How do I arrive and leave by Jungo Road on pedal power?

Bikes, trikes, personal mobility and getting to/from the event - this is the place to discuss general transportation issues.
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Zhust
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Post by Zhust » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:45 am

fbcota wrote:Spots are really cool devices,
I have been reading up on them (http://findmespot.com/en/) but the Amazon reviews are mixed between "awesome" and "worthless". I guess if I get flak from friends at home, I can tell them to buy me one of those and get it all set up and running and I'd be glad to stick it somewhere for the journey.

I have considered building/buying a GPS logger/home-brew LoJack, but without cell service, the latter function won't work at all. Spot uses direct satellite communication so it's usable pretty much anywhere.

We'll see.
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Post by ygmir » Wed Apr 13, 2011 11:54 am

*noting perimeter patrol in Frog pond waiting, watching.....*

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Post by Bluemandrew » Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:19 pm

Out of curiousity, what mining trucks use Jungo? I assume they're not USG trucks, or we wouldn't have much concern this year. [/url]

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Post by Kinetik V » Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:36 pm

The trucks you have to worry about are the pickups, not the big mining trucks like you're likely thinking of as those stay on the mine property. And the pickups in question belong to Allied Nevada Gold Corp.
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Post by Lassen Forge » Thu Apr 14, 2011 11:52 am

Yeah, I was thinking the gold mine or cyanide plant...

Just make sure you're visible, and if you stop for a while, pull well off the road.

Pleasepleasepleaseplease... make sure you get pix of the run... I've flown OVER Jungo for 3 or 4 burns, and driven it to the shooting range / frogpond a number of times, but never made the fool, er, full Winnemucca to Blackrock run. Yet.

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Post by melodiousdirge » Fri Apr 15, 2011 1:53 pm

Please don't read this as rain on your parade - it sounds like a great adventure and I hope you make it. One thing that sticks out to me quite glaringly is the issue of weight however.

How much is this pedal powered contraption going to weigh? 3 civic tires on wheels is at least 100lbs off the hop. Plus you, your gear, all the containers, tools, etc for your trike, and your water (7 days x 2 gallons ~ 150lbs of water). It sounds like you're going to be dragging WELL over 500lbs on your own power up a sandy, winding road. I dunno how many hills there are but you better have a LOW low gear to get up them. I'd guestimate you're looking at travelling 1-2mph uphill and maybe as high as 10mph downhill if that... probably average 3-5 mph. How far is this trip?

Again, more power to you, and I'm sure where there is a will there is a way, but really consider the weight issue.
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Post by Zhust » Fri Apr 15, 2011 7:24 pm

melodiousdirge wrote:How much is this pedal powered contraption going to weigh? 3 civic tires on wheels is at least 100lbs off the hop. Plus you, your gear, all the containers, tools, etc for your trike, and your water (7 days x 2 gallons ~ 150lbs of water).
Yeah, weight is a concern — and I already know it'll be wicked heavy. The Bike With 2 Brains was 160 pounds and I need to be somewhere be around that as well (just for the frame, for the train, so I can split it to three 50-pound checked "bags"). I have not yet weighed the wheels, but they are alloy with 13" rims, and I think I remember them being more like 25 pounds each. And I usually target on the low side with water, bringing about 12 gallons for the week and live comfortably on that, so that's around 110 pounds. Tires plus wheels alone (the heaviest things) then is, on the low side, around 185 pounds.
melodiousdirge wrote:It sounds like you're going to be dragging WELL over 500lbs on your own power up a sandy, winding road. I dunno how many hills there are but you better have a LOW low gear to get up them. I'd guestimate you're looking at travelling 1-2mph uphill and maybe as high as 10mph downhill if that... probably average 3-5 mph. How far is this trip?
In the end, yeah, it'll be far heavier than a bicycle and, realistically, probably much closer to 500 pounds. The plan is for the final gearing to have a two-speed transmission for "easy rolling" versus "rock crawling" ... I'm shooting to double the ~ 600% shifting range with the final transmission. I'm also designing to not be totally out-of-control over 30 mph should I come to a hill that permits it.

My estimate is for an average of 10 mph — a little faster on the Winnemucca-Sulphur side, and slower (sometimes a little, sometimes a lot) on the Sulphur-BRC side. That said, I'm giving it 12 hours for the 100 mile trek, and I'm really in no hurry at all, so I might just camp overnight out there somewhere. A rudimentary check of the topographic map shows that the road is more flat than not, and more slow rises than steep ones, but I'll know for sure come August ...
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Post by mdmf007 » Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:02 pm

Bluemandrew wrote:Out of curiosity, what mining trucks use Jungo? I assume they're not USG trucks, or we wouldn't have much concern this year. [/url]
Newmont is there as well. I have driven Jongo from Winny to Gerlach literally hundreds of times. Jungo is fine, there are a few blind curves, but for the most part you have pretty good vision. You can Google earth the entire roUTE as well. Its there on street view - your welcome.

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Post by theCryptofishist » Sat Apr 16, 2011 9:26 am

Yeah, I'm not sure if the mine Newmont wants to expand is there, but it is southeast of the playa.
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Post by Zhust » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:10 am

jaycerochester wrote:I have not yet weighed the wheels, but they are alloy with 13" rims, and I think I remember them being more like 25 pounds each.
I weighed one: 26 pounds. Sweet guess. This does mean that I'll have one wheel each of 3 checked "bags" since they have a max weight of 50 pounds each (although I can pay extra for extra bags) which means each big piece of frame (since I can carry-on some of the small pieces) has to come in somewhere around 20 pounds.

The way I see it, the frame components are:
  • The Center Rib and Drivetrain which is a front-mounted bottom-bracket, a few internal-hub shifters, chain, sprockets, steering mount, etc. I can remove the rear suspension parts and the rear hub and brake parts, but it's highly unlikely I'll hit 20 pounds regardless. 30 pounds maybe.
  • The Seat which will bolt onto the center rib and also contain the brackets for the front suspension. As I have read, stable tadpole trikes have a weight distribution of 70:30 to 85:15, front:rear so most of the weight sits just behind the front wheels. I figure that aside from gear on-trike, my self is the bulk of the "most of the weight", so I thought I'd just mount the suspension brackets right to the seat. I also want the seat to be a kind of roll-cage unto itself so if I do get creamed, I have a chance of saving my skull, spine, and guts.
  • The Front Suspension consisting of 2 sets of A-arm pairs and shock absorbers along with the front hubs, brakes, and steering linkages.
  • The Trailer I figure is necessary for getting all my gear to the Playa, plus I'll have something to do with the shipping container parts.
That leaves incidentals like lighting and electronics, steering parts, spare parts, and tools. In all honesty, if I can get the unladen vehicle under 250 pounds, I'll be impressed. Of course, I "need" to get it closer to 150 pounds unless I want to pay extra for another checked bag.
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Post by ygmir » Fri Apr 22, 2011 7:46 am

is there any way you can UPS it to Winnemucca?
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Post by J/J » Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:52 am

Thru hikers have always used caches for supplies and not compromised their self reliance- just planning ahead and catching up with their necessities. Why don’t you use Black Rock Citizens for your water Cache? I’ll gift you an IOU for some gallons - other peeps join in and save this adventurer some weight, Some camps have water delivered I understand. If we can gift water then there must be a way of getting you into the city without water?
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Fri Apr 22, 2011 9:18 am

The extra water is for if he gets stranded out where there are no citizens. :)

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Post by Major Krash » Fri Apr 22, 2011 11:20 am

...it is not that hard to get an Amateur Radio Technician class licence, and an HT weighs a pound or so (could hit a repeater to call for help if needed). You can buy one for $200 or so that would do both 2m and 70cm (the repeater freqs). Would also be usable at BM, since there is a HAM community there...

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Ode to Jungo

Post by stormlight » Sat Apr 23, 2011 6:38 am

Jungo Road is not that rough but many won't go
They didn't work to find it's beautiful transition
From our world to the Black Rock Desert
We come over Jungo to dance among them
But from a different Road that few find
And we know this Man will soon light up the night sky

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Post by gyre » Sat Apr 23, 2011 9:19 am

Are you using nuvinci gear?

You can get those rims lighter, maybe the tires too.

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Post by gyre » Sat Apr 23, 2011 9:27 am

3M diamond grade conspicuity tape for visibility.

Silver or fluorescent orange.
Silver is brightest.
Fluorescent is amzing in cloudy conditions, dust.

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Post by mdmf007 » Sat Apr 23, 2011 10:11 pm

You can also get on and off the Playa at the "Microwave Crossing." Jungo road comes to within 200 yards of the playa edge on the East side.

Pull up 37 25' 19.1"N, 122 05' 06"W on Google Earth this is the crossing that puts you on playa or off for that matter without having to go all the way to Gerlach or onto 447. By doing so my math on Google Earth shows a saving of 22 miles each way.

Its called the "Microwave Crossing" because there is a microwave transmitter for the rail roads at the crossing. Looks like a radio tower with wire antenna's. Perfect landmark to look for while on playa. Also keeps you off the busiest portion of 447

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Post by Rice » Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:18 pm

mdmf007 wrote:You can also get on and off the Playa at the "Microwave Crossing." Jungo road comes to within 200 yards of the playa edge on the East side.

Pull up 37 25' 19.1"N, 122 05' 06"W on Google Earth this is the crossing that puts you on playa or off for that matter without having to go all the way to Gerlach or onto 447. By doing so my math on Google Earth shows a saving of 22 miles each way.

Its called the "Microwave Crossing" because there is a microwave transmitter for the rail roads at the crossing. Looks like a radio tower with wire antenna's. Perfect landmark to look for while on playa. Also keeps you off the busiest portion of 447

MDMF
You still need to take the 12 mile entrance off highway 34. Any attempt to enter the city from any other road will result in a discussion with Perimeter and possibly the BLM rangers... That is where the entrance road to the gate starts.

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Post by mdmf007 » Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:45 pm

stretch80 wrote:
mdmf007 wrote:You can also get on and off the Playa at the "Microwave Crossing." Jungo road comes to within 200 yards of the playa edge on the East side.

Pull up 37 25' 19.1"N, 122 05' 06"W on Google Earth this is the crossing that puts you on playa or off for that matter without having to go all the way to Gerlach or onto 447. By doing so my math on Google Earth shows a saving of 22 miles each way.

Its called the "Microwave Crossing" because there is a microwave transmitter for the rail roads at the crossing. Looks like a radio tower with wire antenna's. Perfect landmark to look for while on playa. Also keeps you off the busiest portion of 447

MDMF
You still need to take the 12 mile entrance off highway 34. Any attempt to enter the city from any other road will result in a discussion with Perimeter and possibly the BLM rangers... That is where the entrance road to the gate starts.
BMAN doesn't rent the entire playa, you are certainly allowed to use other areas of the playa outside the exclusion zone. I am betting that if you show up on a heavily modified bicycle and a ticket would be allowed to continue. If they weren't, shame on whatever asshat says no.

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Post by Bob » Sun Apr 24, 2011 8:17 am

mdmf007 wrote:
stretch80 wrote:
mdmf007 wrote:You can also get on and off the Playa at the "Microwave Crossing." Jungo road comes to within 200 yards of the playa edge on the East side.

Pull up 37 25' 19.1"N, 122 05' 06"W on Google Earth this is the crossing that puts you on playa or off for that matter without having to go all the way to Gerlach or onto 447. By doing so my math on Google Earth shows a saving of 22 miles each way.

Its called the "Microwave Crossing" because there is a microwave transmitter for the rail roads at the crossing. Looks like a radio tower with wire antenna's. Perfect landmark to look for while on playa. Also keeps you off the busiest portion of 447
You still need to take the 12 mile entrance off highway 34. Any attempt to enter the city from any other road will result in a discussion with Perimeter and possibly the BLM rangers... That is where the entrance road to the gate starts.
BMAN doesn't rent the entire playa, you are certainly allowed to use other areas of the playa outside the exclusion zone. I am betting that if you show up on a heavily modified bicycle and a ticket would be allowed to continue. If they weren't, shame on whatever asshat says no.
Yeah, Perimeter and the BLM love to watch people aimlessly circling the boundary fence, it's their favorite pastime while sipping donuts and eating coffee.
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Post by ygmir » Sun Apr 24, 2011 8:45 am

Bob wrote:
mdmf007 wrote:
stretch80 wrote: You still need to take the 12 mile entrance off highway 34. Any attempt to enter the city from any other road will result in a discussion with Perimeter and possibly the BLM rangers... That is where the entrance road to the gate starts.
BMAN doesn't rent the entire playa, you are certainly allowed to use other areas of the playa outside the exclusion zone. I am betting that if you show up on a heavily modified bicycle and a ticket would be allowed to continue. If they weren't, shame on whatever asshat says no.
Yeah, Perimeter and the BLM love to watch people aimlessly circling the boundary fence, it's their favorite pastime while sipping donuts and eating coffee.
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Post by motskyroonmatick » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:09 am

Image

Here is a past map of the event site and the surrounding closure. If the past is any indicator of future conditions the closure will be very much like this.

From this map I see that entrance to the eastern side of the playa is unrestricted as far as the Burning Man closure. So entering the playa is a go from the east side. Then the decision is how to gain access to the event. The event has entry points for participants at the gate and the airport. Airport is questionable and gate is probably the best low hassle approach.
If it were up to me to chose a route to entry I would travel well outside of the event fence on the southern edge. Once I had gone far enough that gate was at my 1:30 I would turn to intercept gate road about 1/4 mile from gate to make it around the western edge of the sprawling gate complex.
I think it will be nearly inevitable that you will be intercepted by either LEO or Perimeter. Following their commands/advice may be necessary. I hope you run in to someone who wants to be constructive rather than the opposite.
I think the playa portion of the trip holds a fairly high danger from all the extremely high speed vehicular traffic I have seen there. Having a tall flag may help overcome some of the mirage effect that seems to obscure things that are close to the ground.

Best of luck with the trip. It sounds like a great adventure.
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Post by gyre » Sun Apr 24, 2011 11:24 am

The usual jungo shenanigans

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Post by ygmir » Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:34 pm

motskyroonmatick wrote:Image

Here is a past map of the event site and the surrounding closure. If the past is any indicator of future conditions the closure will be very much like this.

From this map I see that entrance to the eastern side of the playa is unrestricted as far as the Burning Man closure. So entering the playa is a go from the east side. Then the decision is how to gain access to the event. The event has entry points for participants at the gate and the airport. Airport is questionable and gate is probably the best low hassle approach.
If it were up to me to chose a route to entry I would travel well outside of the event fence on the southern edge. Once I had gone far enough that gate was at my 1:30 I would turn to intercept gate road about 1/4 mile from gate to make it around the western edge of the sprawling gate complex.
I think it will be nearly inevitable that you will be intercepted by either LEO or Perimeter. Following their commands/advice may be necessary. I hope you run in to someone who wants to be constructive rather than the opposite.
I think the playa portion of the trip holds a fairly high danger from all the extremely high speed vehicular traffic I have seen there. Having a tall flag may help overcome some of the mirage effect that seems to obscure things that are close to the ground.

Best of luck with the trip. It sounds like a great adventure.
Motz speaks true, as well.
Just know, as he says, Perimeter will have seen you before you enter the closure area.
Try to stay out of it.
and, if you're going to cross, find the shortest route, and hope, you get a kind intercept. Attitude can easily determine this.
And, hope intercept is by GPE personnel. Others are not always as helpful, or willing.
On that south side, you'll also be dealing with the airport.....and, it's even more important to keep slow moving vehicles/people well clear of the runway, and a fair area around.
You might make sure you have a tow strap.....in case an offer to tow you across faster happens.
Also, the playa surface, as you well know, can be very unpredictable, and, I've seen it very soft and full of dunes in that area. Tough pedaling for sure.

It seems it'll be a fine balance, between direct route to gate road, and, impending intercept, by the adept, astute, articulate and disarmingly sexy GPE folks........and pray not to get popped by LEO or BLM........they're not nearly as good looking.
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Post by Clar-i-ty » Sun Apr 24, 2011 12:54 pm

WORD! Think the playa is soft on Saturday in the City? Try it out of bounds where nobody has taken the time to scrape roads.

It would behoove you to use a designated path, lest you become story of the week with those oh so sexy Perimeter folks. (You know who you are)
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Post by Playa+Tom » Mon Apr 25, 2011 12:37 am

I took Jungo Road from Empire to Winnemucca twice this winter, In January it was frozen and a very easy drive, in March it had thawed but was still in very good condition. From Winnemucca to Jungo there is a bit of traffic mostly related to mining, there are big trucks, service vehicles and crew transportation buses in abundance. The road is hard, flat and smooth all the way to Sulphur. Past Jungo the road goes through some small hills and the sight lines are not as good. I hope you have a rear view mirror so you can get out of the way of the traffic. From Sulphur on the road is not as good but the traffic is much less. The road is not as flat or smooth and the sight lines can be very limited. Get one of those flags on a long antenna so you can be seen a little better. As soon as you can get on the playa and take the east side road, there are a few signs indicating the exclusion zone. Go past the city, circle around to the gate and you should have no problems with perimeter or LEOs.
Pedal power from Winnemucca to Black Rock City is the stupidest thing I have heard of in a long time. Sounds like quite a trip. Good luck.

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Post by stormlight » Mon Apr 25, 2011 4:07 am

for the past two years I've taken Jungo from Winnemucca and back. Our posse in a Camper built on Ford F550 4x4 (17,000 lbs) no issues there but what pisses me off is last year it took 5 hours after temple burn to get to spot on Jungo which would have taken 20 minutes from BRC going across that little strip of desert. You can see how close it is on the map. The extreme nanny state attitude is really irritating to an experienced off road driver. There ought to be a special entrance for those of us who take Jungo since we are the enlightened few who regard such a route as a special, indeed spiritual, path to Burning Man. (unless you're coming from a different direction.) But I love Jungo! I think I'll cross over this year and see what happens. Then I will devise an escape route for sunday night. Now it's getting serious...The irony here is the constraints of freedom on a certain level at BM, but once I'm in I feel pretty free.

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Post by ygmir » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:16 am

stormlight wrote:for the past two years I've taken Jungo from Winnemucca and back. Our posse in a Camper built on Ford F550 4x4 (17,000 lbs) no issues there but what pisses me off is last year it took 5 hours after temple burn to get to spot on Jungo which would have taken 20 minutes from BRC going across that little strip of desert. You can see how close it is on the map. The extreme nanny state attitude is really irritating to an experienced off road driver. There ought to be a special entrance for those of us who take Jungo since we are the enlightened few who regard such a route as a special, indeed spiritual, path to Burning Man. (unless you're coming from a different direction.) But I love Jungo! I think I'll cross over this year and see what happens. Then I will devise an escape route for sunday night. Now it's getting serious...The irony here is the constraints of freedom on a certain level at BM, but once I'm in I feel pretty free.
Thanks for the heads up.

yeah, really, a special entrance should be created, for you "special few". because, we also know no one else would try it, knowing it exists,,,,,,,never have trouble with someone wandering into flight or airport areas, making their own entrance in the trash fence, nothing like that.

One might imagine, in the light of a "spiritual route".......folks of said spirit, would not necessarily want the "easiest" route for the end, but, be willing to accept the penance of extra effort, and the satisfaction therein. Flagellation may well help with this.


spelling edit.
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Post by Bob » Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:38 am

Fuck the Temple. Jailbreak before the Man burns and it's ten minutes out to Gate.

Bikes can probably lanesplit, but keep your helmet on.
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