Is it over?

All things outside of Burning Man.
User avatar
gaminwench
Posts: 3017
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 11:57 am
Burning Since: 1999
Camp Name: DOTA, EoD, OBOP, Destiny Lounge
Location: Blue Ridge-la

Re: Is it over?

Post by gaminwench » Tue Sep 29, 2020 10:35 pm

I'm still here, I'm just not snarky.

And I imagined Simon being the running Jewish guy with a feather in his ass.
"the prophecies of doom were better last year" trilo

User avatar
Simon of the Playa
Posts: 20633
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:25 pm
Burning Since: 1996
Camp Name: La Guilde des Hashischins
Location: BRC, Nevada.

Re: Is it over?

Post by Simon of the Playa » Wed Sep 30, 2020 4:37 am

first of all, it was not a feather. too moopy.

it was a tie-dye flag i was gifted at center camp.

jumping jesus, give me some credit.

and secondly, it was not a swaztika, and quite frankly at this juncture i no longer have any sympathy for a certain camp that got some “feedback” about their theme..

thirdly, im not gay, yet.

how u like them apples?
Frida Be You & Me

User avatar
ygmir
Posts: 29614
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:36 pm
Burning Since: 2017
Camp Name: qqqq
Location: nevada county

Re: Is it over?

Post by ygmir » Wed Sep 30, 2020 7:07 am

GreyCoyote wrote:
Tue Sep 29, 2020 4:48 pm
Token wrote:
Tue Sep 29, 2020 4:39 pm
It’s been a while since we had a thread with this much flavor.
I miss us!
This place really has gone quiet. And I see Eric is gone? WTF? How the heck are we supposed to have an “Ask Eric” thread now?

But you are here. And Ygmir. And the Capt, Mozy, Unjon, Jackass, Simon, Elliot.. etc.... so the “culture of snark” might survive.
Nice indeed. add to that this thread can be snarky and informative, with "mostly" no politics.
YGMIR

Unabashed Nordic
Pagan

User avatar
unjonharley
Posts: 10387
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2003 11:05 am
Burning Since: 2001
Camp Name: Elliot's naked bycycel repair
Location: Salem Or.

Re: Is it over?

Post by unjonharley » Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:23 am

gaminwench wrote:
Tue Sep 29, 2020 10:35 pm
I'm still here, I'm just not snarky. HA

And I imagined Simon being the running Jewish guy with a feather in his ass.
I'm the contraptioneer your mother warned you about.

User avatar
M F Bonz
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:51 pm
Burning Since: 1999

Re: Is it over?

Post by M F Bonz » Tue Oct 06, 2020 12:58 pm

“”I feel like I'm Drowning in a river
...can't catch my breath
....Swift and deep
....the sides slick and steep.””

From the clock on the wall.. it appears to me that the end is getting near. You’re starting to look desperate. Like most companies in stress over this pandemic ....Reduce restructure and possibly sell assets to survive. I would hate to see you lose Fly but you may have no choice. The question for me is not if it will survive.
It’s whether or not you will survive with it.


I Don’t have an answer it’s just an observation.
Coincidence, traced far enough back becomes and inevitable.

User avatar
Simon of the Playa
Posts: 20633
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:25 pm
Burning Since: 1996
Camp Name: La Guilde des Hashischins
Location: BRC, Nevada.

Re: Is it over?

Post by Simon of the Playa » Tue Oct 06, 2020 1:02 pm

oh ye of little faith...

A6319454-8C86-4210-9D58-1E8844595D8B.jpeg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Frida Be You & Me

User avatar
M F Bonz
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:51 pm
Burning Since: 1999

Re: Is it over?

Post by M F Bonz » Tue Oct 06, 2020 1:48 pm

That’s why I love you Simon. Oh wait!!! I mean Fuck off.
Smiles~
Coincidence, traced far enough back becomes and inevitable.

User avatar
Popeye
Posts: 822
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:39 pm
Burning Since: 2013
Camp Name: Beaverton
Location: Where the east wind blows

Re: Is it over?

Post by Popeye » Tue Oct 06, 2020 3:32 pm

M F Bonz wrote:
Tue Oct 06, 2020 12:58 pm
“ I would hate to see you lose Fly but you may have no choice. The question for me is not if it will survive.
It’s whether or not you will survive with it.
I don't think selling Fly is the answer.
When you make a decision as to what assets to get rid of you need to look at the long term and not just short term effects.
First who woud buy it? There is land around Gerlach that has been for sale for years without much interest.
Second, what would they do with it? We would have no control over what happened there.
Third, The future of the philosophy of the Org is heavily tied up with Fly. Google for LAGI.
When we received donations for the purchase of FLY it was with the expressed intent of preserving and protecting the land within the philosophy of BM. We have at least the moral responsibility of keeping that promise. Depending on the terms of the donations we may have a legal responsibility also.
“Tell me, what is it you plan to do / with your one wild and precious life?” Mary Oliver

User avatar
M F Bonz
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:51 pm
Burning Since: 1999

Re: Is it over?

Post by M F Bonz » Tue Oct 06, 2020 4:00 pm

Thank you.
I hold a similar hope.
I’m just looking through a small window from the outside. Any opinion I would have would only be an educated speculation.
Selling it you’re probably right ...losing it is what I do fear. Like I said I have no answers. Just an observation.
Coincidence, traced far enough back becomes and inevitable.

User avatar
M F Bonz
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:51 pm
Burning Since: 1999

Re: Is it over?

Post by M F Bonz » Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:15 pm

Thank you Barbara

But I should let you know that I don’t use that email anymore. It should start kicking emails back soon.  But I did receive it. I have to admit I didn’t watch the video, or read much of the letter.

Trust me that the urgency is not lost on me. I get it.

“I feel like I’m Drowning in a river...can't catch my breath...Swift and deep....the sides slick and steep.”

I know the song verse seems like a snarky poke in the eye, but really it’s an acknowledgment of the white knuckle ride the BORG is on right now. I really am trying to be gentle.

Reduce, restructure, and possibly sell assets to survive.  Can help with that white knuckle ride, but a person can only speculate without crunching the numbers.  

Which BRC asset are you trying to protect the most? If it’s Fly ...fall back to Fly until the dust storm passes.

This is a risk assessment question that came to my mind when I heard BORG was interested in buying Fly:  a business model based only on the popularity of an event that happens only one time a year.  What is your plan, if for whatever reason, you lose that popularity or a technical ability to hold the event itself?

I understand you are trying to save the Black Rock City you know and love, but which one? For many of us that Black Rock City that we knew and loved was lost by multiple people at multiple points over multiple years.  Black Rock City and the loss is different for every person.  I’m no longer invested in the current Black Rock City. That doesn’t mean I don’t want yours to exist. I’m just not gonna help pay for it.

Don’t get me wrong I’m rooting for you, but spamming me on an old email is not going to save your city. “Clock on the wall”” means I’m recognizing some signs. your email was one.

For me, the loss had to do with ownership of the city.  When somebody puts money, time, and effort to bring something, that is where their ownership occurs.  When someone like a plug and play camp comes, they are still putting in the same money, time, and effort in, but it’s based off of my ownership.  For example, when I say my ownership, I mean I build my camp to provide an opportunity for interaction and participation by individuals that pass by.  My camp invites people to come in and visit, exchange ideas, and interact with other strangers at the event.  What most plug and play camps offer, is the opportunity for its campers to only experience and enjoy what others have built; their camp does not offer an opportunity for the average burner to interact with its campers.  

For me, Black Rock City changed with the loss of personal interaction; burners came to the event to participate in the event.  At some point in the recent past, personal interaction among burners seems to have dried up.  For example, I have a large shade structure, sitting under it, almost everyone that passed by, paused to offer some entertainment/interaction to us; or at the very least eye contact with a smile and hello.   A person playing a violin, a group of people singing a cappella to you, stilt walkers just looking for a place to get out of the sun, because my tent is 16 feet tall; all of these people were participants looking to make a personal connection with strangers.  Compared to my last year at the burn, as I walked around the city, I noticed that people were in a hurry, heads down, no eye contact, no offer of interaction, heading for a perceived entertainment; these were spectators.  I’ve tried to give a few simple examples of how things have changed for some of us.

I can only give you the advice that I would give anybody, not just burners, but in burner’s terms, this is a global alpha white out we are in. Tie down the shit you can’t afford to lose and hunker down. If you don’t you might lose your tent, contents and all.

I wish you luck, maybe we can share a story at the burner’s without borders fire pit one day.

Mozy Fucking Bonz~
Coincidence, traced far enough back becomes and inevitable.

User avatar
Token
Posts: 4724
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 2:55 pm
Burning Since: 2001
Location: Gold Country, CA

Re: Is it over?

Post by Token » Sat Oct 10, 2020 2:20 pm

M F Bonz wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:15 pm
Thank you Barbara
Fucking far out M!

User avatar
M F Bonz
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:51 pm
Burning Since: 1999

Re: Is it over?

Post by M F Bonz » Sat Oct 10, 2020 3:55 pm

Token wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 2:20 pm
M F Bonz wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:15 pm
Thank you Barbara
Fucking far out M!
Wha Wha what happened??? I think I blacked out.
....???? where’s my pants?

ranger magnum
Posts: 745
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:05 pm
Burning Since: 1996
Camp Name: Outpost Tokyo
Location: santa barbara

Re: Is it over?

Post by ranger magnum » Mon Nov 09, 2020 2:52 pm

It’s over as we once knew it. Or to be more exact, it’s over as it has become. If Burningman is endless partying, sound camps, quests for swag, and conspicuous consumption of pharmaceuticals, then yea, it’s done. I for one am fine with that. Fuck it, I’ll just go to Coachella for that shit, and have a hotel and pool I cam come back to the a house night.

It can come back, just in a much smaller way. 2020 was proof that it is not over, and really just starting over again. I really enjoyed it and will be back next year.
Praise the Lowered

User avatar
FlyingMonkey
Posts: 1267
Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:33 am

Re: Is it over?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Tue Nov 10, 2020 4:55 am

M F Bonz wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:15 pm
Thank you Barbara

No, Thank you MFB.

I have never heard anyone articulate the way I feel and have not been able to express so eloquently.

To Ranger Magnum's point, yes it will continue on (and be awesome in it's own way) but much of what drew me in to Burning Man has slowly faded and I want that back. I think there is less community felt among strangers now. People used to be able to overcome their differences because they all shared the fact that they were Burners & that was most important to them on the Playa. The way it is now I am indifferent and will only return hoping to recapture some of that old Larry magic. Honestly, for me anyway, the event died with him if not sooner.

Maybe I'm just being nostalgic but the event has changed and I don't think for the better. The fact that the profits for the event were put in to everything except ensuring the survival of the event is inconceivable. And that the event itself was funded by wealthy donors makes me think that is precisely what drove the change. Now through mismanagement the hat is being passed around to bring it back. Am I the only one who thinks that is a little ass backwards?

Ranger, while I understand and respect your opinion I think you don't understand what has been lost if you think it's just endless partying, sound camps, quests for swag, and conspicuous consumption of pharmaceuticals. It's much deeper than that.
Last edited by FlyingMonkey on Tue Nov 10, 2020 5:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
In your wildest dreams you can not imagine the marvelous SURPRISES that await YOU.

User avatar
FlyingMonkey
Posts: 1267
Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:33 am

Re: Is it over?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Tue Nov 10, 2020 4:57 am

Thoughts? Am I crazy?
Last edited by FlyingMonkey on Tue Nov 10, 2020 5:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
In your wildest dreams you can not imagine the marvelous SURPRISES that await YOU.

User avatar
FlyingMonkey
Posts: 1267
Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:33 am

Re: Is it over?

Post by FlyingMonkey » Tue Nov 10, 2020 4:58 am

If I'm ranting it's because I gave up Coffee & alcohol for a month.
In your wildest dreams you can not imagine the marvelous SURPRISES that await YOU.

User avatar
Token
Posts: 4724
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 2:55 pm
Burning Since: 2001
Location: Gold Country, CA

Re: Is it over?

Post by Token » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:02 am

FlyingMonkey wrote:
Tue Nov 10, 2020 4:57 am
Thoughts? Am I crazy?
I’m pretty sure it’s batshit crazy, but that don’t stop you from being right on this one. ;)

BM was rotting slowly, dying a death of a thousand cuts over the past decade++.

Don’t take my word for it, the BORG itself said so (in a much nicer way) and launched a ton of efforts to address it the past few years.

The current clusterfuck may be just the right kind of medicine we needed to reboot the damn thing.

User avatar
Simon of the Playa
Posts: 20633
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:25 pm
Burning Since: 1996
Camp Name: La Guilde des Hashischins
Location: BRC, Nevada.

Re: Is it over?

Post by Simon of the Playa » Wed Nov 11, 2020 4:30 am

yes indeed, a reboot.

a fresh start.

a new direction...
Frida Be You & Me

User avatar
lucky420
Posts: 9428
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 9:47 am
Burning Since: 2021
Camp Name: Dye with Dignity
Location: Reno, NV

Re: Is it over?

Post by lucky420 » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:03 am

FlyingMonkey wrote:
Tue Nov 10, 2020 4:57 am
Thoughts? Am I crazy?
No, you’re not crazy
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

User avatar
M F Bonz
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2020 1:51 pm
Burning Since: 1999

Re: Is it over?

Post by M F Bonz » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:54 pm

FlyingMonkey wrote:
Tue Nov 10, 2020 4:55 am
M F Bonz wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:15 pm
Thank you Barbara

No, Thank you MFB.

C50E6F46-A4CF-41CF-BBDE-994F312358CC.jpeg
Smiles~
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Coincidence, traced far enough back becomes and inevitable.

Post Reply

Return to “Open Discussion”