Shame on you Burning Man Organization.........

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.
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gyre
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Post by gyre » Fri Aug 14, 2009 9:59 pm

The more accurate term for indians is americans or early americans.
Everyone else, please refer to yourself as new americans or late americans.


I haven't committed genocide against anyone lately, so no compensation there.
But it is true that the us has done many things much more recently to keep many indian areas impoverished.
These effects are still with those still here and should be corrected.

The situation with indian land is unique and the government's behavior quite hard to understand.

Of course, the government's creation of redlining and segregated neighborhoods is baffling too.
We now reap the economic brilliance of that.

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goathead
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Post by goathead » Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:06 pm

Fair warning KIDS

Haven't seen a cow on Hwy 447 all summer.

Till this evening, and there are now a fuck load of them.

ON THE HIGHWAY !!!!!!

Between mile marker 28 and mile marker 42.

So much for the tribes concern about

YOUR SAFETY....

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Generic Anonymity
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Post by Generic Anonymity » Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:27 pm

I'm not sure why, but it seems the less often a big group comes through your area, the more annoying it is when they do.

A football game in which Pittsburgh plays? Reason to celebrate. Cops may not care for the revelry, but most of the locals are happy. (Steeler fans apparently are willing to travel crazy distances. They are also everywhere.)

Anime convention in Baltimore? The shop owners love it. The locals hate it.

Familiarity seems akin to becoming accustomed.

Also, the longer something has been happening, the feelings around it get exaggerated. Those who dislike it grow to hate, & those who enjoy it look forward to it all year.

Am I overgeneralizing or on the right track here?

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gyre
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Death Week

Post by gyre » Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:40 pm

Yes.

Come to Memphis for Death Week with all the elvis fans.

The only good part is that during Death Week, it's legal to hunt elvis impersonators with tranquilizer guns.
Tougher than it sounds though.
They seem to have an amazing tolerance to the darts.

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chiefdanfox
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Post by chiefdanfox » Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:43 pm

How often does anyone invoke the stereotype of the old man sitting in his lonely, dark house thinking, "I wish those kids would get on my goddamn lawn" ?

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the fire elf
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Post by the fire elf » Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:16 pm

the big beast name of many foot
comes trolling by and belching soot
to whom which where and why because
there's never word for that which was


parry your arrow, your target's too big

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ygmir
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Post by ygmir » Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:23 pm

gyre wrote:The more accurate term for indians is americans or early americans.
Everyone else, please refer to yourself as new americans or late americans.
no
YGMIR

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Pagan

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chiefdanfox
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Post by chiefdanfox » Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:51 pm

ygmir wrote:
gyre wrote:The more accurate term for indians is americans or early americans.
Everyone else, please refer to yourself as new americans or late americans.
no
or maybe the more accurate term exists in the native tongue. I mean really, this continent was named after a plagiarizing mapmaker. In European terms, maybe this county should have been "Codville" or "Burning Woodland" or "All of those dudes are dying-land". By the time the white male oppressors showed up, at least 80% of the indigenous population had been wiped out by swine flu and small pox. It was just fishermen, making ephemeral camps to dry cod who wiped out most of North America's indigenous population. It was like, "Dude, you want a fish? (cough)" Game over.

DoriumLux
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Post by DoriumLux » Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:00 am

chiefdanfox wrote:
ygmir wrote:
gyre wrote:The more accurate term for indians is americans or early americans.
Everyone else, please refer to yourself as new americans or late americans.
no
or maybe the more accurate term exists in the native tongue. I mean really, this continent was named after a plagiarizing mapmaker. In European terms, maybe this county should have been "Codville" or "Burning Woodland" or "All of those dudes are dying-land". By the time the white male oppressors showed up, at least 80% of the indigenous population had been wiped out by swine flu and small pox. It was just fishermen, making ephemeral camps to dry cod who wiped out most of North America's indigenous population. It was like, "Dude, you want a fish? (cough)" Game over.
The native tongue? Groups across the country speak 100's of languages. There is no one native tongue. Also, 80% of the population was not killed by fishermen before colonists arrived and does not explain the deaths in the interior of the country. Not all groups had contact with each other. I'm not sure where you got your stats but I'm guessing you pulled them out of thin air. Contact with colonist killed unfortold numbers through disease but warfare, boarding schools and outright slaughter are all contributing factors that are to all be collaboratively considered. Events such as the "Trail of Tears" alone killed thousands.

Environmental Discrimination is another continuing factor that inflict groups living on reservations today. Many, many rez's have been subjected to nuclear testing, targeted for nuclear waste storage or live down river from uranium mining sites and other environmental hazards that the government can't get away with as easily putting next to other communities.

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Post by Mekishiko » Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:05 am

You all make this pacifist want to punch you all in the face.

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Oldguy
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Post by Oldguy » Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:27 am

slang word quapa :
A hybrid of quarter and hapa. Refers to a person's cultural/ethnic identity as being a quarter or three-quarters of something, in other words at least one parent is hapa or half. One could be three-quarters Japanese American and one-quarter European American or one-quarter Japanese American and one-quarter French Canadian and half African American.

Since my greatgrandmother was "full-blood" "Quapaw", my grandmother was one half, and my father quapa Quapaw. And our ancester grandmother who lived on the plains of Mongolia and is " rolling in her grave " about your post, "brother".

Why is it we hurt the ones we love? Cultural/racial identity is meaningless now that we have a multi-ethnic president and society. Shall we throw away 300 years of history and evolution? We are all human, are we not? The "whiteman " is the new minority. We are now a blended society, and like a blended family we have to learn to live together.

Rich and poor, male and female, north and south, east and west. And like the poet, I have trod the path less traveled by and that has made all the difference. Namaste, peace, aloha.
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the fire elf
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Post by the fire elf » Sat Aug 15, 2009 2:45 am

who knew the cost of inventions was to toil with them...

could you not invent some more worth, rather than wallow disparaged?

and soo, even then, the planet they knew as they thought they did, brought with it less innocence beyond the horizon

where shall you fix the blame?

walk, and the horizon unfixes

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Post by MikeVDS » Sat Aug 15, 2009 6:41 am

You all make this pacifist want to punch you all in the face.
Haha. I know you're intentionally saying that for emphasis on how mad you are, but I'm guessing you're reasoning behind it is as backward and illogical as the only statement you made. If you feel something is wrong about this conversation, take a deep breath and chime in contributing something informative. Prove me wrong about thinking you have nothing useful to say.
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Post by DoriumLux » Sat Aug 15, 2009 8:58 am

Oldguy wrote:slang word quapa :
A hybrid of quarter and hapa. Refers to a person's cultural/ethnic identity as being a quarter or three-quarters of something, in other words at least one parent is hapa or half. One could be three-quarters Japanese American and one-quarter European American or one-quarter Japanese American and one-quarter French Canadian and half African American.

Since my greatgrandmother was "full-blood" "Quapaw", my grandmother was one half, and my father quapa Quapaw. And our ancester grandmother who lived on the plains of Mongolia and is " rolling in her grave " about your post, "brother".

Why is it we hurt the ones we love? Cultural/racial identity is meaningless now that we have a multi-ethnic president and society. Shall we throw away 300 years of history and evolution? We are all human, are we not? The "whiteman " is the new minority. We are now a blended society, and like a blended family we have to learn to live together.

Rich and poor, male and female, north and south, east and west. And like the poet, I have trod the path less traveled by and that has made all the difference. Namaste, peace, aloha.
Sorry, one president does not erase generations of pain, suffering, racism, discrimination that certain groups in this country have faced. Tell someone who has had a family member hung, put in a internment camp, enslaved, thrown in a boarding school or some other such atrocity that it is meaningless now that we have Obama as president.

One president also does not make the white man a minority. However, it might make certain white men feel small.

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gyre
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Post by gyre » Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:23 am

You seem as dependent on the myth of the white race as any klansman.

Prove there is a white race.
Dare you.

Better people have tried.
I guess some still are.

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Post by Elderberry » Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:33 am

DoriumLux wrote:
Wow. Open up a casino? So you think that Native Americans just have a load of money sitting around to open up casinos with? You also believe that everyone benefits from these casinos? Not. Try again. Also do a little research before you spew out your ass some more.
OH PA-LEEZE girlfriend, this is an internet bulletin board, my ass can spew anything it likes. If you don't like it don't read it oh defender of the world (or Indians). I'm still pissed we had to change the name of our baeball team to be politically correct.

We came, we saw, we conquered. Get over it. This land is our land now! How do you like those politically incorrect apples DoriuimLux???

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Post by Elderberry » Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:35 am

DoriumLux wrote:
Oldguy wrote:slang word quapa :
A hybrid of quarter and hapa. Refers to a person's cultural/ethnic identity as being a quarter or three-quarters of something, in other words at least one parent is hapa or half. One could be three-quarters Japanese American and one-quarter European American or one-quarter Japanese American and one-quarter French Canadian and half African American.

Since my greatgrandmother was "full-blood" "Quapaw", my grandmother was one half, and my father quapa Quapaw. And our ancester grandmother who lived on the plains of Mongolia and is " rolling in her grave " about your post, "brother".

Why is it we hurt the ones we love? Cultural/racial identity is meaningless now that we have a multi-ethnic president and society. Shall we throw away 300 years of history and evolution? We are all human, are we not? The "whiteman " is the new minority. We are now a blended society, and like a blended family we have to learn to live together.

Rich and poor, male and female, north and south, east and west. And like the poet, I have trod the path less traveled by and that has made all the difference. Namaste, peace, aloha.
Sorry, one president does not erase generations of pain, suffering, racism, discrimination that certain groups in this country have faced. Tell someone who has had a family member hung, put in a internment camp, enslaved, thrown in a boarding school or some other such atrocity that it is meaningless now that we have Obama as president.

One president also does not make the white man a minority. However, it might make certain white men feel small.
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

JK
JK
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Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me

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rodiponer
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Post by rodiponer » Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:47 am

This is why some people should not study history. Please, what is the point for you, as an individual, or for any society as a whole, to dwell on grieving outrages in the distant past?

How is it actionable? Do you want Congress to declare that, yes, some of the people who died one hundred years ago were a bunch of dicks to some other people who died one hundred years ago? Would that make you feel that someone's great great grandparents finally "won"?

After that, would you shut up so we can move on to improving our society in the present and future?

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Post by MikeVDS » Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:55 am

This is why some people should not study history. Please, what is the point for you, as an individual, or for any society as a whole, to dwell on grieving outrages in the distant past?
People who do that either haven't "studied" history, rather just know one small aspect from the past, or are just ignoring the rest of it. I think if they studied a little harder their point of view might change.
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Re: Troll?

Post by goathead » Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:06 am

DoriumLux wrote: If you suddenly found out that you couldn't afford go to Burning Man you might be pretty freaking bummed and go on a rant too. Right? Excuse her for being human and being upset about something that would be terribly upsetting to most of us. It's called empathy. Have you ever felt that feeling before?

She isn't a troll BTW.
DL
Notice of the increase came out the middle of June, for locals. Now is a little late to be sniveling about it. We have all had to adjust to it. So now two weeks before the event and she just found out about it?

Where is her planning?

Plus it is not HER that is lacking a ticket, it a guest, so the price went up BFD, deal with it, maybe her GUEST can pitching in a few bucks, MAYBE, other camp mates can do the same.

Fucking deal with it.

Its nice we get a break, and the chance for reduced guest tickets.
I am grateful for them, BUT if they went away BFD, I would buy my tickets just like everyone else.

Also she is kind of a troll, she posts and never seems to return.
Except to stir up more shit.

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Re: Troll?

Post by SageV » Sat Aug 15, 2009 12:23 pm

DoriumLux wrote:
Sage Venkman wrote:I'm not sure if the original poster is a troll, but I do have a suggestion. If she had posted first that she was looking for help instead of going on the attack, one of the veteran burners would have probably given her a ticket. I don't know about you all, but each year I buy two tickets: One for me, one for someone who I don't know yet to whom I will gift the experience.
If you suddenly found out that you couldn't afford go to Burning Man you might be pretty freaking bummed and go on a rant too. Right? Excuse her for being human and being upset about something that would be terribly upsetting to most of us. It's called empathy. Have you ever felt that feeling before?

She isn't a troll BTW.
Okay, well its hard to tell if someone's a troll these days. Funny you should mention it, but this year I can't afford to go to Burning Man and though I was depressed I didn't go on a rant against BMORG. The reason I mentioned it is if I had seen the ad before I got rid of my gifting ticket, I might have given it to her. Though, I would be less likely to give it to someone who attacks the community than just needed help. So yes, I'm feeling that right now.

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Post by trenton » Sat Aug 15, 2009 4:02 pm

Im poor and cant afford the new 60k RV I want. I lost relitives in Auswich can you dirty hippies talk BM into gifting me one or sell me one for say 20k ....... whats the difference.

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Post by DoriumLux » Sat Aug 15, 2009 6:47 pm

rodiponer wrote:This is why some people should not study history. Please, what is the point for you, as an individual, or for any society as a whole, to dwell on grieving outrages in the distant past?

How is it actionable? Do you want Congress to declare that, yes, some of the people who died one hundred years ago were a bunch of dicks to some other people who died one hundred years ago? Would that make you feel that someone's great great grandparents finally "won"?

After that, would you shut up so we can move on to improving our society in the present and future?
Distant past? I can tell you are a historian. I really can. You must be educated too...

Here is to hoping you are smart enough to catch the sarcasm.

I have serious issues with people discussing things and citing what they call to be "facts." I can cite what I say, can you?

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hdh

Post by Mekishiko » Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:45 pm

It's understandable for people to come on here and ridicule her for bitching about her ticket, but to have no empathy from where she is coming from is rediculous.

Imagine if your family was murdered,slaughtered,kidnapped put in boarding schools, had your people brainwashed and tortured and kicked off your land where you and your people lived for thousands of years.

Then imagine if you, as a surviving relative TODAY are forced into povery by things that happened hundreds of years ago.

Then imagine that your plight, your pain, and your families struggle has not only gone by the wayside, ignored, but has turned into an acceptable joke and subject of entertainment for the very people who murdered your family in the first place. with early TV depicting every native as a savage, or a mocking sports mascot running around with a peace pipe and tomahawk.

Then imagine this tiny plot of land they've given you, literally your backyard is in the way of a huge party, and thousands of people are going to trounce through your backyard, leaving trash, empty stores where you normally buy your food, having your children get ranover by speeders, and have those people critisize you as if you have no reason to complain.

The symantics of race are not in question here (yet again) we all know race is an idea not based in science. But the reality is people are treated differently based on stereotypes and this is stupid, cruel and unfair, what makes it all the more insulting though is when people who have no experience with any of it claim that the plight of people who still suffer today is somehow equivelant to those who are not met with those hardships at this time. I know people today who were kidnapped as children and forced into seperate boarding schools from their siblings in order to be christianized. They don't know how to find their parents or their siblings to this day.

Kudos for a black president, I am happy. But its a beginning, not an end.

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Post by DoriumLux » Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:57 pm

DoriumLux wrote:
rodiponer wrote:This is why some people should not study history. Please, what is the point for you, as an individual, or for any society as a whole, to dwell on grieving outrages in the distant past?

How is it actionable? Do you want Congress to declare that, yes, some of the people who died one hundred years ago were a bunch of dicks to some other people who died one hundred years ago? Would that make you feel that someone's great great grandparents finally "won"?

After that, would you shut up so we can move on to improving our society in the present and future?
P.S. What the hell is history about if it isn't about studying the past? What a conundrum! Please see your nearest dictionary.


:roll:

DoriumLux
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Post by DoriumLux » Sat Aug 15, 2009 11:11 pm

trenton wrote:Im poor and cant afford the new 60k RV I want. I lost relitives in Auswich can you dirty hippies talk BM into gifting me one or sell me one for say 20k ....... whats the difference.
Okay, you don't get it. Let me explain...

I understand that technically Burning Man doesn't owe her anything and has been quite "nice" in gifting locals tickets. I get that. However, I sympathize with her disappointment.

What shocks me is the numerous bigoted, uneducated and stereotypical comments that have been posted here in the wake of Pyramid Lake Woman's post. It saddens and disgusts me. For those of you who feel that they have said nothing of the sort and yet clearly have; shame on you. It's a travesty that you think, feel and speak this way and I can only hope that you censor yourself in the real company of humans who may be hurt by your errant remarks. Something tells me it might be a positive thing that most of you seemingly spend more time on your asses infront of a computer screen interacting with others in cyberspace than you do with others in real life.

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Re: Troll?

Post by DoriumLux » Sat Aug 15, 2009 11:22 pm

goathead wrote:
DoriumLux wrote: If you suddenly found out that you couldn't afford go to Burning Man you might be pretty freaking bummed and go on a rant too. Right? Excuse her for being human and being upset about something that would be terribly upsetting to most of us. It's called empathy. Have you ever felt that feeling before?

She isn't a troll BTW.
DL
Notice of the increase came out the middle of June, for locals. Now is a little late to be sniveling about it. We have all had to adjust to it. So now two weeks before the event and she just found out about it?

Where is her planning?

Plus it is not HER that is lacking a ticket, it a guest, so the price went up BFD, deal with it, maybe her GUEST can pitching in a few bucks, MAYBE, other camp mates can do the same.

Fucking deal with it.

Its nice we get a break, and the chance for reduced guest tickets.
I am grateful for them, BUT if they went away BFD, I would buy my tickets just like everyone else.

Also she is kind of a troll, she posts and never seems to return.
Except to stir up more shit.
She isn't a troll. I've read her other posts. Have you? Asking people to drive carefully through the reservation or giving people advice on kayak rentals at the lake stirring up shit? Really???

Maybe, she has a life or intermittent access to internet. Hard to fathom for some of you I imagine.

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Hell, I hope she never has the opportunity to read the embarrassing shit that so many people have written here. It's a shame.

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Re: Troll?

Post by Mekishiko » Sat Aug 15, 2009 11:30 pm

DoriumLux wrote:
goathead wrote:
DoriumLux wrote: If you suddenly found out that you couldn't afford go to Burning Man you might be pretty freaking bummed and go on a rant too. Right? Excuse her for being human and being upset about something that would be terribly upsetting to most of us. It's called empathy. Have you ever felt that feeling before?

She isn't a troll BTW.
DL
Notice of the increase came out the middle of June, for locals. Now is a little late to be sniveling about it. We have all had to adjust to it. So now two weeks before the event and she just found out about it?

Where is her planning?

Plus it is not HER that is lacking a ticket, it a guest, so the price went up BFD, deal with it, maybe her GUEST can pitching in a few bucks, MAYBE, other camp mates can do the same.

Fucking deal with it.

Its nice we get a break, and the chance for reduced guest tickets.
I am grateful for them, BUT if they went away BFD, I would buy my tickets just like everyone else.

Also she is kind of a troll, she posts and never seems to return.
Except to stir up more shit.
She isn't a troll. I've read her other posts. Have you? Asking people to drive carefully through the reservation or giving people advice on kayak rentals at the lake stirring up shit? Really???

Maybe, she has a life or intermittent access to internet. Hard to fathom for some of you I imagine.

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I think you forgot their mousepad:

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gyre
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Post by gyre » Sat Aug 15, 2009 11:40 pm

Fuck you and your racist stereotypes about the south.

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Post by DoriumLux » Sat Aug 15, 2009 11:53 pm

gyre wrote:Fuck you and your racist stereotypes about the south.

What? Huh? There are stereotypes that southerners are addicted to the internet? Really? Are you also implying that the south is a race? Oh, the irony!

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