New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

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junglesmacks
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by junglesmacks » Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:44 pm

Theres Always One wrote:
bluesbob wrote:Also...I spent hours buying a ticket for 2011. I took a day off from classes. How many days is this lottery going to take? I can't sit day after day waiting for my number to be drawn.
5 minutes. All you do is register your info and wait for your name to be called 7 months later.
You're wrong. Your name gets called right after the one of many lotteries. Read carefully. Neatness counts.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by junglesmacks » Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:47 pm

essjay wrote:Calm down, JS. It is just a discussion - don't take it personally. Let people vent a bit. Then you can tell everyone "I told you so" later. People are concerned, and your repeated posts of assurance are not going to stop this discussion until we hear more from BMORG.
My point here is that everyone is going off all half cocked without simply reading carefully. It's full on ludicrous.

The toxicity spreads and people spreading half truths spread it to others. Read the above post for godsakes. People thinking that there will be only one lottery and omg they won't tell us until July whether or not we have a ticket at all. The above post is a prime example.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by lemur » Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:57 pm

junglesmacks wrote: My point here is that everyone is going off all half cocked without simply reading carefully
on the bright side it might create a great chance to buy used theme camp equipment and mutant vehicles..
Don't link to anything here!

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by clerkkent » Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:57 pm

I don’t see how this lottery reduces scalping opportunities. It is still a matter of using banks of computers to jam up the ticket server. I don’t see how delaying ticket confirmations until ‘early summer’ will benefit the community… it seems that work on camps or projects would not take off until ticket confirmations are set.


Without seeing details, here are my initial questions:

1) Since they are now collecting money ‘early summer’, does that indicate that they no longer need ‘early in the year’ funding that they would get under the old system? If so, then do we need tiered ticketing at all, or maybe consolidated brackets? (example, instead of having 8,000 tickets in each of the $210, $240 and $280 brackets, combine them all into one $260 bracket with 25,000 tickets). Then remaining tickets are at the $350 price point. This would reduce the mad rush on opening day, and severely the classicism of the different tiers…" I got in at $210".. "oh man, I almost missed the $280 mark." etc etc

2) Does this mean the end of walk in ticket outlets? Will call tickets?

3) Is the ticketing agent from previous years still involved? Can their computer system that failed last year handle the complexity of a ‘lottery’? Is this a case of allowing the tool (the current ticketing service provider) to dictate the process? We should determine a process first, then find a provider that can meet the requirements. The current ticketing agent charges a per ticket fee, so they are not benevolent volunteers.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by junglesmacks » Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:59 pm

lemur wrote:
junglesmacks wrote: My point here is that everyone is going off all half cocked without simply reading carefully
on the bright side it might create a great chance to buy used theme camp equipment and mutant vehicles..
If they still reek like dumbass then I dunno...



Speaking of.. didn't I just see Christina.. the "Queen of BRC" up for sale somewhere?
Last edited by junglesmacks on Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by Elorrum » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:00 pm

lemur wrote: tickets will still be sold, you'll get one if you want it...
I think lottery implies that "No you will not get one" is a possibility, no matter when you try to buy it. Or for what price you try to buy it at.
I need to read and understand this better.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by junglesmacks » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:01 pm

Elorrum wrote:
lemur wrote: tickets will still be sold, you'll get one if you want it...
I think lottery implies that "No you will not get one" is a possibility, no matter when you try to buy it. Or for what price you try to buy it at.
I need to read and understand this better.

The only way that you will not get a ticket is if more than the pop cap has already put in.

..sound familiar? Oh yeah. It's because it's like every other year.

Think about it.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by caliban » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:02 pm

StormInADDCup wrote:Caliban, if you read back a bit there's someone in there reporting that they know for a fact that only one of the organizers reads these threads and then not very often. Whether that's true or not if I was in their position I'd direct people to somewhere they could vent and let them get on with it while I carry on implementing my lottery that I've already decided on before the 2011 event even began. I think the forum might not be sufficient - I HOPE it will though.
I saw that. A voice in a forum, mostly anonymous, making claims about a group at which they are complaining. And even if it's true, I firmly believe that they'll be watching this node carefully since they explicitly asked for input here. Hi Larry!

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by lemur » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:03 pm

clerkkent wrote:I don’t see how this lottery reduces scalping opportunities. It is still a matter of using banks of computers to jam up the ticket server. I don’t see how delaying ticket confirmations until ‘early summer’ will benefit the community… .
re-read it yo, you misunderstood the announcement.


confirmations arent held until early summer, fulfillment is ........ it means your order will be taken, paid for and completed say in february but you wont get the actual physical ticket until early summer, the order wont be fulfilled until that time.


keeping fulfillment till early summer, for whatever other reasons theyve decided to do it, should also, in my estimation, have a negative impact on scalpers because they wont have tickets to sell, as they wont be fulfilled, until early summer....That gives them a short time to sell them, as well as leaves money tied up for possibly months until early summer.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by unjonharley » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:05 pm

junglesmacks wrote:
essjay wrote:Calm down, JS. It is just a discussion - don't take it personally. Let people vent a bit. Then you can tell everyone "I told you so" later. People are concerned, and your repeated posts of assurance are not going to stop this discussion until we hear more from BMORG.
My point here is that everyone is going off all half cocked without simply reading carefully. It's full on ludicrous.

The toxicity spreads and people spreading half truths spread it to others. Read the above post for godsakes. People thinking that there will be only one lottery and omg they won't tell us until July whether or not we have a ticket at all. The above post is a prime example.
Wrong.. It's is known that the first round has the most buyers. 20-30 000.. First level sells in a flash.. I can only afford so much.. My bid becomes mote for the next round.. You can figure that around 40 000 will throw there hat in the ring on the first round and so on.. dropping the low bidders from the very start..

WE have been jump in balls out buying these tickets for years now.. Changing the system will not change the buyers.. A lottery will only increase the rush..

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by caliban » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:06 pm

moonrise wrote:I don't use credit cards, LLC will you allow a relative or freind of mine to enter your proposed lottery with their credit card?
Drop by your local credit union and get a prepaid gift card for the amount your going to pay for your ticket. Don't even need a credit check, it's backed by cash.

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by Theres Always One » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:08 pm

junglesmacks wrote:
Theres Always One wrote:
bluesbob wrote:Also...I spent hours buying a ticket for 2011. I took a day off from classes. How many days is this lottery going to take? I can't sit day after day waiting for my number to be drawn.
5 minutes. All you do is register your info and wait for your name to be called 7 months later.
You're wrong. Your name gets called right after the one of many lotteries. Read carefully. Neatness counts.
Ah yes you are correct. Your name will be called when the lotteries happen but you won't get your ticket until months later. I was off getting all half cocked.

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by motskyroonmatick » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:09 pm

In past years I bought my ticket on the first day to show enthusiasm for the event. The lower price was a nice side benefit.

If tickets are transferable or giftable without a name attached I'll simply buy several when my lottery number comes up and supply any lottery losers in my camp with an at cost ticket. I imagine many people will do this and so the event will sell out fast(er).

I'm going to miss that great atmosphere and chaos of ticket day launch. It was fun networking to figure out ways to maintain ones position in the queue. It made victory all that sweeter.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by junglesmacks » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:13 pm

Theres Always One wrote: I was off getting all half cocked.
Hey these days, however you can get it.. get it! :wink:

Nothing but love for ya, holmes..
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by caliban » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:13 pm

mgb327 wrote:Well, after re-reading JRS, and the forum here, I did what any non-gambler would do in this situation. All ahead STOP. I just went to the work-shop and ...turned off the lights. I will not invest any more time or money into something I may or may not "win" a chance to go to. I drive 6000 miles round trip. Yes, thats about $1600.00 in fuel, as well as the 6 days of hard driving. Since I am against gambling, I will not chance investing any more into my trip from here. I would hate to be finished and ready to go and find out late summer I can't. And the next year? Nope. Not gonna do it. Really saddened. Really.
11/11/11 - Never Forget!

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by aliendna14 » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:17 pm

Joshy Neurotic wrote:OK firstly, i think this Idea is stupid. Now let me explain why.

Firstly,
The great circle, the fire conclave... i work with a group of performers, as a saftey not a fire spinning hippie ;), and we are usually in the great circle. save for last year. Now with all the planning, equipment, practicing, video submissions, etc, will be shot if this actually happens. What happens if half your fire troupe cannot attend due to not being picked. fail.

Secondly,
If you look at last year, after the tickets were sold out, how many did you see on ebay going for outlandish prices. What do you think will happen this (2012) year ? u think 3000$ for a ticket was bad. i can foresee a 10,000$ ticket.

Thirdly,
If you are a dumb ass hippie who cant get your shit together then you dont deserve to go.... if you dont fucking bring water ... you should have not came.... if you dont bring your own food... your a god dam idiot... unfortunatly alotta people do, do this.


Now this will be my 4th year. i say it will, because im going one way or another. but this lottery idea isnt the correct way, imo, to go about things. mabe invest in using a larger server... blizzard, sony, apple, all have more then 100,000 people accessing there servers for games, icloud, sharing, etc, on a constant basis and have little issues. Im sure there could be a, "subleted" server system that you could rent ( i use all these terms losely cause i am not a netrunner nore do i play one on tv) for the time of ticket sales. And with this last year as evidence, the servers would not have to be rented for long.
I take offense to what you've said about supposedly "dumb-ass hippies" (and so callously I might add) even though they just happen to be the backbone of this event since its inception - along with the cacophany society I might add.... "Welcome home" is the mantra of those who greet the return of their true family or tribe members whether it be at a rainbow gathering or a decompression et cetera. Please learn a little bit more about this event before you make such foolish comments about it. Nevertheless, I have to agree that the new ticketing system sucks ass.... It's a horrible idea!

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by Paloma8 » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:33 pm

This sounds so freaking complicated. So now instead of getting this planned and done in January or February, we have to keep the topic open and keep coming back to it and back to it and BACK to it until we might (or might not) win a lottery of our choice? I really do hate to sound whiney, but I thought the purpose of buying a ticket ahead of time was not only to have the different tiers, as a reward for people who got it together ahead of time AND to give BRC the funds it needed early so they could plan and build things out. Now all of this is put on hold while 10,000's of names are hashed out over and over and over, over MONTHS? Then they can't even do pre-sale at higher price? That has to be a lottery as well? I NEVER PLAY THE LOTTERY. Gambling sucks.

There have always been people who 2 days before the burn decide to go and go crazy trying to buy a ticket. There have always been the planners who picked up their tickets early in the year because they were committed to going. I've been 11 seasons. The past 8 years I've bought my tickets early, not at the cheapest tier, but because it was done; I was set and BRC had the money to work with. I didn't have to think about it anymore. Doing by lottery drags out the pain for months. It seems like an administrative nightmare... and after the crash of last year, I have a bit of fear there'll be enough of a system to handle all this. And then there's no guarantee of getting a ticket at any tier. Ouch.

Oh I get it - life's no guarantee etc etc....... but something as simple as buying a ticket....... while I waited for the announcement as to how they were going to avoid last years crash I thought... why don't they simply have 3 sites, each with 15,000 tickets, each with the identical tiers -- so the servers could handle the demand. No matter the servers crashed last year and the event eventually sold out, it didn't sell out until late in the summer. So putting sales through several sites just gets the early ticket buyers done and everyone else should watch sales and freaking commit before sell-out. I feel punished for being on time for years. It's not gonna be any fun to 'win' a lottery and then wait to see for the next 3 mos if the rest of my camp is gonna make it or not. People have built mini-communities within BRC - and depending on a lottery that will drag on for months is going to break those communities up. I don't understand the point of this. Even with last years crash, I hung in there for the nearly 20 hours and WAS DONE. Now I have to hang around for??? thousands of hours wondering. Ouch again.

I hate this system. What are the chances this bit of complicated technology will even work first time around. Ugg.

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by Ratty » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:37 pm

I seriously feel like I was the only person mailing in my money on the first day. I'll miss it. I always got my ticket in the mail. So far I'm not trippin. Everyone on this board is 'thinking' playa all year. the people that aren't on this board are the ones that will end up ticketless.

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by rubymermaid » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:43 pm

I want to add my voice that this new system has me very worried. This should be my third trip out to the playa, but even though the chance I will not be granted a ticket is slim, I still have great anxiety over it.

Also, I did not get this JRS email. I had it forwarded by a friend, but I should be on the mailing list! Did anyone else have this problem or know what to do about it? I'm worried when they start the lotteries I will not be informed!

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by Awwwyeah » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:48 pm

Well now, this is just pure fucktardary. At it's finest. Outsource the ticketing, charge a slight increase in ticket fees, make all tickets non-transferable, and charge a restocking fee.

Did I mention that the lottery is pure fucktardary? Ok. I'm going to bed now.

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by Shinylilypad » Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:02 am

[quote="Awwwyeah"]Well now, this is just pure fucktardary. At it's finest. Outsource the ticketing, charge a slight increase in ticket fees, make all tickets non-transferable, and charge a restocking fee.

Did I mention that the lottery is pure fucktardary? Ok. I'm going to bed now.[/quote]

Fucktardary at it's finest!!
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Reading posts, just getting more wound up

Post by Paloma8 » Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:06 am

I hate the idea of waiting for months. Not knowing if I'll get a ticket. Or if my family will. Or the rest of camp. If you build it they will come, but theme camps won't be there without a ticket. I've worked on major theme camps 3 seasons, there were not 4 people there but hundreds working to bring the experience out to BRC, how do you plan for that without having 6 or 7 months to budget, work and get it all done?

I hate the idea of having my credit card hanging out there. Last week a friend was in a car wreck he caused. Guess what? His wallet had been stolen a few weeks earlier and in the fracas of getting another card, other stuff in wallet, he forgot that his car ins pymt was charged to his credit card. Credit card stolen, canceled, no ins pymt. No ins for car wreck. What does this have to do with BMan's ticketing? That things CHANGE - buying tickets ONE DAY meant everything is in order. You know your card is working and you have money available to pay for it.

The new system: Register one day. Get this that day. Put in my credit card... what if I have to change that. What if MY wallet and credit card get stolen.

I have read carefully. It appears to me that you choose a tier/lottery to enter, if you win well lucky you, it'll be months down the line. If you don't? THere's nothing saying you can now GO BACK and re-register for a different lottery.

What about all the people that DON'T register during Those Two Weeks? Are they OUT? If so, we can all stop worrying.

Really. Is it just THOSE two weeks worth of people that get to gamble?

Over the years I have both sold an extra ticket and bought tickets from other burners. I didn't charge more than I paid and didn't pay more than they purchased the ticket. While there are scalpers out there, I don't think it's the majority of the business - maybe a small minority - BIG DEAL!!! Do we ALL have to pay for the Scalpers with this silly complicated gamble?

Why would we have to buy A ticket and put OUR name on it and SHOW ID to get in... that's like the freaking airlines... you used to BUY A TICKET and that bought you a seat. But then oh no, you had to put a name on it so if YOU couldn't go see Aunt Betty, too bad, your sister couldn't take your seat because her name wasn't on it.
Can we just dispense with the freaking BurningLand Security and let the feathers fly? I don't think there's that many thousands of scalpers out there - am I wrong? Have you people bought ridiculously priced tickets from scalpers? Maybe I'm missing the biggest scandal since....... Lehman Bros.
I agree with burner way back there........ as if there wasn't enough uncertainty, chaos, economic issues already. We need to bring some to BRC? RELEASE THE HOUNDS...

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by unjonharley » Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:09 am

Just re read JRS

If I bid low, You can bet your sweet ass I wont win a ticket.. Every body and his brother we be bidding on that level..

OK.. So I bid $400.. And a whole tier worth of people think like me. My odds are screwed on both ends..

Rereading it again.. You get a conformation right after the lottery draw.. The "ticket" arrives in the summer..

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by jmm018 » Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:21 am

I cant even believe this is happening. How unfair...Im with many others on the fact that it will be difficult if one family member or person in a theme camp group..or any camp for that matter gets a ticket while another member doesnt. We are just gambling...with our money...hopes...and chances of being able to go with this whole lottery thing. How are we supposed to plan? take time off work..etc? Personally I will be extremely sad if I don't get a ticket...or if any of my friends don't either. What about all those volunteering? What if they sign up to volunteer and don't get chosen for a ticket? I really dont think this will elimnate any scalping opportunities...they find their around everything and know how to work the system...Thats what they do. This is all just poorly planned and thought out. Lets get it together and find a different system. SO FRUSTRATED.

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PLEASE READ!!!!

Post by GREEN » Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:28 am

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

I really hope BURNING MAN READS THIS!!!!!

In all honesty Im hoping this is a joke!

This claim/reply that people are stalking up on tickets early and selling them for lots of money is ridiculous! FREEDOM!
I do not think this behavior is acceptable either and believe that those people should burn! But IT IS WHAT IT IS...Here me out!

OK - Let's break down and look back in history to how this kind of response does not work.

- A couple people get carried away with drugs & what happens - the Big Brother Government steps in to regulate.
- A couple people get carried away with guns in various states & what happens tons of regulation by government.
- From how many dogs you can own to the amount of water you can have in your toilet!!!!
I can go on and on…

OUR vital decisions we make everyday as people are being damaged daily by the controlling currupt system.

Choices are an inate quality of our being as free individuals.

These greedy people making money off tickets will try even harder to abuse the next system that is being implemented!
Please dont take these choices away.
This event is supposed to be about freedom & choices. Now it’s being all taken away.

How about a vote from the people of the dust?....to show how BURNING MAN values freedom???

Please respond!

-GREENS

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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by capjbadger » Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:54 am

You people need to chill for a few days till the next JRS comes out with the DETAILS on how the process will work.

-Badger
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by lemur » Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:58 am

what would janeway do
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by britzbitz » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:14 am

so wait, even if i say i'm willing to pay for tickets in any of the 3 tiers (i don't make a ton of money, but who am I kidding, I AM willing to pay to go home…)

i STILL might not get tickets??? =/

wtf…

It also bothers me that my card *might* be charged at some random time *if* they select me to buy tickets. I'd much rather go through the steps of a normal transaction, get my receipt, and know when the money has been charged to my card.

/bitching

Whatever. I know I'm gonna go through whatever process they make me to (hopefully) get tickets anyway...
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by Eric » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:16 am

capjbadger wrote:You people need to chill for a few days till the next JRS comes out with the DETAILS on how the process will work.

-Badger
But Badger, that would ruin a perfectly good freak-out. Think of it as a Thursday meltdown on-playa and it becomes much easier to deal with. Also, just glance over the posts. Reading them hurts.
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Re: New Burningman Ticket Process - 2012

Post by amarantha » Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:23 am

i’m just confused. especially by the people saying that everyone who enters the lottery will get a ticket, and therefore we shouldn’t be freaking out. how do you figure?

last year, tiers sold out on the first day. there were more people trying to get 1st 2nd, and even 3rd tier tickets than there were tickets. therefore, it would seem that if you enter into the lottery for anything but the highest tier, there IS a very real chance you will get shut out. especially because people will have two WEEKS to sign up, instead of one day. then if you get shut out the first time, presumably, your name is entered into another round? what does that mean exactly? will there be more 1st, 2nd, and 3rd tier tickets released? or are subsequent rounds highest-tier only? if you lose again (CAN you lose again?) and again… IS there a possibility that you won’t get one at all? can you CHANGE the tier for which you are entered between rounds? lots of unanswered questions… but the people saying, “hey dum-dums, read carefully, everyone will get a ticket,” well i just don’t see how that is the case. a lottery is a lottery, and if it’s not actually a lottery then why are they calling it a lottery.

i also can’t for the life of me see how this addresses the scarcity problem, as JRS put it. but then again, i can’t really wrap my brain around any of it at this point... so hopefully we will get some clarification soon. until then i am just confused as all hell. and i read it carefully.

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