Temple Burn -- one hour of silence and reverence possible?

[lucky420]

Judging a book by its cover is either arrogant or ignorant...

[Eric]

I will always resent the apparent spectators who don't get involved with anything if I feel like they're making my burn worse through their ignorance and resulting behavior.

They aren't making your Burn worse by their behavior - you are making it worse by letting other peoples actions dictate your reactions.
You know going in that people are going to do things that you might not approve of, so you can either (a) accept that and move on without focusing on someone being what you might consider an "asshole", or (b) get hung up on that "asshole", focus heavily on them, fume and fuss and get all cranky, and then blame them because you couldn't exert basic control over your emotions - even knowing this was going to happen going in.

I've said it over and over - if you need a particular "head space" for the Temple burn (or any burn), you know it's not going to happen in a crowd of 30,000+ people and it's your job to move yourself somewhere where you can get the environment you need - it's not the job of the other 29,999+ people to respect your wishes. That's what I do with both the Man & the Temple, and I haven't had a bad burn out of either of them in years.

[Savannah]

I generally watch the Temple Burn in silence because that's how I like to do it, although I might cheer when a big piece of it falls (if there's something particularly majestic about it). I don't really plan my reaction to the Temple Burn though . . . and unless someone knows what I have written on the temple, and why I might have reason to cheer as it goes up in smoke, I won't let their inevitable judgment touch me in the least. The Temple belongs to everyone and people go there for many reasons, not just to write the names of the dead. Sometimes people write their resolutions, their regrets, their guilt or anger or hatred, their hope, and their love. I saw crutches hanging there one year. They belonged to a man who had learned to walk again after a terrible accident; the doctors told him there was no hope of it. The crutches were hung too high for me to understand this at the event--zooming in on a photo when I got home gave me a name, and I googled him and found an article. I hope that man & his lovely wife cheered whenever they felt like it.

People are entitled to their personal feelings, opinions, and an Ideal, but the Temple is not necessarily just a place of death, it's a place of emotion. And even death or letting go cannot be held up to one standard of mourning or expression.

The two main Burns are already very different in tone. Perhaps there is health and release in realizing you cannot make tens of thousands of people behave in lockstep, and you can still have profound meaning whether or not the entire rest of the world understands or agrees with you.

[theCryptofishist]

Perhaps there is health and release in realizing you cannot make tens of thousands of people behave in lockstep, and you can still have profound meaning whether or not the entire rest of the world understands or agrees with you.

You're forgetting the Nuremberg burns.

[FossaFerox]

*snip8
How do we know, that you "know what's up"?

The only sure facts are:
It's a structure, built almost entirely out of wood.
It should burn on Sunday August 30th at approx. 8 PM.
People LOVE FIRE and celebration.

These temple be quiet threads are pretty much never ending ropes, continuously flogging a deceased equine.

Nobody's opinion really matters, mine included...

True, I'm not trying to change anything or even suggesting that I'm right, just talking about my feelings on the matter. But when I talk about knowing "what's up" I'm simply referring to the fact that for many people the temple has significance as something more than another piece of art, and that Sunday night can be thought of as something other than another big bonfire.

The first time I visited the temple on Monday I had no idea what it was or what it signified. At first glance it was just another big piece of art, and for the first 30 seconds I feel that I was disrespectful with how loud I was. My buddy (veteran burner) quietly pulled me aside and explained how many people used the temple. He wasn't doing it to tell me how to act, he just wanted me to be aware of what the situation was so that I could make my own decision about how to act. I wasn't loud because that's how I would want to behave in a space like that, I was loud because I didn't understand what the space was.

They say we hate in others the things we hate most about ourselves. Maybe this is just a projection of that. Whatever the case, that is EXACTLY the kind of thing that bugs me, when I feel like it's being done out of ignorance rather than a conscious decision, because they don't understand where they are.

you are making it worse by letting other peoples actions dictate your reactions.

I'm not reacting outwardly, and I'm not as well practiced as I might like when it comes to keeping things from affecting my inner experience. I lost a friend who I loved dearly to suicide. Watching that temple burn with her name on the wall... I was down on one knee, watching the fire, shaking, utterly silent. It was a powerful experience, and people jubilantly shouting "Wooo!" did take me out of it from time to time. To employ a bit of reductio ad absurdum (because I might as well go for broke while being absurd) saying that their actions shouldn't bother me is like saying the Westboro Baptist Church doesn't do anything wrong by picketing funerals, the mourners should simply not let the WBC's actions dictate their reactions.

I generally watch the Temple Burn in silence because that's how I like to do it, although I might cheer when a big piece of it falls (if there's something particularly majestic about it). I don't really plan my reaction to the Temple Burn though . . . and unless someone knows what I have written on the temple, and why I might have reason to cheer as it goes up in smoke, I won't let their inevitable judgment touch me in the least.

Like I said, this I'm not only fine with, I support. How people burn will occasionally be at odds with others, and that's part of the magic.

I'm just admittedly a giant, absurdly foolish, occasionally hypocritical idealist when it comes to what I consider "burning". I still maintain to a degree that some of the weekenders who treat the burn like a spectator event they're attending rather than participating in aren't as valid. Some part of me honestly believes that their experiences count for less and that their actions are therefor more deserving of scrutiny. It's absurd, I know, and I don't pretend otherwise. I'm working on this, but it's part of how I feel and being honest about my own hangups is a necessary first step in eventually working through them.

[Ano]

I, too, remember how I felt coming back from my first Burn and heading in to my second.

[BBadger]

To employ a bit of reductio ad absurdum (because I might as well go for broke while being absurd) saying that their actions shouldn't bother me is like saying the Westboro Baptist Church doesn't do anything wrong by picketing funerals, the mourners should simply not let the WBC's actions dictate their reactions.

The WBC protests are a demonstration of what is great about this country or any other free society: that our rights are protected to such an extent that even those who run completely counter to the majority sentiment are still able to practice their rights. They represent what having rights is all about: it's a messy process where unpopular opinion and acts must be tolerated to protect what is more important.

To that end, the Temple, as with everything at Burning Man, also represents a part of the bigger picture: that this event is all about what you bring and what you get out of the event. We arrive with nothing more than a blank canvas that people build things upon. Likewise, the temple is simply whatever you want to make of it, and how you make of it. Even the name of the structure -- a "temple" -- doesn't necessarily connote a place of mourning, but that of spirituality, whatever that may mean to a person. For those who do mourn losses, some mourn quietly, remembering what was lost, others loudly, celebrating a life lived.

How you treat that structure is up to you, but you're here among everyone, and there is no agreement, explicit or implicit, as to how this structure should be treated. If you want silence, use earplugs. If you want to make noise, shout out. If you don't care either way, just watch the structure burn. If you don't want to endure Exodus, leave early.

I'm just admittedly a giant, absurdly foolish, occasionally hypocritical idealist when it comes to what I consider "burning". I still maintain to a degree that some of the weekenders who treat the burn like a spectator event they're attending rather than participating in aren't as valid. Some part of me honestly believes that their experiences count for less and that their actions are therefor more deserving of scrutiny. It's absurd, I know, and I don't pretend otherwise. I'm working on this, but it's part of how I feel and being honest about my own hangups is a necessary first step in eventually working through them.

And I would call you arrogant and a busy-body for believing such things. Concern yourself with your own burn -- not how others burn -- and you'll have a much more satisfying burn, and life for that matter.

[FossaFerox]

I care because their behaviour becomes part of my burn. It's not the mere fact that it's happening, it's having it interrupt something I'm enjoying.

And say what you will about the WBC representing our great, diverse, open system, I still think they're terrible people and would hate to have to interact with them any week of the year.

If, hypothetically, some WBC members singled you out for some reason and had tickets and they proceeded to follow you around all week with a megaphone shouting at you and driving other people away, would you support their behavior then? I mean, what if that's how they burn?

(Reductio ad absurdum is fun)

[FIGJAM]

YOU are interrupting my enjoyment of Eplaya!!!

I hope you're satisfied.

[Eric]

I care because their behaviour becomes part of my burn. It's not the mere fact that it's happening, it's having it interrupt something I'm enjoying.

Might I gently suggest you read my rant from last years BRC Weekly on this very issue? Scroll down, it's on "Page Two":
You, personally, are ruining Burning Man
(link is to a pdf)

[FossaFerox]

I swear, you assholes are some of the nicest people a guy could wander into the desert with...

[tatonka]

Im more than likely leavin sunday morn

https://www.fest300.com/magazine/videos ... g-man-film

[Simon of the Playa]

i'm not going to be there either.


thank g*d...


because if i WAS there, i would have my bull-horn, and i would be doing my imitation of joan baez singing freebird.


suck it, buddha boy.

[TT120]

I thought Freebird was entirely appropriate.

[Roberto Dobbisano]

i think maybe we should change it up...

[media]

now THIS i would sing along to....

[robrob]

Might I gently suggest you read my rant from last years BRC Weekly on this very issue? Scroll down, it's on "Page Two":
You, personally, are ruining Burning Man
(link is to a pdf)

oh man... totally off topic, but fucking LOL at the purple palace "we never discriminate" quote in that art car cover story.

[Simon of the Playa]

PLAYA VIKINGS UNITE

[desertwind]

I thought Freebird was entirely appropriate.

yes it was, and it was also appropriate for myself and every person I know to stop dropping hundreds of dollars of supplies and beer with the DPW when we exit. not that they give a fuck, but that is my radical self expression just as freebird is theirs.

[stratdax]

Someone blew a conch shell for about 5 seconds, and then some lady screamed "shut up! Show some fucking respect!" Guess which one was more disruptive, antagonistic, and unnatural. Some people need to express themselves in different ways for them to feel a cathartic experience. There's also people with different cultures there that might celebrate their dead or mourn in different ways. Let the moment pass and get on with your life, because really it only affects you if you choose to let it. Someone who truly is focusing on their moment isn't going to be affected by someone else's, and anything else is just an over-reactionary act.

Edit: The crew in that crane or whatever were being a bunch of pricks for no reason, though. Just pop a bottle of champagne and celebrate a job well done privately. Or maybe they should give the Temple experience a proper try, they might get something out of it.

[Ano]

I hate the Temple Burn, but mainly because of the people who think it is appropriate to yell "SHUT THE FUCK UP!" if someone makes an inkling of a noise.

Someone near me got upset and huffy when people "oooo'd" the twisting collapse of the 2014 temple. Seriously?

[unjonharley]

I approached the temple for a look see a amid afternoon..

Was playing some soft 50's music on a boom box..

About 100 feet from the temple some dudewad said: turn the volume down.. Them a 50 feel, some old bitchwad come out to me and said: turn the volume down.it's the temple...

Well fuck oh dear.. I said (being nice): Lady this is the way I burn..

She was damn lucky I am on my chill pills.. It could have been a very different experience for her..

[Just_Joe]

There was a fair amount of music/singing/noise around us on the 6 o'clock side.
They all caved to the "shut the fuck up" crowd.
The sound of the wood snapping and popping was beautiful.

[DoctorIknow]

Many burns ago, I was fortunate enough to be at the perimeter "gate/fence" to the Temple, when David Best, the designer of many Temples including the 2014 Temple, was talking to about six of us.

He spoke of his need to make a barrier around the Temple to keep out "the noisemakers."
I imagine this years barrier took at least 25% of the time and resources to build.

This year he had rather high bridges to climb to get inside the perimeter "fence."
Was that an even stronger hint to "noisemakers" who sometimes drag their powered music on wagons all over the playa and even into art structures?

One self confessed boom box carrier in this thread felt the need to express their burn in their own manner.
Such imaginative and creative efforts are as amusing to me as other great artists with megaphones who prowl the streets before dawn deliberately waking as many people as possible.
Perhaps their real art, unbeknownst to them, is making frat boys look benign.

I've never talked to burners who bring attention to themselves in such manner(s), so I'm not sure, but does their thinking go:
Fuck burners, fuck the art, fuck the artists, this is me and I don't give a shit and that's my art, that's my burn.
If people don't like it, that's their problem they should consider learning that their happiness should not depend on others behavior.

Seriously, is that the thinking?

[theCryptofishist]

Are you saying that in all the years of burning man, no one has ever heckled the temple with a bull horn?

[gibson_]

People get whiney about being quiet at the temple burn because they're new, and because yelling at somebody for doing something *wrong* makes them feel superior.

It's just basic human insecurity. Ignore them.

UNLESS you're that person who got up and did a stupid speech at the 3:00 side right after the temple fell. Shut up, lady! Nobody cares what you think, and you just sound like a drug addled hippy moron.

[mdmf007]

I stopped going a few years ago for this reason -

I visit during the week, leave what I need to, read some stories and feel others pain and move on. Seeing a good portion of the people trying to pay respect and let go, while some asshat is pounding OONTZ OONTZ OONTZ behind them just isnt the vibe for me.

[BBadger]

The fact of the matter is that BM is a public place. Even if there are "shoulds" when it comes to silence or noise, it really makes no difference unless there is some sort of enforcement, which there generally is not.

So bitch and moan all you want. It's a public space. Silence can be oppressive too -- often more so than noise-making because it denies expression to the group. If you want to avoid all this mess, retreat from public spaces -- which can also mean putting earplugs in. David Best recognizes this fact and does the same thing on a larger scale with his walled gardens to create the quiet space he desires -- but without forcing a policy on the playa. It works, and fits in with the rest of BM.

Do the same thing with your own ears if you want silence anywhere. I know I wear them when I sleep because even the hubbub of camp can wake me; a bullhorn is not necessary. I'm certainly not going to chew out camp mates about their "loud" behavior because this is Burning Man, not a private residence.

[Lonesomebri]

UNLESS you're that person who got up and did a stupid speech at the 3:00 side right after the temple fell. Shut up, lady! Nobody cares what you think, and you just sound like a drug addled hippy moron.

Ha, I almost forgot about her. No, she did not just sound like..., that was no performance.

Shortly after the Temple opened I visited. As I was leaving, instead of taking the arched bridge high road, I walked thru the gap offered as handi-capped access right next to the bridge, I took the low-road. A volunteer at the Temple stopped me and told me I had to take the arched bridge exit, I could not walk thru the un-raised playa exit. Obviously this was something she was told to enforce by someone up the ladder of command. Some sort of "artistic vision". There was no line or anyone else trying to use the path. My passage would have zero effect on anything. I complied but told the volunteer that I was being discriminated against because I was not handi-capped.

[maladroit]

That might have been some random person messing with you...I walked in and out of the temple courtyard many times, both over and beside the bridges, and no one ever said anything to me nor did I see anyone else being stopped for any reason.

[unjonharley]

It appears a hand full of people decided to be self appointed guardians of the temple sound..

This just may call for a/some flash mobs of crazy pagan.