Absolutely unbelievable

[GreyCoyote]

If you are following the dialogue in regards to Commodification Camps, etc, the Burning Blog has a real howler: Will Chase decries commodification (Black Friday), and suggests we all boycott it... but he suggests if we don't boycott it, then kindly consider purchasing your goods via a method that gives a 0.5% "donation" to Burningman!

I nearly fell off of my chair. Read it and weep. Link: http://blog.burningman.com/2014/11/part ... -you-must/

If the BMORG doesn't see the rich tapestry of contradictions here, then they have clearly lost their minds.

[GreyCoyote]

Amazing. It appears the BMORG pulled the blog post.

[digital]

Just going to say... Seems to have vanished behind the smoke and mirrors. Lol

[GreyCoyote]

Just going to say... Seems to have vanished behind the smoke and mirrors. Lol

And of course, nobody has a copy (banging head on monitor)... so it never happened and I really didn't see that.

Nothing to see here... just move along, Citizen...

[Sham]

Not sure what you're talking about. Were you dipping into the cooking sherry?

[GreyCoyote]

Sham: I will be COMPLETELY honest here. In the very finest Burner tradition, some very fine spirits were indeed consumed today. Its thanksgiving, so sue me.

That being said, it changes nothing. Please see the post on Burners.Me.

[FIGJAM]

My comment was right behind yours.

" But we’re sure as hell not going to set foot in a box camp."

Was my edit!!!!!!!!

[Elderberry]

That didn't take long. Google didn't even have time to cache it.

[Lonesomebri]

Wow! Is there some form I could submit to the Bmorg to register to them my thoughts on this? You know, to contribute a real positive realistic action?

[GreyCoyote]

Wow! Is there some form I could submit to the Bmorg to register to them my thoughts on this? You know, to contribute a real positive realistic action?

My dog, Bri! You are SUCH a dumbass! Cant you think, man? (Notice tongue planted firmly in cheek)

The "form" is $100 bills. You are allowed one word per form. 200 word minimum. Send to the attention of Will Chase / Larry Harvey. Subject: "Outrage about commodification camps".

That'll fix 'em!

[motskyroonmatick]

Hahahahahaha Wow! Just wow.

Nice work Grey Coyote!

[Simon of the Playa]

"Paranoia will Destroy ya"

rich man throwing stones from his big glass house...
the BRCCP will eat you too.

[FIGJAM]

"Paranoia will Destroy ya"

rich man throwing stones from his big glass house...
http://www.politico.com/story/2014/01/w ... 1gOkg.like

[Simon of the Playa]

burners.mexxx don't like commies...

[GreyCoyote]

Its going to be very interesting to see how they address all of this. I dont see the BORG spanking their own in public, but I guess anything is possible. And if they choose to just gloss it over and ignore the core issues... (-shudder-)

[Elderberry]

I know exactly how it will end. You should too if you've been going to BM for any length of time and watching how they have handled the population crisis and the ticketing crisis, just to name two.

[GreyCoyote]

I know exactly how it will end. You should too if you've been going to BM for any length of time and watching how they have handled the population crisis and the ticketing crisis, just to name two.

Then pray tell, oh Great Oracle. Share with us your insider knowledge. Expouse it for us, the unwashed masses with only a paltry non-green color to our names.

TL;dr - spell it out in specifics, or be labeled just another clueless rube like the rest of us.

[Elderberry]

OK, I will...

Here's what I think will happen, whether I or you or anyone likes it or not:

1. They will say that there was a problem, especially with Popsicle camp and they will be implementing much stricter guidlines on TurnKey camps.

2. They will assure everyone that there will not be any special accommodation in ticketing or placement.

3. They should, i'm hoping but doubt that they will, remove Tannenbaum from the board.

And that will be the end of it as far as the BMORG is concerned. And why not? There are less than one percent of the population protesting, only what 20 or less here? More on FB and burners.me, but certainly the numbers are not big enough to give them any concern.

So, I might as well resign myself to that fact. And frankly, other than reading about it after the burn, those camps had literally no effect on how much I enjoyed my burn.

If I'm wrong, so be it. But that's how I see it playing out.

[GreyCoyote]

Ya know, its just damn scary when you and I are on the same page, EB. mrgreen:

Thats pretty much how I think it will go down too. Nothing earth-shattering or powerful. The real wiggle-room will be in the spin and window dressing they use.

Pass the popcorn.

[Eric]

Ya know, its just damn scary when you and I are on the same page, EB. mrgreen:

Thats pretty much how I think it will go down too. Nothing earth-shattering or powerful. The real wiggle-room will be in the spin and window dressing they use.

Yup, pretty much how I see it playing out as well (except JT won't resign or be forced out, they might have him do a mea culpa). I'm really hoping they make these camps follow the same rules as any placed theme camp, especially enforcing the interactivity rules. I mean seriously, by the rules they don't even have to do it non-stop. They can throw their bar open for a "special sunset cocktail hour, Mon - Thurs" and be considered interactive, and they would be better neighbors.

Note: this is all speculation on my part, based on how they've handled other "issues" since I've been attending.


edit: I also meant to say if you hang around here long enough, and have an open mind, you'll actually find yourself agreeing with almost everyone at some point, no matter how much you wouldn't think so.
Tangentially, some of my favorite people from Burning Man & eplaya are folks who I would never meet in the "real world", and who are pretty far from me in most philosophical matters. They are, however, kick-ass human beings.

[Jovankat]

If you guys are right and the above is how it all plays out there's still one issue I feel is left unresolved; access to the turnkey application process. If the solution they come up with is stricter policing of the turnkeys will anyone able to run one? Until now the processes to do with turnkeys have been kept secret. Now that we know there exists a third class of placed camp with early access privileges (theme and support being the first two) will we all be a allowed apply to run such a camp? Or will that option remain only open to those who already have *connections*?

[Elderberry]

Good question.

And there's also one more issue that I'm sure will have be brought up in negotiations with those camps. If TurnKey camps aren't guaranteed anything that regular camps are, wouldn't that also have the effect of limiting the scope of those camps? Which, would actually solve the entire problem. And, the answer to your question would be yes, as those types of camps have been going on for years.

We can only hope. (Oh, and continue to voice our displeasure.)

[Eric]

If you guys are right and the above is how it all plays out there's still one issue I feel is left unresolved; access to the turnkey application process. If the solution they come up with is stricter policing of the turnkeys will anyone able to run one?

I fervently hope they make it as open as any theme camp application - meaning anyone who wants to put in the work can apply, and that application can be found right there on the website with the other ones, but they're held to standards that could cause them to get lousy placement, or none at all, if they don't meet what they claimed they would do in the way the camp is run on-playa, just like every other theme camp.

We all know that once Theme Camp applications are submitted it's a completely opaque process, and I honestly don't have a problem with that, but there should be known standards for TurnKey camps, and there should be repercussions if they break those standards. Hell, we all know (or at least have heard of) camps who've gone from multi-year Esplanade camps to being sent to the boonies when they started phoning it in, that risk should apply equally to Commerce Camps.

[elKay]

I just don't understand why there should be placed commerce camps at all. There is no justification that will make it feel right to me.

[Elderberry]

I wouldn't mind them being placed if placement were based on participation just like any other camp. With the money those camps have, it could actually add to the event if done properly and was open for all to enjoy just lake every other camp.

[Lonesomebri]

....We can only hope. (Oh, and continue to voice our displeasure.)

Hilarious, simply hilarious, all you have done is criticize any and all who complain, and now you act like you are one of us. Hilarious, and a bit pathetic. Yeah, you expressing displeasure at anyone standing up against the for-profit hotels going up in BRC has now transformed itself into opposition to the sell-out. Welcome to the team. Sure,nothing much will be done, but some of us had the integrity and balls to state our claim without so much wishy washy internal dishonesty.

Elderberry- And frankly, other than reading about it after the burn, those camps had literally no effect on how much I enjoyed my burn.

Sort of like slavery, human trafficking, and child abuse.....who cares (says the concerned) it doesn't effect me or my comforts?

[Ratty]

Don't hold back Lonesome. Tell us all how you really feel.

[Lonesomebri]

Don't hold back Lonesome. Tell us all how you really feel.

Weather is nice out, had eggs and hashed brown to eat.

Tell you the truth, I am considering changing sides and supporting the sell-out, seeing as the quality of characters in the anti side has slid so dramatically downhill in recent days.

[elKay]

I wouldn't mind them being placed if placement were based on participation just like any other camp. With the money those camps have, it could actually add to the event if done properly and was open for all to enjoy just lake every other camp.

How great can their gift be if the motive is really about profit?

[Elderberry]

My position hasn't much changed. I wasn't going to jump to conclusions until there was sufficient credible evidence. Once there was, my position has been consistent. If you're upset that I didn't go off like some raving maniac, well sorry. That's your problem. I might suggest you take some advice from my avatar.