People Are In Trouble and You Can Help....

[Rabbi Dali Rick]

Hi Guys,

I know you probably know that most of my post here are ususally flippant, off the cuff and usually just silly stuff but this is important and I need your help. A producer friend of mine who did the Federated Store commercials many years back with Shadoe Stevens, got an email from him that reads:


Dear Friends,

You know I rarely send "group" emails ---- but this is very important. It was sent to me by someone with the utmost integrity and I trust that the information is true.

Shadoe


Dear Friends,

Hi. Apologies for spamming you, but this is worthwhile.
It's not often that sitting at our computers sending mass emails may make an impact of our world, but in this modern age, as the trajedy in Burma continues to unfold, there is something we can do....
An Australian monk from Bundanoon fwded me this email with inside information from a monk in Burma.

Here is the original message:

Hello dear readers,
Today I received an e-mail from Shirley Blair, who runs the school in Nepal for which my website raises money. The e-mail is from a monk who details tragic news from Myanmar.

It is almost impossible for information to get out of the country. I am sending you this message in the hopes that someone can help get this news into the media. (I have already sent this e-mail to the papers and magazines I deal with.)

Sincerely,

Georgia

From:
Tashi Wangchuk <Email>[/Email]
Date:
28 Sep 2007 10:44
Subject:
Some Fact from Yangoon

We just got phone call with our sister living in Yangon about a few hours ago.
We saw on BBC world, saying that 200 monks were arrested. The true picture is far worse!!!!!!!!!

For one instance, the monastery at an obscure neighborhood of Yangon, called Ngwe Kyar Yan (on Wei-za-yan-tar Road, Yangon) had been raided early this morning. A troop of lone-tein (riot police comprised of paid thugs) protected by the military trucks, raided the monastery with 200 studying monks. They systematically ordered all the monks to line up and banged and crushed each one's head against the brick wall of the monastery. One by one, the peaceful, non resisting monks, fell to the ground, screaming in pain. Then, they tore off the red robes and threw them all in the military trucks (like rice bags) and took the bodies away.
The head monk of the monastery, was tied up in the middle of the monastery, tortured , bludgeoned, and later died the same day, today. Tens of thousands of people gathered outside the monastery, warded off by troops with bayoneted rifles, unable to help their helpless monks being slaughtered inside the monastery. Their every try to forge ahead was met with the bayonets. When all is done, only 10 out of 200 remained alive, hiding in the monastery. Blood stained everywhere on the walls and floors of the monastery.

Please tell your audience of the full extent of the fate of the monks please please !!!!!!!!!!!!

'Arrested' is not enough expression. They have been bludgeoned to death !!!!!!

Aye Aye
Hong Kong

Tashi Wangchuk
P.o Box 1287
Kathmandu. NEPAL-
Santi Forest Monastery
Lot 6 Coalmines Road
(PO Box 132)
Bundanoon
NSW 2578 Australia

Please read on; this is from Avaaz, which is doing a global petition to make it know to China and the UN what the voices of the world are saying....their target is to reach one million signers to achieve "A Global Roar".

Please follow their link and make yourself heard with all of us who care about what's happening in Burma....

Thankyou!


Dear Friends,

Burma's generals have brought their brutal iron hand down on peaceful monks and protesters -- but in response, a massive global outcry is gathering pace. The roar of global public opinion is being heard in hundreds of protests outside Chinese and Burmese embassies, people round the world wearing the monks' color red, and on the internet-- where our petition has exploded to over 200,000 signers in just 72 hours.

People power can win this. Burma's powerful sponsor China can halt the crackdown, if it believes that its international reputation and the 2008 Olympics in Beijing depend on it. To convince the Chinese government and other key countries, Avaaz is launching a major global and Asian ad campaign on Wednesday, including full page ads in the Financial Times and other newspapers, that will deliver our message and the number of signers. We need 1 million voices to be the global roar that will get China's attention. If every one of us forwards this email to just 20 friends, we'll reach our target in the next 72 hours. Please sign the petition at the link below -if you haven't already- and forward this email to everyone you care about:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/stand_with_burma/t.php

The pressure is working - already, there are signs of splits in the Burmese Army, as some soldiers refuse to attack their own people. The brutal top General, Than Shwe, has reportedly moved his family out of the country – he must fear his rule may crumble.

The Burmese people are showing incredible courage in the face of horror. We're broadcasting updates on our effort over the radio into Burma itself – telling the people that growing numbers of us stand with them. Let's do everything we can to help them – we have hours, not days, to do it. Please sign the petition and forward this email to at least 20 friends right now. Scroll down our petition page for details of times and events to join in the massive wave of demonstrations happening around the world at Burmese and Chinese >> embassies.

With hope and determination.


_________________________________________________________




As you know this is very serious, and these people need our help. Anything you can do with this information, even the smallest thing will help. Please feel free to post this message anywhere, to anyone you think can make a difference.




Today is the day you have to stand up and be the Hero.




you're bestest pal,

the rebbi

[Valkyrie]

Reports like these are always interesting. I'm thinking back to the one I received from a recruiter stating outrage over how the Taliban was seriously oppressing women in Afghanistan. (This was in '99 or so.)

What I told her was "yes, of course, there are terrible things going on in the world. Certainly, it's a supreme tragedy. What on earth do you expect to do about it? What should I do?" As everyone knows, nobody really did anything specific about the terribly oppressed women there, but things crumbled on their own. What she sent me, while true, left little room for action. Obviously someone's done something and we're all asking ourselves "are the warlords any better?" After all, rival warlords were struggling for control of Afghanistan long before the Taliban moved in. Women were treated just as badly then, as most Afghanis practiced pardee, the sequestering of women. Many argue that at least there was order when the Taliban was in town.

I also have to ask the same about this... what CAN be done? I'm a firm believer that people who sit in the first world and say "oh the violence!" are as much responsible for the violence as anyone. We so much want to meddle in affairs of state of foreign places, whether for benevolence or self-service. I can't help but believe that this manipulation is far more likely to do harm than good. If you think about it, it really is arrogance to believe that we know better than the people on the ground who are living it, as to how to resolve it.

It's hard to sit back and watch (or hear about) terrible world violence. After all, we're only better off than they largely out of luck. We could prop up an opposition group, but experience shows that such groups are likely to move into the role established by those they deposed as the pendulum swings back. It's only through popular local solidarity, disgust by those who are asked to commit atrocities, and other internal social changes can the volatile parts of the world settle out.

[LeChatNoir]

Reports like these are always interesting. I'm thinking back to the one I received from a recruiter stating outrage over how the Taliban was seriously oppressing women in Afghanistan. (This was in '99 or so.)

What I told her was "yes, of course, there are terrible things going on in the world. Certainly, it's a supreme tragedy. What on earth do you expect to do about it? What should I do?" As everyone knows, nobody really did anything specific about the terribly oppressed women there, but things crumbled on their own. What she sent me, while true, left little room for action. Obviously someone's done something and we're all asking ourselves "are the warlords any better?" After all, rival warlords were struggling for control of Afghanistan long before the Taliban moved in. Women were treated just as badly then, as most Afghanis practiced pardee, the sequestering of women. Many argue that at least there was order when the Taliban was in town.

I also have to ask the same about this... what CAN be done? I'm a firm believer that people who sit in the first world and say "oh the violence!" are as much responsible for the violence as anyone. We so much want to meddle in affairs of state of foreign places, whether for benevolence or self-service. I can't help but believe that this manipulation is far more likely to do harm than good. If you think about it, it really is arrogance to believe that we know better than the people on the ground who are living it, as to how to resolve it.

It's hard to sit back and watch (or hear about) terrible world violence. After all, we're only better off than they largely out of luck. We could prop up an opposition group, but experience shows that such groups are likely to move into the role established by those they deposed as the pendulum swings back. It's only through popular local solidarity, disgust by those who are asked to commit atrocities, and other internal social changes can the volatile parts of the world settle out.

Just curious, but what was also your take on the problems after Katrina?

[Valkyrie]

New Orleans was struck by a natural disaster. There's really only one side to that issue (although there were more than a few people on the wrong side nonetheless, but that's politics).

I'd hardly call a brutal military dictatorship a natural disaster. By putting them side by side, you either trivialize the politics that led up to the dictatorship or overestimate the kind of role people outside can take.

I'm not saying that there's nothing that could possibly be done, but fact of the matter is, most people who are not directly involved do not know enough to effect change in a productive, positive manner.

[LeChatNoir]

I was referring to the problems after Katrina that were related to humans interacting with other humans... or perhaps not interacting. It seems like you're proposing that since the problem in Myanmar is so complex and far away that "we" continue to do nothing and go about our collective business. Is this what you're saying?

If not what do you propose be done other than nothing?

[thisisthatwhichis]

It's hard to sit back and watch (or hear about) terrible world violence. After all, we're only better off than they largely out of luck. We could prop up an opposition group, but experience shows that such groups are likely to move into the role established by those they deposed as the pendulum swings back. It's only through popular local solidarity, disgust by those who are asked to commit atrocities, and other internal social changes can the volatile parts of the world settle out.

Part of what you say is very true..... But we are fortunate in this country, though, to "make" our gov'mt speak out with a voice, and hopefully $$$ they waste trying to influence those in power that are commiting atrocities.

It's too easy for evil powermongers to laugh behind the collection plate, as they promote fake promises to "reform"..... Hopefully an "outcry" will dry up the collection plate......

But Shit, but this one is bad... only to get worse...............

[Valkyrie]

In short, uh, yeah.

Unless you have the time to spare to go over there, risk your life, immerse yourself in their culture and politics, and even then only get a small fraction of the story, only to discover by the time you've figure out what the hell could have caused them to come to that, they've sorted themselves out.

It reminds me a little of Rwanda. I had an anthropology professor who spent some time over there before the conflict and knew people who were involved. He started explaining that the tensions between the hutus and the tutsis went back literally thousands of years and that it was people who tried to help them out that wound up disturbing the balance that wound up cascading them into that terrible violence.

I think one of the things a lot of fairy-tale-like movies tells us is that there can be clear black and white, when in real life there just isn't. Then again, we'd walk out of a movie that had solutions that are as slow, tortuous and unstable as the way it usually works in real life.


I am thinking that if you are really concerned about people who are suffering, it might be better to start taking a look closer to home. It's so much easier to get to understand those folks... but it's so much more glamorous to help the exotic Burmese. There are so many people who suffer in this world. Why neglect any one?

[LeChatNoir]

Why neglect any one?

Exactly and I try not to. Be it as simple as calling or writing someone who might be in a position to make a difference to as complex as loading up my truck and driving to where I can make a difference. I've not simply remained complacent over any atrocity that's crossed my screen yet.

[theCryptofishist]

It certainly gets my goat that Halliburton is helping the junta (or whatever the appropriate name for the dictators is) for money. Yeah, we haven't been able to stop Halliburton from running all over this country, but perhaps we do bear some responcibility here. I don't know what to do, just like I don't know what to do about oil companies in Nigeria.

[theCryptofishist]

Maybe this will add something to our perspectives.

[thisisthatwhichis]

In short, uh, yeah.

It reminds me a little of Rwanda. Why neglect any one?

Ummmm.... Yea, I almost went there, but stopped short..... Still, we DO HAVE A VOICE!...... Gosh, it never seems like it, but, thankfully we do....... and can send messages to the gov'mt directly.

As far as us "lucky" peeps that live in 'merica, there are lots of resources, compared to many other countries..... as LCN has opined.....

We could look inward, but I think plenty of us, including myself already do.... Fact is, we are a world comunity... I don't separate suffering from any region of the world........

On the other hand.... manipulation/terror/social straight-jakets around the world are kinda worth paying attention to.......

(joking).... Or I could just say we are all Fucking DOOMED!!!!

[Rabbi Dali Rick]

First They Came for the Blacks

First they came for the Blacks
and I did not speak out
because I was not Black.
Then they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the Monks
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Monk.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left
to speak out for me.

[Valkyrie]

Cryptofishy, that's a magnificent article. I think everyone should read it before replying. Then again, it's so much easier to shoot from the hip without thinking too hard about things.


Here's the bit that gets me the most about reactions I see: You actually have the trust enough in your government to not screw up the situation like they have everywhere else they've intervened?!? I simply cannot believe that people have that much faith in them!

Think about it folks. When the government doesn't act to stop such violence, you get all up in arms trying to get them to move and make a change in the world. When the government does act (by doing something phenomenally stupid like going to war, but hey, how else are they supposed to make people behave?) you're also up in arms trying to just let the people whose lives they're screwing up be. You expect the government to be or do something it's not?


Besides, I'm still not convinced that letter isn't from a Nigerian spammer somewhere along the line. People who are legitimately involved in relief efforts will actually offer suggestions on things to do.

If you want to make a real difference, go back to the organizations you've been supporting all along and inquire about special campaigns for trouble areas. Of course, if you were a conscientious person, you'd have already heard from your organization of choice. For example, I'm a fan of Amnesty International, as they do this whole "anti-repression" business. They've got a lot of news about Myanmar currently, and a few things you can do if you're motivated by this to finally get involved with the world and do something.

[Rabbi Dali Rick]

Valkry I "personally" know,( except for the monks of course) and can vouch for the people in the email, as I'm sure others here can vouch for me.


It's you, I'm not so sure about.







the rebbi

[BAS]

I heard about Burma almost ten years ago, and had no idea what to do about that situation then, and still do not. Last I heard, almost no businesses were willing to do business them (not even the sweat-shop, garment industry-- the government there is too corrupt even for them [they tend to bleed the cash cows dry]). I seem to recall that only a few of the nearby countries are willing to have anything to do with them. Burma is just about as isolated as a nation can get itself. This was the same trouble we had with Afghanistan. Short of invading, there doesn't seem much of a way to force a change on the nation (and right now we are spread much too thin, with Baby Bush practically wetting his pants to go into Iran!)

I am really open to suggestions on what can be done.

I wasn't aware Halliburton was one of the few companies willing to do business with Burma, but somehow it doesn't surprise me....


(a very tired) B.

[diane o'thirst]

If not what do you propose be done other than nothing?

International outrages are something that always sticks in my craw.
Yes, they happen. They always have, and always will. Yes, they're horrible. There isn't a single inch of ground in the humanosphere that hasn't, at one time or another, absorbed human blood; some accidental, some by design.

But, what can you do?
Beat your breast? Stand on the street corner holding signs and yelling? Blog? Write the UN? Throw money at it?

Is there any guarantee that the money you throw at it will go where you intended it to go? Or do what you intended it to do?
What if you have no money?
How can you keep someone from dying in pain, half a world away, by standing in an intersection with a piece of white cardboard in your hands?

I hate to sound callous, but those monks are dead, there's nothing else we can do for them. My $20 won't do bugger against the Burmese junta. My refusal to travel there won't do a lot, either.

[LeChatNoir]

Simply raising public awareness, talking about it, seems a far cry better than shrugging one's shoulders and saying, "Oh well". And though it may not mean much to anyone, one who did stand on a street corner with a piece of cardboard could at least say they did something.

The act of standing up and saying something might not stop the butt of a rifle from crushing bone. But you may well give much needed strength to those who were one step away from that death blow and are now wondering how to keep on living without someone. A few people pushing just a little bit can make big differences, even if only to a handful of people. In fact, I've known quite a few folks who have been helped in times of need by the simple acts of others.

I've heard before that if you scratch the surface of a cynic you’ll find a disappointed optimist.