Will Burningman become a religion?

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.
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ramen
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Post by ramen » Mon Dec 29, 2003 5:18 pm

drowned_saved wrote:i don't know...
has anyone killed in the name of the ORG yet?
Only in effigy.

In my mental picture, religion is an organization's attempt to containerize the spiritual experience for mass consumption.

I have no doubt that many, many people, including myself, have had spiritual experiences out on the dirt, though what constitutes spiritual for me probably varies quite a bit from the Roman Catholic Church's ideas.

The ticket I purchase from BM, LLC is my license to experience once again the intense frequency of the playa. I find the price a bargain compared to prostrating myself thrice daily or othe forms of organized spiritual practice, though I am sometimes saddened by the schisms within the community.

Flagellation, anyone?
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BM Religion....

Post by Guest » Fri Jun 11, 2004 6:20 am

I want to be a showman errrr shaman in the BM religion.

madmatt
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Post by madmatt » Fri Jun 11, 2004 9:03 am

antron wrote:...can it outlast its founder?
Next year's theme: Harveytown (like Jonestown, but, ya know, with Larry Harvey). But not with koolaid, with tequila.

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Post by blyslv » Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:21 am

Take me back to the mystery!



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orangepeelmoses
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burning religion

Post by orangepeelmoses » Sat Jul 24, 2004 8:31 am

art is my religion.

opm

jesus was an alien ReMiX

magnus greel
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Post by magnus greel » Sat Jul 24, 2004 11:41 am

Alright, what with all the interference with my eye and brain functioning, I could very well have missed something in the previous posts, but has anyone actually said what might actually be religious about the experience of BM?

I find that the word "spirituality" (or "spiritual") is so mis-used and over-used, as to be so watered-down that it ends up being utterly meaningless. It's usually a sign of pretentiousness and/or refusal to think original thoughts.

I haven't gone to BM. For medical reasons, it's hard to see my getting there. So I'm trying to connect with BM-ish people here. I'm sick of the meaninglessness imposed on us by the pop culture, but also sick of the fake, empty meaning of the only visible non-traditional mindsets that I know about. I'm certainly NOT out to latch onto a world-view... I think for myself. I just want to connect with individuals whom I just might be in synch with. I'm looking for my species.

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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Mon Jul 26, 2004 9:07 am

magnus greel wrote:Alright, what with all the interference with my eye and brain functioning, I could very well have missed something in the previous posts, but has anyone actually said what might actually be religious about the experience of BM?
The actual burn can be viewed as a rite in which we are reminded of the fragility and impermenance of everything. This is more spiritural than religious--a religion would most likely make up some sort of permanence if you only perform the proper rites, bribe the right priests ect. The curve of creation and destruction of the city reinforces the sence of living in the moment. YMMV. I carry the death of my younger sister 9 years ago next month, and I think that shapes a lot of my world view. I think that the happy playa theme song is Brave Combo's "Nothing is Permanent"
[Rain falls and turns to mud and then it dries and blows away
Grass grows in yards of green and then it gets to tall and causes worry
...
Buildings of any sort are just lean-tos and that's all]
and the unhappy same is the Klezmatics/Tony Kushner song about the Statue of Liberty.
[By the time we're done with dancing
Elsewhere, darling, you'll be glancing, and the night's a river torrent tearing us apart.
.....
Don't call out and cling in terror, darling that's a fatal error, clinging to a somebody you thought you knew was yours
Dispossesion by attrition is the permanant condition that this wretched modern world endures
.....
Someday you may be a refugee
A refugee, running from the wars, escaping from the fire bombs they hurl]
And much more of great wisdom. The playa love poem is Andrew Marvell's, of course.

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Holy Larry Harvey

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gilmore
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Political party????

Post by gilmore » Tue Aug 03, 2004 11:01 pm

.
What about instead of a religion, it became a political party ???

Imagine the possibilities.....
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DVD Burner
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Re: Political party????

Post by DVD Burner » Wed Aug 04, 2004 12:08 am

gilmore wrote:.
What about instead of a religion, it became a political party ???

Imagine the possibilities.....
this world can use this about now.
https://www.facebook.com/NeXTCODER

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BAS
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Re: Political party????

Post by BAS » Wed Aug 04, 2004 6:24 pm

DVD Burner wrote:
gilmore wrote:.
What about instead of a religion, it became a political party ???

Imagine the possibilities.....
this world can use this about now.
Who would be the party's Sock Puppet/Presidential Candidate? :wink:
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Do things that have never been done."
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TheJudge
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Re: Political party????

Post by TheJudge » Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:05 am

BAS wrote:Who would be the party's Sock Puppet/Presidential Candidate? :wink:
The man, of course. Then we could burn him in effigy every year and not have it be seen as some neo-pagan, post-apocalyptic, hippy lovefest.
"Be at one with the dust of the earth. This is primal union." - Lao Tsu

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DVD Burner
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Post by DVD Burner » Fri Mar 28, 2008 12:22 am

haven't seen this in awhile.
https://www.facebook.com/NeXTCODER

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TheJudge
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Post by TheJudge » Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:26 am

Indeed. I had forgotten I even wrote that last comment.

Still applies, though.
"Be at one with the dust of the earth. This is primal union." - Lao Tsu

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Simon of the Playa
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Post by Simon of the Playa » Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:26 am

fuck all the semantics.......WE ARE A RELIGION......


now can we get some of that lovely tax-free status?


i got dibbs on the playa name "Pastor Panties"....
Frida Be You & Me

DaddyMassive
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Post by DaddyMassive » Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:10 am

No, BM is not a religion... there are no gods involved.
Just cos people really really like something and it draws a crowd, doesn't mean the majority are getting a spiritual roadmap for the rest of their lives and after.

I can understand why people might feel they're having spiritual/enlightening episodes while out in the baking desert half cut on whatever they're taking, but I'd also bet these people are the type to have an epiphany eating a particulaly tasty cheese sandwich on an otherwise miserable day.

It's more comparrible to a charity organisation.

People are drawn together wanting to be amongst others with a similar temprement and give their time and/or money to work together on some shit or another.

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Simon of the Playa
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Post by Simon of the Playa » Fri Mar 28, 2008 9:37 am

No, BM is not a religion... there are no gods involved.

i beg to differ....there are many gods and goddesses on the playa.

can understand why people might feel they're having spiritual/enlightening episodes while out in the baking desert half cut on whatever they're taking
sounds an awful lot like 40 days in the desert, or forty years, both of which are precursors to "salvation"....Just ask MoMo and JeJe...

It's more comparrible to a charity organisation.
wtf is the Roman Catholic Church then? or Scientology for that matter, any "non-profit" spiritual organization that relies on "tithing" is just that, a charity.

at least the schwag is better at Burning Man...not to mention the wafers.
Frida Be You & Me

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Ugly Dougly
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:29 am

We're still on our first millenium. Give it time.

What did Moses say, "hey everybody, let's all have a religion!"
No, he said, let's go out to the desert this weekend and fuck shit up, it'll be fun.

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Post by DaddyMassive » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:38 am

[quote]i beg to differ....there are many gods and goddesses on the playa.[/quote]

Riiiight. Call me a cynical twat but that’s just fluffy saccharine nonsense.

[quote] sounds an awful lot like 40 days in the desert, or forty years, both of which are precursors to "salvation"....Just ask MoMo and JeJe... [/quote]

Sounds like it happens a lot then. If only ‘Momo and JeJe’ had pissed clear, kept in the shade and not read too much into their delusionary states of mind, the world might be a better place. Though, I fear, some other hallucinating yoyo with over zealous self-conviction would of come up with some other sh1t to spoon to sheep in 2000+ years.

[quote]wtf is the Roman Catholic Church then? or Scientology for that matter, any "non-profit" spiritual organization that relies on "tithing" is just that, a charity.

at least the schwag is better at Burning Man...not to mention the wafers.[/quote]

For tax purposes yes, but I’m guessing both those institutions would consider themselves a religion first and a charity second or fifteenth.
I could go on but I know you’re just troll baiting.

DaddyMassive
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Post by DaddyMassive » Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:39 am

I never got quotes to work & frankly I don't care ;D

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Simon of the Playa
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Post by Simon of the Playa » Fri Mar 28, 2008 11:36 am

yes, but this is the e-playa, so it's a hav-a-heart trap.













there you go little critter, you're FREE!
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Teo del Fuego
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Post by Teo del Fuego » Fri Mar 28, 2008 12:20 pm

Ugly Dougly wrote:What did Moses say, "hey everybody, let's all have a religion!" No, he said, let's go out to the desert this weekend and fuck shit up, it'll be fun.
and if you remember from the film Ten Commandments what the Israelite camp looked like while Moses was up in the Mountains? Yep, it looked exactly like Burning Man!

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Post by Silverwheel » Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:42 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:The actual burn can be viewed as a rite in which we are reminded of the fragility and impermenance of everything.
Almost right. The burn is a rite in which we are reminded of the fragility and impermenance of almost everything.

I'm a bard. In what I do I'm keenly interested in the use of ritual. Handled correctly it can bring about growth and centeredness in the participants. Handled incorrectly it leaves a vague feeling that everybody else is getting it so I'll just pretend I got it too.

But to get back to your point, I think you meant the fragility and impermenance of everything material. What do you have when all that is gone? The answer that popped into your mind when you read that question is what the ritual is about.

And finally to return to what got me into this thread: no, Burning Man is not nor will it ever be a religion. As has been stated on this thread, religion is an attempt to codify and instututionalise the spiritual experince while the individual shuts up and follows along in the hymnal (I paraphrase). Yet BM is about hundreds of thousands of people having individual spiritual experiences that are unregulated and unregulatable.

And we can all be grateful for that!
[b][i]Love without hope, as when the young bird-catcher
Swept off his tall hat to the Squire's own daughter,
So let the imprisoned larks escape and fly
Singing about her head, as she rode by.
-Robert Graves[/i][/b]

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Captain Goddammit
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Post by Captain Goddammit » Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:16 pm

I still say it's a fucking camping trip, where we burn shit and party. Simple as that.

But if we call it a religion, can we go on a crusade to wipe out the god damn Christians?
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Simon of the Playa
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Post by Simon of the Playa » Sun Apr 13, 2008 6:10 am

"will everybody just SHUT UP!, i'm trying to have a spiritual experience"*



*asshole heckler at the temple burn.......**

**it may or may not have been this asshole....
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Gravity Mike
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Post by Gravity Mike » Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:36 pm

Yeah, already a religion...

At my first burn I noted the similarities to another major world religion.

Islam: people swirl in a circle in the desert around a black rock.

Burning Man: people swirl in a circle in the black rock dessert around the burning man.

Of course, the similarities stop there.

Gravity

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tubahurl
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Post by tubahurl » Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:57 pm

To get back to the original thread,

Can Burning Man become a religion? Absolutely. Will it? the question of the hour. The question I have posed before at lectures to fry everyone’s noodle a little is; at what point does a philosophy metamorphose into a religion?
If Burning Man were to take that fatal step, what would be the center of worship? The Man in effigy, or the pseudo paganesk worship of each others individuality, creativity and general couldn’t care less about the established “order of thingsâ€

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magicmarty
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Post by magicmarty » Sat Apr 26, 2008 11:18 pm

Captain Goddammit has it perfectly!

No pretensions. Just the opportunity to drop the inhibitions and have a week of wonderful freedom, caring and fun. Forget the religion and its separation influence and get with the oneness and humanity of us all
"Creativity requires the courage to let go of certainties" - Erich Fromm

Stay firm but loose!

MagicMarty

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Ugly Dougly
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Sun Apr 27, 2008 9:25 am

Gravity Mike wrote:Yeah, already a religion...

At my first burn I noted the similarities to another major world religion.

Islam: people swirl in a circle in the desert around a black rock.

Burning Man: people swirl in a circle in the black rock dessert around the burning man.

Of course, the similarities stop there.

Gravity
Clockwise or counter-clockwise?
Heretic.

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Ugly Dougly
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Sun Apr 27, 2008 9:28 am

It's a ritual and it's a matter of time before people ascribe meanings to the ritual and start fighting over interpretations. When the first blood is drawn is the birth of a religion, what a holy day it will be.

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