Logistics Ques.

[wyn]

G'evening All,

This is my inaugural post, so please bear with me should I be posting in the wrong forum.

Here is my question, and, as far as I can tell (via the - almost - inordinate amount of reading and "researching" I've been doing) it hasn't been addressed. My question is twofold:

1.) If we arrive on the 29th or 30th will we be able to find adequate (meaning even quasi-desirable) camping? We don't need to be in the thick of things, per se, but also since we won't have bikes or anything, is it realistic to assume that by arriving late our camping experience (if that's an adequate way of describing it) will be limited? Realizing this is a subjective question, I look forward to opinions.

2.) Do many people leave the Sunday after the Burn? We're planning to drive to Reno the next day (9/3) to catch a flight back to Boston (we're flying into Las Vegas on 8/28, renting a car and driving to BM)? Again, is this - in people's opinions - a realistic expectation?

All feedback will be considered and GREATLY appreciated!!

Thank you kindly,
Wyn

[Chai Guy]

1.) If we arrive on the 29th or 30th will we be able to find adequate (meaning even quasi-desirable) camping? We don't need to be in the thick of things, per se, but also since we won't have bikes or anything, is it realistic to assume that by arriving late our camping experience (if that's an adequate way of describing it) will be limited? Realizing this is a subjective question, I look forward to opinions.

You will be able to find camping no matter which day you arrive. Desirable is a totally subjective term. It's a big place, with a lot of room. One thing that you should note, when arriving at night, it's best to park in the "short term parking" area (ask a greeter to direct you) and then catch a few zzzz's or just walk around until the sun comes up. If you arrive during the day time, it's best to find a spot that you like and then ask your neighbors if that spot is available. Every year I have to deal with someone deciding that our performance space would make a great spot to park their RV. Do the neighborly thing and ask first, most people are really friendly and will direct you to the best place for eveyone's needs. Also be sure to tell them if you're going to be running a generator, and ask if they have one (so you don't get stuck camping right next to it).

Not bringing a bike??? WHY??? Walking is great and all, but a bike is heaven when you just need to make an ice run or you want to just get from point A to point B. The city is just too big to navigate without a bike these days. I'm serious, if you don't bring a bike, you will absolutely regret it (even though I don't ride my bike every day, I would die without one). When you fly into Vegas, pick up a couple of bikes in a thrift store there or some where on the way (Not Reno or the surrounding areas as they will have been picked clean the week before the event). When you leave you can drop them off at a thrift store in Reno, or sometimes the locals have a thing set up to take them along the highway on 447, DO NOT leave them on the playa, a bike is a very big trace.

2.) Do many people leave the Sunday after the Burn? We're planning to drive to Reno the next day (9/3) to catch a flight back to Boston (we're flying into Las Vegas on 8/28, renting a car and driving to BM)? Again, is this - in people's opinions - a realistic expectation?

In a word, "no". A LOT of people leave on the Sunday after the Burn. Last year I left on Monday morning at 10:00 am and got to San Francisco at 11:00 pm (there was an accident on 447). Just leaving the event and hitting the nearest black top can take 4+ hours, depending on traffic and accidents on 447 you might be delayed another 4 hours just getting to Reno. (I've seen the road closed for several hours due to traffic fatalities, which are all too common after the event.) My advice is to leave a full day before your plane is due to depart and spend the night in a hotel in Reno and fly out the next day. (not to mention, I think you might be underestimating the amount of dust that will leave the playa with you. Showering before your flight in the clean environment of a hotel room is highly encouraged, the people you sit next to on the plane will thank you ).

Hope this helps!

[LeChatNoir]

Chai’s not kiddin’ about the bike making things better. I’ve taken at least one day to walk everywhere that I go, because it’s a different point of view. But a bike is a big plus. One you’ll wish you had if you don’t bring one.

In '04 we got a room in Reno and I took a shower. I scrubbed like crazy and figured for certain I'd gotten all the dust off. When I stepped out of the shower and toweled off, I looked at the towel and it had playa all over it. Like I'd never even gotten into the water. What a wonderful thing...

[Kinetic IV]

Adding to the already good posts if you get a rental car to drive down there do everyone a huge favor and make sure it's thoroughly cleaned before you drop it back off. People returned a lot of rental trucks that were covered in playa dust and now it's almost impossible to get a rantal truck in the Reno area around Burning Man...they flat refuse to rent to you because they got tired of cleaning up the messes.

Also my average time over 4 years of leaving the greeters / DPW drop off site until I hit 447 during Exodus is just under 3 hours. And I know the official word is to listen to BMIR to get the latest Exodus info...I listen but you can forget about getting accurate greeters to gate timing. It just doesn't work.

And I have to add to the chorus of people saying bring a bike. Even if you go by Wallyworld and pick up a cheap one you seriously need to reconsider the walking idea. And if you bring a bike you need basic lights for it. I know that sounds like an extra hassle on top of bringing the bike to begin with but the first ride out at night when you almost get run over by an art car, another bicyclist, etc you'll be wishing you had some kind of lighting. Even a simple headlamp like a Petzl Tikka which can be used for other things would be better than nothing.

[theCryptofishist]

And if you bring a bike you need basic lights for it. I know that sounds like an extra hassle on top of bringing the bike to begin with but the first ride out at night when you almost get run over by an art car, another bicyclist, etc you'll be wishing you had some kind of lighting. Even a simple headlamp like a Petzl Tikka which can be used for other things would be better than nothing.

I use my flasher for crossing busy streets at night in the "default world." My bus leaves me off on a street that people cheerfully buzz down at 30 mph and there's no crossing light, so I love having it.

[phil]

>SNIP<
1.) If we arrive on the 29th or 30th will we be able to find adequate (meaning even quasi-desirable) camping? We don't need to be in the thick of things, per se, but also since we won't have bikes or anything, is it realistic to assume that by arriving late our camping experience (if that's an adequate way of describing it) will be limited? Realizing this is a subjective question, I look forward to opinions.

Your _camping_ experience will never be limited at Burning Man. Chai Guy gave great answers on how to get a space. The 29th and 30th are Tuesay and Wednesday, you'll still have plenty of good pickings; just follow Chai Guy's tips on asking around before plopping. Asking about noise and generators is good, although not reliable as new people arrive hourly and bring noise and stuff. :->

I understand that getting a bike may not be possible, but as with others, I encourage you to get a bike rack and however many bikes you have people, even though this will be enormously inconvenient in driving to the Burn.

If it's not possible to bring a bike, so be it. You still will have a wonderful time and can rely on the strangeness of kinders for transportation on art cars, bar cars, and whatever.

2.) Do many people leave the Sunday after the Burn? We're planning to drive to Reno the next day (9/3) to catch a flight back to Boston
>SNIP<

Here's what I wrote after the 2004 burn:

We left on Monday. As with coming early for the Burn, this turned out to be a mistake. Black Rock Information Radio was encouraging people not to leave, but to come to Center Camp to enjoy the shade. We left Hushville at 3:00 pm and got in line, turned the car off, and waited for an hour and a half. No one moved. We could see the black top between our turn off and Gerlach, and not one car passed during that time. Not one. Eventually traffic started moving. The radio said it was a three hour delay getting to black top and not to come to Center Camp as it was being taken down. This appeared to us to show that there is no coordination within BMOrg. When things are going stupidly wrong with the exodus, striking Center Camp is dumb. It may be the only shade left for people who have taken down their own camp and now have nowhere to go and no way off the playa.

It took us two and three quarters hours to get from Hushville to the blacktop, longer than it took us to get from Reno to Hushville. The drive to Reno was appalling. Long lines of cars with people passing in the face of on-coming traffic. We arrived at the Peppermill at a quarter to nine. That is longer than it takes to drive from San Mateo to Reno. The woman in line ahead of us at check-in had left her camp at 2:00 pm, and the guy behind us had left at 2:30. When we went down the hall to our room, almost every door had a room service tray outside. We ordered room-service as well, after an exhausting six hours in our car.

Executive summary: it took us six hours to get from our campsite to our hotel in Reno.

This was not the usual traffic, so it may not be a problem in 2006, but as others have said, there are occasional wrecks that shut down lanes (it's a 2-lane blacktop) for hours. You just can't plan on a definite time to get from the playa to Reno. If you drive in the dark, do not drive faster than you can stop when you see a cow on the road in the range of your headlights. Seriously. It's open range and cows have the right of way.

Now, the real advice: forget all this crap, do your best, and we'll see you on the playa in 2006. You'll have a wonderful time. Louise and I camp in Hushville, and we give away clothes to first-timers so they don't look out of place -- stay with this board and we'll post more information in August on where we'll be and the day of the giveaway.

[Chai Guy]

This was not the usual traffic

Last year was my 8th burn, huge delays leaving BRC are more typical than not.

The bottom line is that 30,000+ people all have to leave through one exit, onto a single lane highway, that takes time.

Also, you have to deal with the Yahoos who decide that they don't like cruising behind a slow RV so they have to cross into the oncoming lane of traffic in a quest to be one more vehicle closer to the next slow RV, of course they end up causing accidents which result in people getting killed and injured and thus causing even more delays for themselves and the people behind them.

[Ugly Dougly]

Might as well hang out and clean up. You ain't going nowhere just yet.

[zorro sings]

One more thing.I find citizens of the East Coast have little idea how big the states in the West are.Certainly not trying to insult anyones intelligence but do you realize it is over 600 miles between The Project and Las Vegas?Long trip after a week of little sleep etc.In any case,good luck.

[MrMullen]

If you leave Sunday, you have to get out before 10am. Best if you get up at 6:00a and leave. I have left the last two years at about 8:30a or 9:00a and it's a straight shot out to the I-80.

On Monday, I heard you can get out if you leave at 4:00a or 5:00a, it's the same story. However, any time after that and you are sitting for a while.

[phil]

Certainly not trying to insult anyones intelligence but do you realize it is over 600 miles between The Project and Las Vegas?Long trip after a week of little sleep etc.In any case,good luck.

Uh, he said he's leaving the playa for Reno, if I read his post right.

[CLARKcon]

Yeah, Wyn- Alot of people leave on the Sunday, and quite possibly, a traffic jam at that. Monday as well. If you can stretch it, try to stay that Sunday night as well 1.) to watch the burn of the Temple located behind The Man, and hopefully 2.) The chance the Exodus may be smaller Monday morning (note the word "hopefully".)

[robotland]

For the past three years I've followed the same routine- Depart BRC Monday morning before 8 or 9 AM. Perhaps a half hour in the departure line...Might be more, but you're moving the whole time. (Except for when you stop to drop off beer for the DPW.) Then perhaps two hours on 447, and you're rollin' on '80. It might take a little more time than that, but doesn't SEEM like it...and time is merely a function of perception.

[safetythird]

2005 we left on Monday near sunset. Cleaned up and hung out all day watching the exodus line grow and shrink. We figured we'd rather make our exodus when the sun was down, and it was cooler with less people. Still had about an hour wait to hit blacktop and slow, stop and go traffic but it was bearable. The shower and dinner in Reno was much appreciated. So much so that we may spend an extra day this year to sleep, eat more and maybe do some swimming before our trek back to Cali.

S3