2008 "American Dream" theme

How much do you like the 2008 "American Dream" theme?

Lame. Lame. Lame.
215
30%
Lame. Lame. Lame.
215
30%
Sort of lame.
60
8%
Sort of lame.
60
8%
Good enough.
32
5%
Good enough.
32
5%
Brilliant. Inspiring.
47
7%
Brilliant. Inspiring.
47
7%
 
Total votes: 708

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premonut
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Post by premonut » Mon Sep 10, 2007 3:29 pm

07 was a great 2nd year for me and was preparing mentally what I would do for 08 while driving back..... Then I find out the 08 theme is American Dream..... WTF!!!!!! this is biast to americans.... what about the Canadians, the Brits, aussies and all other people that come from all around the world for burning man suppose to do. This is a complete disregard to the multi culturism of what bman has become..... definately disapointed and definately not making it next year. The theme is prejudice to other nations and makes bman a US only club. Fuck that

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Badger
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Post by Badger » Mon Sep 10, 2007 3:57 pm

This is a complete disregard to the multi culturism of what bman has become..... definately disapointed and definately not making it next year. The theme is prejudice to other nations and makes bman a US only club. Fuck that
Quick! Someone call a Whaaambulance

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Desert dogs drink deep.

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premonut
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Post by premonut » Mon Sep 10, 2007 4:02 pm

[quote="Badger"][quote]This is a complete disregard to the multi culturism of what bman has become..... definately disapointed and definately not making it next year. The theme is prejudice to other nations and makes bman a US only club. Fuck that
[/quote]

Quick! Someone call a Whaaambulance

[img]http://pekingduck.org/archives/crying_baby.jpg[/img][/quote]


LOL!!!!!!

Saki
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Burning Man Revolution

Post by Saki » Mon Sep 10, 2007 5:51 pm

Perhaps a thoughtful group of Burners will look to the American Revolution, Boston Tea Party, and other battles to fight off outside control as the source of their inspiration.

Perhaps Burning man needs a revolution. The powers of King Larry and BMLLC (BORG) should be given to the people of Black Rock City.

Maybe a group of people will raid camp Arctica and give away their bags of ice that they are otherwise raping our community with their $3.00 / bag prices.

Maybe the center camp cafe will be boycotted or blockaded and a BRC Cafe will take its place where the barista's don't shake their tips jars at us.

Democracy in BRC!
Who's with me?

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ravenluv
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Rules of Division

Post by ravenluv » Mon Sep 10, 2007 6:55 pm

jeez, i leave this thread for a day or so and the comments just pile up. it's taking forever to get through them all. yeah, that's right - i actually read them.

i recently ran into people i hadn't seen in five years. they'd just got back from burning man and had an awesome time. but they didn't like the theme next year (and yes, they'll go). the reason is one i happened upon early in the game.

this theme is an invitation for cynicism and mockery, whether larry or the bmorg wants to admit it. and yes, art is art. but like many others, i enjoyed the largely apolitical nature of burning man. sure, there would be displays here and there that were political, but they were few and far between.

maybe we're worrying about nothing. it's going to be whatever it's going to be. but yes, many of us are afraid too much of it is going to be harping on the ugliness or ludicrousness of the so-called 'american dream'.

some say the theme is unimportant. and really, it kind of is, in a larger sense. but if it's so unimportant, why is it important to stick with THIS theme?

spectabillis
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Post by spectabillis » Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:22 pm

Badger wrote:Quick! Someone call a Whaaambulance
never said this before, but since you are fond of telling this to myself and others...

if you dont like it, leave.

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BAS
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Post by BAS » Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:27 pm

premonut wrote:07 was a great 2nd year for me and was preparing mentally what I would do for 08 while driving back..... Then I find out the 08 theme is American Dream..... WTF!!!!!! this is biast to americans.... what about the Canadians, the Brits, aussies and all other people that come from all around the world for burning man suppose to do. This is a complete disregard to the multi culturism of what bman has become..... definately disapointed and definately not making it next year. The theme is prejudice to other nations and makes bman a US only club. Fuck that

Technically, Canadians ARE Americans.

You know, humans did NOT evolve in either North or South America, so maybe the American Dream is whatever came before humans on these land masses. A pre-human American Dream. What America would have been like if humans had never come.

Or a pre-Columbus American Dream. America of the Apaches, Sioux, Aztecs, etc. Or the Ice Ages American Dream (when the playa was a lake, come to think of it.)


B. (just tossing out some ideas.)
"Nothing is withheld from us which we have conceived to do.
Do things that have never been done."
--Russell Kirsch

Saki
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Post by Saki » Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:33 pm

[quote="spectabillis"][quote="Badger"]Quick! Someone call a Whaaambulance[/quote]
never said this before, but since you are fond of telling this to myself and others...

if you dont like it, leave.[/quote]

I've heard that Badger spends no less than 4 hours each day looking at baby photos to find the perfect cry face. Apparently, it is a common condition caused by teasing and harassment during adolescence and teen years.

The result is negativity that they hope is misinterpreted as confidence.

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ravenluv
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Only In America....

Post by ravenluv » Mon Sep 10, 2007 8:13 pm

some people are pointing out that burning man could only happen in america, and that's why the theme is appropriate.

maybe. but let's look at the history a bit. it started in san fran, which is a city that hardly represents what i've seen of the rest of america (and i've been everywhere, man). when the police came and said 'enough' in san fran, they took it out to a place where the locals had little idea of what was going on, a place with precious little law enforcement infrastructure, or even a population sizable enough to make a ruckus about it. and then, when it grew extremely quickly - probably related to the spread of the internet and the continued decrease in the price of communications of all sorts, not to mention the reign of Bill Clinton, in which leo didn't have such free reign. when it grew, the money made from the masses started to play a role. once money entered the picture, even those who might otherwise see little use in it could at least tolerate it for a fee.

the police of america have slowly, but steadily, made their presence known at every fun event in this nation, to the point of making many of them hardly fun at all. as a result, burning man has become an even more precious place to many of us.

i went to concerts in the late 70s and early 80s. everything used to be wilder and more free than it is now. if burning man really did represent something about america, then why isn't it happening all over, as it surely would have if social trends of the 70s had continued? given that the vibe that burning man celebrates gets systematically shut down or hindered in most of the rest of the nation, how can we even insinuate that it represents what america is about?

it kind of reminds of when people go to a movie about racial harmony and then go home satisfied to live in such a progressive area of racial harmony. they think the sliver of progressiveness they witnessed on the screen represents the larger reality.

only in america? i doubt it. but this is where it happened. and from everything i've seen in this nation, it happened in spite of the fact that it was in america. how many other states could this have happened in? iowa? new york? louisianna? texas? isn't it really it's proximity to the west coast - a realm quite unlike the rest of the nation - that made it so big?

maybe those who love the theme are in a place in america where things seem groovy, liberated and cool. but a lot of us are living in those places where people are rooting for gitmo and the end to all that 60s crap that is on display at burning man. that is, if those around us aren't totally apathetic.

to me, burning man is a manifestation of the ideals of real freedom. in that sense, it is 'american' because i'm an american that was taught that we are the only ones who can dream properly of freedom. but i knew that was bullshit when i was in elementary school. i love the dream of freedom, but it's an ancient dream that has only been approximated by every 'greatest' nation in history, including this one.

there is, for me, one valid reason why burning man could only happen here. that is, because of our wealth - especially our wealth of land.
it wasn't a dream that got us that land, it was a nightmare of violence, ignorance, prejudice and greed.

not that any of that matters. some say the theme is a non-issue. maybe it is. but it's the maybe part that worries me.

how can we know for sure that the passions coming out on this board aren't going to pollute the playa? it makes my skin crawl to read ra-ra american posts on this board, not because i'm anti-american, but because i don't like nationalism or us/them sentiments that so often come with it. i know those same people are at burning man, and i'm sure we'd have a damn fine time if we met each other out there - as long as we didn't start trotting out our political beliefs.

yes, we can ignore the theme. but i'm not worried about people ignoring it, i'm worried about people actually taking heart in it - especially in less than whimsical ways.

aaronm
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We are truly fucked

Post by aaronm » Mon Sep 10, 2007 8:45 pm

So I don’t want to sound like an elitist and say things like “When I started going to the burn it was cool but now it sucksâ€
The last thing most people say before dieing is "Shit!" Dare to go out with a "Whoopsie!"

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Bob
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Post by Bob » Mon Sep 10, 2007 9:00 pm

Boo fucking hoo.

None of you people cried like little peeping baby birds when the theme was Pirates.
Amazing desert structures & stuff: http://sites.google.com/site/potatotrap/

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Badger
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Post by Badger » Mon Sep 10, 2007 11:22 pm

never said this before, but since you are fond of telling this to myself and others...

if you dont like it, leave.
Hey Spec, FWIW, I'm not the one protesting so much here and I've certainly never let the theme define my experience at TTITD.

BTW, let us know what bug crawled up your ass would ya?
Desert dogs drink deep.

spectabillis
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Post by spectabillis » Mon Sep 10, 2007 11:36 pm

just tired of seeing you return to throw out asshole comments and stoking up old fires, so i mention the same thing you have said to me and... yep, get this reaction.

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K-mom
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Post by K-mom » Mon Sep 10, 2007 11:55 pm

Badger wrote:
I can work with this theme.
As can I once plans are solidified for our 'refugee' processing station to be located at the very edge of Black Rock City. It'll be the camp closest to the trash fence where all the sneak-in's make their mad dash from the 12 mile point. As with Cuban refugees the idea is that if runners can set foot on soil within BRC then just as with Florida they'll be automatically be granted asylum. They'll be provided food, water, cigarettes, immunity and a bacon subsidy to do as they see fit while at the event. This idea also borrows from the Hawaiian idea of "pu`uhonua" or place of refuge http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pu%27uhonu ... rical_Park which Hunter S. Thompson wrote about in his book The Curse of Lono.

.
imho, that's the best contribution to this thread yet
You call it malt liquor, I call it breakfast.

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Post by Toolmaker » Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:59 am

K-mom wrote:
Badger wrote:
I can work with this theme.
As can I once plans are solidified for our 'refugee' processing station to be located at the very edge of Black Rock City. It'll be the camp closest to the trash fence where all the sneak-in's make their mad dash from the 12 mile point. As with Cuban refugees the idea is that if runners can set foot on soil within BRC then just as with Florida they'll be automatically be granted asylum. They'll be provided food, water, cigarettes, immunity and a bacon subsidy to do as they see fit while at the event. This idea also borrows from the Hawaiian idea of "pu`uhonua" or place of refuge http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pu%27uhonu ... rical_Park which Hunter S. Thompson wrote about in his book The Curse of Lono.

.
imho, that's the best contribution to this thread yet
It is pure genius and fits with the theme. I for one would love to see Badgers dream fulfilled next year. We could also have spotters watching the Perimeter folks chase em down. We could do some betting action on various hippies running for the border. Maybe even run it to a projector in a dome and have people watch live. Maybe the hat will gift the project a few free tickets a day for participants. Could you call it a performance art camp/installation and get a grant?
This account has been closed as demanded by Wedeliver.

Greens
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Post by Greens » Tue Sep 11, 2007 6:21 am

Perhaps I won't officially attend next year, but rather, organize a large group to rush the trash fence and seek asylum at the Refugee Camp!

We can then act as illegal immigrants in BRC, giving out cheaper coffee in centre camp, selling $1 bags of ice next door to Arctica, and making delicious ethnic food!

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AntiM
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Post by AntiM » Tue Sep 11, 2007 7:09 am

Greens wrote:Perhaps I won't officially attend next year, but rather, organize a large group to rush the trash fence and seek asylum at the Refugee Camp!

We can then act as illegal immigrants in BRC, giving out cheaper coffee in centre camp, selling $1 bags of ice next door to Arctica, and making delicious ethnic food!
Bags of oranges at the intersections? Cleaning windshields during Exodus?

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BAS
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Post by BAS » Tue Sep 11, 2007 7:48 am

:D I am doing a "ME TOO!" post about the refugee processing station being a cool idea! (Heck, I like it better than my flag burning idea... :? )


B.
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Do things that have never been done."
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Post by lurker » Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:53 am

Only in America?

Yes, ONLY in America.

Where are all the other ones?

Where are all the other giant art/survival festivals? Where?

By all the gods, even most of the small regional burns are in the US.

And San Francisco is not an aberration in the Us, it is, again, something that could only happen here.

A countercultural city.

And there's more than one.

There is a difference about America, a different way of thinking about freedom. Every point made by the people shocked and saddened by this theme is fueled by that difference.

And it's a difference that is, in general, encouraged by all facets of the country--in spite of their political bent.

People who call themselves liberals and support socialistic ideals--a system that requires a level of state control unheard of in America--scream for liberty even while advocating programs that would destroy it.

People who call themselves conservatives and support moralistic ideals--ideals that would limit personal freedoms--consider themselves protectors of personal freedom--even while advocating programs that would destroy it.

There is an underlying American ideal that moves all but the most fanatic among us. We understand that freedom --American style freedom--is a fragile thing that is under assault from the left and the right, from people for whom The People are just something to be controlled.

We resonate more to 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' than to anything else in our political canon.

And that keeps us, in general, from letting the controllers--on both sides--go too far.

So yes, only in America, and we should be proud of that instead of trying to defuse it.

And you can take THIS attitude--
07 was a great 2nd year for me and was preparing mentally what I would do for 08 while driving back..... Then I find out the 08 theme is American Dream..... WTF!!!!!! this is biast to americans.... what about the Canadians, the Brits, aussies and all other people that come from all around the world for burning man suppose to do. This is a complete disregard to the multi culturism of what bman has become..... definately disapointed and definately not making it next year. The theme is prejudice to other nations and makes bman a US only club. Fuck that
And shove it.

Burning Man was started by an American. An American. And a white male American at that.

You play in his American dream.

And Burning Man is mono-cultural. It's burner-centric. That's the point. An 'experiment in temporary community'.

It's home to all the burners in the world. Home. That's what they say, isn't it? When you go through the gate--'Welcome Home'.

And all you can do is bitch that the people who came up with this thing dare to include the name of their country in anything to do with BRC or Burning Man.

And even they had their tongues in their cheeks when they came up with it, expecting this type of reaction, expecting that even the people who were fine with it would, most of them, create themed art that takes a poke at the US.

Does it hurt everyone so much to admit that there ARE good things about America? That it's not all fascist, corporate, imperialist fundamental stormtroopers trying to crush world freedom under the neo-con jackboot?

The people of this country have done a lot of good for this world. Why must that good always have to justify itself by being 'in spite' of being American?
"Life is like a box of razor blades. Sharp, shiny, and good for removing unwanted body hair"

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Ron
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Post by Ron » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:12 am

AntiM wrote:.... Cleaning windshields during Exodus?
The Black Rock City car was was open Sunday and Monday this year. We washed lots of windshields, enough so that the gate folk came by to see who was improving visibility for all the folk exiting...

Ron

MistDance
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Post by MistDance » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:37 am

>> 2008 Art Theme: "American Dream"
This year's art theme is about patriotism -- not that kind which freights the nation state with the collective weight of ego, but a patriotism based upon a love of country and culture. Leave ideology at home; forget the blue states and the red; let parties, factions and the issues that divide us fall away. Ask yourself, instead, what can postmodern America yet give to the world?<<

If a person reads this with an open mind instead of prejudice, you would find all sorts of positive reasons to support the theme.
>> pa·tri·ot·ism (pÄ
Think - Its not that hard

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COPPERFISH
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Post by COPPERFISH » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:05 am

[quote="Badger"]if some people would just take time to stop their [color=red]Knee-jerk PC Dance of Angst and Moral Indignation([/color]TM) and think of a few ideas to take it in another direction.[/quote]

But that's my main Dance, yo! Aside from the cabbage patch and the running man!

Ok Ok -

I give.

CAMP CONDI 2008!

Who else embodies the American Dream more quintessentially than Condi Rice. It may be a nightmare but it's a dream none-the-less. A wondrous shrine adorned with weird Condi-Creatures from the depths.
I will be giving away Condi-Cookies, Condi-Cocktails, Condi-Cock rings and all sorts of Condi-Crap.

She's my muse.

I am embracing the Dream.

Camp Condi 2008!

blyslv
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Re: Rules of Division

Post by blyslv » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:25 am

ravenluv wrote:j

this theme is an invitation for cynicism and mockery, whether larry or the bmorg wants to admit it.

Since when do people who attend the event need an invite?
Fight for the fifth freedom!

blyslv
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Post by blyslv » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:34 am

Image

Image
Fight for the fifth freedom!

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COPPERFISH
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CAMP CONDI 2008!

Post by COPPERFISH » Tue Sep 11, 2007 11:54 am

Image

CAMP CONDI 2008!!!

honeyfire
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I like to think *before* condemning, just myself...

Post by honeyfire » Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:08 pm

ravenluv sayed:

"maybe those who love the theme are in a place in america where things seem groovy, liberated and cool. but a lot of us are living in those places where people are rooting for gitmo and the end to all that 60s crap that is on display at burning man. that is, if those around us aren't totally apathetic. "


Actually, it appears to me that a lot of people are defending or at least not trashing the theme, but rather considering it on it's own merits. This may not mean that they love the theme, but may mean that they aren't just kneejerk reacting to the conditioning we've been getting for the past 40 years, that liking this country and embracing its ideals is only for the straight white wealthy.

There's actually not that many "place in america where things seem groovy, liberated and cool".
MOST of us "are living in those places where people are rooting for gitmo and the end to all that 60s crap", and for some of us, it inspires us to take back the ideals and try to put them into action.
I remember back when the global view of the US was as "the good guys", and i really miss it.
I'd really like to be the good guys again, and discarding any kind of positive sentiments as being jingoistic imperialism is not gonna get us there.
Somebody comes in and steals my bubble wand so they can poke people in the eye with it, i'm not gonna just declare that bubble wands are bad.
I'm gonna get my bubble wand back and blow bigger better bubbles with it, thank you very much.
I'm just trying not to be liveMOOP...

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Post by actiongrl » Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:17 pm

I'm just surprised to hear that anyone from another country thinks asking for commentary about the American Dream excludes them. I would think that an outsider's perspective would provide all kinds of fodder for artistic commentary. In fact, I'm most interested to hear what they have to say about the state of this country more than I am any domestic artist. I don't understand how examining the subject excludes the international voice. I have my suspicions about what the rest of the world thinks of us, and I for one am quite curious to see those feelings examined artistically.

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Walienweird
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Does the playa represent "America"?

Post by Walienweird » Tue Sep 11, 2007 3:20 pm

I think the B Morg has lost all sense of anarchy and is starting to suck the ass end of the mainstream. If this is where BRC is heading, then it is up to US, as artists, DPW, and participants to take this fucker back! We can use these hollow, stupid themes to make a statement, we can ignore them entirely, or we can go out onto the open playa, AS INDIVIDUALS, and have our own non organized, no leaders, "event", and let the cops, rangers, and spectators watch each other for a week, while we do whatever we are inspired to do! I have been coming to BRC for 10 years, and have disliked most of the themes (floating world being 1 exception), due to the narrowing of expression that goes with them. This is not a kindergarden class that needs a lesson in conformity, that is for the default world, BM started as a wide open, creative event where you had no idea what you would see when you turned around, now thanks to the ever present authority figures, you can't scratch your ass without some one questioning your intent and/or arresting you. Larry's "American dream" has been realized, cash in the bank, do what your told, and most of all keep it PROFITABLE!

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Post by Badger » Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:03 pm

I think the B Morg has lost all sense of anarchy and is starting to suck the ass end of the mainstream.
Please elaborate further. The 'a' word seems to be popping upall over the place in reference to the event and I'm not sure that it ever really had a role on the playa. But then, I guess that might be based on my preferred definition of the word suggests.
Desert dogs drink deep.

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Post by thisisthatwhichis » Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:16 pm

Ohhhh, My.......... 8 pages since Exodus............ I'm thinking I can't wait till '08, now......... 8)
TITWI

To be on the wire is life. The rest is waiting.
It's show time, folks.....Joe Gideon

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