Newbie family

Start here - tell us about yourself and what brings you to ePlaya.
bmcgahey
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Newbie family

Post by bmcgahey » Sat Oct 10, 2009 7:51 pm

Burning man seems like an amazing experience. I would like to go with my family we have a son( 5) and two daughters(11 and 12). Is it too harsh physically? We would have a tent trailer.

Also are there any family friendly campsites out there that we could meet up with? Or families with kids that are similar in age? We don't know anyone that goes. We live in Southern CA. I would love to help out with an art installation.

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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Sat Oct 10, 2009 7:58 pm

You might be interested in Kidsville.

Das Bus runs it, I think. Sail Man has camped there for the past two years. Just going to say it now, Kidsville fills up quick, so you want to make the decision to camp with them early, late spring/early summer? But that's not the only place with kids, just the most prominent.
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bmcgahey
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Kidsville sounds perfect!

Post by bmcgahey » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:08 pm

Thanks for the guidance!! How do you sign up...I am very very uninformed right now.

bmcgahey
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I found kidsville...I love the internet

Post by bmcgahey » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:22 pm

I joined kidsville on facebook and I found DasBus' email, and asked him if we could camp with him/her.

Thanks again for the welcome Cryptofish :)

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Sham
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Post by Sham » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:25 pm

I have seen so many happy families with little kids exploring the playa. I can't think of a more exciting and rustic vacation for a family. The dust and wind storms can be a bit heavy, but dust masks and googles can make the situation fun. There is some nudity, but nothing lude or inappropriate. I think if the children are exposed to this with no sensationalism, they tend to be much more accepting and open minded.

At kidsville, they will find other childern their age and will have a fun time just with that.

I hope this info helps----and WELCOME!

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Elderberry
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Post by Elderberry » Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:57 pm

Hey there, welcome to eplaya!

JK
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bmcgahey
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Playa dust

Post by bmcgahey » Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:05 am

LOL, thanks Shambala and jkisha!

Yes we pretty much let the kids see what is out there and use it as an opportunity to discuss. That way we get some input instead of having them find things out from friends and not want to come to us with questions.

It looks fun. Were you serious about the dust masks and goggles? I saw some pics of a little kid naked on the playa. super cute and I'm sure there was sun screen involved. But I also read about the alkalinity of the playa dust.

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Elorrum
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Re: Playa dust

Post by Elorrum » Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:08 pm

bmcgahey wrote:It looks fun. Were you serious about the dust masks and goggles?
Not all of the time, from time to time, like most weather. If you don't think your kids would wear them at all, you may have a problem. When there's a dust storm, IMO they are necessary. Maybe play with masks and bandanas and goggles before you decide and see if they are going to fight them. Other parents may have more information for you on how they've handled this.

I still remember sitting in a white out dust storm and watching a mother give up on her toddler who absolutely would not wear the goggles or a mask. This was probably not too safe for little lungs which are more sensitive to the dust than adults'. It got me thinking that some children aren't really safe there.

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MikeVDS
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Post by MikeVDS » Sun Oct 11, 2009 5:17 pm

It can get very hot and very cold. Sometimes there are duststorms for days with few breaks. Some tent trailers will not help much with dust storms, while others do a good job. You could be stuck in a 105 degree trailer in a dust storm that lasts 3 days. It could be beautiful and you might not experience that, but plan for the worst.

Also, your kids will see naked people, naked pictures and art, giant representations of penises, breasts, vaginas. They will see people very drugged out, drinking, bondage.

I'm just preparing you for the things some people would consider objectionable that you will not be able to avoid out there. I go with my family and there are tons of great things for my daughter to experience out there.
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Elderberry
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Post by Elderberry » Sun Oct 11, 2009 5:58 pm

Geeze Mike, where do you hang out on the playa?

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Sham
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Post by Sham » Sun Oct 11, 2009 6:14 pm

Let's not scare the poor man. Dust, wind, heat, cold and sun. For the past few years, all have been managable. Prepare for all extreme scenarios and you will be fine no matter what. If you feel you need some assistance, you can always ask a neighbor for help. In other words, don't fret the small stuff.

There is nudity that they will be exposed to. Not to worry, all is ok. I saw a few intoxicated people, but again, not too many to worry about.

If asked if I would recommend that you bring the kids, I would tell you without a doubt, YES!

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ygmir
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Post by ygmir » Sun Oct 11, 2009 6:43 pm

I think MikeVDS did the right thing.........What he says is true, and, not uncommon, more so in some areas than others, but still.......


IMHO, I'd rather someone prepare for what he says, and, not encounter it, than, not know those things (and, they all can and do happen with some frequency, in my experience, anyway) exist and get blind sided by something........
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Elderberry
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Post by Elderberry » Sun Oct 11, 2009 7:31 pm

Well, all of those things happen an ANY big city. Isn't that why people move to the suburbs?

I've come full circle on this, from my first burn thinking that BM was not a place for kids, to knowing that it was a great place for kids.

Everyone's burn is what they make it. And though all of the afore-mentioned "perils" do exist, most need to be sought out and those that you encounter by accident can be great learning experiences--both for the kids and their parents. Kids are pretty resilient and many things that impact adults on some level will just go right over the head of a child-- especially if the parents are cool in how they deal with things.

If you think nudity is wrong, the playa is not for you, let alone your kids. I think it can be a tremendous experience for learning -- both for kids and parents.

Don't let fear of what "might" happen prevent you from attending the burn, let alone stop you from living life to the fullest.

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MikeVDS
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Post by MikeVDS » Sun Oct 11, 2009 9:22 pm

I'm not trying to scare anyone, but if you're not ready for those things it could potentially be an awful experience. Can you imagine getting up there, paid for tickets, etc, then having your significant other saying this isn't appropriate for the kids and wanting to leave? To someone who is conservative about those things I would say BRC is a bit "worse" that most places people take kids. I love kids at BRC and will keep taking mine as long as they want to keep going, but for parents who have never been before it could be a disaster if they aren't aware of what they are getting into. I know people who would leave after 20 minutes of being there with children to "protect the children from the indecency". So I posted the most extreme common examples of what their kids might see. If their kids are mature enough and their family dynamic can handle those situations, they'll probably have a wonderful time. If they don't meet those criteria, it might not be a very good trip.

I personally recommend not taking kids your first year. That way you know how to deal out there before you expose children to something you may not know how to deal with. Many people are just fine with kids their first year, but make sure you do your homework and know what it takes for desert camping.
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littleflower
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Post by littleflower » Sun Oct 11, 2009 9:43 pm

i have yet to find a bar called "suck 'n fuck" in LA, JK ... it was in the 3:00 portal, i passed it a million times ...

i would never take kids there. plenty of time for that when they are older, IMHO. but i wouldn't tell anyone else how to raise kids, either ... and i think it's a good idea to let parents know as much as possible, considering the work and expense involved.

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gyre
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Post by gyre » Mon Oct 12, 2009 4:18 am

littleflower wrote:i have yet to find a bar called "suck 'n fuck" in LA, JK ... it was in the 3:00 portal, i passed it a million times ...
Funny.
I was through there all the time and it didn't even register with me.
I believe you, but I never noticed it.


Los Angeles has no decadence, I'm sure. lol
The burn as it is now, grew out of the cacophony society from L.A.

Just go east on sunset until you reach the gates of hell..

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littleflower
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Post by littleflower » Mon Oct 12, 2009 8:30 am

LA has plenty of decadence.

but far less openly adult sort of behavior than at burning man. i am amazed that anyone would even argue such a thing... all you have to do is look at the photos ... and read this board ... :shock: :D :D

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Elderberry
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Post by Elderberry » Mon Oct 12, 2009 11:38 am

littleflower wrote:i have yet to find a bar called "suck 'n fuck" in LA, JK ... it was in the 3:00 portal, i passed it a million times ...

i would never take kids there. plenty of time for that when they are older, IMHO. but i wouldn't tell anyone else how to raise kids, either ... and i think it's a good idea to let parents know as much as possible, considering the work and expense involved.
But that was my whole point...there are strip clubs in LA too...but you wouldn't take kids there, yet you might walk or drive by those places with your kids getting from here to there. Most of the decadence is in specific camps and tents/domes, etc., and except for public nudity, which I think is good to expose kids to, there isn't much to worry about.

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Then I realized that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me

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Das Bus
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Post by Das Bus » Mon Oct 12, 2009 11:45 am

Hey Barbara!

I just sent you an email. : )

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littleflower
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Post by littleflower » Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:41 pm

jkisha wrote:
littleflower wrote:i have yet to find a bar called "suck 'n fuck" in LA, JK ... it was in the 3:00 portal, i passed it a million times ...

i would never take kids there. plenty of time for that when they are older, IMHO. but i wouldn't tell anyone else how to raise kids, either ... and i think it's a good idea to let parents know as much as possible, considering the work and expense involved.
But that was my whole point...there are strip clubs in LA too...but you wouldn't take kids there, yet you might walk or drive by those places with your kids getting from here to there. Most of the decadence is in specific camps and tents/domes, etc., and except for public nudity, which I think is good to expose kids to, there isn't much to worry about.

JK
somehow, JK, i think "Peppermint Rhino" is at least somewhat more subtle than "Suck 'n Fuck" ... :P

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Post by Elderberry » Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:46 pm

littleflower wrote:
somehow, JK, i think "Peppermint Rhino" is at least somewhat more subtle than "Suck 'n Fuck" ... :P
Well, I still say if the kids are old enough to know what it means, it doesn't matter much, now does it? And if they don't know what it means, it might as well be the Peppermint Rhino, which can be explained as easily as a chocolate easter bunny.

BTW can you PM me your email address. John wants to put you on his contact list. Are you on Facebook yet?

JK
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littleflower
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Post by littleflower » Mon Oct 12, 2009 9:51 pm

yeah, yeah , yeah ... how would you answer "daddy, what's suck 'n fuck???"

at least, with peppermint rhino, you can make something up that has peppermints and rhinos ...

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MikeVDS
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Post by MikeVDS » Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:29 pm

how would you answer "daddy, what's suck 'n fuck???"
That answer obviously depends on the age of the kid, etc. But I'd say, "It's supposed to be an adult joke and it's not really funny." Which is pretty much a similar answer I'd give for Peppermint Rhino. Dealing with adult topics is easy. I don't think it's the kids who have problems with the burn, it's the parents that sometimes have problems. That's why I warn parents, not kids.
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MikeVDS
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Post by MikeVDS » Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:33 pm

at least, with peppermint rhino, you can make something up that has peppermints and rhinos ...
Also I don't think I would make up a lie like that. It could easily be answered by "exotic dancing" alone, without having to make things up. Kids too young to comprehend the notion of sexuality will not think it's anything "bad" and kids old enough to understand sexuality can be taught about how people are.
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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:24 am

As the whole idea of childhood as an "innocent" stage is less than 200 years old, I am skeptical of a lot of the things that adults do to "protect" them. I think children can, and pretty much always have, been perfectly okay with casually seeing adult sexuality. Note: this is different than having children being forced or seduced or otherwise participating in adult sexuality. That is damaging.
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gyre
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Post by gyre » Tue Oct 13, 2009 12:54 pm

I think children take their cues from adults as to what is serious.

And expectations have a lot to do with trauma too.

In Bosnia they had many cases of ptsd in children that had been shot.
After the first six months, they stopped getting new cases.
No one was surprized anymore.

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ygmir
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Post by ygmir » Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:25 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:As the whole idea of childhood as an "innocent" stage is less than 200 years old, I am skeptical of a lot of the things that adults do to "protect" them. I think children can, and pretty much always have, been perfectly okay with casually seeing adult sexuality. Note: this is different than having children being forced or seduced or otherwise participating in adult sexuality. That is damaging.
I'd think that a very subjective statement...........totally relative.........

"perfectly okay with casually seeing adult sexuality".........

and then trying to delineate it from the second part about seduction, etc........

I'd say that's moot, at best..........and very sociologically dependent.
who's to say anyone is "okay" with a particular set of events?............where does it lead?...........

to me, it implies that innocence in childhood is not important........or maybe even desired.......

I'd say as skeptical as you may be about "protecting" them, it's just as valid to have skepticism relating to "exposing" them.........

IMHO, much too individual and specific to make generalizing statements about.......
other than stating what an individual may do, or approve of, themselves.......
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littleflower
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Post by littleflower » Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:39 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:As the whole idea of childhood as an "innocent" stage is less than 200 years old
do you have a source for this, fishy? victorian england?

seems to me that childhood innocence is instinctive, actually ... children are, after all, born innocent. how and where and when they learn the lessons of adulthood depends on many things, as gyre suggests ... and i absolutely agree that being too protective can be terribly damaging.

obviously, burning man seems to me a bit more adult oriented than to various others around here. even the nudity thing ... the word sounds innocuous enough, but really ... there was a huge difference between, say, the chubby-ish middled aged guy who tore off his clothes when the water truck went by, and the gorgeous, well-hung young stud in the ice line wearing see-through genie pants. the older guy was amusing ... the younger, well ... :twisted:

i don't see why a kid needs to see it .... but i am fan of modesty, anyhow ... oh, shit, who knows ... :lol:

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Woot!

Post by octoboi » Tue Oct 13, 2009 2:53 pm

Awesome idea. This last burn (2009) was my first, but I noticed very few families (in this definition of the word family, I am including the fact that there were all ages involved), and I think that it would be a great experience for the full family to enjoy. I think back to my youth and I would have positively flipped had my family done something like this. Kudos to you.

D. (considering a playa name for next year

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Post by Sail Man » Tue Oct 13, 2009 4:00 pm

Well, I can see I'm a little late to the party :D Welcome newbie family to eplaya. You've been given some good advice. As Crypto pointed out, I have camped there the last 2 years. Allow me to reiterate a few things.

Kidsville is a great place for families, but we/it, is not a baby-sitting service.
Make damn sure that all adults responsible for supervising said kiddies dont all get fucking smashed at the dame time. This year we had one single parent escorted to they're camp in Kidsville by the rangers because they were too wasted to remember where they were camped. It was a dickens of a time getting them both in bed. And to top it off, they wondered away again soon after we had them tucked into bed, and yep, got lost again. :shock: :roll:

My dusty little burner dude, 6 this past burn, fared very nicely in the dust his 2 burns. Wipe them down from time to time with un-scented wipey dipes and throw them back out to the trampolines. This year we had a ball bouncy thingy, a major hit. Oh, and there is also movies shown at night. Sock Monkey making work-shops, and this year we had a pirate swash-buckle his way into camp, and enthrall the kiddies with tales of life on the high seas as a pirate. Plus a myriad of other activities.

We also have many art cars that make there way through the camp for the kids to check out, occasionally to ride on an art tour as well.

Register as soon as you see the registry on the yahoo Kidsville site go active. I believe there is a 2nd database in there as well for listing pert. demographics.

Keep em hydrated. Our son has his own hydration pack. And yes to goggles. It's hard to find stylish burner goggles for the wee ones, we carry a few of the kid swim goggles, and also kids ski goggles. Simple dust masks from Homey Despot also come in handy, as well as a bandana. There are also more advanced dust masks available from medical supply stores, more geared to patients with bad allergies. I have a link or 2 for that as well.

Food is what they eat a home, being mindful of being able to keep refrigerated items properly chilled. Its not the place to get food poisoning. Allow them, and yourself to splurge on favorite items. Surviving out there, you def. earn it. Also simplify recipes etc.

Hmm, what else. Ahh, blinkies. Light them up good, and they're bike. They will love having all sorts of cool blinkies and lights to mess around with. And art cars and peeps on bikes will love it as well. They hate running over burners. Although they do love running over hippies. Sayyyy, BTW, your not hippies are you? :wink: If so, you'll have to camp with the Canadians :lol:

You'll run across a few that don't like kids at the burn, but they're just verbal. Most burners love kids at the burn, recognizing they are the up and coming burner generation. We often hear fellow burners commenting on our dusty little burner in a most positive way, and often love to give him swag, which he loves.

Feel free to hit me up with any questions, pm me. I also see that the mayor e-mailed you.

Just be prepared, read up everything you can find. The better prepared you are for your family, and the better they understand the journey they are about to undertake, the more fun you will have.
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