Let's face it burners

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.
themessenger
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Let's face it burners

Post by themessenger » Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:42 pm

It's just a "RAVE" :?

West
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It's not a rave

Post by West » Fri Sep 05, 2003 3:14 pm

It's not a rave, it's sad you missed the art, the community, the unfettered expression, the building of a fully functioning community 70 miles in the desert and then that community's mournful destruction. Dancing is a part of the celebration and expression, music is a motivator to move...another beacon to entice people out into the night.

If it's just a rave to you, please stay home next year. The playa doesn't need any more lecherous 18 year olds sucking on binkies waving glow sticks while tripping their faces off on E.
Thank you B-man 2003

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playasnake
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Post by playasnake » Fri Sep 05, 2003 4:37 pm

thats quite a compelling argument you have submitted here...

but no, its not just a rave.

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TheMuse
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Post by TheMuse » Fri Sep 05, 2003 5:17 pm

I would like to see a little more variety in the music. Too much techno and not enough drum circles!

themessenger
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There were...

Post by themessenger » Fri Sep 05, 2003 5:38 pm

lot's of drum circles. I saw them, I heard them, but there was never that many people around them, just the drummers mainly. there was one in center camp that was so good that I in my semi-coherant state could have sworn was a dj on decks, till I looked and saw em. oops just a buncha hippies jammin. I swear they were hiding a bass player somewhere. Also I heard a wider variety of music than ever before, and I think it was because I spent way less time at the large scale sound venues. Which is an amazing accomplishment for me, since I'm like a dj and all. it's all there you just got to go find it!!!

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metaphysical
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rave?

Post by metaphysical » Sat Sep 06, 2003 11:37 am

i have been to rave's all over the country, and nothing is like burningman.

just the people who attend make it more then a rave ever could be off the bat.

i think hi energy music just happens to be a medium of choice for people around the WORLD right now, but that was such a small part of burningman.

those who couldn't get past the surface value, and really open themselves up, probably left never really knowing how special burningman is.

those that gave of themselves received twice what they gave.

plus there was some really good music this year, even in the drum circles in center camp, they were getting off.

i just layed there and listened for hours.

there were flutes, and drums with a beat you could bob too, not just get lost in.

i love it, and i will be there next year, open again, taking it all in, and giving everything i have......

peace and love

DarthVegan
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Post by DarthVegan » Sat Sep 06, 2003 12:08 pm

? "Just a RAVE" ?

Please don't tell that to the folks at Camp Bayou who created an other-worldly bayou oasis in the middle of the desert, served homemade mint julips, and entertained with toe-tapping bluegrass.

Those guys made my whole week!

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Angry Butterfly
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Damn, you went to the wrong event

Post by Angry Butterfly » Wed Sep 10, 2003 5:13 pm

I was in a "RAVE" camp, and it shure as hell didnt seem like "just a rave" to me! But raves are great, mabe it was "just a rave" a really good one. It was what raves are supposed to be. Peace. Love Understanding, respect, Raves are SUPPOSED to be about all those things, and burningman was, and a lot more "just a Rave" indeed, a rave can save your life.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

Flon
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Re: Let's face it burners

Post by Flon » Fri Sep 12, 2003 4:43 pm

themessenger wrote:It's just a "RAVE" :?
If it were, I wouldn't be there (been going since '99).

It's the art and the community that's the thing.

I'll be the first to admit that I just don't "get" the whole electronica, rave, techno (or whatever it's called now) thing. No breath, nothing "human", nothing to engage the mind.

I long for music that matches the intricacy and thoughtfulness of some of the art at BM.

I guess if that's what I want, I just got to get up off my lazy ass and do it myself next year.

ragnar1963
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Post by ragnar1963 » Fri Sep 12, 2003 5:02 pm

"No breath, nothing "human", nothing to engage the mind. "

It's music for DANCING. Can't get much more human than that. Don't deny the body, celebrate it!

"I long for music that matches the intricacy and thoughtfulness of some of the art at BM. "

Granted. It's unfortunate, but most really talented musicians probably make music for a living, and are disinclined to do it for free--in fact, paying for the privilege--at BM.

"I guess if that's what I want, I just got to get up off my lazy ass and do it myself next year."

Also granted. Myself, I'd love to hear more classical music at BRC, live or recorded. Trying to figure out the best way to set that up next year.

ragnar1963
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Post by ragnar1963 » Fri Sep 12, 2003 5:06 pm

"No breath, nothing "human", nothing to engage the mind. "

It's music for DANCING. Can't get much more human than that. Don't deny the body, celebrate it!

"I long for music that matches the intricacy and thoughtfulness of some of the art at BM. "

Granted. It's unfortunate, but most really talented musicians probably make music for a living, and are disinclined to do it for free--in fact, paying for the privilege--at BM.

"I guess if that's what I want, I just got to get up off my lazy ass and do it myself next year."

Also granted. Myself, I'd love to hear more classical music at BRC, live or recorded. Trying to figure out the best way to set that up next year.

themessenger
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"I guess if that's what I want, I just got to get up of

Post by themessenger » Fri Sep 12, 2003 5:40 pm

"I guess if that's what I want, I just got to get up off my lazy ass and do it myself next year."

That is exactly the difference beetween the electronica peeps and people who prefer other types of music. Motivation!!!

I know it is not just a rave. I was only trying to stimulate some discussion about music. Because, I am so tired of people constantly complaining about all the electronica. And how they yurn for the old days when there was no amplified music, or how they wish there were more variety. well, If thats what you wish for then... "I guess if that's what I want, I just got to get up off my lazy ass and do it myself next year." -ragnar1963 Ragnar you said exactly what I wanted some one to say. So, thank you!

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Post by Flux » Sat Sep 13, 2003 12:15 pm

I think it would be cool if there was, for lack of a better term, a folk music camp, kind of a mellow space with relatively mellow, lyric-centered music. Some ani difranco, Dar Williams, Leonard Cohen, Greg Brown, Dylan, Sarah McLachlan, etc. etc. I love to dance, but I also love music that speaks to my mind and my heart as well as my feet.

Disclaimer: No, I'm not going to do it myself. No, I'm not asking anyone else to do it, either. I think it would be cool, but I have other fish to fry.

themessenger
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Lenard Cohen..

Post by themessenger » Sat Sep 13, 2003 3:48 pm

on the center camp stage, say. Hmm, I am all for it!!!

aglaia
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real, live, professional musicians do play for free

Post by aglaia » Sat Sep 13, 2003 4:14 pm

Did anyone go to the Paddy Mirage and see - and hear - some of the music there?

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Post by Flux » Sat Sep 13, 2003 10:40 pm

Did anyone go to the Paddy Mirage and see - and hear - some of the music there?
Not me! Tell us about it!

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Angry Butterfly
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Post by Angry Butterfly » Sat Sep 13, 2003 11:37 pm

Woah, hold on, if you think a rave is about fucked up 18 year olds sucking on binkies, you have never been to a real rave, A real rave has art, music, dancing and community. come to san fran and Ill hook u up.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

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fresh
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not just a rave

Post by fresh » Sun Sep 14, 2003 10:16 pm

did you not see:

the mermen
lost in love
any band at hair of the dog
rev billy and the stop shopping choir
extra action marching band
tribal rhythm
and any jams at mulitude of camps, mine was at vision quest in the middle of the day with the doobie's Black Water with guitars and banjo

there is plenty of other music at BM, you just need to find it. I agree there is alot, maybe too much trance, race, and electronica, but there is also much more. Just got to find it, it can get hard to find what you are looking for there

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antron
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Post by antron » Sun Sep 14, 2003 10:54 pm

i saw hothouse flowers a couple of nights at paddy mirage

the little irish pub on the playa was about as far away from a rave as you can get

Flux
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Post by Flux » Sun Sep 14, 2003 10:56 pm

I saw Lost at Last on Friday at the Church of WOW, and saw that they were playing again on Saturday night, but was too busy running around like a chicken with its head cut off looking for an injured friend to stop and party.

Lost at Last is one of my favorite bands, and the WOW concert was wonderful!

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Angry Butterfly
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Post by Angry Butterfly » Sun Sep 14, 2003 10:57 pm

I was actully surprised at how LITTLE rave stuff I saw. Like I said, I was at Opulent Temple of Kaos, but I see those guys all year and have a choice of like 4 great raves any given weekend, so I guess I might have intentionaly sought other stuff out, I spent only ONE night on the playa at anything remotely like a rave. It reminded me more of a carnival most of the time. One of my favorite memories was when I was out with 3 "Raver" friends, and we danced to "Ring of Fire" and "Sweet Home Alabama" at thunderdome! One of my best friends in the world was with me ( the guy who introduced me to the "rave" scene, ironicly ) And I knew we had both grown up on country music. We Freed our inner rednecks that night, and it felt great!
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

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Post by Flon » Mon Sep 15, 2003 12:40 pm

ragnar1963 wrote:"No breath, nothing "human", nothing to engage the mind. "

It's music for DANCING. Can't get much more human than that. Don't deny the body, celebrate it!
Don't get me wrong, I love to dance. Swing dancing, Cajun dancing, tango, and I've been told by more than one person that I was the best waltzer that they knew. Dancing at its best is an interaction between dancer and musician. I just find it difficult to interact with a tape loop or drum machine.

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Angry Butterfly
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Post by Angry Butterfly » Mon Sep 15, 2003 12:55 pm

antrony wrote:i saw hothouse flowers a couple of nights at paddy mirage
HOLY S*IT! HOW DID I MISS THAT??? I saw the paddy mirage, it was awesome, but I would have loved to see that show, I used to love those guys! I am so looking at the schedule next year.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

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Angry Butterfly
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Post by Angry Butterfly » Mon Sep 15, 2003 1:01 pm

[/quote]
I just find it difficult to interact with a tape loop or drum machine.[/quote]

Whoah, I really need to take you to a real rave, I am totaly serious, a great DJ can read the crowd and totly intereact with it, even though the music is pre recorded, a good dj plays the tables like an instument and really gets the crowd going, it's spiritual, it realy is, I have been to so called raves with music like you described, and it is a joke, they are not real raves, it is like waching a 5th grade band recital instead of the cronos quartet, NOT THE SAME THING!
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

ragnar1963
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Post by ragnar1963 » Mon Sep 15, 2003 5:09 pm

"Dancing at its best is an interaction between dancer and musician. I just find it difficult to interact with a tape loop or drum machine."

Good point. For me dance music is about immersing myself in a big sonic wash, a sensory overstimulus. Trance music is pretty good at doing this; the relentless mechanized pulse can be irritating, or it can be something to surrender blissfully to.

twist
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Post by twist » Mon Sep 15, 2003 8:44 pm

Angry Butterfly wrote:
I just find it difficult to interact with a tape loop or drum machine.[/quote]

Whoah, I really need to take you to a real rave, I am totaly serious, a great DJ can read the crowd and totly intereact with it, even though the music is pre recorded, a good dj plays the tables like an instument and really gets the crowd going, it's spiritual, it realy is![/quote]

Whoo-hoo!! Rave vs. "real" music!!

My only complaint about the rave camps is that some of 'em START at 6 in the frickin' morning. I'm sure that the three friends of the DJ want to hear it really badly, but what about the few thousand neighbors within earshot? You can't just blast spiritual experiences at people.

This all reminds me of a little story...

We camped rightnextdoor to a psytrance camp (the slightly less retarded cousin of goa trance) in 2000. 24 hours a day they played psytrance to a crowd of absolutely zero. I'm exaggerating there. There was the DJ... and maybe a dust devil.

Anyway, morning, noon, and night the psytrance played. After a few days of this, we were interrupted even further during breakfast. One fellow was working on some scaffolding to hold up some black light tapestries. All of a sudden, he throws his hammer down on the boards and screams, "can you please TURN OFF THE FUCKING MUSIC!?!?"

Our whole camp cheered.

Other than that, I heard more variety this year than before. It's not too tough, just keep walking til you hear something better or play it yourself.

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Post by The Bass » Mon Sep 15, 2003 9:54 pm

warning: rehashed argument from old eplaya ahead...

there are always a lot of posts asking for "variety" in the music that djs play at bm -- why can't we hear more james taylor? more elvis costello? more lawrence welk? more sly & the family stone? etc.

i think there's something different about electronic music, though - at least there ought to be, in the hands of a great dj...

and that's that the dj is _creating something new_ out of the beats, instead of just playing something someone else has already created.

now, at burningman this takes on some special significance, imho.

for me at least, the spirit of the event is for all of us to be giving something of ourselves to each other, not bringing something someone else created, whose meaning has already been determined in the broader culture.

of course there are uses for prerecorded pop music at BRC. i don't actually support banning it.

but the "real thing", for me, is something that happens live in the moment, that's shared by the community.

live music does that. good dj's playing electronic music can do that. dj's playing recognizable music by artists who aren't at the event...well...you can get that anywhere. not the same thing.

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psytrance

Post by themessenger » Tue Sep 16, 2003 9:04 am

Yeah Angry Butterfly, you gotta pioint about those psytrance-heads they think its the only music there is, and that every one wants to hear it 24/7 out of a huge sound system. Back in 1999 it was literaly the only music on the playa, that was back when I used to like it. Since then though, electronica on the playa has become more diverse, but right now nubreaks seem to be the flavor of the moment, which is good for me since I am a breaks dj. House seemed to be out in force this year, which I found refreshing. Thank you, Pinky's and Deep End. By the way the sunrise from atop that scaffolding was AMAZING!

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Angry Butterfly
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Post by Angry Butterfly » Tue Sep 16, 2003 2:02 pm

HEY! I AM ANGRY BUTTERFLY! Someone tried to quote me and it got all mest up, I AM THE ONE WHO IS INTO PSYTRANCE! I camped at opulent tempple of kaos! People dug our shit cuz we stopped, we chilled the music down around 4 or 5 and by 6 it was pretty much over! It was hilarious to listen to all the ravers in our camp (who are hardcore psy trancers in real life) bitch about Trance village not shutting down till noon. Me, I PERSONALY CAN LISTEN TO PSYTRANCE ALL DAY AND ALL NIGHT, but the same thing turns my sweet natured husband into evilbitchboyfromhell. Wheras Phish does the same thing to me. I swear if he makes it out next year he is going to camp far, far away from me. He wants to start "Dangerous Musical Instument Camp" and build a glass harmonica made of differently tuned grinding wheels.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

Flon
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Post by Flon » Wed Sep 17, 2003 8:56 am

Angry Butterfly wrote:He wants to start "Dangerous Musical Instument Camp" and build a glass harmonica made of differently tuned grinding wheels.
Now THIS is what we seriously need more of!

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