Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Bikes, trikes, personal mobility and getting to/from the event - this is the place to discuss general transportation issues.
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sparr
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Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by sparr » Wed Aug 03, 2016 11:48 am

If I end up riding with strangers from SF / Reno / Gerlach, what are the steps I can take to make sure I can get into the burn without being at risk of other people in the vehicle being stowaways and/or not having valid tickets?
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by sparr » Wed Aug 03, 2016 11:50 am

someone off-topic wrote:
sparr wrote:
someone unreasonable wrote:Only ride with people you know and trust.
That's not a reasonable answer and would exclude a lot of first-time burners.
Sparr's being crazy again
I'm probably naive in my hope that getting this out of the way early will let us skip a few posts worth of useless commentary below
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by BBadger » Wed Aug 03, 2016 11:58 am

If you don't already trust the people you're with, just ask to have everyone verify that they have a ticket. It would be in the best interest of all people in the vehicle. You can volunteer to show your ticket first just to prove to them that you're not a problem to break the ice.

If you're concerned the request might cause offense, you could use the excuse that you're making sure nobody forgot their ticket. Or just be honest that you're being cautious and don't want to get burned.

Aaaand... if you somehow find out that in the gate line some asshole is trying to crawl into a cooler or something in order to stowaway, I'd demand to be let out and have your stuff removed. It doesn't mean you're going to rat them out (though they'd deserve it), but at least you'll be out of that situation.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by Elderberry » Wed Aug 03, 2016 11:59 am

OK This made me smile. :)
sparr wrote:
someone off-topic wrote:
sparr wrote:
That's not a reasonable answer and would exclude a lot of first-time burners.
Sparr's being crazy again
I'm probably naive in my hope that getting this out of the way early will let us skip a few posts worth of useless commentary below
JK
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by sparr » Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:03 pm

BBadger wrote:if you somehow find out that in the gate line some asshole is trying to crawl into a cooler or something in order to stowaway, I'd demand to be let out and have your stuff removed. It doesn't mean you're going to rat them out (though they'd deserve it), but at least you'll be out of that situation.
Elsewhere I suggested that the best defense would be to just get out of the vehicle regardless. I can't know who is laying on the roof or mad-max-ing it under the vehicle. It seems safest to just hop out a quarter mile before gate and walk in.

But then someone elsewhere said that walking in isn't allowed, which seemed wrong to me since I know people who have hiked or biked to BRC, but if they are right then I'm curious what the next step of your plan is after getting out.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by misfit » Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:17 pm

>>>>That's not a reasonable answer and would exclude a lot of first-time burners.<<<<

its a totally reasonable answer,,, why would it exclude first time burners.?. first time burners aren't as needy as you might think. most are very resourceful and knowledgeable about the playa and travel. those that aren't didn't do their homework. all of your answers are out there, you just refuse to do the work, and you disguise your questions as, "someone else may need to know". well that someone is out there reading the blogs and web sites dedicated to burning safely. have you ever thought about writing your own blog on, "Sparrs way to burn", without annoying first timers and vets.?. I would certainly read it... see you in the dirt.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by sparr » Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:27 pm

misfit wrote:all of your answers are out there, you just refuse to do the work, and you disguise your questions as, "someone else may need to know". well that someone is out there reading the blogs and web sites dedicated to burning safely.
OK, if you really need an example that's applicable to me, personally... What if our car breaks down in Reno and we have to just ask random people in the Walmart parking lot for a ride? We've done all the research, knew each other very well, trusted each other, and still end up riding in with strangers.

Or, more hypothetically, what if I'm the only burner in my town, and my ride options are people from hours away that happen to be driving through; people I can't meet until the trip starts?

Or what if I do know and trust all of the people I thought I was riding with, but at the last minute the driver invites their partner who I don't know? Should I bail because I don't trust this person, or just risk them not having a ticket and ruining my trip?
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by maladroit » Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:30 pm

What are the sheer odds of you making it all the way to Gate with a carload of strangers? I think you'd make it as far as Wadsworth before ending up on foot again.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by GreyCoyote » Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:39 pm

^^^ BAWAHAHAHAHA!!!! ^^^

So. Much. This.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by misfit » Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:50 pm

Sparr,,, sometimes common sense needs to take over.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by June Cleaver » Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:56 pm

Son, don't get in cars with strangers!!!!!
....if you make it through the gate, candy n condoms from strangers is fine. This is where you might want to really focus on helping out the virgins at the burn. Good luck.

If say hypothetically, a birgin is lost in the forest with their ticket, please be a sport and go help them find their way.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by trilobyte » Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:02 pm

It probably depends on the vehicle. 4 people in a sedan, you probably can use common sense. If it's a larger vehicle, the best way to be sure there aren't any stowaways is to be there and help load the vehicle. If that's not an option, then ask the driver in advance. On the day, before you leave your departure city, pull out your ticket and say something like "I've got my ticket on me - how about you guys?" Keep things on the happy and excited side, you don't want to come off as 'that guy' in the early stages of a long car trip.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by Token » Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:07 pm

Just wear this and move on with your life.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by maladroit » Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:07 pm

trilobyte wrote:Keep things on the happy and excited side, you don't want to come off as 'that guy' in the early stages of a long car trip.
If I meet these theoretical strangers on the playa, I will tell them that you tried to help.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by BBadger » Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:39 pm

sparr wrote:Elsewhere I suggested that the best defense would be to just get out of the vehicle regardless. I can't know who is laying on the roof or mad-max-ing it under the vehicle. It seems safest to just hop out a quarter mile before gate and walk in.
I think the days are probably gone that people try to stowaway using such obvious tactics, and if they did you'd have ample opportunity to exit the vehicle. Also, whomever picked you up would probably have more to lose by picking up a stranger who might not approve of the ruse.

Then again, I didn't expect to encounter an self-entitled gift-ticket bum this year, so I guess anything is possible when it comes to BM crazies.
But then someone elsewhere said that walking in isn't allowed, which seemed wrong to me since I know people who have hiked or biked to BRC, but if they are right then I'm curious what the next step of your plan is after getting out.
Depending on the time of day and your point of discovery, you could probably hitch a ride with someone else (after showing them your ticket). I can't imagine anyone hanging out in a false wall, or RV bench, or storage cooler, or whatever those assholes use longer than entering the gate line. After that point you're pretty much guaranteed to be able to hitch-hike with someone.
sparr wrote:OK, if you really need an example that's applicable to me, personally... What if our car breaks down in Reno and we have to just ask random people in the Walmart parking lot for a ride? We've done all the research, knew each other very well, trusted each other, and still end up riding in with strangers.
It kind of happened to me last year in Gerlach. I asked some RV guys if they'd help me but eventually hitched a ride with an awesome burgin who was filling up gas.

My advice: keep your wits, because no amount of advice in a forum post is going to cover every situation. Preparation only goes so far when you encounter an unplanned situation.

Also, if you're worried about these problems, the best thing to do is just ask the people you encounter to verify tickets and such. There's really not much else you can do but be direct. Most people will understand if you have these anxieties, especially with a big event like these with a lot of investment.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by mudpuppy000 » Wed Aug 03, 2016 3:34 pm

There's a lot worse things that can happen than stowaways or no/fake/cancelled tickets. You're just going to have to roll the dice.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by sparr » Wed Aug 03, 2016 3:44 pm

mudpuppy000 wrote:There's a lot worse things that can happen
And I'm worried about those things, too. Different threads for different problems.
mudpuppy000 wrote:You're just going to have to roll the dice.
I'd rather swap them for loaded dice. (in this analogy, that means collecting info and taking steps to make the outcome less random)

Maybe that means hopping out of the car in the gate line and asking a bunch of other cars for a ride in until I find one that feels the most trustworthy (see also: Sultan's Dowry Problem).

Maybe that means it's worth the money to rent a car instead of accepting a ride, if I find myself facing that choice.

Maybe... a dozen other possibilities, which I'm narrowing down as people give me new information on this front.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by Token » Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:01 pm

Fuck Reddit!

We embrace Sparr, defects and all.

I don't judge or blame personal impediments and pathologies, but I sure as fuck don't mind having a good laugh at 'em.

It all works out in the end.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by maladroit » Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:28 pm

Token wrote:Fuck Reddit!

We embrace Sparr, defects and all.

I don't judge or blame personal impediments and pathologies, but I sure as fuck don't mind having a good laugh at 'em.

It all works out in the end.
That's very true. Missing out on the main sale and then having to network to find tickets is sort of a gateway here. Maybe my network is especially good, but I've had at least four opportunities to get normal priced tickets over the past few months if I didn't already have some.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by vantim » Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:33 pm

We embrace Sparr, defects and all.
You say that now, but that wasn't the sentiment on previous posts. If you want him, he's yours, but just remember that no matter how much you argue and debate, your advice and wisdom will never meet his standards of an "acceptable answer".

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by Sham » Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:42 pm

I pulled the post with the reddit links.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by Bless » Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:47 pm

Sparr, do you mean to tell us that you live in San Fransisco but are unable to befriend anyone attending this year's burn?

Maybe there are bigger issues for you to worry about...
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by sparr » Wed Aug 03, 2016 5:20 pm

Bless wrote:Sparr, do you mean to tell us that you live in San Fransisco but are unable to befriend anyone attending this year's burn?
Neither do I mean to tell you that nor have I told you that.
Bless wrote:Maybe there are bigger issues for you to worry about...
You worry about your reading comprehension problems, I'll worry about my carpool.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by maladroit » Wed Aug 03, 2016 5:45 pm

But we're all worrying about your carpool here at your request.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by GreyCoyote » Wed Aug 03, 2016 5:51 pm

Hot safety tip about car pools: always roll the windows down as soon as you hit the water. Hard to open a door with all that water pressure on the other side. And grab your ticket as you exit. Dont want any damn mermaids scamming Gate with Sparr's precious ticket...
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by Eric » Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:03 pm

vantim wrote:
We embrace Sparr, defects and all.
You say that now, but that wasn't the sentiment on previous posts. If you want him, he's yours, but just remember that no matter how much you argue and debate, your advice and wisdom will never meet his standards of an "acceptable answer".
I think you misinterpret the use of "embrace": this is ePlaya, we give fuck-all about someones quirks, but people are free to make fun of those quirks them if they want to - as long as they're not threatening or harassing that poster (It's a thin line sometimes, but how people present themselves online is going to affect peoples reactions to them, we take this into account).

The only time we're going to ban or block someone from the site is for continually breaking the sites rules; being pedantic about minutia isn't one of those reasons. If people find it annoying they can avoid the threads, or, if they really, really don't want to see a persons posts they're free to "plonk" them, which will block that persons posts from being seen. Plonking someone really can make for a more enjoyable ePlaya, we encourage it as the radically self-reliant way to make the site work for you, while still being inclusive to others.

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by lucky420 » Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:41 pm

it's like an insane merry go round on that Reddit thread
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by mojo » Wed Aug 03, 2016 8:05 pm

I have personally busted people who rolled into camp asking for handouts while bragging that they snuck in. I'm over 60, (and not very big), but at the top of my lungs, I backed a 25'ish guy a half block down the street at high volume hoping someone with a radio would hear so he could be removed. I belong to this event, it belongs to me. I have, and still do, put many weeks a year of hard work into volunteering. It is not easy - I still work for a living every day. Please, never, ever, put up with people who would use all of our resources and hard work to get a "free ride". Every person who sneaks in causes the rest of us to have to shoulder their burden.

So, please ask to see valid tickets when riding in.
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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by lucky420 » Wed Aug 03, 2016 9:15 pm

mojo wrote:I have personally busted people who rolled into camp asking for handouts while bragging that they snuck in. I'm over 60, (and not very big), but at the top of my lungs, I backed a 25'ish guy a half block down the street at high volume hoping someone with a radio would hear so he could be removed. I belong to this event, it belongs to me. I have, and still do, put many weeks a year of hard work into volunteering. It is not easy - I still work for a living every day. Please, never, ever, put up with people who would use all of our resources and hard work to get a "free ride". Every person who sneaks in causes the rest of us to have to shoulder their burden.

So, please ask to see valid tickets when riding in.
This is good
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

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Re: Protecting my trip and ticket when carpooling with strangers?

Post by trilobyte » Wed Aug 03, 2016 9:42 pm

I think you're getting yourself in a twist over extreme possible variants, probably needlessly. It is impossible to 'load the dice' if you're in a situation of completely random chance.

That is, if you've got a breakdown, and you're going to abandon the people you're traveling with (which in many circles, btw, is a dick move) and then try to catch a last minute random ride from a complete stranger you know even less than the strangers you're abandoning in Reno (in your hypothetical situation).... you've got to take what you can get.

That said, if you're stressing out about 2nd and 3rd backup contingency plans, you probably may want to either rent a vehicle and control your own destiny (be the rideshare you want to see in this world) or arrange for your gear to get hauled out and travel by Burner Express.

Use common sense. Don't get into the car with someone who looks like a murderer or rapist or gives off some kind of 'stranger danger' vibe, and ask the question about stowaways and tickets. Simple facts of the matter - if everybody in the vehicle does not have a valid ticket or the necessary paperwork to be able to pick up their ticket order, they turn the vehicle around and send it back to Reno. And if they find a stowaway on board, the tickets are confiscated for ALL the vehicle's passengers and the vehicle information is taken down (so that it can not return after another vehicle pass is found at a later time). Trust me, nobody wants to be in that vehicle for what I can only imagine would be the most awkward drive home ever.

Asking if everybody has their tickets is good, asking if they have them HANDY should be required. Every year, people leave tickets pinned to the wall or on the fridge - it's much better to find out close to home (or at least within fedex range if in Reno). Beyond that, people also do stuff like pack their tickets in one of their bins, or in a bag that's absolutely nowhere that's easily reachable from where they're sitting in the car. Asking is a great reminder for people in the car, and speeds things up for everybody in the line.

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