I hate sock puppets because. . .

All things outside of Burning Man.

I hate sock puppets because

They don't match other socks.
6
17%
They don't match other socks.
6
17%
They always have holes.
0
No votes
They always have holes.
0
No votes
They stink.
0
No votes
They stink.
0
No votes
The ears rub blisters inside my shoes.
1
3%
The ears rub blisters inside my shoes.
1
3%
My hatred of sock puppets is so esquisitally nuanced that no poll can adequately express it.
11
31%
My hatred of sock puppets is so esquisitally nuanced that no poll can adequately express it.
11
31%
 
Total votes: 36

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BlueBirdPoof
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I hate sock puppets because. . .

Post by BlueBirdPoof » Mon Dec 22, 2003 2:59 pm

Inquiring minds (or is that idle minds) want to know.

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Last Real Burner
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My answer is simple....

Post by Last Real Burner » Mon Dec 22, 2003 3:13 pm

Cause I don't have one.....BwaaahhhhhhImage


singluarly,
mr smith
"Do you know what happened to the boy who got everything he wished for? - He lived happily ever after".

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Ivy
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Post by Ivy » Mon Dec 22, 2003 3:17 pm

(or is that idle minds)
Idle minds are the devil's playground?

Kinetic II

Post by Kinetic II » Mon Dec 22, 2003 3:30 pm

I hated sock puppets because some of the original socks carried around a holier than thou attitude and proceeded to slam people with impunity if they made mistakes. A person's position on the playa does not transfer into authority online. Respect yes. Authority no.

Socks do work great though for mocking that imagined authority.

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Ivy
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Post by Ivy » Mon Dec 22, 2003 3:35 pm

I am not afraid to mock authority--imagined or otherwise--with my own voice.

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Chai Guy
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Post by Chai Guy » Mon Dec 22, 2003 4:00 pm

I kind of liked the anti-angry butterfly, but was that really a sock puppet?

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NaughtySnowAngel
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Post by NaughtySnowAngel » Mon Dec 22, 2003 4:31 pm

I agree.....I don't like them because I don't have one :cry: :cry: :cry:

I've been good, maybe Santa will bring me one ;)

bandwagon

Post by bandwagon » Mon Dec 22, 2003 4:42 pm

NaughtySnowAngel wrote: I've been good, maybe Santa will bring me one
Here's one. But you have to share.

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Anti Butterfly
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Post by Anti Butterfly » Wed Dec 24, 2003 3:50 pm

I kind of liked the anti-angry butterfly, but was that really a sock puppet?
Thanks Chai! And no I'm not a sock puppet, Angry Butterfly is!
things are not always what they seem

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DE FACTO
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I like sock puppets!

Post by DE FACTO » Thu Dec 25, 2003 1:08 am

I never heard the term untill Eplaya. (but I'm new to the chatroom/messageboard thing.)

I think it is a good thing.

From what I have experienced from watching kinetic II and Iso/badger, and others, it gives the opportunity to express an opinion that would otherwise be not be granted or accepted under the most commonly used avatar.

But this thread has been done already;

http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... t=de+facto

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Lilly Flower
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Post by Lilly Flower » Thu Dec 25, 2003 2:10 am

That's it.

I am going to get a sock puppet.

And it is going to be a guy this time.

Whoops! I should have kept that to myself huh?
You are watching too much TV.

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Last Real Burner
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Hey don't look at me I was just standing here...

Post by Last Real Burner » Thu Dec 25, 2003 8:25 am

I thought it was just a place to put a meat puppet.

enlightly,
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"Do you know what happened to the boy who got everything he wished for? - He lived happily ever after".

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joel the ornery
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Definition

Post by joel the ornery » Thu Dec 25, 2003 12:10 pm

The definition is:

sock puppet n. [Usenet: from the act of placing a sock over your hand and talking to it and pretending it's talking back] In Usenet parlance, a pseudo through which the puppeteer posts follow-ups to their own original message to give the appearance that a number of people support the views held in the original message.

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ecliptic
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Post by ecliptic » Thu Dec 25, 2003 1:05 pm

Lilly Flower wrote:That's it.

I am going to get a sock puppet.

And it is going to be a guy this time.

Whoops! I should have kept that to myself huh?
that's pretty funny when you have your own puppets talking to each other DF.

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Badger
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Post by Badger » Thu Dec 25, 2003 1:09 pm

that's pretty funny when you have your own puppets talking to each other DF.
And he was behaving so well...
Desert dogs drink deep.

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Angry Butterfly
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Post by Angry Butterfly » Thu Dec 25, 2003 4:34 pm

I think they are boring. Unless it's mine.
No really, it
's good to have a way to express veiws you couldnt ordinarily express, but it can get out of hand.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

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Lydia Love
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Post by Lydia Love » Thu Dec 25, 2003 5:19 pm

why couldn't you ordinarily express a view?

I express all my opinions as myself. If someone doesn't like my opinion they can either a. take the opportunity to try and change my mind or b. fuck themselves.


I mean, are any of all y'all (referring to sock holders here) *ashamed* of your opionions? Afraid to take heat for 'em?

I think in many cases the sock creators, instead of letting public opinion decide whether or not a thread or topic dies have taken it upon themselves to try and force discussion, create drama and keep threads bumped. There are a handful of exceptions... but not all that many.
It's all about the squirrels.

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Eric
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Post by Eric » Thu Dec 25, 2003 5:50 pm

Lydia Love wrote:why couldn't you ordinarily express a view?

I express all my opinions as myself. If someone doesn't like my opinion they can either a. take the opportunity to try and change my mind or b. fuck themselves.
I agree. I'm not afraid to say what I think, I'm also not worried that others might disagree and want to argue my reasoning. It's a fun thing called "communication".

Yours socklessly...
It's a camping trip in the desert, not the redemption of the fallen world - Cryptofishist

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Former Ass't Editor & columnist, BRC Weekly

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Angry Butterfly
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Post by Angry Butterfly » Thu Dec 25, 2003 5:53 pm

no, im not ashamed < and I only made anti to make a point. Anti is pretty obviously me, part of the point was that it is hard to reallly know someone from internet posts, and the other part of the point was that noone feels the same way about anything all the time, yes, I contradict myself, and sometimes my beliefs are at odds with my desires, and also I must add that this keyboard sucks. YEAH< ithink sock puppets are pretty dumb, obviously, or I wouldnt have made anti so obvious. Anti has taken on a life of her own now. I really didnt realse the gravity of what I wrote tell people aking me to come back and I started having people come up to me at parties who knew who I was from my posts on another mailing list. If you look hard enough, you can figure out who I really am in real life, I dont obfuscate it too much, like the picture is really me, of course I'm a few pounds heavier and dont have the nice playa tan anymore, but you will know me when you see me. I'm out there, but I'm not here anymore.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

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Post by BlueBirdPoof » Mon Dec 29, 2003 4:48 pm

I just have to reiterate how clueless I am about all of you. I think Angry Butterfly makes a good point when she says that you can't know anyone from their posts on a board. (BTW I hope she manages to drop in from time to time, I'll miss her.) Sometimes reading this board I feel like I've wandered into a long series of very subtle political novels--somewhere around page 138 of volume 3. People I believed to be allies turn out to be bitter enemies. Sock puppets appear and dissappear. And sometimes people are incredibly passionate about things that seem as vital to me as the long ago court intrigue of a minor Renassaince Italy principality. So in some weird way sock puppets almost don't matter--what's another layer of unreality.


And you're all wrong. Blisters are painful in the real world--the best reason to hate sock puppets.

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Badger
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Post by Badger » Mon Dec 29, 2003 9:16 pm

Well, I hate Spock puppets because I'm continually reminded of the almost adversarial dynamic that existed between Spock and McCoy - especially in the second season.
Desert dogs drink deep.

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Lydia Love
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Post by Lydia Love » Mon Dec 29, 2003 9:19 pm

I disagree. I think you can end up knowing a great deal about someone... if they are being genuine and honest.

Of course you don't end up knowing the *whole* person... but how often do we do that in our face to face relationships?

I don't end up spending a whole lot of time on here anymore because I get tired of that extra layer of unreality. I mean, what the fuck? If I want fiction I'll read a book because, frankly, a Harlequin romance novel does fiction better than most of the sockpuppeteers on this board. When I want conversation I seek out people who are being real - and there are some of ya'll around here but it gets tiresome to find you.

Oh well...
It's all about the squirrels.

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Tancorix
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Post by Tancorix » Mon Dec 29, 2003 9:31 pm

Sometimes the socks allow you to explore points of view or angles on discussions that you might not be comfortable presenting otherwise. Sometimes your shy and not sure how your ideas will be accepted, and the sock serves as a shield to insulate the puppeteer from any backlash.

If the sock is handled with even a little bit of skill it can be used in so many ways...there are some friendships and relationships that you never test and just accept as they are. There are others where you might have doubts and you can create a sock and test that relationship. That happened to me with my g/f coming on here, which I had no idea she was on here, and she read my posts and then out of the blue dropped a major can of whoop ass on me. Actually it wasn't so bad but it shocked me. But she quickly found out that the things I told her to her face was exactly the same as the stuff she saw online. It strengthened a relationship so in one sense a sock is not all bad.

I know socks piss some people off and Lydia made that very clear. But damn, half the stuff I see at BM is about creativity, of trying new things, exploring...and I saw the sock as a way of doing that...of slipping into an online persona that was different and checking it out...what was the reaction? How could I develop the character? Hell I even got ideas for short stories and other creative ideas off the sock interactions...my socks are gone but the info I gained from them is still useful.

In any event I buried the socks and went with one ID due to sheer time issues. It takes a lot of time and energy for me to run a sock, time better spent welding, rigging up telematics systems for the truck, working on technical certs and more. So after seeing all the recent posts I had to weigh in with what I saw was the good side of socks. And while I attacked Iso / Badger, I also have to step back and say nobody runs a sock better. Iso is cool, even if I do have a serious case of sock envy about her.

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Lydia Love
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Post by Lydia Love » Tue Dec 30, 2003 10:19 am

*using* real, actual people - without their knowledge or consent - to further some hidden agenda, even a "creative" one is pretty fucking manipulative in my book.

but hey - anyone who wants a million socks a piece can have them - my opinion of it is just that - an opinion. just don't be surprised if, eventually, you are just talking to yourself.
It's all about the squirrels.

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BlueBirdPoof
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Post by BlueBirdPoof » Tue Dec 30, 2003 10:52 am

I think there is a legitemate, creative strain of pranksterism that fools the media and also real, actual people. I'm thinking of the guy who put out press releases under the name of Dr. Gregor saying he'd discovered a longevity treatment from cockroaches, for instance.
But then I think the whole "reporting on press releases rather than actually digging up a story" trend of news organitions over the past couple of decades is a bad thing. And having decided there are some cases in which it's okay to "dissemble" where do I draw the line?
I also sort of think that all of us should take care to remember just how much of crafting of personnas goes on, on-line. (I'd say that mine is probably a fairly good likeness of the actual self, despite the fake name and goofy avatar.)
Not that I'm trying to pick a fight with you, Lydia. You'd cream me.

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stuart
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Post by stuart » Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:04 am

why can't we just be ourselves?

isn't that kinda the whole point?

isn't that kinda a nice goal?

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BlueBirdPoof
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Post by BlueBirdPoof » Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:23 am

On a certain level "ourselves" are masks constructed to function in social contexts. I think that's unavoidable. That being said, I try to be a "self" in public that is not to far distant from the "actual" me. Some of it is "Don't spit in public" level of disguise. And some of it is choosing words and behavior carefully, maybe even giving up some part of the self in order to facilitate group cohesion. I failed to do this with Dr. Pyro and in tern got my feathers ruffled. (I meant "turn" but under the circumstances I'll leave the misspelling.) And sometimes being too much yourself leads to TMI.
But I'm not being someone else--real or imagined, just another self. Nor am I committing fraud--and I don't think any of us condone the use of sock puppets for that. So, Stuart, it is an improvised performance. Actual connection is important. So is personal safety. Dance between the two.

Guest

Post by Guest » Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:32 am

I think Stuart nailed it. Part of the idea of Burning Man is self-expression. To express one's self, in all the multi-faceted variety that we have.

Joel also contributed to the discussion a great deal with his definition that nailed when a sock puppet becomes manipulative, rather then humorous.

I do think that obviously made-up alternative personalities for the sake of humor have a place. 1 cracked me up with this post. http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... peak#11702 Isotopia sometimes cracks me up too.

I guess basically I like the idea that Burning Man and its bulletin board, is not neccessarily the only opportunity to, as one acquaintance put it, 'cast aside the inhibitions' that we live with the rest of the year, but is instead another opportunity to live who we are in the real world.

Guest

Post by Guest » Tue Dec 30, 2003 11:39 am

BlueBirdPoof wrote:Actual connection is important. So is personal safety. Dance between the two.
Wow, that's the kind of thing i come here for. Thanks BlueBirdPoof.

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BlueBirdPoof
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Post by BlueBirdPoof » Tue Dec 30, 2003 1:39 pm

*blush*

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