Can You See This Happening???

Theme camps and villages are the interactive core of Burning Man. This is the place to announce and discuss camp and village plans for Burning Man 2019.
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FIGJAM
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Can You See This Happening???

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:13 pm

"Because reserving more space for more camps means less space for open camping, I want to make an early request for all theme camps to welcome open campers. This could be in the form of inviting open campers to join your ranks before arriving on playa, and also to allow open campers seeking space to camp within your flagged boundaries after Gate opens. We have always encouraged theme camps to share unused space with open campers, and this year the need is greater than ever. Please occupy only as much as you need, be generous with the space you don’t, and be sure that everyone leaves no trace.

Good luck with your playa preparations!"

I hardly think so, and can imagine allllllllll those open campers combing the city opening day to find this "Fantasy" camp that will share their space. :roll:
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Ratty
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by Ratty » Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:38 pm

Figjam! Are you gonna sit there and tell us that you never took anyone in? It happens a lot. At least in our camp.
Those aren't buttermilk biscuits I'm lying on Savannah

Pictures or it didn't happen Greycoyote

Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see.
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some seeing eye
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by some seeing eye » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:13 pm

Mr Figjam is playa royalty, so he would be a great addition to many camps. (and villages...)

I agree with Mr Figjam though, vehicles with exhausted drivers roaming the playa at all hours on arrival and finding a home in the placed zones is a BORG pipe dream and dangerous to walkers and bikers. There is room on the outer rings.

It is also easy for the BORG to buy a satellite image of the event at timepoints, overlay it with the as-is placement map, and chastise camps who sprawl.
increasing the signal to noise ratio with compassion

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Ratty
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by Ratty » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:38 pm

SSE If you research you'll find out that NO, there isn't room on the outer rings. It filled up in 2 days. There have always been people roaming the city asking for a small unused spot.

And what does Figjams 'worth' have to do with him taking in someone? He may have been welcomed into someone else's camp when his usual spot wasn't available. I would have made room for him.
Those aren't buttermilk biscuits I'm lying on Savannah

Pictures or it didn't happen Greycoyote

Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see.
Arthur Schopenhauer

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some seeing eye
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by some seeing eye » Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:34 pm

I think you may be misunderstanding the intent of my comment. It was two part: long term campers who want to be self sufficient in their small camp, but where; and the 2019 challenge of Placement vs the numbers of solo campers and unplaced camps.

To the second:

My first 3 years, I camped out about 2:30 and Z before the current design. After, 1 year we had amazing luck in placement and 4 years we had a lot of BORG cred in placement.

More precisely I would say,
some seeing eye wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:13 pm
There is room on beyond the outer rings.
The challenge is that there is infrastructure that needs emergency and other vehicle access between about point 5 and point 2.3. But a compact sprawl beyond L and 6:30-10 is a lot of space. Call it a village!

Placement and the BORG is responsible for making that happen safely. If you are compactly camped out from L, not in "placed open camping", and Placement or the rangers want you to move, they will need, in 2019, to find you a place to move to. The BORG is not dumb, so they will have a plan beyond hope and pray. If I were them, which I'm not, I would have 24x7 staffed edge adjust there.

After, Placement has an anti-sprawl criteria to feed into 2020.

Somehow this reminds me of all the dystopian urban fictional cities as well as all the unplanned city planning social systems that happen globally. They work because of people. For example: https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesig ... n-pictures BRC people will work it out.
increasing the signal to noise ratio with compassion

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lucky420
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by lucky420 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:40 pm

Yes if we have room we would offer up. As it looks right now I’m pretty sure we’re packed in.

I see it as happening more on the spot. Like a vehicle doing a loop or a drive by, you know they’re looking for just a bit of land maybe, I don’t know start a convo, see if they know a bit about LNT, Porto etiquette, etc and see if you think “ok they look/seem decent prob be ok neighbors”

I mean that’s how we used to camp, right?
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FIGJAM
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:45 pm

Ratty wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:38 pm
Figjam! Are you gonna sit there and tell us that you never took anyone in? It happens a lot. At least in our camp.
Sweet Ratty, of course I've brought people and taken others in, but I'm not a placed camp.

I think roaming bands of cars and vehicles with trailers (not to mention RVs) trying to get space at placed camps isn't an idea worth thinking about.

Royalty???

Kicked to the outer most rings???

No thanks.
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

"If I can't find an answer, I'll create one!!!"

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FIGJAM
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:48 pm

lucky420 wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:40 pm
Yes if we have room we would offer up. As it looks right now I’m pretty sure we’re packed in.

I see it as happening more on the spot. Like a vehicle doing a loop or a drive by, you know they’re looking for just a bit of land maybe, I don’t know start a convo, see if they know a bit about LNT, Porto etiquette, etc and see if you think “ok they look/seem decent prob be ok neighbors”

I mean that’s how we used to camp, right?
But placement is taking a closer look at land use in camps and cutting back on space.

So where is this "extra" space in camps?
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

"If I can't find an answer, I'll create one!!!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me

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lucky420
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by lucky420 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:52 pm

Yeah they say that and it will be interesting to see if we get what we asked for. But we’ve all seen camps/villages that seem to have big chunks of unused space. So maybe placement will be noticing those more this year because those empty chunks are still going to exist I think
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

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FIGJAM
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:27 pm

Stay lucky Lucky.

I find the dichotomy of saying for weeks that the space pinch is coming and then recommending that the "Homeless" wander the streets looking for scraps is just a little ludicrous. :lol:
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

"If I can't find an answer, I'll create one!!!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me

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lucky420
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by lucky420 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 4:29 am

FIGJAM wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 8:27 pm
Stay lucky Lucky.

I find the dichotomy of saying for weeks that the space pinch is coming and then recommending that the "Homeless" wander the streets looking for scraps is just a little ludicrous. :lol:
:coffee: yep agreed
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

goodleaf
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by goodleaf » Fri Jun 14, 2019 5:13 am

I’m a newbie, last year was my first year. Driving around looking for spots to squeeze in on K and L after getting through gate on Monday was stressful.

In the spot where we did set up, our neighbors were initially a little salty because they too had had to navigate some kind of land grab and altercations with their neighbors (but we all made up over whisky after getting some sleep that night).

We ended up having lots of conversations with the open campers around us last year about this - it sounded like it took most folks driving around for hours and hours after gate to find a spot in the outer rings before being able to set up.

I’m a little sad that it’s going to be worse for us this year out there. I don’t fancy relying on the kindness of the elusive placed camp that also has space for open campers.

I’m looking into walk-in camping as an alternative for this year (though we’ll miss having our couch on street frontage and yelling at randos to come hang out with us).

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mgb327
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by mgb327 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:04 am

Space on the outer rings for us unplaced, small camps? Non-existant. This is the most difficult part of the burn, finding a small spot open to set up our small camp. Simple as that, unless I want to become part of some placed camp, I am not going to find a few open square feet anymore. This is not how I expected my end of burning to be the reason. Not at all.
Dogs are the leaders of the planet. If you see two life forms, one of them’s making a poop, the other one’s carrying it for him, who would you assume is in charge?
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Molotov
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by Molotov » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:28 am

I think some residents of placed theme camps or villages are reluctant to invite in outside campers, is that if these new residents leave a MOOPy mess or commit some other malfeasance, it can reflect badly upon the placed camp and jeopardize placement in future years.

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Dr. Pyro
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by Dr. Pyro » Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:22 am

If I wanted people who I don't know just parking their ass and camping in front of my home, I'll move to San Francisco.

maladroit
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by maladroit » Fri Jun 14, 2019 9:10 am

We're going to do it, having been stuck in the same situation last year.

Definitely starts with a "welcome to the city, how's it going" conversation and ends with either "well good luck" or "does that spot in our camp work" depending on the answers.

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some seeing eye
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by some seeing eye » Fri Jun 14, 2019 12:23 pm

Consider this tactic to find a place. Park the vehicle. Put all the passengers to work going out on bikes with MURS radios and tape measures to find a camp space. Then, after reaching agreement with the neighbors, move the vehicle to he camp.
increasing the signal to noise ratio with compassion

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ygmir
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Re: Can You See This Happening???

Post by ygmir » Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:31 am

Dr. Pyro wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 8:22 am
If I wanted people who I don't know just parking their ass and camping in front of my home, I'll move to San Francisco.
love you.
YGMIR

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