Temple Burn Protocol

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.
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cenglewood
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Temple Burn Protocol

Post by cenglewood » Tue Sep 07, 2004 9:37 am

My one negative experience at burning man was at the temple burn. My friends and I were standing just in front of the temple bus (we assume by its appearance), and they were understandably very emotionally involved in the burn. It became quickly clear to me that they had some very specific ideas about the reverence that was due to the event and that these were (unwritten ?) rules not known to everyone around us.

People on the bus started shouting into the crowds of people around us, telling them to stop drumming, stop using laser pointers, stop having conversations, be more respectful, etc. Needless to say, the shouting didn't add to the reverence of the occasion. Some of those shouted at didn't take it kindly, and in one case, two women started an insult war that was very unpleasant. Meanwhile we heard people bemoaning the passing of "the good old days" of burning man. My friends and I just stood there awkwardly trying not to get caught in the cross-fire of anger.

So my questions are:

(1) what is the protocol for the temple burn?
(2) why didn't everyone know this protocol? If respect for the event is as important as it seemed to the people on the bus, how can they make this widely known *before* the event?
(3) what was the right thing to do at that moment?

comments welcome,
-anne

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Post by Burlap » Tue Sep 07, 2004 5:11 pm

These temple people take themselves way too seriously. Always a nice structure and burn - but get over yourselves and your forced symbolism, and ESPECIALLY don't shame others into your mindset. I'm glad it burns - but that's what it is to me- just a big fucking burn!!!

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olivia
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Post by olivia » Tue Sep 07, 2004 6:54 pm

being told how to react sucks. granted the laser pointers were stupid and annoying, and if i never hear a drum circle again it will be too soon, but if you're emotional and in the moment it is stupid to focus on what other people are doing and concern yourself with modifying their behaviour. you cannot force people to have the same experience as you.

the nazi chill mindset really got my goat this year and this is a great example of it. not everyone comes to "be spiritual," not everyone thinks ohming is the greatest thing since sliced bread, not everyone reacts to a giant temple burning with reverent silence. why should anyone be forced to react and act in certain ways for the comfort of others who could be focusing on themselves and investing in their own experience instead of other people? why do some feel the need to control the speech and actions of others when they are doing no harm to anybody?

if the temple crew wish to control the reactions to their burn they should restrict attendance by making it an invite only event somewhere other than burning man.

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Datura
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Post by Datura » Tue Sep 07, 2004 7:53 pm

I really think there's a difference between taking a piece of art which is intended to be a serious occasion, with a memorial overtone and having a drum circle (which while I respect, isn't really so much my thing)...and taking that *same* piece of art and shining you fucking laser pointers, and playing your boonsa boonsa fucking ravermobile music at it.

I had a very negative experience prior to the actual burn, with people around me, but I chose rather than shouting at them to save the write up for when I got home, and to encourage a sense of respect. No, I'm not going to demand you stay silent, but I am going to say that at least in my world, I would prefer people had a good sense of what this temple (or any piece of art you are observing, or observig the burn of) means to its creator, and try to remain within that mindset.

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Post by DangerMouse » Tue Sep 07, 2004 8:27 pm

Basic temple burn protocol.

When the temple burns, it tends to be about a sense of loss. A celebration of something/someone that is no longer physically in your life.

For example, the person camped next to me intended to celebrate the passing of his brother from a brain tumor. I respect that greatly. He obviously missed his brother, and the temple was not just another burn to him.

Granted I'm not out to tell someone how to celebrate the temple burn. To be honest I missed it this year due to my travel schedule. I wish I could have been there for the temple, but alas was not.

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Post by Angry Butterfly » Tue Sep 07, 2004 8:56 pm

I gotta confess I was really upset at a woman being loud and obnoxious at the temple burn, but I kept my mouth shut. She was very Loud, very obnoxious and my husband and I needed to move away from her. I get sentimental at the burns, and I didnt want to listen to some drunk bitch. I get enogh of that in "real" life. I tryed to deal with it by telling myself that she has a horrible job in real life, and then pretended that she was in reality, Condeleeza Rice. When we finaly got away from her some amatur belly dancer was playing the finger symbols, badly, and it actualy hurt my ears. I shouldnt complain, since those two things and getting creeped out by a guy early in the week were really my only low points, of the whole time I was out there, but it really seems there are better times and ways to draw attention to your self.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.

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Post by minimalistik » Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:49 am

how about the people furthur in front of that temple bus. we were sitting up there and had a group of 4 people refuse to sit down. they were in the 3rd row and a thousand of us were sitting behind them. people begged and pleaded with them to sit but they refused. they blocked hundreds of us from seeing the actual temple at all. They said it was for spiritual reasons but they also were drinking from a gallon jug of wine and smoking a joint. These people lacked any respect for the thousands that came to watch.

people just dont seem to understand that we all need to work together so we can all enjoy an event. It got to the point that people were ready to trample these 4 and leave them for dead. I just hope that the karma gets them back for us all. In the future if you want to stand than go stand behind the sittin people.

Why is sitting important? well, i always get to the burn early so i can see. If the people in front of me sit, i sit. We all see. If everyone stands, I stand, and i stand 6'9" so all you people behind me get fucked.

and fuck that temple bus.....why does a three story bus need to be so close to the temple burn that is blocks others who didnt drive there with a stereo and full bar.

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Madrone
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everyone has their own unique experience

Post by Madrone » Wed Sep 08, 2004 8:35 am

Its tricky, I go to the temple to do magic, and focus on what I placed in the temple earlier. What ever I am working on. I surrendered to what happens around me at the Burn, as its meant to be exactly as it is.

A drunk woman, clinging to my arm, saying to me "the steeple is going to fall on us, fall on us", kissing me with her stinking perfumed self when I assured her it would not fall on us. People bitching at the crowd for whatever reasons. A drunk man harrassing us. Its all part of the bizarre mix of Burning Man. I still felt moved at the temple, with all these outside distractions. I looked into the sky, with the silver kites flying in the night breeze. I see how vast the stars go on for, and how truely tiny I am in all of this. I see a large group of people coming together in our humaness. The village idiots, the lonely man. We are all connected. The more I open the more accepting I become of myself and all others around me.

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Post by iamtonynyc » Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:02 am

would all of you moaning complaining winers give me a break. theres miles and miles of space out there around the temple. if you want to reflect on your thoughts, be by yourself away from the drum circles go some where else and watch it burn and quit your crying.

everyone has their views on how an "ideal burn " SHOULD be, but if you dont take burningman for what it is your fooling youself. :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

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Re: everyone has their own unique experience

Post by meander » Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:09 pm

Madrone wrote:Its tricky, I go to the temple to do magic, and focus on what I placed in the temple earlier. What ever I am working on. I surrendered to what happens around me at the Burn, as its meant to be exactly as it is.

A drunk woman, clinging to my arm, saying to me "the steeple is going to fall on us, fall on us", kissing me with her stinking perfumed self when I assured her it would not fall on us. People bitching at the crowd for whatever reasons. A drunk man harrassing us. Its all part of the bizarre mix of Burning Man. I still felt moved at the temple, with all these outside distractions. I looked into the sky, with the silver kites flying in the night breeze. I see how vast the stars go on for, and how truely tiny I am in all of this. I see a large group of people coming together in our humaness. The village idiots, the lonely man. We are all connected. The more I open the more accepting I become of myself and all others around me.
very nice Madrone :)
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Post by bradtem » Wed Sep 08, 2004 3:28 pm

It's a hard call. The temple burn is the art project of David Best and his large group of volunteers. They have a vision for it. People drumming or shining lasers or playing their own music are saying "look at me" and modifying the artists' work to get attention to themselves. Some art projects are meant to be interactive in this way, in that each participant adds to it and others appreciate these additions. Some are interactive in other ways (the Temple is). Some are not interactive at all. When you say, "What I want to do should overshadow what the artists wanted" I don't think it's a great message. I have had people come and write things on my photos. That's horrible and this has some similarities. (On the other hand, when I am out chanting "Save the Man" I expect you to interact and either join or oppose me.)

I also encountered a number of won't-sit-down folks in spite of (and perhaps eventually because of) tremendous pressure from those behind to sit and let everybody enjoy the event.

If anybody knows the names of these spectators -- I took some pictures -- I would highly appreciate having it, so I can arrange some karmic balancing.

Image

And this couple at the burn were almost as bad.
Image

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lemanczyk
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temple burn

Post by lemanczyk » Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:05 pm

I was almost directly in front of the temple for the burn, and standing in the back with the other standing people. But there was this guy standing near the front of seated people and it got ugly. The people sitting and some near me standing were going off on this guy. I was pretty embarrassed by it all. Yeah, the guy should have either sat down or moved to the back like any sensible person, but to go off on the guy like that for so long.
I had to say something to at least defend the guy to the people around me, I told them about my knee surgery that I had recently and how it hurts to sit. It’s hard to sit for that long without being able to stretch. Also, the people sitting and that were yelling at the guy, eventually stood themselves once it started burning.
So please people, please don’t go off on people that aren’t acting like you want them. Yeah that guy standing in front of you pissed you off, but your yelling at him ruined it for me. Lets try to be more understanding of other people, and try not to be so angry.
Other than that, I thought most people were very respectful out at the temple and yes that burn tends to be more reflective without all the lasers, techno music, etc… that’s at the Man burn.

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Dork
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Post by Dork » Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:08 pm

Very minor gripe.. I drove my mutant up early and parked where the other cars were at the back of the temple, well behind the line of people. I had one ranger come up and ask me to move back 10 feet, but also told me that I can feel free to tell him to fuck off. I was a little confused, but moved back anyway. 5 minutes later another ranger came up and told me I had to move back another 100 feet! Sort of where the other cars were back there, but not exactly there because she didn't want a "line of cars". Ugh. Ok, I move back. Shortly thereafter 10 more cars came in and parked in a line in front of me, roughly where I had been before. No more rangers came to tell them to move, so I just stayed there and walked up when the burn started.

A little consistency would be nice. For the man burn it was pretty clear where we were supposed to park. Far enough back that we weren't blocking anyone, but still close enough that we could get a good view.

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Post by Hotspur » Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:10 pm

The problem, Iamtony, is that it's not always easy to tell what sort of person you're sitting next to when you start.

This year, I was at about 3:00 (from the Temple) and in the middle of a great crowd -- quiet, respectful, engaged, but not without a sense of humor (pretty close to the bagpiper who played, after "Amazing Grace" and "Danny Boy", "Iron Man.")

Last year, on the other hand, I was in a bunch of people who just wanted to see a big fire. Not that there's anything wrong with that, of course, but it wasn't the experience that i wanted. Of course, by the time I found out, it was too late to move.

It seems to me that if you want to be loud and crazy and party-ish, given the nature of the temple, the one place you SHOULDN'T be is center-front, where most of the ceremonial stuff takes place. To me, that's just common courtesy to the people responsible for the project. Beyond that, I think it's important for everyone to recognize the participatory nature of burning man, and that every piece of art will be appreciated in unexpected ways.

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Post by geekster » Wed Sep 08, 2004 4:24 pm

I suppose for me it is a matter of reverence. Many people put some most powerful stuff in that temple. It was obvious they had a lot of pain they needed to burn. I think celebration might be due when it is all consumed, but for me to celebrate before the burn would be to somehow belittle the sorrow and the burdens they have loaded into it. I remained hushed and seated but felt no need to force my beliefs onto my neighbors. I am not the police and maybe that behavior is part of the art. Like any other piece of art, there may be some parts of it you like, and some parts you don't, but there it is, warts and all. Like us, it is imperfect. I loved the burn and had a wonderful time.
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Post by bradtem » Wed Sep 08, 2004 5:11 pm

Our particular won't-sit-down couple at the Temple Burn were astounding. In fact, it's clear that the more that those around them (all of whom were sitting, for 30 rows back of them as well as those in front of them) begged and pleaded and chanted for them to sit, the more resolved they were to stand. It wasn't a physical disability. They just felt that because they got there first they deserved to stand.

I participated in taunting them. In fact, I did it creatively -- had the whole crowd laughing, with me and at them. And we tried polite requests first. Usually comedy can diffuse things, give them a chance to admit they were wrong and sit down. But for some, the more they refused the polite requests at first, the more resolved they are to resist all pressure later because otherwise they would be admitting they were wrong and rude. The rangers stopped a guy who went up to talk to them, but didn't stop him. I guess I can understand them not wanting to get involved, I wonder if they had a policy on this.

But as a result my pictures of the temple burn look like this:
Image

(Along with our standing spectators another couple parked their art-motorcycle with antlers in the 5th row and stood next to it. I realize after the crowd formed it would be tough (but not too tough, this crowd would have easily parted to let them get the bike out) to move it, but they should not have brought a vehicle to the front rows in the first place.)

For me, he was right in front of the core of the temple, but the crowd wanted to sit and once the burn started my own sense of decorum prevented me from standing or jostling to get out of there. I just couldn't conceive he would not be convinced to sit when all before and behind him were sitting. If somebody knows his name, let me know so I can contact him.

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Fuck the laser pointer Nazis

Post by pachimichanga » Wed Sep 08, 2004 6:52 pm

I'd like to extend a final and heartfelt FUCK YOU to the self styled laser pointer Nazis who accosted me near the Porta Potties a few hours after the temple burn. This year was my first Burning Man and I found it to be a truly transcendent experience, with the exception of the run-in I had with these assholes on the last night. I was quietly amusing myself with a laser pointer on the ground when of these guys asked me if I was one of the people who'd been training a pointer on the temple. Innocently (and after three days in BRC somewhat absent mindedly) I replied something like "Yeah me and about 50 other people". This guy, who stood about six-four, immediately grabbed the wrist of the hand I was holding the pointer in. Shocked, I told him to get his fucking hand off me. He then launched into the most insulting in-my-face tirade, calling me a prick and telling me he was going to "haunt my dreams".

At least two or three other guys appeared and joined in (I've no idea if they were together or not). One of these vigilantes likened my heinous crime to desecrating a funeral, implying that I, alone, had ruined the event for every other single person there, and asking "Didn't you hear the announcement asking people to stop" (only afterward did I realize how ridiculous a question this was, at Burning Man where there is no central organization or PA). So shocked was I by the vitriolic nature of the attack from these people (in all seriousness it felt like it got very, very close to physical violence. I have no doubt that's what they wanted), that for a while I attempted to appease them, figuring I really must have really done
something wrong. But they were not interested in talking, or "educating" someone they clearly regarded as scum, only in insulting me. Ultimately I stood my ground and told them to fuck off. But it was a very unpleasant moment.

Now, it's true that I had joined in with the other people pointing at the temple, however my pointer is a cheap piece of crap bought in Hong Kong and it didn't work very well anyway, so I gave up after about 30 seconds. But at no point was I aware of anyone around me getting upset about me or others doing this, nor was I asked to stop by anyone. Perhaps had I known that it was going to upset certain people I would have thought twice. I'm not some sort of clueless tourist -- although it was my first time at BM I'm a sensitive, open minded individual. I wasn't drunk, clowning, shouting, or showing insensitivity to those around me who were clearly involved in a deeply spiritual moment. I stayed and watched the burn till about 10 minutes after they finally pulled down the tenacious superstructure.

This really does raise the issue of what, exactly, this temple burn is supposed to be about if people are going to become so enraged when others don't follow their "spiritual" dogma. During my trial by the Porta Potties, one of the LPN brigage asked me if I'd visited the temple, and in fact I'd spent at least two hours there the afternoon of the burn. A lot of the stuff people had left there was very moving, and I've no doubt for those commemorating a loss the burn can be very meaningful. However, I also saw messages like "Thanks for the great sex" and "Burn Bush in 04". Would these people be setting themselves up for similiar
vilification?

However, another issue is, what's so fuckin' offensive about laser pointers anyway? OK, so apparently some people find them intrinsically annoying, but isn't one of the most amazing things about Burning Man the, er, LIGHT? Now I'm not saying that a few little colored dots playing on the side of the temple is in any way meant to be some incredible sight, but, really, why is that so fucking disrespectful? Shitting in the temple would be disrespectful. Changing or defacing people's messages would be disrespectful. But playing a little light on the side of the structure? Is that really so bad? Can anyone tell me why, exactly?

It seems to me that the non-denominational nature of the temple burn is going to mean it ALWAYS means different things to different people. Some are going to weep and wail, others are going to party. It's just the way it is. If you want rules with your religious ceremonies, go and join a cult. Sure, the temple burn is an impressive event and an opportunity to indulge your spiritual nature if you want to, but judging from the other postings here about this issue there are a lot of "spiritual" people who are
actually "assholes" who want to dicate to others how they should behave.

I hate religious zealots of all stripes, and these people were no different in my mind to any others. I'll be there next year with a bigger, better pointer. When you see it on the side of the temple, think of me.

And maybe next year, those who want to impose their views on others should enjoy the temple burn from a particularly privileged position. From the inside.

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Pictures of "offenders"

Post by pachimichanga » Wed Sep 08, 2004 6:54 pm

BTW, I'd just like to say that the McCarthyesque posting of temple burn "offenders" here is particularly pathetic.

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Post by bradtem » Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:08 pm

If these folks went to blows you have a right to complain, but I guess I don't see this line about suggesting those who want to impose their views on others should burn in the temple.

What they were angry about is they wanted to see the temple burn in the way that David and the other builders of the temple wanted to present it, a solemn event with music they selected. You -- and the 30 others with lasers -- were modifying their work and presentation against their will, and that bothered some people. You were the one forcing your own vision of the burn by actually modifying somebody else's artistic vision. All they were doing was complaining, if too angrily.

Don't get me wrong, there are many things which people take too seriously to which some fun modification is appropriate. But usually not one-time things like the temple burn, where people have slaved in the heat for weeks for a particular artistic vision. Would you defend playing loud music on another sound system because their music was too much of a downer?

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Temple burn

Post by pachimichanga » Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:27 pm

Well, of course I am being sarcastic when I suggest people should see the burn from the inside (but at least then there'd be no room for them to whine about the view).

I take your point about this being an artwork that should not be modified with other people's light. However, that's a totally different argument to laser pointers somehow sullying the spirituality of the event -- or worse, that it is somehow a deliberate display of disrespect directed personally at those who are marking a personal loss with the burn or otherwise engaging in their own special moment. That was clearly the take of the Laser Nazis.

I'll admit to being a little ignorant of the temple burn until now (as I said I was a first timer), and being the sensitive individual that I am I will probably keep my head down next year out of genuine respect for those who are marking a personal loss of some kind. (Or I might skip out altogether to avoid Monday's three hour exodus to the road).

However, perhaps it would behoove the organizers of the temple burn to make it a little clearer exactly what THEIR vision of this event is, so that we all have some kind of baseline for appropriate behavior. Is is supposed to be an opportunity for a spiritual occasion of whatever kind you choose (hey, for some people getting ripped on tequila IS a spiritual event), or is it specifically supposed to be a certain "type" of event, with particular emphasis on commemoration or personal loss? If you don't tell people what type of party you're throwing, they won't know what to bring.

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Post by bradtem » Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:32 pm

In the past temple burns -- there have been 5 now, I guess, everybody just knew. Everybody visited the temple before, saw what it meant, and watched with a quiet respect, even when the name of the temple was the "Temple of Joy."

So since it worked all those times they probably felt they didn't need to have an instruction sheet. Just as I wouldn't have felt the need to have a "Don't make marks on my art" instruction sheet for my own project until somebody came up and wrote on it.

Nor should it have been necessary to try and convince the spectator who was standing up in front of all the sitting people that this was not a very community oriented position, I guess.

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Post by Badger » Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:34 pm

...my husband and I needed to move away from her.
Ding. Ding. Ding.

Right answer. It's what I did when the folks on the ass bus started their annual routine.
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Instruction sheet

Post by pachimichanga » Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:57 pm

The term "instruction sheet" implies a set of strict rules. Isn't that what the fuck people come to Burning Man to get away from? Doesn't that smack of organized religion? Maybe that's why the Laser Pointer Nazis wouldn't seem out of place in some extreme Christian Youth boot boy group.

I don't think direct do's and don'ts are required -- just a better job of communicating the general desired tone of the event. Perhaps suggesting that, if you want to be boisterous you might consider remaining further away from the temple. I was not aware of any such suggestions. Certainly in the program the references to "30,000 people Ohm-ing together" or somesuch seemed kind of tongue in cheek in its wording, so despite the obviously emotional nature of a lot of the offerings I saw in the temple itself, I guess I still thought of it as just a big and very impressive torching of a great piece of art.

I'm curious, however. Have the actual creators of the temples expressed particular upset over certain types of behavior? Have they said explicitly they don't want laser pointers shined on it? THAT would get my ear, rather than the presumptive enforcement of the Self-Righteous Brothers.

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Post by Tancorix » Wed Sep 08, 2004 8:42 pm

I thought the laser pointers were fucking annoying more than anything else...they do nothing to add to the temple, all people do is wave them around and make idiots of themselves. But hey, it's a free country, you can wave your little laser pointer anywhere you want...but if you shine it towards my eyes I will knock it out of your hand which is what I did to an asshole who made that mistake twice. I'm not going to suffer retinal damage because of someone's carelessness. Your freedom ends where mine begins.

Anyway I feel the temple burn should be a bit more reverential. It's a temple...not the man. It's got a lot of symbolism there, and I've put a lot of things in there like Tallinn's last pieces of irridescent glass and other things the past couple of years. But with a crowd that size it's impossible to control everything...so putting up with a couple of yahoos is part of the experience. It's a reminder that perfection is so hard to attain...but don't let the quest for perfection spoil an otherwise very memorable and beautiful experience.

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Post by pachimichanga » Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:22 pm

You've summed up the issue in a nutshell there.

What, exactly, does "It's a temple" mean though? Outside of the context of some sort of recognized religious structure, does it mean anything at all? Or does it mean everything? Or is it just a very elaborate and flammable structure made from offcuts of industrial wood?

And without any religious reference points, who is to say what is appropriate and what isn't? Not all religions express their devotion in the same manner as the major (predominantly white and conservative) Christian churches, so who is to say that whoopin and hollerin isn't more appropriate than being still and silent? Just because you're having a good time doesn't mean you're not necessarily hurting, remembering, commemorating, honoring. Ever been to an Irish wake? And who's to say that the burn shouldn't be rejoiced over as a ceremony of renewal? The great cycle of creation and destruction? It can mean so, so many things and as such there can be no "appropriate" behavior.

The majority view here seems to be that we should behave as if we're at a Sunday service in a Christian church. This is a typical white, middle class, conservative stance. If this is the thinking of the people who attend Burning Man -- arguably the most radical event in the entire U.S. -- then no wonder there's such an extreme right wing prick in the White House. How sad.

Wake up and stop being sheep. Think for your fucking selves and don't just adopt a knee jerk reaction cuz the next person is doing it.

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Post by Hotspur » Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:53 pm

For what it's worth, I think that part of the reason there's a problem with "mood" building up to the Temple burn is that unless you're front and center, it doesn't seem like anything is happening.

The wonderful opera singer from Death Guild sang at abotu 9. It was more than half an hour from when she finished until the temple went up. Despite the fact that the crowd I was with (at the right-hand side) was polite and mostly attentive, we couldn't tell a thing was going on for that entire half hour.

Yeah. People got bored. Started acting up. What do you expect?

I think they could solve a large part of the laser-pointer problems simply by having the talking part of the ceremony before the singing, so that the period of time when spectactors feel an obligation to be quiet is smaller.

Let's face it: it's not reasonable to expect the crowd to be silent for half an hour. Not going to happen. Setting yourself up for failure.

But if the talking-part of the ceremony happened before the singing, and the singing went directly into the fire, then the singing would serve as a "okay, pay attention now" moment and a lot of people would shut up and behave for five minutes while they got the temple going.

As for pachimichanga, grow up. Yeah, you were obnoxious -- intentionally or not -- and pissed some people off. They weren't rude about it. So you're going to be more of an asshole next year because a few people were rude to you?

Grow up. Just because you're free to be an idiot with your laser pointer doesn't mean you're not an idiot. Coming back with a bigger one just makes you a bigger idiot.

pachimichanga
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 6:07 pm
Location: San Fran

Post by pachimichanga » Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:59 pm

To Hotspur:

You totally miss the fucking point and are obviously incapabable of entering into this discussion at the level I'm trying to bring it to.

So my laser pointer pissed you off? Boo fucking hoo.

Are you even remotely capable of asking yourself the question why? Analyzing what it is in your narrow little belief system that is so affronted by this?

If anyone needs to grow up it's people like you who aren't able to do any independent thinking whatsoever.

PantyMechanix
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Oct 14, 2003 9:29 pm

Post by PantyMechanix » Wed Sep 08, 2004 10:07 pm

fuck the pointers, what about all the bikes 20 feet from the inner circle. coudn't even rest my weary feet from saturday without having a bike seat up my ass. We need bike corrals furthur back for next year.

User avatar
joya
Posts: 65
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 9:40 am

Post by joya » Wed Sep 08, 2004 10:16 pm

First,

pachimichanga I am sorry to hear about your experience.

and, Bradtem , who are YOU to enact "karma" on anyone? Think about it.

Now, my experience of the temple burn... Let me just say that I had NO problem with the laser lights on the temple. When I initially saw the lights I thought they were part of the "show"... and I perceived them to be "spirit" lights flying and flickering around the temple belfry (or whatever you'd call the upper main structure). Perception is everything -- and each to their own. I thought it was cool. (And it gave me something to watch, as I sat with the rest of y'all for that looong half hour...)

What I disliked, however, was the vibe from many of the people. What happened to the love/respect element that was present almost every other moment (for me, anyways) at Burning Man???

I got their early enough to get a seat that pleased me. Me and my companion were sitting comfortably, just chilling. More people came and took their spaces. ... and then, like five minutes before 9:00, a gaggle of younger chicks invaded. Five or six of them decided that they were going to sit EXACTLY where I was. Litterally, one girl sat practically on my lap. When I scooted back (into a puddle of spilled Bloody Mary), she had the gall to stretch back into a semi-prone position. I refected on my agitation and tried to view this rudeness as a lesson. Who am I to "claim" space, or judge, or whatever. But, fuck, who the fuck were these girls who were so oblivious to others and respecting personal space.

The crowd also became quite hostile (sp? I dunno, I'm tired, can't spell)... when some dude behind me was yelling out offerings of candy. A lot of yelling, shushing, and "shut the fuck up!" ensued. Pretty poor display of human nature.

The burn itself was beautiful... but I have to say, that that night was the low point of my otherwise amazing burning man experience.

... just my two cents, again. :)

peace

joya

User avatar
joya
Posts: 65
Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 9:40 am

Post by joya » Wed Sep 08, 2004 10:16 pm

First,

pachimichanga I am sorry to hear about your experience.

and, Bradtem , who are YOU to enact "karma" on anyone? Think about it.

Now, my experience of the temple burn... Let me just say that I had NO problem with the laser lights on the temple. When I initially saw the lights I thought they were part of the "show"... and I perceived them to be "spirit" lights flying and flickering around the temple belfry (or whatever you'd call the upper main structure). Perception is everything -- and each to their own. I thought it was cool. (And it gave me something to watch, as I sat with the rest of y'all for that looong half hour...)

What I disliked, however, was the vibe from many of the people. What happened to the love/respect element that was present almost every other moment (for me, anyways) at Burning Man???

I got their early enough to get a seat that pleased me. Me and my companion were sitting comfortably, just chilling. More people came and took their spaces. ... and then, like five minutes before 9:00, a gaggle of younger chicks invaded. Five or six of them decided that they were going to sit EXACTLY where I was. Litterally, one girl sat practically on my lap. When I scooted back (into a puddle of spilled Bloody Mary), she had the gall to stretch back into a semi-prone position. I refected on my agitation and tried to view this rudeness as a lesson. Who am I to "claim" space, or judge, or whatever. But, fuck, who the fuck were these girls who were so oblivious to others and respecting personal space.

The crowd also became quite hostile (sp? I dunno, I'm tired, can't spell)... when some dude behind me was yelling out offerings of candy. A lot of yelling, shushing, and "shut the fuck up!" ensued. Pretty poor display of human nature.

The burn itself was beautiful... but I have to say, that that night was the low point of my otherwise amazing burning man experience.

... just my two cents, again. :)

peace

joya

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