cooling your tent or van

Swamp Coolers, Cooler Management, Dry Ice, Misting Systems, and just plain how to beat the heat.
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MFOB
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by MFOB » Fri Sep 05, 2014 12:06 pm

Yep, Lid off, no fast or lots of CFM airflow. I wasnt impressed, but like I said I had nothing to judge it against so i didnt know any better.

I figure with a 4 " duct it would allow for positive pressuer inside and the fan should have been strong enought to push out any air. The Pos pressure would not allow dust or hot air to flow in. That was my thought anyway.

Ill try tonight and see if I reverse the wires if it does anything different.

Parallel is how I wired them. Directly to the battery.

Thanks Again for all your help.
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Canoe
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Canoe » Fri Sep 05, 2014 12:15 pm

MFOB wrote:...I figure with a 4 " duct it would allow for positive pressuer inside and the fan should have been strong enought to push out any air. The Pos pressure would not allow dust or hot air to flow in. That was my thought anyway...
Correct, but any size of duct will still result in some positive pressure inside. The air coming in has to force air inside to the outside. You're not going to win the war against stronger winds, so not constricting your exhaust duct usually means maximizing your cooler air flow (up to it's limits).

Having the intake to the exhaust up near the apex is the optimum way to do it. Exhaust the hottest air first, and no pool of hot air left above you radiating down. And when the cooler is shut off when you leave the HY to go explore, as the cool air inside the HY drains to the outside, the easiest path for hot air to enter is through the exhaust duct, where it is raised above objects.
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FIGJAM
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Fri Sep 05, 2014 12:18 pm

The EB fan actually puts out 60 more CFM on low than the PC fan.

PC fan pulls 1.6 amps. (190CFM)

The EB on low pulls 1.16 amps. (250CFM) :shock:
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MFOB
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by MFOB » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:10 pm

The good news out of all of this is its a HY. It held the heat it built up in the daytime to keep it pretty nice and comfy at night. During the night time, i would open a couple of windows to get a good cross breeze and it would cool off pretty nice. Around Sunrise (aka Bedtime) I would shut the windows and the cool air would stay inside making it nice to sleep in the yurt until about noon. Even after noon when it would start to heat up Id open the lid to the cooler and turn on the fan to get "some" air flow. It was possible to take a nap later on in the afternoon. Even with the heat of the day, opening the windows again to get that good cross breeze, it was a little bit warm, but easily napable.

So, if it was hotter and the cooler broke I would have been screwed. But here in Central WA, its been 100+ for a month and so in BRC at 85-90, it was no big thing to me. Fairly comfortable heat wise.

PS, did yall see my art I built....
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maladroit
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by maladroit » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:23 pm

I saw that, it was a good art.

My swamp cooler is stock FIGJAM style and worked well in the hexayurt. I might need a better pump because it didn't draw down the water as fast as last year...but then, I think the playa was more humid. It seemed to work better late in the week.

This was my roof vent, partway up one of the roof panels. I ran this vent 24/7, and the swamp cooler 4-5 hours a day. The fan is almost a foot across and is completely silent, but not much CFM...would probably need 1 or 2 more for optimal venting. It would spin from convection even if the power was turned off.

I brought a 110AH deep cycle battery (fully charged) and a 30W solar panel. In addition to the the vent and cooler (12 watts total) I also had 12W of LED lighting inside the yurt, charged USB batteries frequently, and ran a CPAP machine at night. When I brought the battery home, it was at 70% capacity. Last year I had to recharge the battery using a generator a couple times, because the solar panel setup wasn't permanent...I'd either hook up to the solar panel or to my breakout box. This year I had the battery, solar panel, and charge controller hooked up full-time, and wired through the hexayurt wall to a switch panel. Getting every possible hour of sunlight from the panel into the battery made a huge difference, never needed to charge it with the generator.

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Canoe
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Canoe » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:42 pm

maladroit wrote:... This was my roof vent, partway up one of the roof panels. I ran this vent 24/7, and the swamp cooler 4-5 hours a day. The fan is almost a foot across and is completely silent, but not much CFM...would probably need 1 or 2 more for optimal venting...
If you're running that powered vent 24/7, then with the swamp cooler off, once the filter pad evaporates dry, you'd be pulling in hot dusty air.

If you run more of those fans, while the swamp-cooler is running they could be trying to exhaust more air than the swamp-cooler is pushing in. This results in positive negative pressure inside the shelter, which will try to pull in hot dusty air through any available openings. For optimum results, make sure that powered vents always exhaust less than the swamp-cooler is pushing in.
Last edited by Canoe on Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by maladroit » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:55 pm

I think that would be negative pressure...but in any case, the fan wasn't that powerful. It was basically helping some of the hot air escape that would have risen through a plain hole in the roof anyway.

Pulling in unmodified outside air wasn't a huge concern (it was what I wanted to do, really). The hexayurt will heat up a lot during the day. We'd be out and about by 10am and wouldn't want to run the swamp cooler, but it was nice to make sure the hexayurt was no hotter than the outdoors if I needed to duck back in for something. If the outside air is cooler than the inside air, it's a net win to pull it in even without evaporative cooling. At night, it pulled in cold air and I'd sleep under a blanket...yurt would start off that much cooler in the morning.

Dust was never an issue with any of the ventilation, we brought in far more dust on clothes than came in on a breeze.

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Canoe
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Canoe » Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:00 pm

Yes, negative pressure.
And not a problem, with that one fan. Start adding more fans, and there's the concern. Always be powering out less than you're powering in. As that can be tricky to get correct, the recommendation for running swamp-coolers is to just let it push air in, and let an unpowered exhaust vent handle the exhausting.
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Ano » Thu Sep 11, 2014 11:05 am

Some notes, from my first year with a swamp cooler:

1. These things are voodoo. At home in Sacramento, the bucket cooler was able to keep an entire room slightly cooler when the ducting was blowing directly at people. On the Playa, it was able to make us shiver in the mid-afternoon when the ducting was aimed at us. Adjustable ducting is GREAT!

2. It's very effective at cooling an enclosed space for sure, but it's also wonderful at keeping random people cool throughout the day. We hid the bucket behind our monkey hut and had the ducting come out from the bottom, and I stood on the side of the road with my megaphone yelling out "Janky Blowjobs! Janky blowjobs here!" (We nicknamed our bucket "Janky," and he was blowing, and doing a good job at it). I got tons of people to come up and get refreshed throughout the day. When I was running it like this, I kept topping it off with ice rather than water. The ice made things even colder, and melted fast enough to keep up all day. Don't be afraid to get a blowjob from your bucket! It's great!

3. These things use water so slowly, it's amazing. With about 4ish gallons in the bucket, I could run it for 5+ hours without refilling. I installed a timer switch (Intermatic Wall Switch) and it was great. I would vote that wiring a timer switch onto a bucket can make it totally foolproof, and you'll never burn your pump out.

4. A 10x10 Kodiak tent with no shade was completely comfortable to sleep in with a 190cfm fan blowing from the bucket and a few windows open for ducting (slight billowing of the tent) ALL DAY. I went to bed at 1pm once, and woke up around 11pm. Cooler had turned off automatically at 6 and the cool evening air kept me asleep for the rest of it. A small coleman tent with shade over it was freezing cold from noon to six when a friend napped in it.

5. Don't be "that guy" and put food in the cooler where the ice melt is coming from. Realizing that the water I was filling my bucket up with was a shade of brown and thus putting it out of commission for burn weekend (it blew smelly air!) was one of the low points of the week. Still not sure who thought putting fresh lemons and limes hidden under drinks in my drink cooler would be a good idea. They... got soggy and... interesting. Very interesting texture to the water by the time we got back to default.

6. I suck at all things technical, mechanical, or buildable, and I was able to throw this thing together in about an hour once I had all of the materials. Don't let your lack of knowledge stop you from building a bucket! Just do it! The results don't make sense for how easy it is to build. These things are too fucking good.

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dragonpilot
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by dragonpilot » Sun Sep 14, 2014 6:19 pm

OK...year #2 and it still sucked. I think the culprit is the wimpy HF solar pump...I just don't think it's putting enough water into the pads...seems like it is, but my guess is it's not. The fan goes like gangbusters off my battery.

This thread is so huge I've lost track of what 12V battery-powered pump to get. Willing to give it another try.
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maladroit
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by maladroit » Sun Sep 14, 2014 6:27 pm

dragonpilot wrote:OK...year #2 and it still sucked. I think the culprit is the wimpy HF solar pump...I just don't think it's putting enough water into the pads...seems like it is, but my guess is it's not. The fan goes like gangbusters off my battery.

This thread is so huge I've lost track of what 12V battery-powered pump to get. Willing to give it another try.
I may have the same issue (works, but interested in what more gph will do). If I find an interesting pump to try I'll post back in here.

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Sun Sep 14, 2014 6:37 pm

This is the new "best choice" that I've found at a fraction of the cost of the original!!! 8)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/261351083541?lpid=82
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Wed Sep 17, 2014 11:42 am

Here is a real easy way to build a box.

Go to your local lumber place and get a 2"x8"x8' board. ($7)

Make sure to pick a nice flat one with no bows or twists.

Most places will make your cuts for free, and their saw will cut the ends nice and square.

Drill 3 holes in each end of the bottom piece so that the screws can pull it tight to the sides.

Image

Lay these on a flat surface, then glue and screw these pieces together.

Now it is simple to add the plywood to the front and back to complete your box! 8)


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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Joeln » Wed Sep 17, 2014 12:23 pm

FIGJAM wrote:This is the new "best choice" that I've found at a fraction of the cost of the original!!! 8)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/261351083541?lpid=82
I got one of these - it works great.
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Wed Sep 17, 2014 5:13 pm

They're cheap enough to buy two so that you have a backup pump. 8)
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maladroit
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by maladroit » Wed Sep 17, 2014 5:21 pm

Cheap enough to buy four...and install two in your cooler with failover switch!

You can do that with fans too, a lot of rackmount servers stack fans in series.

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Advice on leaks in the bucket cooler

Post by bud buddah » Sun Sep 28, 2014 10:21 pm

Does anyone have advice on how to keep the bucket cooler from leaking through the side holes? Mine leaked something awful. I had to stop using it because the leak was forming a puddle that run into the yurt. I used the harbor freight solar pump and followed the usual directions. When it was on, it blew lots of cold air. But I had to give up on it to keep from getting puddles in the yurt.

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by BBadger » Sun Sep 28, 2014 10:31 pm

Your leaks might be because the sponge is saturated and the water has no place to drip.

My friend used a bucket-on-top-of-bucket design. The bottom bucket was the reservoir that the pump drew from and the top had the vents and a drain on the bottom so excess water would drip back into the reservoir. Maybe that would work for you.
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:10 pm

The pad should NOT be touching the sides of the bucket where the holes are.

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bud buddah
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by bud buddah » Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:57 pm

Well hell, Figjam, that's my problem. My pad was right up against the bucket. I'll try rolling it a bit tighter and see how it goes.
Thanks,
J

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Monkeystyle » Thu Oct 23, 2014 9:17 pm

Figjam, i just want to say thank you. I made a cooler this year and it worked beautifully, to the point where we moved it out of the monkey hit a few times and away from the tent, and into the common shade, sat around.ut and.passed the hose.like a hooka pipe. I switched out the hard plastic pvc pipe on the top for metalic dryer flex pipe, it made it easier to pipe into.the tent of our choosing without having to tape it to a window vent. Just pull the pipe into a tent and zip the door closed on it.

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Monkeystyle » Thu Oct 23, 2014 9:21 pm

bud buddah wrote:Well hell, Figjam, that's my problem. My pad was right up against the bucket. I'll try rolling it a bit tighter and see how it goes.
Thanks,
J
Figjam, i just want to say thank you. I made a cooler this year and it worked beautifully, to the point where we moved it out of the monkey hit a few times and away from the tent, and into the common shade, sat around.ut and.passed the hose.like a hooka pipe. I switched out the hard plastic pvc pipe on the top for metalic dryer flex pipe, it made it easier to pipe into.the tent of our choosing without having to tape it to a window vent. Just pull the pipe into a tent and zip the door closed on it.

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by oscillator » Thu Jan 08, 2015 7:42 pm

Quick report on my experience:

Ordered (4) units. Of those four, guess how many worked?

Nada. Zip.

The motor turns on, emitting something much less than an "ultra quiet" noise, but I got no flow at all thru the unmarked inlet or outlets - in either direction.
P1000652.JPG
P1000653.JPG
Perhaps I am doing it wrong, but methinks you get what you pay for.

BTW, the previous $45 pump died after 3 days on playa after a grand total of maybe 12 hours usage.

-OSC

FIGJAM wrote:This is the new "best choice" that I've found at a fraction of the cost of the original!!! 8)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/261351083541?lpid=82
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FIGJAM
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jan 08, 2015 8:48 pm

That surprises me.

I bought 4.

2 for coolers I built for somebody else, and 2 for backups.

They all worked great and put out as mush water as the big original pump. :?
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maladroit
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by maladroit » Thu Jan 08, 2015 11:10 pm

In those pictures, they don't look very wet...

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by unjonharley » Fri Jan 09, 2015 7:57 am

The solar HF fish pumps have worked to burns.. Thinking of getting two more for back up..
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by oscillator » Fri Jan 09, 2015 2:59 pm

Bad production run? Sunspots??

They all did have a 'Passed QA" sticker, but maybe it was Friday.

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Dactylion » Sun Jan 11, 2015 12:30 am

MFOB, The "wrongway Endless Breeze fan" that I got doesn't blow the wrong way! It blows the right way but with a lot less force than it should have if the blades were molded in the correct orientation. [Here, I'll try to explain this problem better... ] The blades turn in the correct rotation and they are angled to push the air in the proper direction. BUT the curvature of the blades-- the airfoil shape that's supposed to make them work like little airplane wings and give them more efficiency-- was flipped 180 in the mold. So it blows the right way but with much less effectiveness. Here's the original post viewtopic.php?f=280&t=33842&p=1020032&h ... r#p1020032

If you dremel out the shaft hole, flip the fan over and add a washer to hold it, it still blows the same direction as before but with a whole lot more volume & force. Good Luck!
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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by Thecatman » Sun Jan 11, 2015 1:06 am

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Re: cooling your tent or van

Post by burn_shady » Fri Jan 16, 2015 5:55 pm

Dactylion wrote:...BUT the curvature of the blades-- the airfoil shape that's supposed to make them work like little airplane wings and give them more efficiency-- was flipped 180 in the mold. So it blows the right way but with much less effectiveness.
OMFG... it finally makes sense. I'd disassembled the fan, poked at the wiring, put it all back together and sat there thinking "WTF did I just do to it to make it suck and blow at the same time and still not do either very well?" I went over polarity, fan attachment, etc. trying to figure out how I just crippled what was supposed to be a mild tornado in a plastic cage, but with no luck. It "worked" but not in a heroic kind of way. All of my swamp-cooler attempts with this fan were foiled and craptacular at best.... now I get it.

I just went out, dremel'ed the hole, reattached with a washer, presto: the kind of real gust I was expecting, flowing straight out from the fan. Before this, it felt like air was being pushed forward, but in an extremely outward direction at the same time ("outward" as in radially outward from the center of the fan).

Thanks again.

When I bought it, I bought two and gave one away being somewhat frustrated with it all.... now the dilemma... tell him about the fix or discreetly ask for it back since it's probably useless for him too.

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