Large Sound Camp DJ Line-ups.

[Jovankat]

So my being completely ignorant of anything to do with the music side of things is actually helpful to the event in terms of being able to justify that it's not just a music festival right? So staying ignorant is like the scared duty of us musical ignoramuses now right? Don't worry I'VE GOT THIS COVERED GUYS!

[Roberto Dobbisano]

i'd like to clarify something.

i am not against Big Name DJ's. I am not against Big Sound….i love the shit, you know that. some of my good friends are objects of cults of personality, i don't begrudge them success or fame.



think of it this way…..what is better, suddenly coming across one of your favorite "acts" out of nowhere on some random venue VS. showing up at an appointed "time & Place" to see a prefab set, exactly one hour long, because you know, there's a fucking schedule to adhere to…

hell it was ADVERTISED….

one is serendipitous bliss, the other is defaultia expectations.

and you know what happens when you have expectations.




and…..whats to stop Pershing County or any other Official Agency from trying to designate BM as a "music festival" vs. an "art festival", because , you know, the fuck you fees and taxes almost double in Nevada for that shit, and look…... we have Music Line-ups being ADVERTISED, way in advance of the event.

just warning'...

Spot on! We already have a congresswoman down in Vegas who wants to start taxing/new fee this event because it's not just a party in the desert. She sees it as a venue, etc and should be subject to fees/taxes in accordance with other concerts, events.

yes....we are aware.

[EspressoDude]

It's supposed to be a Flaming FIRE Festival. It is not called Music Man. At the end the Man does not sing, beat drums, or put headphones on and push the play button on his PC screen

[Bless]

i'd like to clarify something.

i am not against Big Name DJ's. I am not against Big Sound….i love the shit, you know that. some of my good friends are objects of cults of personality, i don't begrudge them success or fame.



think of it this way…..what is better, suddenly coming across one of your favorite "acts" out of nowhere on some random venue VS. showing up at an appointed "time & Place" to see a prefab set, exactly one hour long, because you know, there's a fucking schedule to adhere to…

hell it was ADVERTISED….

one is serendipitous bliss, the other is defaultia expectations.

and you know what happens when you have expectations.




and…..whats to stop Pershing County or any other Official Agency from trying to designate BM as a "music festival" vs. an "art festival", because , you know, the fuck you fees and taxes almost double in Nevada for that shit, and look…... we have Music Line-ups being ADVERTISED, way in advance of the event.

just warning'...

I know I'm wading into the lion's den on this one, but here it goes anyways:

TTITD is an arts festival, not a music festival. Just because a few sound camps publish their schedules beforehand, does not make it a music festival. And I sincerely doubt that Dina Titus is going to hold up White Ocean's lineup when making her case in court for a different tax regime.

Is TTITD figuratively turning into a music festival? I doubt it. The quality of music and acts is still far below that of any major music festival (of which there are quite a few these days). Do you think some candy raver is going to take the time and effort to buy a ticket, schlep out into the middle of the desert for a week, just to see Paul Oakenfold?

I know we have this debate every year, and I know where the sympathies of the majority of people on this board lie... but I wish someone would stand up to this "sky is falling, we're all going to get taxed into oblivion if one more sound camp posts their lineup on Facebook" hyperbole.

This argument about serendipity would hold more water if most theme camps didn't published all of their non-music events beforehand. Last time I checked, we have a whole booklet of pre-planned events numbering in the thousands. Does that represent "default expectations" as well?

And again, what happened to radical inclusion? We shouldn't shush Simon at the Temple burn and he shouldn't shush sound camps trying to do their thing.

[Simon of the Playa]

let me tell you why...

[media]

[theCryptofishist]

Kissinger plays the accordion? Now i have to revise my whole opinion of the warmongering murderer man.

[Roberto Dobbisano]

the quality of music and acts is still far below that of any major music festival (of which there are quite a few these days)

you are either Drunk, High, Stupid or Terribly Terribly Misinformed.


which one is it?

[Simon of the Playa]

fishy, i knew you would catch that...

[theCryptofishist]

Accordions are the ultimate aphrodisiac.

[H.G.Crosby]

Accordions are the ultimate aphrodisiac.

SHHHHHH!!!!



then every schmo looking to get laid will bring an accordion to the playa....thats supposed to be on the down low....


gah.

[Simon of the Playa]

so many stars.

[Simon of the Playa]

.

[some seeing eye]

The ORG should go after the promoters for infringement. (given the above, it might be worth it) The DJ schedule should be word of mouth on the playa day of. That's how I found about Daft Punk.

It's not a "festival" with a "schedule" of "names". (or is it?)

[lucky420]

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrggggggghhhhhhhhhhhh

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[H.G.Crosby]

.

[Eric]

This argument about serendipity would hold more water if most theme camps didn't published all of their non-music events beforehand. Last time I checked, we have a whole booklet of pre-planned events numbering in the thousands. Does that represent "default expectations" as well?

You bet your sweet bippy it does. There's the camps expectation that their event will be seen, the participants' expectation that events will actually happen (maybe even at the stated time), everyone who uses it has an expectation that they can organize their day or week around events in it. All default behaviors. I'd love to see camps use the "hawking" method of getting people in, instead of the guide - grab a megaphone (or a loud-voiced campmate), entice people to your bar/ wing making/ S&M dungeon/ painting workshop/ whatever. Makes it playadippity, creates more spontaneity in the day.

Personally, I have a 3-event calendar: Weds, Meet 'n Greet; Saturday, Man go boom; Sunday, Temple go boom. Everything else is up to whim and where my bike wanders.

[Bless]

Russian mafia

[Roberto Dobbisano]

let us not jump to assumptions.

you are sayink that, not me...

[Ratty]

Eric I'm with you. (Except that I don't give a hoot about the Temple). I can't seem to make it to any events. If I do, they are cancelled or different than expected. Best to just roam and enjoy.

[Jovankat]

Whoa whoa whoa. Dina Titus?! For reals? That sounds like something bad that happens to your feet if you don't keep them dry

[Roberto Dobbisano]

this is from a girl who camped with them last year.

no names.....just because..

[Bless]

The horror

[Simon of the Playa]

Oh, the Hora....THE HORA!!!

[media]

[Jovankat]

We were camped near White Ocean last year and took in a few refugees who weren't enjoying their experiences and wanted to hang out somewhere a littl more down to earth.

[Lonesomebri]

I suppose for me there really is a difference between someone listing that they are giving away tequila at 5pm, or making me pancakes in the morning, compared to a listing by a corporation advertising professionals doing a paid gig. Sure, corporations are people, too....but this really isn't about loud obnoxious talentless music anymore, is it? I love stumbling home and stopping at the various soundcamps on the way, waiting for the bottom to drop out and the flames to erupt. It's great fun. I have nothing against those camps being there and blasting it. But I find that the majority of people I talk to who have never been to the Burn for some reason believe it is a music rave. How did this happen? Who is responsible? I worry that the event then attracts and ends up with people coming to attend a music festival and watch their favorite DJs tilt their heads ever so slightly while placing a couple fingers to the lower tilted temple....then don't drink enough water and end up vomiting on themselves mid-playa before passing out on whatever designer pills they took, interfering with my evening plans while I stop and administer water. I want the event to attract the kind of people who bring it, "it" being shit I don't even know about yet. Is it non-inclusive to desire participants who are willing to add to the enjoyment of the event and disfavor others who are only there to take? Sure, that's judgmental and whatever, but I'm not making rules, I'm trying to make reality. Burning Man is not a Music Festival, it is not a rave, though a great many people would argue otherwise. I don't concede. Engaging in that debate is healthy.

[goathead]

if you have a line up, your doing it wrong.

[Jovankat]

I suppose for me there really is a difference between someone listing that they are giving away tequila at 5pm, or making me pancakes in the morning, compared to a listing by a corporation advertising professionals doing a paid gig.

Do we know for sure they're being paid though? I was always under the impression that Burning Man was the one event in the year where the people for whom playing big gigs is work get to kick back and do it just for fun of it outside of the confines of the commercial events. I'm not sure where I got that idea though. EDIT - I think I may actually have read it on the White Ocean website last year...

But putting aside the issue of them being paid, if they aren't does it matter that they're professional DJs in the real world? I understand it's not the crux of your point but it kind of sounds like just the idea of people who make their living DJing big parties DJing at Burning Man isn't something that sits well with you and I'm not sure I understand why. I don't really see how that's different to an artist who lives off selling sculptures most of the year coming and building one at burning man. In both cases they're getting to do the thing they love outside of the commercial for profit system and they get a bunch of exposure to potential real world consumers of their artistic products.

There seems to be some an invisible line being drawn between sound camp DJs and other theme camp events by some people in this thread. This troubles me because is suggests a threshold of coolness above which events shouldn't be advertised and that just sounds wrong. Do we really want restrictions on what famous people can do at Burning Man because they're famous and that somehow completely colours their actions? Like would it be more ok for a random rich dude who only has a day to spare to helicopter in and make grilled cheese sandwiches than when Mark Zuckerberg did it because people know his name?

I totally agree that paid gigs and commercial interests have no place at Burning Man but it sounds like "famous" is getting lumped in with that and I'm not sure that's cool.

And side note; White Ocean had a website last year which was where you could sign up to be in their camp and help pay for and build everything. It doesn't seem to exist and there has hardly been any acticting on their Facebook wall this year. I wonder if they've moved away from having campmates prop up the camp or it's something else.

I don't concede. Engaging in that debate is healthy.

YES!

Except when doing it means you sit on the couch eating cookie butter straight out of the jar all day...

[Simon of the Playa]

if you don't know about something maybe you shouldn't talk about it.



i was there….i know where the bodies are buried, and this DOES involve paying the talent.



is that clear enough?

[Jovankat]

Not knowing anything about the details of who the DJs are and what sort of music they play is not the same thing as not being able to have opinions and contribute to the meta conversation of what pre-posted line ups mean for the TTITD.

Also feel free to respond to any of actual things I said in that post rather than just dismiss it and me out of hand. If I'm actually wrong it would be helpful for me and everyone else reading this thread for you to explain how and why I'm wrong rather than tell me to shut up.

Not knowing who James Hannan is really doesn't preclude me from asking whether categorising DJ sets at sound camps as in a different class to food gifting at theme camps is a good idea.

The only thing clear it that you're being kinda elitist.

[Roberto Dobbisano]

why should i respond to nonsense and blather?

if you feel the need to be part of this conversation, fine….but don't expect me to cater to your desire to be informed or part of the loop.


i don't have any obligation to go through your "points" one by one and refute them.


i just know that you really haven't said anything in this whole thread, and hence, until now, i really haven't said anything back.


you're new here, and you like to engage, thats great.

but there also a certain thing called KNOWING before one speaks. please try that, unless you are asking a question.

BTW, this conversation will NOT go on and on, i do not feel the need to meander and ramble about semantics or spelling.

so, if you want to continue, do the maths, i won't respond.


and yes, if you say i am elitist than i guess i am, since you obviously know all there is to know about just about everything.