This is supposed to be easy, is it?

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.
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DVD Burner
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Post by DVD Burner » Thu Jul 30, 2009 9:53 pm

Ugly Dougly wrote:It was easy when it was on the beach.

"The thing was burning when we got here!"
ditto!
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Igneouss
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Post by Igneouss » Fri Jul 31, 2009 7:32 am

Evolution:
Burning Man style...

Three groups evolved.
1) those that remain 'radically self reliant'
2) those that have come to depend on organized camps for support. Call it 'radical group reliance'. One person arranges water. Another, a kitchen. Who's building the showers?...
3) those that simply solve all logistical issues with money. Don't just rent an RV, have it delivered and set up. Charter and airplane to bring you to BRC. Have everything you could need or want shipped in by truck.

As far as I can tell (which is pretty far), if the first burner was radically self reliant, the second had an RV....

Larry lives in an RV.

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Fire_Moose
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Post by Fire_Moose » Fri Jul 31, 2009 7:44 am

is double posting yer new schtick....trying to boost yer post count huh?
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Igneouss
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Post by Igneouss » Fri Jul 31, 2009 11:44 am

It's my work server. Sometimes it does that. Sometimes Eplaya catches it and sometimes not. It happens to my email also.

Sorry.

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Fire_Moose
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Post by Fire_Moose » Fri Jul 31, 2009 12:37 pm

Just talkin' anonymous shit. No need for apologies.
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Igneouss
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Post by Igneouss » Fri Jul 31, 2009 1:26 pm

No worries.
Here's me posting from home. No double post :)

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Ugly Dougly
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Fri Jul 31, 2009 1:40 pm

Igneouss wrote:It's my work server. Sometimes it does that. Sometimes Eplaya catches it and sometimes not. It happens to my email also.

Sorry.
That's because it's sending all your posts for your boss to see. ;)

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Igneouss
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Post by Igneouss » Fri Jul 31, 2009 1:47 pm

Ugly Dougly wrote:
Igneouss wrote:It's my work server. Sometimes it does that. Sometimes Eplaya catches it and sometimes not. It happens to my email also.

Sorry.
That's because it's sending all your posts for your boss to see. ;)
My boss would be clueless about Burning Man. :)

trenton
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Post by trenton » Tue Aug 04, 2009 7:51 am

I'm confused, radical self reliance sounds like a oxymoron to me. I dont see that British army guy droping into BM and seting up a piece of plastic to sweat up a cup of water a day then heading out to the rock outcrops to get a rattle snake to have protien to survive. There is not enough snakes within walking distance to support 50k people! I work hard the other 52 weeks to pay my bills and take a week off to enjoy the desert that I grew up in with 50k other people. I work while I am at BM ( teeter totter of death) wich is a 8 hr athletic event. Ilike going back to my RV for a good nights rest so I can entertain the mases that want a ride the next day. Dont hate people that work hard to afford these luxurys. You might be one of the people that reap the benefit of said item. Dont get me wrong I still enjoy a tent camping trip however the desert is harsh and I want to feel relaxed and refreshed when I get back to the daily gring of reality that I call home. The happy medium between self reliance and self preservation seems blured to me!

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AntiM
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Post by AntiM » Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:04 am

It isn't about survivalism, it is about making the best of what resources you have access to. You have and desire access to an RV. That you can afford it and use it is your means of self-reliance. You don't show up and demand an RV from strangers. For me, radical self-reliance means having a MyLarry and friends who can get me there and set up camp around me. I can't even drive, or lift more than 20 pounds, so I'd never do it all on my lonesome. My inner resources allow me to make and give away art.

From teh Ten Principles:

Radical Self-reliance
Burning Man encourages the individual to discover, exercise and rely on his or her inner resources.

The disconnect comes when people ask others to do it for them, but not in the normal social/family setting which evolves over time, but in the "Who can I pay to do this for me?" mindset. The board is crawling with people who haven't even read the damn survival guide or read the main site enough to know what resources are out there.

trenton
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Post by trenton » Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:47 am

People like you AntiM IS the reason I go to BM.
Art weather phyical or object or sound. In the words of one of my favorite artist
It takes every kind of people- Robert Palmer

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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:22 pm

The "radical self-reliance" thing seems to be to be more of an aspiration than an actual achievement. And when you throw in "radical (?is that teh rght word?) community" it becomes a line you walk. I'd say that you've got yourself in the fuzzy bullseye. You know what you want for yourself, and provide it; you give back to the community.

It's like the limit lines of a hyperbole. You can get close, but you never actually touch.
The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

trenton
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Post by trenton » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:31 pm

I think the bullseye needs a fuzzy navel pass the oj please Thanks

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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Tue Aug 04, 2009 4:33 pm

Hey! The Bar's in Open Discussion!
The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

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Elorrum
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Post by Elorrum » Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:59 pm

"The disconnect comes when people ask others to do it for them, but not in the normal social/family setting which evolves over time, but in the "Who can I pay to do this for me?" yep, AnitM I agree. From each according to their ability is absolutely fair. There's no element of self reliance for those who see this as a funky party adventure vacation, one they just sign up for and make the hotel/camp booking. What concerns me more is the apparent quantity of people who don't consider themselves capable of this without the "support" they are expecting from complete strangers, through purchase or friendly instant symbiosis. They may be capable and they don't even know it. They don't get to find that out.

Alright, my burning man and their burning man will have to coexist. It's a big place.

spectabillis
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Post by spectabillis » Tue Aug 04, 2009 9:14 pm

... the expectations of attending Burning Man begun to encompass concepts such as...
could have stuck with that, mix with a bit of scriptured principals, how the event is changing and change is ok, how it.. you get the idea. there isnt a single aspect of burningman that is important enough to withstand the test of time, except whatever gets reduced to a party atmosphere and those who rule by it.

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Apollonaris Zeus
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Post by Apollonaris Zeus » Tue Aug 04, 2009 9:40 pm

spectabillis wrote:
... the expectations of attending Burning Man begun to encompass concepts such as...
could have stuck with that, mix with a bit of scriptured principals, how the event is changing and change is ok, how it.. you get the idea. there isnt a single aspect of burningman that is important enough to withstand the test of time, except whatever gets reduced to a party atmosphere and those who rule by it.
Sex and Drugs are here to stay!

I'm not sure if Rock and Roll will fits into the future equation though?

And Art? What about him? Is it just an excuse for the above?

Radical Self Reliance sure has changed and morph into "Hey, bring you're own shit!" I guess.

AIIZ

spectabillis
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Post by spectabillis » Tue Aug 04, 2009 10:53 pm

cheebus a2z, you didnt get the point.

but probably doesnt matter since the discussion wont result in something useful, and like the event, is more oriented to whatever entertains.

Psyteknology
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Post by Psyteknology » Wed Aug 05, 2009 8:04 am

[quote="gyre"]I still can't believe there is no organized transport from the airport.
It's a bit of a walk.[/quote]

You're supposed to jump out of the plane when it's just over your camp, duh!! Didn't you read the survival guide and the back of yer ticket ? It's all right there.... hehehe :twisted:
"Your thoughts are giving structure to your future, so consider each one
carefully. Self doubt or negativity is a luxory you cannot afford right
now--there is too much at stake."

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Ugly Dougly
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Post by Ugly Dougly » Wed Aug 05, 2009 10:13 am

The DPW staff went out to the desert and bulldozed everything flat FOR YOU removing all the cactuses and rattlesnakes and thornbushes, and you still complain. :roll:

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theCryptofishist
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Post by theCryptofishist » Wed Aug 05, 2009 10:39 am

Ugly Dougly wrote:The DPW staff went out to the desert and bulldozed everything flat FOR YOU removing all the cactuses and rattlesnakes and thornbushes, and you still complain. :roll:
I lost my leg to an unsmoothed cactus spine in 06. Look at me being stalwart and not complaining. Although if I had that leg, I might kick dpw in the ass.
The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri

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wedeliver
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Post by wedeliver » Wed Aug 05, 2009 2:40 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:....I lost my leg to an unsmoothed cactus spine in 06. Look at me being stalwart and not complaining. Although if I had that leg, I might kick dpw in the ass.
For some of us a visual helps, stalwart
Image

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