Burning Man and environmental impact of travelling there

[tamarakay]

Are you related to Sparr by chance?

[apprehensive]

Are you related to Sparr by chance?

Abandoned bikes are the scourge of the modern world.

[Meat Hunter]

TK.

I am laughing so much that you just caused me to choke on my fried chicken.

I was thinking the same thing. We should introduce them (Sparr & apprehensive). They would confound each other with their non-arguments and for so long that we would never hear from either of them -- ever again.

[some seeing eye]

Maybe mr apprehensive could travel by zorb from the UK to SF, given the prevailing Westerly winds? Then they could meet up and do whatever two trolzorbs do. Go by zorb = carbon zero.

Seriously though, mr apprehensive could book a freighter passage from UK to SF at essentially zero carbon impact and then write about it. Is he up to the challenge?

ePlaya would like to know if you will live up to your ideals!

[apprehensive]

Again, I'm happy to address any reasoned responses to my arguments, but ad hominem is waste of everyone's time.

Also, read what I'm saying again. I'm not saying that we should ban any explosions or the like, merely that there a range of options that could be introduced with minimal inconvenience or impact to the event but which would begin to mitigate the pollution footprint caused by it.

[Ratty]

AH, (I hope you don't mind my calling you that), this has nothing to do with travel but you may find it interesting. If you would like to personally make an impact on the amount of refuse added to the landfill I have an idea for you. Normally this would fall under the do-ocracy category. I'm not up for the challenge.

We are all aware of Recycle Camp. They only deal with aluminum cans. There is quite a bit of money in reclaiming them. There is also a fair amount of money in batteries. I work as a volunteer once a week on a loading dock at the recycle center. They LOVE having batteries dropped off. AA, AAA, 9 volt, C and D. If you would like a worthwhile pastime, look into starting Battery Recycle Camp.

As an aside, here in California the household batteries that you drop off at Home Depot or your local pharmacy are picked up weekly by the recycle company.

[GreyCoyote]

I'm not saying that WE should ban any explosions or the like, merely that there a range of options that could be introduced with minimal inconvenience or impact to the event but which would begin to mitigate the pollution footprint caused by it.

Interesting. You're part of BMORG, are you? (Echo... echo...)

Read A-Rock's signature line out loud. Get back to us.

[Dr. Pyro]

Is it just me or does this guy seem to have a real problem that is unsolvable? I mean, c'mon, who really gives a shit?

[some seeing eye]

apprehensive, look at the year first attended and number of posts by ePlayans commenting on this post. We are trying to help you in your participation in the event and on ePlaya.

Even with all our experience, years, ePlaya posts, BMORG connections and participation, we know we cannot radically change the direction of the event. It is open source.

Get focused on your virgin year

[tamarakay]

Is it just me or does this guy seem to have a real problem that is unsolvable? I mean, c'mon, who really gives a shit?

well yes, but I think he is having fun with us, and us with him.

[BBadger]

Maybe mr apprehensive could travel by zorb from the UK to SF, given the prevailing Westerly winds? Then they could meet up and do whatever two trolzorbs do. Go by zorb = carbon zero.

Seriously though, mr apprehensive could book a freighter passage from UK to SF at essentially zero carbon impact and then write about it. Is he up to the challenge?

He could do all that, but remember: it's how you travel the last 150-350 miles that counts.

The high-road of sin.

The low-road of virtue.

[mgb327]

Nothing will placate this troll.

[GreyCoyote]

Apprehensive: "...These are not the tree-huggers you are looking for..."

[apprehensive]

Thank you, Ratty.

Every thread on here that broaches the environment doesn't seem to go anywhere and ends up with the poster being dismissed as being a troll, so, again, should that be all you have to say then please don't respond to it.

[Bless]

Stop feeding the trolls.

[Elderberry]

Stop feeding the trolls.

Great idea.

[ygmir]

[media]

Stop feeding the trolls.

Great idea.

[maladroit]

I thought the OP actually DID go this year. That was the whole point of the Sob Story / LIT weirdness thread, right?

[lucky420]

I thought the OP actually DID go this year. That was the whole point of the Sob Story / LIT weirdness thread, right?

Yes I thought the op did go this year too. Many others icon this thread keep telling him/her to go first...?

[some seeing eye]

I thought OP did not go, but apparently they did. But they did not grok it is a fire festival.

To the OP you cannot change a thing if you cannot measure it and the change.

[Simon of the Playa]

hey, it could happen...

[BBadger]

I thought OP did not go, but apparently they did. But they did not grok it is a fire festival.

Attended by flying over 5,300 miles + driving an additional 650 miles in a comedy of errors.

[tamarakay]

Right. And that is what makes this the most hilarious thread going. I want to give the guy an award for best gag on a discussion board ever. Very clever.

[some seeing eye]

About 2 metric tons of carbon for your trip. Get a clue.

Propane is 12 pounds CO2 per gallon burned. Honda generators are about 22 pounds CO2 per gallon.

[apprehensive]

This is ad hominem. It's attacking the person making the argument and not addressing the argument itself.

My conscience is pretty clear regarding the amount of flying I do and my carbon footprint generally, both of which are well below average.

Instead, how, if at all, would you seek to mitigate against the pollution generated by international Burners? Carbon offsetting surcharge? Limit the number of tickets available to international attendees? Or do nothing and leave it up to the individual? It is, in practical terms, difficult for most international Burners to get to the event without flying. A domestic Burner could get to the event by driving in lieu of flying, but all travel attached to attending is ultimately a luxury and it's problematic to compare, leaving aside the sheer volume of pollution emitted by international travellers. As I'll say again, my own travel arrangements are what prompted this question, so let's try and focus on the arguments for and against any environmental initiatives instead of me.

Should the event choose to implement some green initiatives, then travel is probably where it will get the maximum gain for the least effort or inconvenience to Burners. I keep saying that I am in agreement that limiting the use of fuel for activities on the playa itself is a nonstarter, as it's such a core element of the event and, besides, looking at the statistics it accounts for a relatively small percentage of the total carbon footprint. The event is making efforts already to limit its impact on the environment and maybe the amount that it is currently doing is all that it can and should do be expected to do in this regard. Thank you for the responses thus far, even the Sir Mixalot clip though I'm still trying to figure out the latter's precise significance.

[Simon of the Playa]

shutthefuckupyoustupidass.jpg

[ygmir]

About 2 metric tons of carbon for your trip. Get a clue.

Propane is 12 pounds CO2 per gallon burned. Honda generators are about 22 pounds CO2 per gallon.

0k, I'm no chemist, but:
how, does propane, which weighs about 4 pounds per gallon, create 12 pounds of CO2?

[theCryptofishist]

apprehensive
Once a thread is started, it goes where it goes. You don't get to be a schoolteacher, declaring what the conversation is about and chiding those who will not conform to your dictates. This is eplaya, and that's how we do it here. Your best bet is to continue talking with those whose responses are pertinent, and letting the other stuff go.

[theCryptofishist]

About 2 metric tons of carbon for your trip. Get a clue.

Propane is 12 pounds CO2 per gallon burned. Honda generators are about 22 pounds CO2 per gallon.

0k, I'm no chemist, but:
how, does propane, which weighs about 4 pounds per gallon, create 12 pounds of CO2?

You've got to remember that burning is a process that adds oxygen to whatever it is you're burning. And that oxygen is heavier than carbon. And that carbon dioxide is two oxygens and one carbon. So, yeah, about three times as much by weight.

[ygmir]

About 2 metric tons of carbon for your trip. Get a clue.

Propane is 12 pounds CO2 per gallon burned. Honda generators are about 22 pounds CO2 per gallon.

0k, I'm no chemist, but:
how, does propane, which weighs about 4 pounds per gallon, create 12 pounds of CO2?

You've got to remember that burning is a process that adds oxygen to whatever it is you're burning. And that oxygen is heavier than carbon. And that carbon dioxide is two oxygens and one carbon. So, yeah, about three times as much by weight.

ah, good info, thanks Fishy. yeah I see it's taking oxygen from the atmosphere and combining with the carbon in the propane.
so adding about 4 lbs. of carbon to the atmosphere, owing to the oxygen already being there, albiet "free" O2.