposed to fill the critical personnel gaps left by the lottery. Not first come first serve. I can understand having a few left over after the critical spots have been filled and then distributing them, but an additional 20?

[fresh]

You think they would used available tickets to close out STEP queue for those sitting in purgatory for months instead of giving them to some large scale camp so their sparkle pony friends can drop by last minute.

[H.G.Crosby]

i was not aware of that vulture chow...thats rather heinous..


poor form at the very least...should'nt those tickets go into step?


we are STILL trying to get a few for our CREW....who will have to purchase them just like everyone in our camp had to do either thru lotto or directed ticketing.


we are only like 3 shy at this point, but seriously, 20 extras? wtf?

we are not going to scalpers and we hope to obtain the magic 3 during the next sale...none of them go to dj's BTW unless they pay face value and they werent from directed, those went to crew only.

this sorta stinks, especially to those who go out of their way to be transparent and try to do the right thing.

[Jackass]

ATTENTION!!!! Area 51 has been directed 20 additional BM tickets!!!! I need non changeable name and emails by July 30th !!! First come first serve and we require $300 from each person for camp dues.
Area 51 Theme Camp Member Info Burning Man 2012

Now this part- not cool!

[Bob]

You will be told when to worry about other ticketholders.

[H.G.Crosby]

i suppose i could direct our crew members there, and have them stay there as well....



im sending the mooks from rhode island.



two words.




woooooooooooooooooooon socket.

[Roberto Dobbisano]

you may have solved another problem as well....


you wont have to break up daily fisticuffs between them and the Charlestown Boys.

[junglesmacks]

An extra 20 tickets so they can sell 20 more spots at $300 a pop for a nice $6000 income.

FUCK THESE GUYS

[pink]

Put 'em out along with the Tiki Bar. Placement voided, tickets voided, black mark forever.

[BBadger]

Is that even a legit website? A plain ol' IP address? A crappy news post on a crappier website? I'm skeptical.

I think it'd be hilarious if someone were just making fake sites to troll ePlayans. Make a fake site, link it with a new account. Watch as the vitriol is spewed forth.

[glitteranddust]

With camp dues like that, that better be some damn good food.

[pink]

It was on their Facebook page. If false info was posted on my Facebook page, I'd be redacting it pronto.

[HandJamMasterC]

Ya, our camp did not need all the tickets we were offered. I let the extras go to STEP. I was just thankful to be able to secure enough tickets for the camp members that actually own, transport and setup the theme camp infrastructure, since many of them did not get tickets. We filled out our ranks with newbies that already happened to get tickets. Keeping extra tickets and selling them is bogus.Although I've seen higher theme camp dues than $ 300.00.

[alex_]

350 is really not astronomical...

Especially since it includes food.

[Eric]

350 is really not astronomical...

Especially since it includes food.

My "camp dues" are zero, and have been zero since I've been going. I pay my share of the RV costs (which I wouldn't if I didn't like staying in the RV), bring my own food, deal with my own stuff. I know other camps and even entire villages that have no dues. What is or isn't "astronomical" is a personal perspective.

Of course, my version of "self reliance" isn't another persons (and lots of people disagree with RV's, so I don't let them sleep with me)...

[pink]

Yeah, our camp doesn't have dues either. Some people can haul lots of stuff. Some can't. Some people can buy stuff, or had it already to offer. Some have strong backs. Some have extensive knowledge of how to build a solar array. others are great cooks or like to bartend.

And we all manage to bring our diverse resources together to build a camp. IMHO that's how it's done.

[theCryptofishist]

I pay dues, and, since they cover the cost of an accessible port-a-potty, I'm okay with that. Also, I can't haul much. I can't put things up and take them down again. I can't build infrastructure. Contributing to the porta potty and the kitchen via dues, as well as directly makes me feel that I am contributing. I think that there a wide range of what works for different camps with different situations.
I also think that selling your camp allotment tickets in this way is creepy. I have an allotment ticket, and I've never been quite comfortable with that decision. But Apokalyptika was my camp before the whole ticket implosion happened, I didn't choose to go there because that was the way I was going to get in.

[Trishntek]

Participation is our camp's due,,, that's how we roll!

[Simon of the Playa]

everybody pays their dues one way or another.


go ahead, try to argue with me on THIS one.


you'll lose.


enough already...it's too close to burn time to bicker.


havent you got shit to do?

[theCryptofishist]

everybody pays their dues one way or another.

Of course. But money is not the same as paying in blood sweat and tears. And it can lead to confusion, on either side, as to what the bargain was.

[Simon of the Playa]

there is something to be said for true noblesse Oblige as well as the honor that goes with working hard and rising thru the ranks...

The first is an acknowledgement that with great power comes great responsibility.

The second recognizes that the mighty oak came from the tiny acorn.

we are all in it together, and this is one of the reasons i love a REALLY REAALLY REAAAAAAALLLLY brutal dust storm...it strips everything away and FORCES you to be human, whether you are rich or poor, raver or hippy, ranger or sparklepony, all of a sudden its SURVIVAL and you HAVE to cooperate and ride the storm out.

Together.

how strange that it takes tragedy or a disaster for neighbors to start helping neighbors....for STRANGERS to start helping STRANGERS...

the immediacy of the moment changes everything.

it really is a state of mind, and just as meditation can bring you to an altered state, so can a really good humdinger of a white out...a total you dont know where the fuck you are or which direction you're going SCARY dust storm...

spend three hours with some total strangers huddled against a wind block, and you will have spent those three hours well.

you may think im crazy, but its true.

the dust is the great equalizer.....we all came from it, and we all will return to it...it is inevitable.

we all turn the same color when we're covered in it too...

it is at these moments, when we all pay our dues.

[Ugly Dougly]

We solve it the Black Rock City way... with culture jamming.

[trilobyte]

I checked in with the placement team on this, and have some information to pass along.

First, the camp did benefit from the directed ticket program (as did many other camps) back in March. For the size of their camp the number allocated was tiny. That's all they've gotten through placement. They have gotten access to additional tickets through another source, and is actually being given directly to individuals from the eastern US burner community rather than one individual to distribute as he sees fit.

Second, the camp has been responsive to requests from Burning Man's legal department and the placement team to remove references to Burning Man and its regional events from their advertising.

Third, they are not placed on the Esplanade. Due to issues regarding sound (and them bringing lots of it), their placement has changed to 2:00.

Fourth, community scrutiny (that's us!) should go a long way to reforms in the way this camp will operate in the future, if it wants to be in good standing.

That said, thanks to the placement team not only for the hard work that goes into putting the puzzle together that makes BRC go, but in providing the above information. I get that any kind of reprimands, discipline, and sticky points should be worked out directly between them and the camp in question and not something that's turned into a public spectacle, but I think some valid concerns have been raised.

On that fourth point, personally (as in my own opinion, not any kind of official suggestion) I'd say that if you're in the neighborhood to stop by that camp. Don't just go in and start yelling at anyone who identifies themselves as a campmate, but take a few minutes and see what it is these guys are bringing to the playa. I don't know them and have never been to their camp, so I couldn't tell you how good or bad it is (besides, you can form your own opinion on that based on your firsthand experience). Take that in, then communicate to them both the things you like and things that bothered you. I think if you just come in shouting you and your views may be dismissed out of hand - but if you give them your considered opinion it's more likely to be taken to heart. Help them figure out how to do a better job.

[Simon of the Playa]

so we'll be neighbors...

nice nice very nice, all little pieces of the same device.



and Trilo, well said, Very well said.

[H.G.Crosby]

ready...

serious face...


you know what drives most of these "Big Sound Guys"?


you do.


im serious....I've watched it first hand....i used to cook, and sometimes, when we were really on, or it was a big party, we would go that extra nine, not because we were getting paid more, not because of recognition, because nobody, im sorry, a few people complement the kitchen staff, but for that moment when the food arrived and it hits the table and the people SMILE and sniff the air, and taste your ART...

you do it for them.

you watch thru the little window as they make funny sounds or slurp your special gravy with awesome sauce.

this is the reward.

i've seen our camp founder, and the rest of the crew stand back, at that moment, as things are just exploding and the people are dancing like there really IS no tomorrow, and just smile.

its a good feeling pulling a rave outta your ass in the middle of the fucking desert, but it's not easy.

the kitchen is hot, the workers have knifes, most are drunk or worse....oh wait thats the crew...no, its the restaurant....fuck, ive lost track of my own metaphor.

now im hungry too.

i digress.

i guess my point is, we make this feast for the playa to enjoy, please help us clean up, help the newcomers acclimate, we were ALL fucking newbs at one point, and then 2nd year meglomaniacs, 3rd year drifters, 4th year disillusionment and 5th year re-birth and so on....

i digress again.

where was i?

HELP, not hate...give people the chance you would want given to you....you cannot judge a book by its cover, and people not only learn they change.

i know im a different person after TTWDITD...

it's almost go time...let's start burning now, and i know, im the worst snarkiest asshole, so i really cant talk but, how about we try to focus on making this the burn we want it to be and reserve the criticism of people and their actions until AFTER they actually occur.

shit, we'll have a WHOLE YEAR to discuss it after sept. 6th or so, RIGHT?

and i always listen...im not the big bad wolf, and if you ask nicely, and say please and thank you, you would be surprised how far that gets you in my world personally, as well as most places on the playa.

anyway...what trilo said, help, dont bitch....if that doesnt work, than bitch, if you think it will help...