Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

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Monkeystyle
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by Monkeystyle » Wed Feb 04, 2015 8:32 pm

6 people in our camp got theirs, me included. four people did not get theirs obviously more passes given out than tickets available this year.

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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by Elderberry » Wed Feb 04, 2015 8:35 pm

trilobyte wrote:And huzzah for my campmates at Eridu Society - I've heard back from most of our core campmates, they've been able to get through without any issues. We'll continue on with the planning, and look forward to seeing you all in the dust!
Same for us, except for one guy who's bank declined the charge as possible fraud. Boy is he pissed. (I've actually had that happen to me too, but never on such an important in the moment purchase without the benefit of a do-over.)
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by thundt » Wed Feb 04, 2015 11:32 pm

@trilobyte lottery means the outcome is governed by chance -- but you're right, this process can better be called a "feeding frenzy" :-)

Here's the help I was reading,
https://ticketsupport.burningman.com/cu ... e/articles
which leaves out the part about "first come, first served".

I don't know where that quote @jneilvindy posted is from, which does say it.

I just think the above pages should be changed to make it more clear.

That is all.

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digital
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by digital » Wed Feb 04, 2015 11:37 pm

thundt wrote:@trilobyte lottery means the outcome is governed by chance planning.
FTFY

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FlyingMonkey
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Thu Feb 05, 2015 5:17 am

Elorrum wrote:I had three windows open before noon, no buttons on either the burner profile, or bm ticket page, so I went with the email link, and counted down to noon on the world clock. I hit the link at noon on the dot, link put me in line with a three minute wait, (go little guy in the green stripe!) I had my code and ticket fly password written down (the email said the code was embedded in the link, but I needed to enter it and my ticket fly log in) anyway... easily done, no worries, until my credit card company fraud prevention called me to verify the charge, and made me listen to more music than I had patience for... still all went well. Is Burning man a trigger? maybe a whole lot of charges went through all at once and it became a flagged item?

I think online ticket sales in general are a red flag. My Card has pretty good fraud protection & I often get calls to approve purchases. They did call to verify when I purchased my pre-sale ticket, but that was after the fact & didn't affect my purchase. I bought 2 in the DGS yesterday for campmates & didn't get a call. Hopefully for most folks the charge only needs to be verified & the card doesn't automatically refuse the charge. (That really sucks)

Here's an interesting quick read on fraud triggers

http://www.creditcards.com/credit-card- ... l-1282.php

On a side note, in 2012 everyone in my travel party had their cards turned off for purchasing gas out of state. Last year we got smart & let our card companies know what states we were traveling through & didn't have a single problem.
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by trilobyte » Thu Feb 05, 2015 6:27 am

@thundt - I disagree (and it's definitely not random chance... it's first-come, first-served). I don't think it's absolutely necessary for the FAQ to repeat every single piece of information on the ticketing page. By its very name a FAQ is for the most frequently asked questions. I'm sorry that you and your camp leader completely spaced on the details of how the directed group sale program worked in 2013, 2014, and 2015 and wish you luck with the individual sale (which is also first-come, first-serve - you can pre-register for that one starting on Wednesday 2/11 at noon PST).

@Elorrum & @FlyingMonkey - I agree with FM, event tickets tend to be something that raises flags, unless your regular year-round purchasing habits include tickets to numerous events. That whole process can vary from institution to institution as banks try to stay ahead of the bad guys. I remember years ago, my gf and I were traveling and the card we were using for a hotel stay came up with a call customer service message alert when we went to check out. Turns out their system had flagged it as unusual and suspicious, the agent said because the purchase was being made in a different city than all our usual purchases.... uh, yeah... because we were traveling... it would be more suspicious if we were suddenly booking hotels in the town we lived in! It can be frustrating, but I can understand their situation and am glad they're keeping an eye on stuff. Pro tip: you can call the customer service # on a card and let your bank know in advance of any big purchases or trips in advance.

@Elorrum - Burning Man does not publish statistics on invitations. There are always more invitations issued than there are tickets available, for a couple reasons. First, they want to help as many camps and projects as possible to get tickets for their core essential team members (as it is, they can't help everyone). And second, not every camp or project uses every single invitation slot or has every participant purchase the maximum number of tickets.

@ElderBerry - I had a bank snafu cause me to go from really great seats to really horrible seats at a concert once, MAN that really sucked. Thankfully that was years ago, when most popular events didn't go from zero to sellout status in minutes (or even seconds).

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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by AntiM » Thu Feb 05, 2015 6:55 am

I usually let my card people know I am traveling. AmEx caught someone trying to buy first class tickets with my card originating out of state. Had they bought coach, it might have gone through, LOL.

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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by jneilvindy » Thu Feb 05, 2015 8:28 am

thundt wrote:@trilobyte lottery means the outcome is governed by chance -- but you're right, this process can better be called a "feeding frenzy" :-)

Here's the help I was reading,
https://ticketsupport.burningman.com/cu ... e/articles
which leaves out the part about "first come, first served".

I don't know where that quote @jneilvindy posted is from, which does say it.

I just think the above pages should be changed to make it more clear.

That is all.
My quote is straight off the DGS invitation email I received from the ORG.

Everyone in your camp who was given an DGS invite by the camp managers had to have received that email over a week ago inviting them to the DGS.

Maybe no one read the email. Maybe it went to spam and everyone in your group just kept checking their burner profile until the DGS invite popped up?

This will only be my 2nd year and even I knew that unless you're a director ran commodification camp it's always first come first serve for tickets!

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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by Elorrum » Thu Feb 05, 2015 8:47 am

I alerted my card company when I traveled recently, and still had a charge denied at a Walmart in Texas for new tires. When I called to check, they said that it was pretty standard to deny large Walmart purchases due to the large number of fraud cases. uh ? Perhaps that location, or in general. I was glad I had an alternative payment method. My ticket charge was not denied, I was just alerted to verify that it was an intentional use of the card.

One last comment about what I think of the meaning of the word invitation. To me it means you can attend, not that you have a chance or opportunity only if if you get in first or early enough. I wouldn't send out a hundred invitations to a party for ten. "Sorry, don't you understand first come first served?" I understand that it isn't a fixed figure, the number of people who will use their codes, or the number of tickets they will buy. Still, in my humble opinion, I think the number of invitations should, even at max purchase, match the number of tickets allotted to the sale, and unpurchased tickets that were allotted would go into the general sale. DGS is a privilege to be taken seriously, and It is the invitee's responsibility to read and follow the directions given in any case. If a camp or group doesn't purchase their allotment, then the following year the allotment could be adjusted accordingly.
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by trilobyte » Thu Feb 05, 2015 9:33 am

It is not an invitation to Burning Man, it is an invitation to participate in the directed group sale. If there was a significant reduction in the number of invitations that a camp or project was allotted there would be a massive freakout, and then there would be significantly more screams of bloody murder if Burning Man didn't allow an infinite number of last minute changes after deadlines or invitations going out (there are already plenty of those). Then dealing with a more extended sale and moving around the serialized ticket inventory (it's like moving little bars of gold, not just typing a number in a spreadsheet) would be a lot more work for a team that already has its hands quite full.

A use it or lose it plan is, in my opinion, fundamentally flawed. It encourages and rewards people for sandbagging their numbers or abusing the system. Speaking personally, if it were up to me I would still run it in the same manner but be a little more restrictive on who gets invites, and be a little more aggressive at going after people found to be playing games with the program.

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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by zorro sings » Thu Feb 05, 2015 11:28 am

trilobyte wrote:
A use it or lose it plan is, in my opinion, fundamentally flawed. It encourages and rewards people for sandbagging their numbers or abusing the system. Speaking personally, if it were up to me I would still run it in the same manner but be a little more restrictive on who gets invites, and be a little more aggressive at going after people found to be playing games with the program.

This is only going to get worse unless something along the lines of what you suggest is seriously considered. The impact of this 45 minute sell out should include a another look at a program which was originally designed to give camps some assurance on tickets and one less hurdle in creating their camp.

On top of that there probably will be a couple thousand more people now entering the regular sale. We had 25% of our invites(all overseas for what that is worth) get shut out and now need to get their tickets in that sale.
Be careful. You can spend all your money in there..............................Oriental Visitor

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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by AntiM » Thu Feb 05, 2015 11:38 am

I just reprimanded someone on bookface for saying it was okay that they didn't get through on the DS, because their friend "bought two extra". It was suggested that was a couple buying two each, just in case. That type of abuse will eventually backfire, and make it more difficult for us all. That, and I find it a greedy, selfish practice. Buying for others in camp specifically is one thing, buying "extras" is wrong. I totally understand it, but do not condone it.

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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by EmilyD » Thu Feb 05, 2015 12:50 pm

trilobyte wrote:Sorry to hear about your campmates, Doc. I've heard from a few camps who had campmates that spaced on clicking the link in the invitation email last week to pre-register (despite multiple emails that explained the process clearly). The craziest part is that these are people who've been through the process before, and that part did not change. Hopefully they'll be better able to prepare for the Individual Sale.
Yup we had about 6 people lose out this way, including our camp lead! EMBARRASSING!
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by Simon of the Playa » Thu Feb 05, 2015 1:19 pm

fuck, if i only had the $500 back in 1997 i could of had a golden ticky for life...



now where did i park my TARDIS?
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Re: Who got tickets in the Directed Group Sale?

Post by trilobyte » Thu Feb 05, 2015 3:56 pm

There may have been some abuses, but the main thing I've seen with people who had trouble with the group sale is.. laziness for lack of a better word. Camps or projects who have been through the process before, but slipping up on things like notifying the placement team of big changes (like a camp leaving a village), or reading the instructions carefully and making sure the names they entered were 'good to go' before the deadline, people thinking they were somehow being guaranteed a ticket, some camps even had pretty high numbers of their CORE people (who you would think are really radically self reliant rockstars) that never bothered to open and read the invitation email and click the link to log into their burner profile and pre-register for the sale (just like they had to do in years past). And then on sale day, many of those who did successfully pre-register weren't successful simply because they weren't in any kind of a hurry. Hell, the DGS reminder email even included a link to a time zone calculator.

I know that the system couldn't have been institutionally terrible, simply by virtue of having actually worked really well and really smoothly for the record number of people who were on the ball and followed the instructions. Remember, there is no way to help everyone's needs (scarcity means there isn't enough to go around), the idea of the directed group sale is to try and help some of those groups who have a history of great performance on the playa to get a leg up. Yep, people who were invited did not get tickets in the DGS. Just like last year. And the year before that. The lesson (if there is one) people need to pay closer attention and be on the ball. No, it doesn't really create "extra" demand for the individual sale, because... not every camp or project can be taken care of in the DGS, the majority of folks get their tickets in the main sale (just like last year, and the year before that). If anything, despite the quick sellout, this year's DGS will still help to reduce pressure/competition for the main sale (since it had more tickets in it than last year's sale).

Having not only participated in Burning Man for a few years now, but having had the great fortune of going to hundreds and hundreds of concerts, festivals, and events, I can say that for the most part it will always get more and more difficult every year. If the band keeps turning out solid albums, the fanbase continues to grow, then it occasionally explodes with a big hit or two, and it goes from never having trouble getting tickets, to shows selling out, to shows selling out really quickly, then the band needs to start working out pre-sales to ensure that fans have a shot because tickets sell out in hours (or minutes, or seconds). In this case, Burning Man is the band. They've been turning out solid albums every year for decades, the fanbase is huge and loyal (there may be a track or two you don't like, but dammit it's still a great album :) ), and tickets keep getting harder and harder to come by. Even when it's a band or performer who takes steps to keep the scalpers at bay, you've got to be on the ball.

Sure, the ticket team will continue to work on their end to try and improve upon the experience and the ticket-buying process (as they have since Burning Man started selling tickets), but they can't make scarcity go away. As long as demand continues to outstrip supply, it's going to be important to stay on top of the posted information and dates and act quickly when those magic tickets go on sale.

Since the Directed Group Sale ended more than 24 hours ago and I don't think we've had anyone posting today about having gotten tickets yesterday, I'm going to wrap this thread up. In closing, I'd like to congratulate everyone who was successful and wish your awesome projects GREAT success. To those who weren't successful, I offer my condolences and encouragement. Regardless of why your quest has not yet been successful. Remember to pre-register for the main sale, you can start doing that on Wednesday 2/11 at Noon PST. To those who were not a part of the directed group sale but have been following along, stay tuned. I will be posting an announcement with tips, tricks, and reminders that will hopefully help you with the Individual Sale.

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