Theme Camp destruction

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lemur
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by lemur » Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:42 pm

dont mistake my not speaking vehemently in defense of theme camps/art projects/mutant vehicles as the heart and soul of all that is burning man as a suggestion that i believe people dont or shouldnt care about their projects...

dont mistake my not speaking vehemently in defense of these projects as the heart and soul of the event as a suggestion that i believe that these arent welcome..

dont mistake my not speaking vehemently in their defense as an indication that i believe those projects have no value.. or that the ones creating them just arent worthy.

dont mistake my not speaking vehemently in their defense as an indication that other shit is just as good or better than what they have to offer..

we all care about our projects.. and i know everyone puts tons of time into their shit.. even people without projects put tons of time to get there... you cant compare things on the scale of money or effort involved because we all put our all into this

to believe i have no interest or no care about these aspects of the burn would be to miss my intent..

i do care about that shit, my favorite thing to do outside of my project is to hang out in a particular theme camp, it has been that way for years.. hell i am there so much i am jokingly considered an 'honorary member'

i think mutant vehicles kick ass.. and I take some small part in making sure they get there, along with many others who do the same, I volunteer with the DMV off-playa for 60+ hours on conference calls processing everyones vehicle applications..as a lowly volunteer with no real say in what happens in DMV... i saw every single application in 2011 (except the disabled ones) and took part in the process that allowed every vehicle that made it to burning man get invited.

just because I can see in my own mind that burning man isnt ruined if every theme camp, project, or mutant vehicle doesnt make it this year it doesnt mean that I am blind to the fact that this shit is stuff people love to do..

it doesnt mean that i dont recognize it might be ruined for you

i volunteer my time and work in the infrastructure of burning man because it is something I love to do, and i get to see all the mutant vehicle stuff others love to do as a result of that work.. i read their description, how much work they put into them.. 1000+ of them.. i can see how much people care.. i can see how much work the mutant vehicle community puts into their art.. it is obvious their work not being able to make it would be a crushing blow.. i dont intend to say otherwise

(i am not a part of placement.. and ive never run a theme camp.. so i dont have that perspective... but i do help to run one of the infrastructure groups which needs year round stewardship to pull off)

yeah.. the place i help to make happen in the Lamplighters has no danger of not making it to burning man.. the DPW is gonna use a heister to drop our shit off in camp and our crew who did receive tickets in the lottery will make it happen.. I would be pretty upset and lost if I didnt have that.. but if we didnt have it.. we would still show up to be together because we like being together (and for those that might not be able to make it some of our group are already in the process of forming a regional event that would be a place for us to get together)

just because i am not speaking vehemently for every theme camp that wants to be there, to be there doesnt mean i dont realize how much people care about their work...

I care, you care.. we all care.. I just see that if some camps and projects dont make it to burning man this year.. we can still all have a good time... nothing more than that, nothing less...
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ZaphodBurner
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by ZaphodBurner » Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:54 pm

lemur wrote:
and hey! i never claimed i wouldnt be partaking in theme camps, either.... i just said there are plenty who already dont..
And I call bullshit. There are people who claim they saw UFOs on the playa, or claim that the moon would be larger than the sun, and people who claim to volunteer who later admit that their camp actually had to pack their shit for them because they were off playing with a new friend.

Some people are just completely full of their own feces. The goal is to try not to be one of them.

At some point it's not worth the effort to build anything at all, if I can, as somebody else described, simply put on a steampunk hat and yell "Fuck your day" and tell all my friends I'm a "Burner." 2008 is over.
"The Red Baron is smart.. He never spends the whole night dancing and drinking root beer.. "-The WWI Flying Ace

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lemur
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by lemur » Sat Feb 11, 2012 4:57 pm

well its true that i didnt verify my friends claims.. i believed them nonetheless !!
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A Jester
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by A Jester » Sat Feb 11, 2012 5:16 pm

ZaphodBurner wrote: Shady Aslyum brought grass--GRASS--to the playa and tried to keep it alive all week in the shade and mist, before donating it to a crisis shelter. Do you know what people did to it? They pissed on it. Random "Burners" wandered into their camp and relieved themselves on the grass. The had no sweat equity in the city. They didn't give a fuck. Because, you're right: There's simply other shit to do at Burning Man.

How long you gonna keep polishing that turd, yo?
To be honest, if I was a detective the first place I'd look for those pissers would be in the Black Hole. And those people have more sweat equity than anyone else.
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theCryptofishist
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by theCryptofishist » Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:47 pm

lemur wrote:
moonrise wrote:Lamplighters is the largest art project at burning man, in scale, besides the city itself. There are roughly 5 miles worth of spires spread out over 1 square mile of space. Roughly 1000 people will help light the city each year.
Robbidobbs might disagree...
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"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

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lemur
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by lemur » Sat Feb 11, 2012 6:58 pm

hey! i said that.. not..moonrise..

and well.. yeah the potty project is surely an undertaking that we are all witness to but but ... i stick by my story!!!

and yeah surely a good 50,000 people take part in the potties... and many vendors workin round the clock..

but i still stick by muh story!!
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by theCryptofishist » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:04 pm

Sorry, lemur. I owe you one. One what? you ask. I'm not sure yet...
The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

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lemur
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by lemur » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:15 pm

one look of longing and never ending desire !?
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theCryptofishist
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by theCryptofishist » Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:20 pm

Yeah, sure. If we get our tickets...
The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

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5280MeV
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by 5280MeV » Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:38 am

5280MeV wrote:
ZaphodBurner wrote:
Shambala wrote:It might be refreshing to have fewer massive camps and more smaller groups. Back to the festival roots.
I'm uncomfortable with this whole philosophy, and offer anybody who seriously believes it a very simple challenge:

Don't go into any theme camps this year. Don't indulge in theme camp art, or ride on their vehicles, enjoy their offerings or listen to their music. When you look at the city at night, avert your eyes from anything large, or spectacular, or lit with neon, or shooting fire, or emitting light that isn't the Man or Center Camp. Which means you pretty much have to stay off the Esplanade, 'cause all that shit that's lit up at night is because of the camps.

Otherwise, if you can't do that, your philosophy is broken.
That is not right. Your ticket goes to fund over 60 art honorarium projects that make up the largest structures on the Esplanade.
I now realize that an art grant does not guarantee one tickets, and certainly not at the time when one would start to construct the project and raise additional funds from the community. As much as I wished I did, I have no argument here.

I now agree that unless something drastic is done there will be very little large scale art. I also think that while there are people (myself included) who are ok with the idea of a week long goofy campout in the desert, even though we did just put down $400 for what we could do on BLM land for free at other times. It is naive to think that potentially 20-40,000 other people who bought tickets feel the same way, especially as Burning Man is arriving in the national consciousness along with a wave of commercial festivals that are nothing like BM. Burning Man, in the minds of some, is grouped with those festivals.

I also now realize that I have been wrong to defend the way tickets have been allocated, which I think is fine for people like myself, but outrageous for people who need to be in the city, making it run, propagating a social framework that is foreign to the commercial system. Radical ideals often look very good on paper.
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BBadger
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by BBadger » Sun Feb 12, 2012 7:26 am

5280MeV wrote: I now realize that an art grant does not guarantee one tickets, and certainly not at the time when one would start to construct the project and raise additional funds from the community. As much as I wished I did, I have no argument here.
Of course it doesn't guarantee free tickets. Like the money in Honorarium grants, the distribution of grant free tickets is need-based. It shouldn't be any other way. They don't want you padding yourself in free tickets, nor making art for the sake of free tickets. Specify what you need in your grant, justify how many you need, and see if they fulfill your request. You can even get free tickets to bring in non-sponsored art, based on the size and construction needs of the project.
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by ZaphodBurner » Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:08 pm

5280MeV wrote: the way tickets have been allocated, which I think is fine for people like myself, but outrageous for people who need to be in the city, making it run, propagating a social framework that is foreign to the commercial system. Radical ideals often look very good on paper.
I think that sums it up perfectly.

My wife and I went to a burner-rich environment in Portland last night and absolutely nobody wanted to mention Burning Man aloud, but in the corners and in line at the bar, and at the tables, people were having these same discussions and debates. Whether they blame the org, or the camps, or the ravers, or the scalpers or YouTube, our ourselves, EVERYBODY seemed to have a strong opinion.

Strong opinions don't get you into Burning Man, so, I hope I can find an opportunity to earn my way in.
"The Red Baron is smart.. He never spends the whole night dancing and drinking root beer.. "-The WWI Flying Ace

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Bunns
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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by Bunns » Sun Feb 12, 2012 7:08 pm

Dr Helix wrote:
Shambala wrote:It might be refreshing to have fewer massive camps and more smaller groups. Back to the festival roots.
I"m with you there. Well said.
I agree that a little downsizing would be good for our soul, small intimate theme camps are just as valuable as the larger ones. The sound camps have gotten out of control at 10 and 2 with the trashed porta poties and thousands of people attempting to get close enough to lose there hearing. Personally I can appreciate a small piece of art as well as a large one.
Theme camps art works and sound camp will all fill the streets this year, some might downsize and some might skip a year but if all you can say is that bigger is better then perhaps you have missed the point.

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Re: Theme Camp destruction

Post by abigailhawaii » Sun Feb 12, 2012 7:25 pm

Dr Helix wrote:Theme camps, theme camps, THEME CAMPS!!!!!!!!!!!!! Love 'em. Want 'em. Hope it all works out. But................if it doesn't. Guess What?????


If there's people there.......they WILL interact.
If there's music there........they WILL dance
If there's a stick setup sideways with some paint on it......they WILL go and look at.

And the MAN WILL BURN.

All the rest is just talk. And...........I'm done here.


I totally agree! Thanks for posting. All this gloom and doom seems unnecessary. By August we'll be having a great time!

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