Using T Posts on the playa?

[LowePro]

Has anyone tried pounding T posts into the playa?
I'm considering using 2 of these to hang a vinyl banner in between--nothing structural is at risk, but they would need to hold up to some wind and flapping.

tips appreciated, esp direct experience using Tposts, thanks.

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[Lonesomebri]

I use them because they are cheap, readily available and I'm an idiot. I use them for guy lines on a 10X20 carport, and tents. The main drawback is that they can "give", bend near the T when pounding in, as the overall length is not rigid enough to pierce the under playa without "shudder". The shorter the fence post, the less this is an issue. And then getting it out.... the same spot right above the T become flexible, if pounded on horizontally and yanked vertically with vise-grips. The metal becomes weakened there, possibly breaking. If you pound it in slow and steady, without contorting the bottom T section, holding a sign should be fine. Once it gets a foot down, if it penetrates without bending, it's gonna hold. If the T makes it into the underplaya, it's in. I'll use some this year, jah willing, along with rebar and military issue 12 inch tent stacks. In review; they hold but are hard to pound in without contorting the tip. Pulling out is a bitch.

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[Lonesomebri]

The drawbacks, reiterated- The posts tend to develop fatigue right above the T when pounded on, not so much break, just bend.

Tips would be; if you can get the professional pounder, the type like a pipe with one end closed and handles on the side, to install the posts, that would be great, lend it to me. Or, if you are using a large hammer/mallet, have another person hold the post while it is being pounded in to minimize the vibration and deviation along it's length as it is hit. Go slow when the tip hits the lower harder playa. To take it out, get a farm jack and a piece of chain. I use an old bike lock chain. Wrap the chain around the jack lift and the fence post. Crank that post out of the ground using the jack.

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[FIGJAM]

Simple answer: They use T-posts for the trash fence.

[FossaFerox]

The trash fence isn't a sail, though. If the sign is sheltered from the wind you should be okay, if not...

If you do this check right along ground level (brush away some dust) at least once a day and look for signs of cyclical loading fatigue/failure. If the surface looks wrinkled or like alligator skin take the sign down immediately.

The danger here is that if the wind catches it the right way it will load it, bend it slightly, spill the wind, and spring back. Every time this cycle repeats it delivers a new shock load which will rapidly propagate tiny cracks on the surface leading to catastrophic failure.

Bouncing loads are way more dangerous than static loads for this reason, and this holds true even with a limited range of motion so small you can barely see it.

[LowePro]

Thanks all for the tips,
our sign banner will be mesh fabric so it will let some airflow through. Main question was if/how to pound these posts into the playa and if they hold up OK. I don't really want to buy and bring a heavy post pounder. Maybe a short PVC sleeve that fits over the post would help dampen vibration while hitting the top of the post w/ a mallet?

[FIGJAM]

I don't think a mallet will work, unless you plan on spending half the burn pounding those in.

You can make a pounder using a 3' piece of 2" iron pipe with a cap on it.

No need for handles.

[Lonesomebri]

Yeah, I could see that working, using a pvc to stabilize while pounding in. And even an extra set of hands can steady the post while pounding it in. Usually I'm trying to do this alone is the problem. That is the big issue for me, sometimes the T takes a twist with the pounding as it hits more solid underplaya. I still end up using the posts as guy line tie offs for the structures. They hold, it works for me. For my use, lag bolts or rebar would be easier to remove. Bring a couple extra posts just in case. Oh, I have a steel mallet, like this (actually 2). Ahhhh.....but will I be bringing a 3 foot capped piece of pipe this year? I'll get to work on that once i get my personal swamp cooler figured out....

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[LowePro]

Sure enough, I meant a sledge hammer, but will look into a homemade pounder of sorts as well. Thanks again.