car pass now more expensive than airport parking

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[jim]
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car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by [jim] » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:10 pm

$50 for a week of parking? plus 'applicable fees'?
I think one can park for a week at LAX for cheaper!

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by smiffman » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:17 pm

Yes but does LAX have all the visual stimulus about..............

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by tamarakay » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:25 pm

or free beer
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Simon of the Playa » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:33 pm

it's still cheaper than hookers and blow.


now please,
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[jim]
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by [jim] » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:35 pm

and I've never received a nice crotch grab and rubdown from the Greeters like I do at LAX.

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by tamarakay » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:40 pm

you will fit in fine around here :D
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Simon of the Playa » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:43 pm

[jim] wrote:and I've never received a nice crotch grab and rubdown from the Greeters like I do at LAX.

i know...riiiiiiiiight?



and then you can't even find a goddamn place to have a cigarette afterwards....



i hate LAX.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by mgb327 » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:49 pm

In the financial grand scheme of my getting there and back, the VP is simply a temporary minor annoyance. Meh, no biggie. Now, scoring a ticket, that's a biggie...
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by [jim] » Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:52 pm

Simon of the Playa wrote:and then you can't even find a goddamn place to have a cigarette afterwards....
there is an area at arrivals that has a bunch of private rooms for smoking... at LAX, those rooms seem to be pronounced 'TAXI'

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by miltef » Tue Dec 23, 2014 3:18 pm

So why are they limiting the number of car passes to the number actually used last year? Why not make more available than what they expect will be needed? Are they trying to create a shortage or at least the fear that they may be hard to get?

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by some seeing eye » Tue Dec 23, 2014 3:28 pm

So why are they limiting the number of car passes to the number actually used last year? Why not make more available than what they expect will be needed?
So they can get approval based on managing road congestion to raise the population above 70,000 in 2016 and beyond.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by trilobyte » Tue Dec 23, 2014 3:48 pm

Parking at LAX makes for a much longer walk to camp, though ;)

You probably could have made the "vs. airport parking" argument last year (I think some people did), but it's an apples and oranges kind of thing.

All in all, it works out to a $20 lift ($10 on the ticket, $10 on the vehicle pass), less if you're traveling with others. That seems like a pretty reasonable increase to me, I've seen other annual festivals increasing their prices from $15 to $50 per person for weekend events.

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by pink » Tue Dec 23, 2014 4:58 pm

High Sierra's lowest price is $210 for 2015, plus God knows what for a vehicle pass (last year was $95). So not a huge increase for BM in comparison.

With the tidbit of info that the vehicle passes never sold out, I bet there is a bit of wailing & gnashing of teeth going on from people that bought hugely inflated scalped passes.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Dr. Pyro » Tue Dec 23, 2014 8:12 pm

miltef wrote:So why are they limiting the number of car passes to the number actually used last year? Why not make more available than what they expect will be needed? Are they trying to create a shortage or at least the fear that they may be hard to get?
A better question you should be asking is: "Why are those people who come in with (as in my case) eight people in their car/RV not given free admission as far as this $50 fee goes?" Clearly they do not care if people carpool, for if they did, they would encourage that and financially reward them, as is done in the private sector (and to a lesser degree even the public sector). No, this is an unabashed rip-off that only Larry & Co. benefits. It is a sad realization that the people we trusted are sycophantic suck-ups to everything we held as dear. The Bmorg: Resistance is futile.

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by C187 » Tue Dec 23, 2014 8:23 pm

What I want to know is why the price went up on them.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by digital » Tue Dec 23, 2014 8:30 pm

C187 wrote:What I want to know is why the price went up on them.
Up on them? You mean up on participants. 'They' set the price.

To me it is reasonable given traffic mitigation is the #1 concern going forward. Personally, I think there should be a tiered system accounting for axles (since the pass is intended to offset damage to roads) -- But it is BMorg's event and they set the price.

And people will bitch about it. Then they will pay it. Or find alternate methods, just as the pass intended.

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by trilobyte » Tue Dec 23, 2014 9:12 pm

Speaking personally here... I think it has less to do with wanting to create a shortage and more to do with wanting to encourage people to further reduce the number of vehicles on the road. I don't think it's any secret to anyone that the highway has limited capacity - so any chance of increasing the population in future years depends quite a bit on Burning Man being able to demonstrate that they can increase the population without overloading the highway.

The vehicle pass system is not only a means to create a separate fund to cover road-related expenses (not only for on the playa, but for when state and local officials put their hands out... as they've been doing), but it also serves as a means for them to track and sort of regulate the number of vehicles coming to the event. From the limited info that's been shared, it sounds like the vehicle pass system was successful in 2014. If we can hit that same number, or (better still) reduce vehicle usage even further while still having roughly the same population, it's reasonable to say that Burning Man has demonstrated an ability to regulate the number of vehicles coming to the event. That could help pave the way to increasing the city's population capacity in future years.

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Just_Joe » Wed Dec 24, 2014 7:00 am

Parking at LAX ranges from 12 to 30 dollars per day.
In the desert, I imagine that the abscence of paid help, concrete, stripes, light poles and shuttle buses does wonders for the bottom line.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by LionsNzebras » Wed Dec 24, 2014 7:01 am

50 bucks aint so bad, airport parking at YEG is 80-120 bucks for 8 days.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Captain Goddammit » Wed Dec 24, 2014 12:34 pm

trilobyte wrote: If we can hit that same number, or (better still) reduce vehicle usage even further while still having roughly the same population, it's reasonable to say that Burning Man has demonstrated an ability to regulate the number of vehicles coming to the event. That could help pave the way to increasing the city's population capacity in future years.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by C187 » Wed Dec 24, 2014 5:46 pm

digital wrote:
C187 wrote:What I want to know is why the price went up on them.
Up on them? You mean up on participants. 'They' set the price.
'Them' in this case is the parking pass.
I haven't seen any justification on why the price needed to go up.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Captain Goddammit » Wed Dec 24, 2014 5:54 pm

It's really quite simple. There isn't any direct competition, this is pretty much like a monopoly.
The Org spouts propaganda and bullshit all the time, but really, they can charge whatever they want as long as we are willing to pay to go to their party.
And it keeps going upscale.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by digital » Wed Dec 24, 2014 5:55 pm

C187 wrote:
digital wrote:
C187 wrote:What I want to know is why the price went up on them.
Up on them? You mean up on participants. 'They' set the price.
'Them' in this case is the parking pass.
I haven't seen any justification on why the price needed to go up.
35,000 * $40 = $1,400,000.
27,000 * $50 = $1,350,000.

Looks to me like they are simply aiming to hit a certain goal. Given the fact they didn't sell as many passes as intended it seems perfectly reasonable to do this. Though, not as fun as screaming, "Propoganda! Monopoly! Lies!"

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Captain Goddammit » Wed Dec 24, 2014 6:09 pm

Hell if I was at the top I'd milk this thing for as much money as I could too!
I'm not faulting them for playing their cards as best they can.
Many of us seem to lose sight of the fact that this is a private commercial enterprise.
Not a free hippy love-fest.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by GreyCoyote » Wed Dec 24, 2014 6:14 pm

Capt: this year I think I will gift bumper stickers that say "fuck yer wallet - Burning Man 2015". :mrgreen:
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by motskyroonmatick » Thu Dec 25, 2014 12:15 am

I'm amazed that there is purposeful disincentive(vehicle pass cost) to drive a vehicle to the playa when all the cool things on playa go there in a vehicle.

Vehicle passes and limiting vehicle pass numbers means less cool things to see and do on the playa. IMHO.
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by ygmir » Thu Dec 25, 2014 12:44 am

also consider the possibility, that some gov. agency is or will limit the number of vehicles allowed in BRC during the event, not so much people, but vehicles, which can be evacuated in a given amount of time.
Now, imagine, how if you want the population to be able to grow, but still stay within this vehicle limit, you would accomplish this.
And, think of increasing costs of such an event, or even just the plain want for more money for whatever, as allowed by free enterprise.
Then, think about raising ticket prices, to reach a certain goal, or, adding a fee, that compared to the price of a ticket, is not huge, but still raises substantial funding, without raising tickets such that it causes a furor. (not that this new fee does not).
and finally, knowing you want to increase the population, but knowing as things stand, it's not possible and still keep the number of vehicles under a certain mark, would you do it a year, or more ahead of time, so you have time for people to yell and scream and get used to the idea, and "carpooling", as well as work out most kinks that are bound to happen at first.

all this may well be speculation........but,just sayin..........
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by EspressoDude » Thu Dec 25, 2014 7:53 am

Limiting cars may have a negative impact on traffic to the event. not less traffic jams, but actually more as people pile more stuff on their cars/trucks instead of taking two. next thing you know there will be a porta potti tax. Oh and Proof of Insurance required for all attendees (available from bmorginsuranceco.)
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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by Major Krash » Fri Dec 26, 2014 7:11 pm

...projecting into the future when the population exceeds 1 million, each them camp will get only 1 vehicle-pass for all it's people & gear, so all vehicles will be fully-loaded 18-wheelers, 27,000 of them (except for the RV's for the elite citizens, of course)

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Re: car pass now more expensive than airport parking

Post by LionsNzebras » Mon Dec 29, 2014 7:00 am

As far as I can see, they are have not limited the cars per se.

They had 40k and change vehicle passes last year (reference needed), only 26k and change sold (reference needed), so they put the limit at 27k to see how thing go.
Running any kind of logistical nightmare like this is a give and take, you cant please everyone.

Here are some facts.

DPW has a limit on the volume of cars that can enter\exit the playa at any given time, especially during exodus.
We (festive gowers) block the highway, cause undue care and debauchery on entrance day, and exit days, LEO is very very busy, waiting for us.
Various agencies have limits on the playa itself, so that we the people dont impact the playa itself too badly.
People (gov agencies) want them to pay for road repair, due to the volume of cars.

So....How would you get more people into the festivities?
BMO to run busses from key points, where people could park their cars and buss in ((car pool), what about all their stuff)
Figure out how to let people in a few hours earlier, perhaps presales gets first entry?
Numbered or groups of tickets at specific times??
Give away at random, colored tickets, anyone with a colored ticket can get in early. If your in a camp, and your camp mates have regular tickets, to bad.
Charge a higher price for colored tickets that get you in at special times, or give them an alternate gate.

Just a few thoughts
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