Bartering on the playa

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inkyboi
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Bartering on the playa

Post by inkyboi » Mon Aug 02, 2004 5:33 pm

I want to bring GOOD stuff to barter!

It's my first year, so what the heck stands for good barter? Short of a full blown massage parlor and booze, what makes for fun barter? Food? Drink? Toys?

I want to be original (so much for posting for help on here) but functional.

:wink:

Simon said
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Post by Simon said » Mon Aug 02, 2004 5:41 pm

You need to read up on the fact that Burning Man operates as a gift economy and not a barter one....they are very different.

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Badger
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Post by Badger » Mon Aug 02, 2004 5:44 pm

It's my first year, so what the heck stands for good barter? Short of a full blown massage parlor and booze, what makes for fun barter?
Bartering is frowned upon. If you follow through you can expect a goodly amount of shit to fly your way for doing it.
Desert dogs drink deep.

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Stormy
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Post by Stormy » Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:05 pm

For gifts people usually appreciate booze. If they've been at the event since the Saturday before and you arrive much later, you'll be a rockstar if you bring popsicles, ice, unmelted chocolate, fresh strawberries, sushi, etc.

Also having a good mister can make you popular, too.

That being said, the best gifts are original. There may be something entertaining that is uniquely you, that others may enjoy.
Be the change you seek in the world.

dzrtrat67
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Post by dzrtrat67 » Mon Aug 02, 2004 9:39 pm

Inkyboi.... check out my last post to the thread titled "Cumming without my boyfriend"

Too lazy to type it over.... though it belongs here more than there.

Rat

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inkyboi
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Sorry guys

Post by inkyboi » Mon Aug 02, 2004 11:52 pm

Barter....gifting.... okay, sorry about the word choice. Remember, 1st timer here.... go easy on us.

:oops:

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KellY
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Post by KellY » Tue Aug 03, 2004 6:27 pm

There are still those of us out there who think that bartering is fun. Just don't think of it as a money substitute. Trading has it's own charm which should be enjoyed for it's own sake, not to "get good loot" or anything like that. Therefore, bartering is best with rare or unique items that are not necessarily monetarily expensive. Cool rare beads (for instance) make nifty barter items, beer or anything else you can walk into Costco and buy does not.

Alchohol and food make great gifts though...
"Of what use is a philosopher who doesn't hurt anybody's feelings?" -Diogenes

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robbidobbs
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Post by robbidobbs » Tue Aug 03, 2004 6:37 pm

Beer, beer beer, beer
Beer, beer, beer.
Beer, beer, beer, beer,
WE LOVE BEER

Tobacco...if you don't smoke, bring some, unless you're politically opposed. Way good giftey out there.
Spontaneous full body massages. Yep, right there on the dirt.
An ear to hear, a heart to care, and a shoulder to cry on

or
(...heh, heh, heh)

You can hang out with me on Poop Patrol. We give to the Community, and the Community gives back to us ...in SPADES!
I'll be in my blanket fort until further notice.

MissNev
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Post by MissNev » Wed Aug 04, 2004 12:11 pm

This year will mark our 5th anniversary with our bar. We are strictly no barter, and we are fully stocked. That said, we do appreciate "tips." We have received some beautiful artwork on our whitewashed bar (we supply paints, pens, etc.) and some great limericks. We have a guestbook that we appreciate hearing comments in. The full body massage I received a couple of years back was wonderful. A hug goes a long way, but only if well received. We have received generous donations of alcohol, ice, food, and trinkets that we proudly display on the bar. I've never liked the feeling of walking into a place and being asked what I have to barter. When and if I feel inclined to share a gift, the situation usually dictates the gift. Enjoy your first burn and come find The Liver's End.

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Piper
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Post by Piper » Wed Aug 04, 2004 2:51 pm

robbidobbs wrote: Tobacco...if you don't smoke, bring some, unless you're politically opposed. Way good giftey out there.
I took 3 extra cartons of smokes, one of my biggest joys was handing out packs to those who came up asking to bum a cig. I would just reach in my pocket pull out a pack and say here ya go brother/sister. No barter(well may be a hug and info on a good place to habg out after shift), no gift back, just seeing a happy face.
One thing I emulated from a vet was give away what you get, I came back with just 7 items(just counted them) and only saved those because they were purple, patches, or the example of someone's truly honest effort to give something they made, not bought.
Number seven was really special though, it was a lighter with a LNT sticker on it, that I picked up as moop.
Peace
Piper

I said, "Man, I'd like to stay
But I'm bound for glory
I'm on my way
My ride's here...

Warren Zevon RIP

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Fat SAM
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Post by Fat SAM » Wed Aug 04, 2004 4:50 pm

Do you guys think anyone is going to dog me and my wife for bringing hemp neckelaces/anklets/bracelets? We're both worried people are going to think it's hack or something. We really have put a lot of time and love into making them, though, you know? Figure that ought to be worth something....
Thanks to Addis, I had more free time.

burningflyer
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Treasure not moop

Post by burningflyer » Wed Aug 04, 2004 5:35 pm

II enjoy gifting and receiving things that are handcrafted or original.

Over the past several years, I have gifted fluorescent spin art made by my children and myself.

http://www.geocities.com/wagon_train_20 ... index.html

Expecting nothing in return, I like to show my creations and offer them to those who are intrigued and promise to find a home for my gift off the playa.

burningflyer
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Treasure not moop

Post by burningflyer » Wed Aug 04, 2004 5:36 pm

I enjoy gifting and receiving things that are handcrafted or original.

Over the past several years, I have gifted fluorescent spin art made by my children and myself.

http://www.geocities.com/wagon_train_20 ... index.html

Expecting nothing in return, I like to show my creations and offer them to those who are intrigued and promise to find a home for my gift off the playa.

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Tancorix
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Post by Tancorix » Wed Aug 04, 2004 5:52 pm

So you are the one that was behind those beautiful pieces of work? I came across your art in Center Camp last year and as I'm typing this I have some pieces close by. It's beautiful work. I don't know if I got the opportunity to say anything on the playa so I'm doing it now. THANK YOU.

burningflyer
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Center Camp Art

Post by burningflyer » Wed Aug 04, 2004 8:20 pm

Thanks Tancorix,

It has been rewarding for my children and myself to know that our art is enjoyed. A simple creation that provides a memory link to a special time, event, experience. So there you have it Fat SAM. Bring your craftwork, gift it to an admirer, and possibly provide a lasting memory.

And to those who have small art pieces to display and gift. Clear off that bench top at center camp, set up your art and sit by it. talk with peeps who show interest. Give your gift to those who enjoy it . . . the return gift of appreciation lasts a long long time.

I have a small piece of driftwood, waxed to a smooth luster, given by a woman after my offer of an art piece she enjoyed. She humbly said she made them on her ride out to the playa . . . I look at it every day and remember.

MissNev
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Post by MissNev » Wed Aug 04, 2004 9:23 pm

Fat Sam, one of my favorite gifts was from a few years ago. I washed a girl's hair for her and braided it (I figured a way to wash the very, very long hair of my campmates as a gift to them, and people started coming from all over for me to wash them and shave them). The year after that, we held a hair washing/shaving day at our bar...but I digress. Anyway, she was grateful and she made me a beautiful hemp necklace with a Celtic knot charm in the center. I wear it still in the real world, and every year on the Playa. By all means, hand crafted works of art are cherished.

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shitmouse
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Post by shitmouse » Wed Aug 04, 2004 9:26 pm

sushi. hahahaha. cmon man, where do you live, denver?
great idea in theory though.

good tequila, or wine works well. although it's always hard to give away precious tequila. (that's why i give away good vodka..... el ka-bong style)-b
=-=-= \<>/ =-=-=

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Fat SAM
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Post by Fat SAM » Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:39 am

Cool. That makes me feel much better.
Thanks to Addis, I had more free time.

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Dave
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Captain Goddamit is a Sexist Boat Captain

Post by Dave » Sat Aug 07, 2004 3:50 pm

Gifts, trade items, barter goods?
I have yet, after many burns, to figure out the ultimate trade item. I guess it changes from year to year. You can generally trade a full pack of smokes for one crummy drink, but not always. One year, I think it was 1996, it was so cold, that packages of hot chocolate were the biggest things going. This year we're making very expensive aluminum necklaces. I know one thing -- it generally helps to be a beautiful 23 year old blond girl. That Captain Goddamnit has yet to give ME a free margarita or one single Peppermint Patty! :x

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Burnmudgeon
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Post by Burnmudgeon » Sat Aug 07, 2004 9:33 pm

Who knows what people will appreciate?
To some, a full pack of cigararettes is wonderful; to others it is gross and an insult. Hand-made items that the person can wear is the best in my opinion. What do you all think?
Excelsior!

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SealBoy
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Post by SealBoy » Sun Aug 08, 2004 2:11 am

Badger wrote: Bartering is frowned upon. If you follow through you can expect a goodly amount of shit to fly your way for doing it.
Actually, that's not true. Some want this to be a pure 'gift economy', and that's fine. But that fact of the matter is, when you give somebody something, you're likely to get something in return. And that's nice! That's the way it should be. Try to think of a situation where you would give someone something without a selfish underlying motive... mm hmm. (I don't believe you.) So my question for everybody is, should Black Rock City be based on a 'gift economy', or a 'barter economy'? Seems to me, a quid pro quo system is the more natural solution.

By way of advice for newbies, bartering is NOT frowned upon by most people at Burning Man. In fact, it's very much a way of life.

Adam Smith & Joseph Stalin unite!

- SealBoy.
Arp arp arp!

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unjonharley
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Post by unjonharley » Sun Aug 08, 2004 8:05 am

Your wrong Sealboy, I give every few gift. What i gift is from me. Bartering in "your" fish market would get you a visit from the rangers. One large MV was asking for a gift up front fo a ride. They were asked no to do this Now I read that this Art will not be here this year. Funny how thing correct there self.
I'm the contraptioneer your mother warned you about.

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Tancorix
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Post by Tancorix » Sun Aug 08, 2004 9:00 am

I've been watching this thread because this is something that bothers me every year. It seems like you have to have something to gift people if you want drinks or other things, and I'm never sure what to give. I don't give away Oriental Trading crap, and I'm not "craft" oriented to make anything close to the cool stuff others make out there. I've been 2 years now and I struggle with it, and I can imagine what a first timer is thinking when they read about "the gift economy".

As for giving of yourself, I've done that and had some interesting and positive experiences. But there are certain camps (I won't name names) that seem like if you don't have stuff to gift them, you're not welcome to even come in and look around, let alone do much else. I'm also not the type to freeload on someone either...so there's the catch 22. What to bring, what to give? And with only a couple of weeks left before the gates open, the tension builds again.

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WildChyld
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gifting

Post by WildChyld » Sun Aug 08, 2004 1:15 pm

Gifting is giving what you have to give out of love of mankind, sometimes it is material, other times it is love, songs, dances, helpfulness or simply a smile.

When you give a gift to a small child do you do it in hopes that they're going to buy you a big screen TV for Xmas? Hell no, you do it because of that fluffy feeling that you get from seeing a little kids eyes fill with joy.

The same can be true of any gifting economy, you share what you can out of commitment to the community and the people around you and leave your arms open to recieve back whatever the playa gods have in store for you....sorta like Santa.

If people around you are too hung up on the "what do you have for me" mentality than perhaps you should just move on to the next camp. Its not like there aren't more places to go!

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Stormy
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Post by Stormy » Sun Aug 08, 2004 2:23 pm

Tancorix wrote:
As for giving of yourself, I've done that and had some interesting and positive experiences. But there are certain camps (I won't name names) that seem like if you don't have stuff to gift them, you're not welcome to even come in and look around, let alone do much else. I'm also not the type to freeload on someone either...so there's the catch 22. What to bring, what to give? And with only a couple of weeks left before the gates open, the tension builds again.
Tis sadly true. But if those certain camps demand something of you, are they really camps you want to spend time at? The gift works both ways.
Be the change you seek in the world.

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buckethead alien
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Post by buckethead alien » Sun Aug 08, 2004 3:20 pm

Tancorix wrote:I've been watching this thread because this is something that bothers me every year. It seems like you have to have something to gift people if you want drinks or other things, and I'm never sure what to give. ... I've been 2 years now and I struggle with it, and I can imagine what a first timer is thinking when they read about "the gift economy".
As usual, Tancorix hits the nail right on the head.

Seems to me that the words "gift" and "economy" are pretty close to mutually exclusive. When you consider the potential moop factor, perhaps the BMORG should just drop the concept.

Some of us are coming from a considerable distance that precludes hauling nonessential stuff to the playa, anyway. Are we the underclass of the "gift economy" or else are we forced to become huggers or masseuses?
Buckethead, Buckethead you are like an Alien
Buckethead, Buckethead your head is like a dish
Buckethead, Buckethead sometimes you wear the Maybelline
Buckethead, Buckethead sometimes you're full of fish

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unjonharley
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Post by unjonharley » Sun Aug 08, 2004 3:48 pm

What the hell are you guys whining about. Sounds like your the ones expecting a gift every time "you" turn around. I have not payed for any thing with a gift. Last year we had some split thunder eggs. Grand father loves to tell the story of how they got the name. We enjoyed a lot of company at our camp to see the eggs. Most were supprised when they were given one. The return gift for these simpel stones was friendship,smiles & a happy feeling inside.
Some one gave me a p30 a dated 03 neckless, and a few other tokens.

If some one is expecting a gift from me I might allow them to kiss my "fine ass"

I'm working on a bradeing(¿) jig. So I can make a gift right on the spot.
I'm the contraptioneer your mother warned you about.

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Markov Chaney
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Post by Markov Chaney » Sun Aug 08, 2004 4:40 pm

As I see it, drinks are gifts too.

Camps may or may not want to give them out as they see fit. For whatever reason they see fit.

Personally, I won't barter, but I'll happily perform for a drink.

sparkletarte
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~

Post by sparkletarte » Sun Aug 08, 2004 10:47 pm

Although I haven't been yet, I'm approaching the 'gifting' as sharing. I'm bringing stuff that I enjoy and then I'm bringing extra in case other people might enjoy it too. I like that communal aspect of it- we're all going to be together for a while, so why not bring stuff that will enhance other people's time there, as well as your own.

I don't like the idea of expectations of giving something to get something. To me that's not gifting. Sometimes, yes, people want to trade with each other, and show their appreciation for a gift by giving one in return. That's okay- I don't like it when there are expectations.

The other thing with gifting is that if someone gives you something, they will get something back at some point- maybe not something from you (of course maybe you will give them a smile, but don't you give those to everyone?). They may get just what they need from a different person, at a different time. I like the circle aspect of that- we all have each other covered, maybe not directly, but covered nonetheless.

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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Mon Aug 09, 2004 1:49 pm

Fat SAM wrote:Do you guys think anyone is going to dog me and my wife for bringing hemp neckelaces/anklets/bracelets? We're both worried people are going to think it's hack or something. We really have put a lot of time and love into making them, though, you know? Figure that ought to be worth something....
There are always gonna be a few twits out there who don't get it. As someone who has strung beads since the 90s and who will be gifting her own beads for the third time this year--don't worry. As a community, we are more likely to appreciate the hand made than the mass produced. (Wide variation here.) And in some ways the gift is itself only the spore of the encounter.

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