The Bar 2014 Edition

LeChatNoir · Post by **LeChatNoir** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:02 pm

unjonharley wrote:[Is that nice lady still hanging around your house? We (@ the bar) would like to hear from her..

Thankfully, she is still hanging around. Or should I say, letting me hang around her. I'll try and wrangle her in here at some point. Things are good here. Busy and bustling.

^Rhino! · Post by **^Rhino!** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 2:50 pm

Supposedly we could get hit with a 'big' quake if the New Madrid fault zone acts up. Problem there for me is the shear factor. If you're down there, g= 0.45, which is the maximum for the state. San Fran is looking at a g= 0.7. By happenstance, I looked up the g for the big quake at that knocked out Fukushima Daiichi, theirs is around 2.0. Living on a subduction zone, I suppose.

Where I live at, g = 0.1or less, which means we don't even have to consider seismic moment in bridge design. Nonetheless, we build to take a M7.5 regardless. It means a LOT more rebar and concrete.

Tornadoes are another story entirely. The F5 that hit Joplin was total destruction. I've seen an F2 here within the city limits, and personally was within 200 feet of an F1. Scary.

One year, in BRC a dust devil was bearing down on us, and something snapped in my brain. I'd had enough dust. I ran out from the camp straight towards it screaming at the top of my lungs,

"Come on, Motherf _ _ _er, You think you bother us? You are NOTHING compared to the tornadoes in Missouri. You don't even have HALF the balls of an F1! Why don't you go back to where you came from?!!"

When the dust devil pulled back into the sky, no one was more surprised than I. Just another example of playadipity.

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sat Mar 29, 2014 3:49 pm

LeChatNoir wrote:
unjonharley wrote:[Is that nice lady still hanging around your house? We (@ the bar) would like to hear from her..
Thankfully, she is still hanging around. Or should I say, letting me hang around her. I'll try and wrangle her in here at some point. Things are good here. Busy and bustling.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:13 am

*strolls in, makes CCC*
dang, missed our favorite black feline! (re-fills rafter milk and whiskey bowls)

we got ice and freezing rain last night.........I hope the plums survive.....fruit just set.

*strokes TV, heads for IBBOD*

[media]

^Rhino! · Post by **^Rhino!** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:31 am

Good morning, all!

Yep, I missed Le Chat, too. I've met him once. I've also met his wife. Both great people. Anybody seen 'The Contraption'? That is one major-league art car that she and Le Chat created. Creative.

Yggy, I missed you coming in, too. Guess you put War Rabbit in stealth mode again. You're going to have to quit doing that around friends, unless you've got a practical joke in mind [*Rhino looks for tell-tale burning 'hotfoot' match between his toes, then breathes easier again.....]

I just looked at the USGS real-time earthquake report site. It seems to me there's a trend developing of earthquakes in a northeast direction from La Brea. The latest quake is a 4.1 near Rowland Hills. Aftershock of yesterday's quake? Possible. Did they feel it? Probably. On the developing trend line....definitely. The trend line is probably parallel to subsidiary faults in the area, and perpendicular to the San Andreas.

West Yellowstone has reported three or four this a.m., too. I'm watching it. If they start getting an earthquake swarm under Lake Yellowstone, it could be a sign of magma movement. Signal of an eruption of the caldera? Not enough data yet.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:18 am

Hey Rhino!

yeah the War Rabbit has been practicing for summer hunting stealth........be warned!

Do you have a good earthquake map? I don't like the changes to the USGS one, or at least the one I see from them.

IIRC, we have dozens of earthquakes, per day, overall in CA. they do pattern up and down certain areas of the San Andreas, and subsidiaries.

But, there are a couple of "locked" areas, that don't move, or, move so smoothly they don't register. not.

A friend, who used to post here (hopefully will come back, both socks), works at a lab that among other things, monitors radon out-gassing in certain areas, said it was the highest he'd ever seen a month or so ago. but this was up in the Bay Area. I've also heard predictions based on hot springs and such.

sadie · Post by **sadie** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:56 am

Hi Rhino! Hi Ygmir!

I am at work today...matinee dance show.

first position pleee-ay, tippy tippy toe - JUMP!!

Thought I would dance a little jig for everyone today.

Later..

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:07 am

HI Sadie!!
thanks for the dance!!

I'll join you! *cues "dance of the sugar plum faeries"*

Elorrum · Post by **Elorrum** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:34 am

here goes nothing...

*spin* and finish with a flourish, ta-da!!!

good to see you this morning all! Sadie, Rhino, ygmir, any I missed.

I just ordered some earthquake kit refresher items. Emergency stuff with a double purpose for Burning Man: some MREs with heaters, for the possible second day of a storm at Burning Man when a hot meal is just what I really need but the stove won't work. Cheap red backpack for the car go-bag. A couple black 2qt canteens... water, or water heaters on playa. My solar shower died last year, just a slow playa watering system now. Poncho and poncho liner for the car kit.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:26 pm

Elorrum wrote:here goes nothing...

*spin* and finish with a flourish, ta-da!!!

good to see you this morning all! Sadie, Rhino, ygmir, any I missed.

I just ordered some earthquake kit refresher items. Emergency stuff with a double purpose for Burning Man: some MREs with heaters, for the possible second day of a storm at Burning Man when a hot meal is just what I really need but the stove won't work. Cheap red backpack for the car go-bag. A couple black 2qt canteens... water, or water heaters on playa. My solar shower died last year, just a slow playa watering system now. Poncho and poncho liner for the car kit.

don't forget a hand held C.B. radio.
in case of cataclysm, Marty and I have a plan to rent/borrow a helicopter, to find friends.
if it hits so. cal. we'll head for Ventura, first, to get my daughter, but will skim along the way, looking for others.
the "call signal" is channel 1, every hour, on the hour, using your playa name.
Marty is a highly skilled and decorated "scout" or "LOACH" pilot from Vietnam, none better at make one do it's job.
If it hits' nor. cal. , we'll cruise the effected areas..

believe this.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:33 pm

What ch # do you watch on the way to BM?

^Rhino! · Post by **^Rhino!** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 1:06 pm

Greetings, all!

Yggy, USGS has got the best maps I've seen of the earthquakes that occur in California, but they come out only at scientific meetings I've been at and I've never seen them on sale in Rolla, MO, which has a service center. Probably because we're getting the water resources publications from there for Missouri, and karst maps for the central states. I'll nose around a little at the University of Missouri's geology library...I'm an alumnus with a state-issued library card, and also because they're a USGS mapping repository.

Radon outgassing as an indicator for earthquakes I'm not familiar with. I know you get radon as a decomposition byproduct of uranium in heavy minerals in granites (there was a scare about radon emitted from countertops that was totally unjustified a few years back - I read the Health Physics articles that proved it) There HAS been increased mining for ore in that area, so I'm not surprised about the increase.

**Rhino does the electric slide to the tune of Gloria Gaynor's "I Will Survive"**

[media]

I dedicate that in return to Sadie.

Ask me about it sometime, there's a huge story to that in my life. It all came together in 2009 at Burningman, and in 2010 I continued the story. 2012 and 2013 seemed to be ramping up for something big for me in BRC. So, now I have ticket, will travel, and who knows what awaits!

Yggy, whatever it takes. You have a good plan there. Your chopper pilot should be one of the best, an ex-Nam LOACH pilot probably knows more about infils and exfils than most. He could dust off in a heartbeat if he had to.

Elorrum, let me remind you to replace those MREs periodically. They can go bad. My personal choice in the event of a disaster still, though, has to be the Cambell's "hungry man" soups....chunky and good for me. Lots of crackers. Bags of Halloween candy (Reeses' PB Cups, Mounds Bars) and jars of nuts round it out for me, along with a big container of instant Folgers' coffee. Hormel one-dish meals are good, too.

MRE originally meant "Meal Rejected by Ethiopians" to most of us who've had the first issue. Now, the manufacturers have done better. Still, very few things were as good as the chocolate disks, crackers, jelly and peanut butter in the old C-ration issues. Single serving fruit cocktails were also hard to come by, but they tasted great!

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 1:24 pm

Hi UJH!!
we use the C.B. on the way out to BRC, on our two (maybe 3 this year) trips, but just find the clearest channel with no one else there.

It'd be fine, maybe even fun, though,if we all agreed on a channel to monitor, to see who's where, and when.

@ Rhino:
not looking for hard copy maps, I mean the "real time" ones......USGS used to be really good, they did some upgrades and now it is not to my liking.......or my browser does not like what they did (firefox).

related to food in crisis: don't forget "long pork".............

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 1:35 pm

ygmir wrote:...
related to food in crisis: don't forget "long pork".............

Kind'a unpleasant, but.... When I ran Kinetic Sculpture Race Camp in 2007, we had two hangers-on with less than stellar personalities. I was talking to a friend when the worst hanger-on did something stupid and I said to my friend: "When we get stranded here by a huge rain, and we are still here and snowed in come December, he's the first one we eat." Apparently this got around, because he moved out early.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 1:50 pm

I stay on CH#17.. Its the family channel in this area..Have a couple of hand held and one in dash.. Hardly ever turn them on in the profane world..

Would like to CB travel with other burners go/come BM..

Elliot, Salted and dried lady finger sound good for a snack..

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 3:07 pm

unjonharley wrote:I stay on CH#17.. Its the family channel in this area..Have a couple of hand held and one in dash.. Hardly ever turn them on in the profane world..

Would like to CB travel with other burners go/come BM..

Elliot, Salted and dried lady finger sound good for a snack..

channeling Jeff Dahmer again UJH?.............

yeah, C.B. traveling is fun. We should decide a channel.

I may be up in your neck of the woods over easter, UJH.

Elorrum · Post by **Elorrum** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:52 pm

My main emergency supply is just my small canned goods cupboard which I rotate through periodically and bring some to BRC as well. Soups, beans, veggies, fruit. That with dried beans and rice, and water. Just a basic 3 dayer is all I plan for. The MRE's are a new indulgence/test, plus I figured I should have something more comprehensive in my car.
the radio helicopter flyover is wow, ygmir. thanks for the comforting thoughts there. You can use your RDF and hone in on station K-ELO also

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:35 pm

^Rhino! wrote:...peanut butter in the old C-ration issues...

For a while, a lot of ours were stale-dated but not expired, that were cycled out of your supply. That peanut butter had to be CUT with a knife.
But the taste was still there.

gaminwench · Post by **gaminwench** » Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:13 pm

I'm suddenly feeling quite fortunate that I live near Ventura

is it bad that I'm also now looking forward to the catastrophiclysm?!?

Post by **AntiM** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:39 am

I live about a mile from the Wasatch Front. We have earthquakes, but not many which can be felt. If and when we get a big one, this is going to suck. My house was originally owned by Mormons, so it has the built in storage racks for canned food, and an under-stair pantry. I'm set for food, as long as I could find water. If my house stands. Ha.

I have deep doubts about my long term survival skills in disaster hits when Larry is out on the road.

Oh well....

^Rhino! · Post by **^Rhino!** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:39 am

Canoe, I'm really very glad somebody remembers the old C-ration peanut butter. Good old repackaged government surplus 100% peanut butter. It came in the little 4 oz C-ration cans and the big peanut butter cans, #10 tin can size, that they used to give to school lunch programs and boy scout camps. Thick...you could eat it with a fork. Real peanutty taste. Its best use was in the peanut butter cookies that the little old ladies used to make in school lunchrooms. They'd spoon the batter out onto a tray, and each spoonful was given a double impression of a fork on top. Remember those? They were peanutty good.

AntiM, you're correct in your knowledge of the Wasatch Front. I made a brief visit to the Utah Geological Survey site this a.m., and found the 'shake maps' for four counties in your area; Utah, Davis, Weber, and Salt Lake: http://www.geology.utah.gov/utahgeo/haz ... /index.htm. Click on the map you want, and you can get the 'g' for what area is closest to you. The 'g' is used in calculations of soil liquefaction and other seismic calculations, and is a good relative measure of what kind of shear transmission of force to expect.

Liquefaction can be NASTY, if you're in some types of clay soil. It will jiggle like a bowl full of jelly, and soil loses all of its strength. This also happens in areas built on fill. One of the worst examples I can think of is Mexico City, where fill was piled on a lake bed. When they had a major earthquake, the whole valley that the city was in had a seismic wave travel back and forth in a phenomenon known as a seiche (pronounced 'seech') that affected the lake that the city was built in. Lake Tahoe is susceptible to seiches. In fact, the Feb. 27, 2010 earthquake that hit Chile affected Lake Ponchartrain, Louisiana with a seiche that approached 0.5 feet. Seismic waves travel great distances, but their strength drops with the square root of the distance involved. You go 2 miles away, you get 1/4 of the wave strength.

gaminwench....it's not bad that you're looking forward to the catastrophiclysm....I want to observe a few myself before I start pushing up daisies.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:43 am

*rides up on War Rabbit™ unbridles for hunting*
*strolls in bar*
Yeah , GW, you're on the short list down there. Knowing right where you are, maybe, we'd cruise right up from Ventura.
The one friend I have, has Huey's, so we can carry a few. Marty can fly anything.

The news this morning is calling for snow for us, later in the week. And just as my tulips are blooming. I better get a couple of photos.
It seems, the "new" bulbs I peeled of when I dug them up, and planted, won't bloom this year. dang. Lots came up, but seem way behind the bigger "mother" bulbs I peeled them off of. Lots of gladiolas just coming through the ground now, so I'm hopeful the bulb separating on them worked.

AntiM: if, you get a shaker, I'd bet your house does fine. I'm hoping/guessing, the blocks are filled with concrete and rebar (like the Hof core), and so, should be damn strong and stable. Might crack but........and, if a big shaker comes, after checking for gas leaks, or just turning it off at first, fill your bathtub and everysink and such with water. There is always at least residual pressure in lines for a time. and remember, toilet tanks are full of clean water.

and, if it happens there, probably not here, so, we'll mount and "eplaya rescue"............*sounds cavalry trumpet**

Joeln · Post by **Joeln** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:49 am

ygmir wrote:and, if it happens there, probably not here, so, we'll mount and "eplaya rescue"............*sounds cavalry trumpet**

And if you both get hit, us Colorado folks will have to mount a rescue from the east...

FIGJAM · Post by **FIGJAM** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:52 am

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:58 am

I live next to a volcano and a geothermal field, so you can just write me off right now.

Of course, I have pedal-powered amphibious vehicles, so I just might emerge from the rubble with the cockroaches.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:00 am

Joeln wrote:
ygmir wrote:and, if it happens there, probably not here, so, we'll mount and "eplaya rescue"............*sounds cavalry trumpet**
And if you both get hit, us Colorado folks will have to mount a rescue from the east...

Hey Joeln: well yeah, and yay. But, I'd imagine any quake, that seriously affected CA and UT, would be the whole great basin sinking or something similar, and probably shake the hell out of the Rockies, as well.
But, the general idea of friends rescuing friends, to me, is where it's at.

lucky420 · Post by **lucky420** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:50 am

ygmir wrote:
Joeln wrote:
ygmir wrote:and, if it happens there, probably not here, so, we'll mount and "eplaya rescue"............*sounds cavalry trumpet**
And if you both get hit, us Colorado folks will have to mount a rescue from the east...
Hey Joeln: well yeah, and yay. But, I'd imagine any quake, that seriously affected CA and UT, would be the whole great basin sinking or something similar,and probably shake the hell out of the Rockies, as well.
But, the general idea of friends rescuing friends, to me, is where it's at.

eeeeeek!

Aurelia · Post by **Aurelia** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:53 am

ooo..!
Can I come too ?

Joeln · Post by **Joeln** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:56 am

ygmir wrote:and, if it happens there, probably not here, so, we'll mount and "eplaya rescue"............*sounds cavalry trumpet**

And while we're on the subject of mounting, who is this "eplaya rescue" person and do you have any pix of her?

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:04 am

^Rhino! wrote:

Liquefaction can be NASTY, if you're in some types of clay soil. It will jiggle like a bowl full of jelly, and soil loses all of its strength. This also happens in areas built on fill. One of the worst examples I can think of is Mexico City, where fill was piled on a lake bed. When they had a major earthquake, the whole valley that the city was in had a seismic wave travel back and forth in a phenomenon known as a seiche (pronounced 'seech') that affected the lake that the city was built in. Lake Tahoe is susceptible to seiches. In fact, the Feb. 27, 2010 earthquake that hit Chile affected Lake Ponchartrain, Louisiana with a seiche that approached 0.5 feet. Seismic waves travel great distances, but their strength drops with the square root of the distance involved. You go 2 miles away, you get 1/4 of the wave strength.

This is what I feel happened to the island of Atlantes.. In the greek writings it turned into a mud pie over night.. Then was washed away by the sea..

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