Rest In Peace Kurt Cobain

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 2:09 pm

How far apart do sociology, morality, psychology, and the music business typically drift?

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 2:09 pm

ITIM "How close".

KellY · Post by **KellY** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 3:38 pm

Thanks for posting that Joel. I was going to do so myself. A very good bit of writing, in my opinion. And to continue the discussion I was having with Dangermouse I created a new thread, since Ric has completely derailed this one (and because it's a broader topic in general).

http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... 4919#44919

spectabillis · Post by **spectabillis** » Thu Apr 08, 2004 4:12 pm

KellY wrote:Thanks for posting that Joel. I was going to do so myself. A very good bit of writing, in my opinion. And to continue the discussion I was having with Dangermouse I created a new thread, since Ric has completely derailed this one (and because it's a broader topic in general).

http://eplaya.burningman.org/viewtopic. ... 4919#44919

Yes, I am sorry that I contributed to this drift. I wanted to dissipate some of the hostility that so many posters were feeling from personal experience with depression.

To help get it back on track, Cobain was heavily medicated himself. I think for some time he was on Lithium, which is usually reserved for more critical cases. Wonder if that is what he based a couple of songs on?

Post by **actiongrl** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 2:02 pm

> I think for some time he was on Lithium, which is usually reserved for more critical cases. Wonder if that is what he based a couple of songs on.

You mean like the song "Lithium"?
sorry. had to.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 2:37 pm

spectabillis wrote: Consider some problems with certain mental illnesses like schizophrenia: hallucinations, delusions, chronic fear, constant emotional pain, and insanity. If a person has a choice to continue living under those conditions most would not. A rational person would seek help, but that's part of the problem, when suffering from insanity you are never in a rational state of mind.

The mental health system in this country sucks. I've known so many people who were turned away for services. Finding any sort of help is hard--finding competent help is miraculous. Of course the lazy, arrogant hostility heaped upon the mentally ill by any yahoo with a second hand opinion is a big component to the problem. But, many of the resources that should be available to the mentally ill are de-facto rationed by the "if we make it really really difficult to get services we wont have to supply them" that saying that the non "sane" status of certain persons is the major stumbling block is overlooking vast portions of the problem.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 2:41 pm

"Ultimately it is a weakness. Suicides are doing the gene pool a favor, if they do it before they have children."

One of the great strengths of the human race is that we are a social species.

Some people might believe that troubled loners who cannot abide being near others should just die without offspring as well.

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 2:49 pm

> I think for some time he was on Lithium, which is usually reserved for more critical cases.

My understanding is that Lithium's main use is for bipolar (manic depressive) illness. A lot of really stupid things have been said about the nature of major depression on this thread, but the more I learn about BP, the more I believe the best explination we have for it is a defect in the feedback loop that keeps brains "happy" and functional. Instead the "patient" moves back and forth between two states the extreames of which are both irrational and (as far as I can tell) unpleasent.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Fri Apr 09, 2004 2:51 pm

But the most striking feature of the man, it seems to me, was the metaphysical anguish which he endured so openly and modestly. Not a single day passed without him being tempted to kill himself. But this suspended death gave him a kind of charming and destructing irony - his native intelligence, which was above all the art of finding and establishing in his daily life, and even in his perception, a lethal duet to which he submitted all the objects of this world.

- Jean-Paul Sartre, mallarme: the poetry of suicide

Lydia Love · Post by **Lydia Love** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 2:31 pm

Some people might believe that troubled loners who cannot abide being near others should just die without offspring as well.

oh fuckin A, Crypto, I love you.

spectabillis · Post by **spectabillis** » Sat Apr 10, 2004 6:23 pm

actiongrl wrote:> I think for some time he was on Lithium, which is usually reserved for more critical cases. Wonder if that is what he based a couple of songs on.

You mean like the song "Lithium"?
sorry. had to.

No worries, ya took the bait.

nipples · Post by **nipples** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 6:23 pm

Hello, KeLLY!

A note to mention I thought of you when I was at the Hard Rock HotL, Las Vegas, about a month ago and paid respects to a glass case full of Mr. Cobains, in the exit lobby.

Said a prayer right then & there for you & he & knew that all was right.

There are most definately occasions when despair greets release, his was, obviously, one of them.

Please have no fear, or sorrow of lose, where there is quest for Love, even seeming with no love found to our eyes, the quest for Love itself may be passage, as in a dream to waken from.

all my best,

nipples

nipples · Post by **nipples** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 7:31 pm

"Said a prayer right then & there for you & he & knew that all was right. "

Arrgh.

This is too easily misconstrued.

I did not say a prayer for him, but for you & I to know peace over the issue.. for you on his suicide, for me on my own desire to do so since eight years old.

Kurt Cobain, on the other hand, immediately before I could issue an utterance of a wishful pray for, I knew he was at peace. Hard to explan.

It is a beautiful display, by the way (thoguh they may want a conservator tyo look after sun fading on handwritten stuff near all the entryways. Fading!) DO NOT miss Carlos Santanas' stuff if you ever get to the Hard Rock Hot L in Vegas!

Id'a wet my pants if I had to pee!

Oh! And a cute anecdote.. while waiting for my bro tyo get done in the gift shop, I helped and ANCIENT old man out the door. About a minut later, his bride of maybe a hunfdred years came by and said "I could be raped & have two children for all he would notice!" as I opened the door for her.

She was joking, of course.

love & stuff,

nipples

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:56 pm

Nipples,

Why didn't Kurt take Courtney with him when he checked out?

nipples · Post by **nipples** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 11:51 pm

if i were to court love
nurture it to stay
once though thought a captive
would it run away?

nipples · Post by **nipples** » Mon Jun 21, 2004 11:56 pm

that poem was not meant for anyone but me, about me. (it is ALL about me!)

i have absolutely no knowledge of or desire to know (project)
of others than me.

seriously, with LOVE to Courtney & all

nipples

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Tue Jun 22, 2004 4:06 am

Badger wrote:Nipples,

Why didn't Kurt take Courtney with him when he checked out?

Courtney was the shooter.

Didn't you get the memo?

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Tue Jun 22, 2004 5:14 am

Simply Joel wrote:
Badger wrote:Nipples,

Why didn't Kurt take Courtney with him when he checked out?
Courtney was the shooter.

Didn't you get the memo?

Yep she did it.

KellY · Post by **KellY** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 10:54 am

Hey, Thank you very much for your thoughts, Nipples.

I still think Courtney Love is a great performer, and Hole puts out (ahem) awesome music. But she's the Hillary Clinton of rock and roll: people just love to hate her.

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 11:01 am

Dont miss understand me. I love Hole too and what she did in larry flint (can't remember the name of the movie.) I just kinda ment it as a joke. it was a mean joke.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 11:27 am

KellY wrote:Hey, Thank you very much for your thoughts, Nipples.

I still think Courtney Love is a great performer, and Hole puts out (ahem) awesome music. But she's the Hillary Clinton of rock and roll: people just love to hate her.

does that infer that the former first lady should have done to Bill what Courtney did to Kurt?

inquiring minds want to know...

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 1:30 pm

Larissa · Post by **Larissa** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 6:27 pm

Well, it's hard to add anything more constructive to this thread, alot of points have already been made. I personally miss Kurt Cobain's music. It seemed simple to some, but to me it was raw and beautiful and original. The whole "grunge" period was the last real rock'n roll revolution in my opinion. Most rock bands since have just been an elaboration on the past.

And as for suicide, Kurt had his reasons. Most we'll probably never know. He suffered depression, addiction, chronic stomach pain, bla bla bla, he had his reasons. I feel sorry that Frances had to be raised by Courtney, but that's another story.

I had a friend who committed suicide with the same make of shotgun as Kurt did. The local media referred to it as a copycat suicide, which just makes it that much lamer. I could be mad at him and I certainly will never completely understand why he did it, but he's gone. And nothing's going to change that.

I am thankful that because of my friend's suicide, I never again was able to even consider doing it myself. So in that sense, he saved me. It effectively took suicide out of my options.

But back to the original point of this thread......

R.I.P. Kurt

baramiah · Post by **baramiah** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:31 pm

im comming into this thread late but decided to post anyways. Many people dont realize how much Nirvana, and Kurt affected my generation. He seemed to speak to you and know how you were feeling. in many ways Nirvana was The Beatles of my generation. The way they changed music. Made people think and feel. Its been 10 years and people are still talking about his death. And i believe that in 10 years we will still be talking about him. He will be missed now and forever.

R.I.P.

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Wed Jun 23, 2004 11:33 pm

He will be missed now and forever.

Three generations from now there'll be no one around who'll remember a single one of us. Cobain is no exception to that.

Sweet sentiments about 'now and forever' but the flow of life is ruder than that.

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 5:38 am

Badger wrote:
He will be missed now and forever.
Three generations from now there'll be no one around who'll remember a single one of us. Cobain is no exception to that.

Sweet sentiments about 'now and forever' but the flow of life is ruder than that.

Both sentiments are true in my humble world.

KellY · Post by **KellY** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 5:55 pm

Badger wrote:
He will be missed now and forever.
Three generations from now there'll be no one around who'll remember a single one of us. Cobain is no exception to that.

Sweet sentiments about 'now and forever' but the flow of life is ruder than that.

Are you suggesting everyone's going to be dead in three generations? Otherwise, I think there are plenty of people who will remember. My lovely wife just gave me a book of poetry by "The Shepard's Poet" John Clare, and a poem about autumn in northern England 180 years ago can bring tears to my eyes.

Hell, a hundred years from now you yourself might have a few pages in a book about the history of that legendary organization, The Black Rock Rangers...

That being said, I don't like to throw around words as absolute as "forever" either.

Badger · Post by **Badger** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 6:36 pm

Are you suggesting everyone's going to be dead in three generations?

Oh, no. Not at all. Only thing I was pointing to is that if you assume a generation is what, 40 years give or take, that in 120 years there'll be no living individuals around that'll be have actually known you or anyone else who lived during this time. Who we are might be rememebered through accounts, writings and such but we won't be rememebered by anyone who knew us.

Bob · Post by **Bob** » Thu Jun 24, 2004 7:16 pm

Good thing offing yourselves doesn't disqualify you from the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame.

There's hope yet for Whitesnake...

Simply Joel · Post by **Simply Joel** » Fri Jun 25, 2004 7:29 am

Bob wrote:Good thing offing yourselves doesn't disqualify you from the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame.

There's hope yet for Whitesnake...

zowie!

Rest In Peace Kurt Cobain

Re: Suicide