Why are you an atheist?

All things outside of Burning Man.
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HughMungus
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Re: Did God create everything that exists?

Post by HughMungus » Sat Mar 18, 2006 6:51 pm

Rockdad wrote:Did God create everything that exists?
Does evil exist? Did God create evil?

A University professor at a well known institution of higher learning
Challenged his students with this question. "Did God create everything
That exists?"
A student bravely replied, "Yes he did!"
"God created everything?" The professor asked.
"Yes sir, he certainly did," the student replied.
The professor answered, "If God created everything; then God created evil.
And, since evil exists, and according to the principal that our works
Define who we are, then we can assume God is evil."

The student became quiet and did not answer the professor's
Hypothetical definition. The professor, quite pleased with himself,
Boasted to the students that he had proven once more that the
Christian faith was a myth.

Another student raised his hand and said, "May I ask you a question,
Professor?"
"Of course", replied the professor.
The student stood up and asked, "Professor, does cold exist?"
"What kind of question is this? Of course it exists. Have you
Never been cold?" The other students snickered at the young man's
Question.
The young man replied, "In fact sir, cold does not exist. According
To the laws of physics, what we consider cold is in reality the absence
Of heat. Every body or object is susceptible to study when it has or
Transmits energy, and heat is what makes a body or matter have or
Transmit energy.

Absolute zero (-460 F) is the total absence of heat; and all matter
Becomes
Inert and incapable of reaction at that temperature. Cold does not exist.
We have created this word to describe how we feel if we have no heat."

The student continued, "Professor, does darkness exist?"
The professor responded, "Of course it does."
The student replied, "Once again you are wrong sir, darkness does
Not exist either. Darkness is in reality the absence of light.
Light we can study, but not darkness. In fact, we can use Newton's prism
To break white light into many colors and study the various wavelengths of
Each color.

You cannot measure darkness. A simple ray of light can break
Into a world of darkness and illuminate it. How can you know how dark a
Certain space is? You measure the amount of light present. Isn't this
Correct? Darkness is a term used by man to describe what happens when
There is no light present."

Finally the young man asked the professor, "Sir, does evil exist?"
Now uncertain, the professor responded, "Of course, as I have
Already said. We see it everyday. It is in the daily examples of man's
Inhumanity to man. It is in the multitude of crime and violence
Everywhere in the world. These manifestations are nothing else but evil.

To this the student replied, "Evil does not exist, sir, or at least
It does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God. It
Is just like darkness and cold, a word that man has created to describe
The
Absence of God. God did not create evil. Evil is the result of what
Happens when man does not have God's love present in his heart. It's like
The cold that comes when there is no heat, or the darkness that comes
When there is no light."

The professor sat down.


The young man's name ... Albert Einstein
WOW!
It's what you make it.

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Post by Kinetic IV » Sat Mar 18, 2006 7:25 pm

Fact Check:

http://www.snopes.com/religion/einstein.asp

Sorry Rockdad. I think many people will not question the link I've provided, in fact many board members have cited Snopes.com in the past.

If you want to take on his arguments you've gotta dig deep and hit him with rock solid, easily verified facts.
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HughMungus
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Post by HughMungus » Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:50 pm

Kinetic IV wrote:Fact Check:

http://www.snopes.com/religion/einstein.asp

Sorry Rockdad. I think many people will not question the link I've provided, in fact many board members have cited Snopes.com in the past.

If you want to take on his arguments you've gotta dig deep and hit him with rock solid, easily verified facts.
I would be happy if someone could simply resolve the seemingly conflicting statements, "There is no god" and "You can't disprove anything". If you can't disprove anything, how can you be an atheist?
It's what you make it.

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bringer
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Post by bringer » Sun Mar 19, 2006 12:44 pm

I would be happy if someone could simply resolve the seemingly conflicting statements, "There is no god" and "You can't disprove anything". If you can't disprove anything, how can you be an atheist?

Tell you what, Hugh:

Why don't you try to answer that question for yourself. If you're smart enough to understand the correct answer when its handed to you, then you're probably smart enough to figure it out for yourself.

If not, well... then I don't see why it should be handed to you.
All Your Base Are Belong To Us!

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HughMungus
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Post by HughMungus » Sun Mar 19, 2006 12:53 pm

bringer wrote:
I would be happy if someone could simply resolve the seemingly conflicting statements, "There is no god" and "You can't disprove anything". If you can't disprove anything, how can you be an atheist?

Tell you what, Hugh:

Why don't you try to answer that question for yourself. If you're smart enough to understand the correct answer when its handed to you, then you're probably smart enough to figure it out for yourself.

If not, well... then I don't see why it should be handed to you.
Are you an atheist?
It's what you make it.

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Rockdad
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Post by Rockdad » Sun Mar 19, 2006 1:00 pm

K4 I did no fact checking I just thought it was a amusing story that somebody sent me. And it was posted for amusement not to take one side or another in fact this thread has been so confusing even if it was true I am not sure who it would be supporting...

But speaking of fact checking what makes Snopes the expert on all facts? and even the link provided does not prove Einstien did not say it to quote Snopes:
Snopes wrote: "Although 2004 tellings of the legend name Albert Einstein as the faith-driven student, there is no reason to suppose the renowned physicist had anything to do with the fictive incident."
It does not say no evidence it says no reason!
So until somebody reads all of Einstiens writings I'll leave the question of proof open

But that brings us back to RG and if the if there is no proof it does not exist argument.......

Oh no we are spinning out of control
help me mister wizard twizzle twazzle twizzle toe?
I am staying out of this one!
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HughMungus
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Post by HughMungus » Sun Mar 19, 2006 3:52 pm

Rockdad wrote:I am staying out of this one!
Who will keep track of the sock puppets?!?!
It's what you make it.

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Post by Ranger Genius » Sun Mar 19, 2006 4:45 pm

Ranger Genius wrote:But to reiterate, and hopefully to help drive this all home later:

Hugh, tell me why you believe there is no easter bunny.
Time since this was posted:

Three days, twenty hours, give or take. As yet, you've failed to respond. Is it possible that you've foreseen how utterly ridiculous your answer will make your position?
“We cross our bridges when we come to them and burn them behind us, with nothing to show for our progress except a memory of the smell of smoke, and a presumption that once our eyes watered.”

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Post by HughMungus » Sun Mar 19, 2006 5:40 pm

Ranger Genius wrote:
Ranger Genius wrote:But to reiterate, and hopefully to help drive this all home later:

Hugh, tell me why you believe there is no easter bunny.
Time since this was posted:
I neither believe nor disbelieve in the easter bunny. It's not relevant to my life so I don't care and have no opinion.
Three days, twenty hours, give or take. As yet, you've failed to respond. Is it possible that you've foreseen how utterly ridiculous your answer will make your position?
Explain.
It's what you make it.

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Post by Ranger Genius » Mon Mar 20, 2006 12:04 am

hugh wrote:I neither believe nor disbelieve in the easter bunny. It's not relevant to my life so I don't care and have no opinion
Then you're even more of a fool than I thought; indeed a bigger fool than I had heretofore considered possible (I suppose, showing that I had too high an opinion of humanity).

You must live in a terrifying world in which every proposition, no matter how ridicuous, must be considered to be plausible; a world in which there being no good reason to believe something is not enough reason to disbelieve it; a world in which no suggestion for how the world works can be discarded out-of-hand simply because it conflicts with everything we know and observe while itself remaining impossible to verify; a world in which you are as an infant, not only knowing nothing about the world around you, but also unable to learn anything about it because you are incapable of narrowing the possible explanations to those which are falsifiable and intellectually profitable.

I find it hard to imagine living in a reality in which the distinction between truth and fiction had no bearing on my life; a reality in which all things that can be imagined are equally valid and viable; a world where "The Simpsons" may well be a documentary film, and any animal featured on "Nature" may well have been computer-generated.

Even a child is capable of surmising that his parents continue to exist when they leave the room, despite a lack of evidence one way or another; but you, if your logic is to be followed to its conclusion, apparently cannot. You can't even say for sure that I'm a human, and not a sentient venezuelan banana monster. How can you even know I exist, or anyone else, for that matter? You must dwell in a solipsistic hell, the likes of which I cannot imagine.

My sympathies.
“We cross our bridges when we come to them and burn them behind us, with nothing to show for our progress except a memory of the smell of smoke, and a presumption that once our eyes watered.”

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Post by HughMungus » Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:29 pm

Ranger Genius wrote:
hugh wrote:I neither believe nor disbelieve in the easter bunny. It's not relevant to my life so I don't care and have no opinion
Then you're even more of a fool than I thought; indeed a bigger fool than I had heretofore considered possible (I suppose, showing that I had too high an opinion of humanity).

You must live in a terrifying world in which every proposition, no matter how ridicuous, must be considered to be plausible; a world in which there being no good reason to believe something is not enough reason to disbelieve it; a world in which no suggestion for how the world works can be discarded out-of-hand simply because it conflicts with everything we know and observe while itself remaining impossible to verify; a world in which you are as an infant, not only knowing nothing about the world around you, but also unable to learn anything about it because you are incapable of narrowing the possible explanations to those which are falsifiable and intellectually profitable.

I find it hard to imagine living in a reality in which the distinction between truth and fiction had no bearing on my life; a reality in which all things that can be imagined are equally valid and viable; a world where "The Simpsons" may well be a documentary film, and any animal featured on "Nature" may well have been computer-generated.

Even a child is capable of surmising that his parents continue to exist when they leave the room, despite a lack of evidence one way or another; but you, if your logic is to be followed to its conclusion, apparently cannot. You can't even say for sure that I'm a human, and not a sentient venezuelan banana monster. How can you even know I exist, or anyone else, for that matter? You must dwell in a solipsistic hell, the likes of which I cannot imagine.

My sympathies.
Yeah, it's really horrible.

Could you resolve these two statements now?

1. You can't disprove anything.

2. God does not exist.

I don't think you can. That's why I wonder how you can be an atheist.
It's what you make it.

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Post by Sensei » Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:59 pm

My god...

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Post by EvilDustBooger » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:47 am

Once again we have achieved singularity!
Exquisite minds colliding and melding into the black hole....

Image

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bringer
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Post by bringer » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:58 am

EvilDustBooger wrote:Once again we have achieved singularity!
Exquisite minds colliding and melding into the black hole....

Image

That triangle seem to be getting taller.
But it doesn't feel taller.
All Your Base Are Belong To Us!

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Post by EvilDustBooger » Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:31 am

bringer wrote: That triangle seem to be getting taller.
But it doesn't feel taller.
You are very observant and absolutely correct.

We have calculated and made the addition of a "bullshit factor".
(once refered to as "the yawn principle")
It seems that with repetition in the cyber world, the same parcel of bullshit re-delivered on a constant cycle actually "looks" like it is increasing...but still "feels" the same, or even diminished...
It is the same old shit...
...the gravity and effects remain the same as the original parcel of bullshit, ...it even smells larger, ...but it still remains unchanged as it
cascades towards, and is consumed by the vortex of rudimentary logic.

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Post by HughMungus » Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:49 pm

EvilDustBooger wrote:
bringer wrote: That triangle seem to be getting taller.
But it doesn't feel taller.
You are very observant and absolutely correct.

We have calculated and made the addition of a "bullshit factor".
(once refered to as "the yawn principle")
It seems that with repetition in the cyber world, the same parcel of bullshit re-delivered on a constant cycle actually "looks" like it is increasing...but still "feels" the same, or even diminished...
It is the same old shit...
...the gravity and effects remain the same as the original parcel of bullshit, ...it even smells larger, ...but it still remains unchanged as it
cascades towards, and is consumed by the vortex of rudimentary logic.
Please stop violating the TOS with these off-topic posts.
It's what you make it.

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bringer
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Post by bringer » Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:55 pm

HughMungus wrote:
EvilDustBooger wrote:
bringer wrote: That triangle seem to be getting taller.
But it doesn't feel taller.
You are very observant and absolutely correct.

We have calculated and made the addition of a "bullshit factor".
(once refered to as "the yawn principle")
It seems that with repetition in the cyber world, the same parcel of bullshit re-delivered on a constant cycle actually "looks" like it is increasing...but still "feels" the same, or even diminished...
It is the same old shit...
...the gravity and effects remain the same as the original parcel of bullshit, ...it even smells larger, ...but it still remains unchanged as it
cascades towards, and is consumed by the vortex of rudimentary logic.
Please stop violating the TOS with these off-topic posts.

I trust your toung is planted firmly in cheek, Hugh.
This topic is close to dead.
All Your Base Are Belong To Us!

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Post by bringer » Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:58 pm

HughMungus wrote:
EvilDustBooger wrote:
bringer wrote: That triangle seem to be getting taller.
But it doesn't feel taller.
You are very observant and absolutely correct.

We have calculated and made the addition of a "bullshit factor".
(once refered to as "the yawn principle")
It seems that with repetition in the cyber world, the same parcel of bullshit re-delivered on a constant cycle actually "looks" like it is increasing...but still "feels" the same, or even diminished...
It is the same old shit...
...the gravity and effects remain the same as the original parcel of bullshit, ...it even smells larger, ...but it still remains unchanged as it
cascades towards, and is consumed by the vortex of rudimentary logic.
Please stop violating the TOS with these off-topic posts.

Would I be violating the ToS if I asked the same question over and over again?
All Your Base Are Belong To Us!

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bringer
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Post by bringer » Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:58 pm

HughMungus wrote:Please stop violating the TOS with these off-topic posts.
Would I be violating the ToS if I asked the same question over and over again?
All Your Base Are Belong To Us!

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bringer
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Post by bringer » Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:58 pm

HughMungus wrote:Please stop violating the TOS with these off-topic posts.
Would I be violating the ToS if I asked the same question over and over again?
All Your Base Are Belong To Us!

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Post by bringer » Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:59 pm

*ahem*


'scuse me.

:)
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Post by bringer » Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:01 pm

I just checked out the ToS, well... gave it a cursory glance to be honest, but I couldn't find any rule about posting off-topic.


Am I missing something?

:?
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Post by Rob the Wop » Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:15 pm

bringer wrote:I just checked out the ToS, well... gave it a cursory glance to be honest, but I couldn't find any rule about posting off-topic.


Am I missing something?

:?
NEVER QUESTION THE HUGH!
LITERACY AND LOGIC ARE NOT THE ISSUE HERE!
HE IS RIGHTEOUS AND ALL THOSE IN DISAGREEMENT WILL BE IGNORED ALONG WITH THEIR PROOFS!
THE HUGH MAY NOT BE WRONG, IGNORANT PEASANT!
FIE ON THEE, NOW GET THEE HENCE AND DISPATCH YON DEFILER!
[b]The other, other white meat.[/b]

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Post by HughMungus » Tue Mar 21, 2006 5:56 pm

bringer wrote:I just checked out the ToS, well... gave it a cursory glance to be honest, but I couldn't find any rule about posting off-topic.


Am I missing something?

:?
"keep on topic"

http://eplaya.burningman.org/profile.ph ... guidelines

So now that that's out of the way, could someone please explain how you can't disprove anything yet can believe that god does not exist? That's still a big conan drum. Thanks!
It's what you make it.

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Post by helitack » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:04 pm

Bottom line:

Who really gives a shit one way or another.

What a waste of bandwidth.

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Post by HughMungus » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:14 pm

helitack wrote:Bottom line:

Who really gives a shit one way or another.

What a waste of bandwidth.
I just want to know how someone could be an atheist if god's existence cannot be disproven.
It's what you make it.

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Post by helitack » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:15 pm

Who cares?

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Post by HughMungus » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:19 pm

helitack wrote:Who cares?
I do. Why do you care that I care?
It's what you make it.

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Post by helitack » Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:23 pm

I don't, I am just trying to establish where this meaningless argument sits on the "The Answer Will Change The World" meter,

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Post by HughMungus » Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:24 pm

helitack wrote:I don't, I am just trying to establish where this meaningless argument sits on the "The Answer Will Change The World" meter,
It's not meaningless. I'm trying to understand how other people think. I couldn't give a rat's ass if people believe in god or not. But thanks for bumping my thread back to the top. Maybe someone else who sees it could resolve the conandrum.
It's what you make it.

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