Interacting with official misinformation?

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.
User avatar
Canoe
Posts: 2989
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:01 pm

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Canoe » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:43 pm

sparr wrote:
Bless wrote:Like yelling out that the Man is going to burn early, on Wednesday. Or that you-know-who is playing at the Trash Fence.
How would you feel about someone who missed the man or temple burn because they got official info that it was happening later? Just want to see how far your dedication to the sanctity of misinformation goes.

It could be that your friend heard someone incorrectly, or remembered it incorrectly, or the teller had been in the heat too long and said it incorrectly, but don't discount the possibility that the teller decided that telling your friend the incorrect time was in the greater good of everyone else going to the Burn because your friend did or said something that made the teller believe your friend was an asshole.
"My favorite people are the people of the dessert", said Lawrence as he picked up his fork.
.
... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.

User avatar
Bless
Posts: 1170
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:43 pm
Burning Since: 2012
Location: District of Columbia

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Bless » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:54 am

sparr wrote:
FlyingMonkey wrote:
sparr wrote:I missed the [start of the] temple burn this year due to a dozen non-official people telling me it happened on the same schedule as the man burn. If that had been disseminated from an official source, it would have caught a lot more people than just me.

You sir are an idiot. Good day!

Can you clarify, does going to see the temple burn when people told me it would burn make me an idiot? Or are you reacting to my prediction that more people would miss it if that info came from an official/central source?


I still thinking you're missing the boat on this one. It's called radical self-reliance. If you radically rely on someone else's misinformation, and are successfully duped, then, yes, you are at best gullible and at worst a complete fucking idiot.

If someone tells you, in all earnestness, that the event was way better last year, and that you should definitely sell your ticket this year... FOR GOD'S SAKE, PLEASE TAKE THEIR ADVICE.
FUCK YOU, I'M A WIZARD. FUCK YOU, I'M A SHARK.

User avatar
sparr
Posts: 334
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 11:01 am
Burning Since: 2015

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby sparr » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:32 am

Bless wrote:I still thinking you're missing the boat on this one. It's called radical self-reliance. If you radically rely on someone else's misinformation, and are successfully duped, then, yes, you are at best gullible and at worst a complete fucking idiot.

Bullshit. You're probably close to right in terms of misinformation from peers, but that's irrelevant here. This thread is about *official* misinformation.

Do you practice radical self-reliance on the subject of the location of the event? Are you visiting the playa, or flying over, a month early to make sure the city is where you were told it would be?

Do you practice radical self-reliance by checking every day if ticket sales have started, rather than relying on BMORG's publications listing the sale dates?

Do you practice radical self-reliance in the gate line, sending runners ahead to check if the line has been stealthily converted into a loop to trap you or the gate has been closed, or do you trust that the gate volunteers have managed to keep the line moving towards the gate and that BMIR will let you know if the gate gets closed for more than an hour or two?

Of course not. We all rely on information from the organization being legitimate, in dozens or more decisions we make along the way and at the event. No one cross-checks everything they see on the official website.

Slightly less universal example: Most people don't practice radical self reliance with regards to the services the org has committed to providing or allowing to exist at the event. If ice sales were canceled, or all the fresh/grey/black water truck services were turned away from the event, that would be a huge problem if the org had lied to everyone about them still being available.
If you want to make a reply about my personality instead of about what this thread is about, don't clutter this thread, post over here instead.

User avatar
Bless
Posts: 1170
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:43 pm
Burning Since: 2012
Location: District of Columbia

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Bless » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:13 pm

I'm sorry, I must have missed your concrete example of BMORG publishing official misinformation about critical aspects of the event...
FUCK YOU, I'M A WIZARD. FUCK YOU, I'M A SHARK.

User avatar
Admiral Fukkit
Posts: 274
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:44 am
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp I'm going to Hawaii instead

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Admiral Fukkit » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:15 pm

Misinformation is a long standing tradition.
There's even a theme camp called the Bureau of Misinformation.
It's expected that you know to show up just before dark for burns.
When such misinformation comes from "official" sources, that's even funnier.
Years ago, there was a legend of a great Playa Chicken. Whatever went missing or wrong or screwy was always attributed to the Playa Chicken.
It's just the way it is.
If things were all textbook, it'd be boring.

User avatar
Simon of the Playa
Posts: 18146
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:25 pm
Burning Since: 1996
Camp Name: La Guilde des Hashischins
Location: Rochester, Nevada.

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Simon of the Playa » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:19 pm

IMG_6809.JPG
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Frida Be You & Me

User avatar
BBadger
Posts: 5620
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:37 am
Burning Since: 2018
Location: (near) Portland, OR, USA

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby BBadger » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:00 pm

Is this all just hypotheticals or is there a concrete example here to work with? Most officials will not spread misinformation on purpose unless it is obvious enough that most laypersons will understand it. They simply don't want to deal with too many butthurt individuals, and also want to ensure that people will believe them when they actually want to have people abide by certain schedules, etc. It's not worth their reputation to have some goofy joke if they have to deal with people loitering around as a result.

There is also the case where information is kept purposely nebulous in order to not build expectations for exactness. This is not misinformation so much as a means to avoid complaints about promises not kept in a dynamic environment.

In any case, you should take efforts to verify the information you receive, even from official sources. Schedules change due to conditions, printed materials may have been printed well in advance of new information on the ground, and people in official positions may simply make mistakes. These are not cases of misinformation, just the nature of how events unfold.
"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Hate reading my replies? Click here to add me to your plonk (foe) list.

User avatar
sparr
Posts: 334
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 11:01 am
Burning Since: 2015

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby sparr » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:11 pm

BBadger wrote:Is this all just hypotheticals or is there a concrete example here to work with?

The concrete example is Media Mecca including among their many informational flyers a set that said the BMIR location (5:45+Esp) had public wifi. I've been told this was meant as a prank aimed at BMIR by MM, sending a lot of newbies to bother them, rather than just being a prank aimed at the newbies.
If you want to make a reply about my personality instead of about what this thread is about, don't clutter this thread, post over here instead.

User avatar
Bless
Posts: 1170
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:43 pm
Burning Since: 2012
Location: District of Columbia

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Bless » Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:31 am

sparr wrote:
BBadger wrote:Is this all just hypotheticals or is there a concrete example here to work with?

The concrete example is Media Mecca including among their many informational flyers a set that said the BMIR location (5:45+Esp) had public wifi. I've been told this was meant as a prank aimed at BMIR by MM, sending a lot of newbies to bother them, rather than just being a prank aimed at the newbies.


And, how exactly was this detrimental to your burn?
FUCK YOU, I'M A WIZARD. FUCK YOU, I'M A SHARK.

User avatar
BBadger
Posts: 5620
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:37 am
Burning Since: 2018
Location: (near) Portland, OR, USA

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby BBadger » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:01 pm

sparr wrote:The concrete example is Media Mecca including among their many informational flyers a set that said the BMIR location (5:45+Esp) had public wifi. I've been told this was meant as a prank aimed at BMIR by MM, sending a lot of newbies to bother them, rather than just being a prank aimed at the newbies.


I don't really know what the actual situation is regarding that. It may have been a prank. It could have also have been outdated information.

If it was a prank, and it matters to you enough, perhaps write them about it. With enough complaints it will eventually discourage people from attempting it again.
"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Hate reading my replies? Click here to add me to your plonk (foe) list.

User avatar
Eric
Moderator
Posts: 9238
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 9:45 pm
Burning Since: 2003
Camp Name: BRC Weekly
Contact:

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Eric » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:18 pm

sparr wrote:
BBadger wrote:Is this all just hypotheticals or is there a concrete example here to work with?

The concrete example is Media Mecca including among their many informational flyers a set that said the BMIR location (5:45+Esp) had public wifi. I've been told this was meant as a prank aimed at BMIR by MM, sending a lot of newbies to bother them, rather than just being a prank aimed at the newbies.

It was not "meant" as a prank - it was a prank. A joke by members of one org team towards members of another org team. It was not "official". It was certainly not "disinformation", which would be an intentional act to spread lies or incorrect information for some reason other than humor.

From all your posts, I think the issue is that you tend to see things extremely literally, and don't have room for much, if any, nuance in your mind. The problem when you apply that type of thinking to something like Burning Man is that it's pretty much *all* nuance. Nothing happens when it's "supposed" to, that's why there's "playa time": it'll happen when it happens, or somewhere there-abouts. Language is bent: there's not a lot of places where "fuck your Burn" could really mean "have a great fucking Burn" - out there it does. Trying to pin down meanings and reason for everything is futile, for many things they simply don't exist (other than "it seemed fun"). If you really see a joke as "disinformation", I wonder how much of the joy of the Burn you're missing. It kind of makes me sad.
It's a camping trip in the desert, not the redemption of the fallen world - Cryptofishist

Regarding Scammers & Scalpers
Please read above link for all official information.

Eric ShutterSlut
Ass't Editor, BRC Weekly

User avatar
Traveller in Time
Posts: 602
Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2016 11:52 am
Burning Since: 2020
Camp Name: Neon Light Alley (should be: Camp Envy)

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Traveller in Time » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:21 pm

At least one of the DJs at BMIR announced he does not have a password "you idiots"

Apparently he was unhappy by the attention
Dreaming a temporary world improving the default world



Not expressing yourself but embracing all other expressions is The Challenge




...I can make anything I can imagine . . . I just can't make _some_ things happen



Have some Free will

User avatar
Token
Posts: 3480
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 2:55 pm
Burning Since: 2001
Location: Gold Country, CA

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Token » Fri Sep 08, 2017 1:45 pm

Much sand in the vagina about nothing.

maladroit
Posts: 2290
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:37 pm
Burning Since: 2012

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby maladroit » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:25 am

There is free wifi during the Temple burn, which happens at noon on Monday (both of them, they rebuild).

maladroit
Posts: 2290
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:37 pm
Burning Since: 2012

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby maladroit » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:40 am

We should have a competition. I'll call it the "Fewest words to make a happy person's face turn awkwardly confused" Tournament and boy do I have a big winner in mind already!

User avatar
Traveller in Time
Posts: 602
Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2016 11:52 am
Burning Since: 2020
Camp Name: Neon Light Alley (should be: Camp Envy)

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Traveller in Time » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:49 am

The DJs announced that Media Mecca has free private showers open 11 to 3

Overdoing it they also announced free pizza and ice as much as you can carry at MM.

Besides overdoing, this was short before sunrise Friday (one listener assumed, I know at least two :D)
Dreaming a temporary world improving the default world



Not expressing yourself but embracing all other expressions is The Challenge




...I can make anything I can imagine . . . I just can't make _some_ things happen



Have some Free will

User avatar
sparr
Posts: 334
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 11:01 am
Burning Since: 2015

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby sparr » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:20 am

Eric wrote:It was certainly not "disinformation", which would be an intentional act to spread lies or incorrect information for some reason other than humor.

I've never before heard the distinction made that intentionally misleading someone is not disinformation just because the motivation is humor. You seem to be suggesting that lying to people is more-ok when the liar thinks it's funny?
If you want to make a reply about my personality instead of about what this thread is about, don't clutter this thread, post over here instead.

User avatar
Bless
Posts: 1170
Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2013 8:43 pm
Burning Since: 2012
Location: District of Columbia

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Bless » Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:42 pm

sparr wrote: You seem to be suggesting that lying to people is more-ok when the liar thinks it's funny?


You're finally catching on!
FUCK YOU, I'M A WIZARD. FUCK YOU, I'M A SHARK.

User avatar
Sham
Moderator
Posts: 7943
Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2008 2:10 am
Location: The hidden mythical place.....

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Sham » Thu Sep 14, 2017 2:36 pm

Hymie the robot from the TV series Get Smart (1965-1970) took every word spoken to him literally. That's how he was programmed. Using the term "get lost" meant exactly that. Hard to believe this was on over 50 years ago. Seems like yesterday. :shock:
Image

User avatar
BBadger
Posts: 5620
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 10:37 am
Burning Since: 2018
Location: (near) Portland, OR, USA

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby BBadger » Thu Sep 14, 2017 2:41 pm

sparr wrote:I've never before heard the distinction made that intentionally misleading someone is not disinformation just because the motivation is humor. You seem to be suggesting that lying to people is more-ok when the liar thinks it's funny?


I think it's more that pranking people is more excusable because the stakes are not that high. In the case of this free WiFi, the stakes are pretty low: pranking people who, for some reason, feel compelled to go on the internet at the Burn, as well as BMIR having to deal with people making a funny request.

This is not like someone yelling fire in a theater, or even something like sending people to the wrong location or time for a burn. It's more like sending people on a snipe hunt.
"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Hate reading my replies? Click here to add me to your plonk (foe) list.

User avatar
Token
Posts: 3480
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 2:55 pm
Burning Since: 2001
Location: Gold Country, CA

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Token » Thu Sep 14, 2017 6:07 pm

Quien es mas macho?

Free wifi at MM

Or

Daft Punk at trash fence

???

User avatar
Jackass
Posts: 1830
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2010 9:25 pm
Location: way out in left field

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Jackass » Thu Sep 14, 2017 7:15 pm

Token wrote:Quien es mas macho?

Free wifi at MM

Or

Daft Punk at trash fence

???

BTW

Daft Punk at the trash fence was some real shit this year. Thursday night/ Friday morning, I seen it with my own two eyes. It does happen!!
And that is NOT misinformation!
Sooner or later, it will get real strange...

11th Principle: Depussyfication - Keeping Burning Man potentially lethal. Token

User avatar
Admiral Fukkit
Posts: 274
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:44 am
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp I'm going to Hawaii instead

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Admiral Fukkit » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:12 pm

BBadger wrote:
This is not ......
like sending people to the wrong location or time for a burn.

Well no, that's usually much funnier.

User avatar
lucky420
Posts: 7984
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 9:47 am
Burning Since: I'm not sure
Camp Name: Dye with Dignity
Location: Reno, NV

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby lucky420 » Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:57 am

Poor guy, born without a funny bone... :cry:
Oh my god, it's HUGE!

User avatar
Eric
Moderator
Posts: 9238
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 9:45 pm
Burning Since: 2003
Camp Name: BRC Weekly
Contact:

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Eric » Sat Sep 16, 2017 6:42 pm

sparr wrote:You seem to be suggesting that lying to people is more-ok when the liar thinks it's funny?

Not just me. You might want to investigate the terms "satire", "parody", "lampoon"; hell, look up the antics of the "cacophony society" (you know, part of the reason BMan was founded), etc. Humorous "lies" have been part & parcel of the human condition for a long time. The fact you can't see them as humor (funny or not) makes you the outlier, not the jokes.
It's a camping trip in the desert, not the redemption of the fallen world - Cryptofishist

Regarding Scammers & Scalpers
Please read above link for all official information.

Eric ShutterSlut
Ass't Editor, BRC Weekly

User avatar
gaminwench
Posts: 2667
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 11:57 am
Burning Since: 1999
Camp Name: DOTA, EoD, OBOP, Destiny Lounge
Location: Shangri-la

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby gaminwench » Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:07 am

Outlier.
Heh. 8)
"the prophecies of doom were better last year" trilo

User avatar
some seeing eye
Posts: 2607
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 12:06 pm
Burning Since: 1999
Camp Name: Woo
Location: The Oregon

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby some seeing eye » Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:23 am

I think ePlaya is big enough and mature enough to accept more members, especially as its relevance in the social media sphere declines. Maybe an approach is to say "could that better be stated/questioned as -," or "that's not a good idea because of -." Then there is the ADA, which includes the autistic spectrum. Got to love https://www.timesofisrael.com/soldiers- ... -disorder/.
increasing the signal to noise ratio with compassion

User avatar
sparr
Posts: 334
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2015 11:01 am
Burning Since: 2015

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby sparr » Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:56 pm

Eric wrote:The fact you can't see them as humor (funny or not) makes you the outlier, not the jokes.

Once again, you're responding to some "fact" that is not in anything I wrote.

I didn't say, or imply, or give evidence from which you might conclude, that I can't see them as humor, or that I can't see that they are funny.
If you want to make a reply about my personality instead of about what this thread is about, don't clutter this thread, post over here instead.

User avatar
Admiral Fukkit
Posts: 274
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 10:44 am
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp I'm going to Hawaii instead

Re: Interacting with official misinformation?

Postby Admiral Fukkit » Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:41 pm

lucky420 wrote:Poor guy, born without a funny bone... :cry:


Maybe he could get an implant.


Return to “Philosophical Center”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests