The Bar 2015 Edition

Thecatman · Post by **Thecatman** » Tue Jan 27, 2015 4:34 pm

Afternoon All!!

Wasn't NYC was supposed to get aprx 30" and ended up with about 6.
It looks like the mountains around Carson City got more than was forecasted though. I was working in Virginia City (6200') today and snow fell for a while. Didn't stick but 500' higher at the top of Gieger Summit it was sticking on the trees and brush. I guess similar for Mt Rose area. Just light sprinkles in Dayton
Day off tommorow

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Tue Jan 27, 2015 5:14 pm

trilobyte wrote:... Fancy setup, Canoe, congrats on the new gear! At some point I'd like to do a nice big 31-32 inch 4K screen for my primary machine, in the meantime I'm making do with a pair of 28 inch 1440p displays. Great background imagery, too!

It was cheap too. 2nd gen 4K is due out, so 1st gen was being sold off. Good enough for my use, so got it for $395 USD (only in CAD plus taxes). Had to shell out $300 CAD for a new graphics card too, but after I sell four of the 28" monitors, and the 6up eye-finity graphics card and the six dongles, I should have $200 to $300 in pocket above what I paid for the 4k & new card. Couldn't say no to that.

For that image, the layers stepped shading with distance is amazing to see on that size of screen. I find they make me feel very peaceful.
I've got two more, aimed to the left. So many renderings possible.
From one:

playa back-light.jpg

FIGJAM wrote:32" is easy on the eyes.

Yup!
The first night I had it, evey time I walked into the room it was WTF! oh, right...

A friend has the 39" same as mine. If it wasn't that I need both the pixels and the size for stock graphs, I'd have gone for the 39" for sure.
But then there's having that desktop image floating there...

Post by **trilobyte** » Tue Jan 27, 2015 9:36 pm

It's very very easy on the eyes, I had the pleasure of working with Sharp's really awesome display from time to time while working on a system design project over the last few years. I'm glad that the project completed successfully, but I miss that fancy display. Every time I played with it, I wished I could have it back home with me, using it for all my own apps and images and videos. Alas, TV's won't cut it for what we need, so I'm holding out for a combination of a) recovering from the monster computer purchase and b) prices coming down from the stratosphere on a viable 4K display. In the meantime, I'm certainly not suffering with the 1440p's.

Meanwhile, time to make drinks and step away from the machine for a while as the big render (155 megapixels) chugs along in the background.

*grabs bottle of vodka and wanders off*

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:36 am

trilobyte wrote:... Alas, TV's won't cut it for what we need...

In my six up was with Hanns-G monitors, except for the lower left, which was the tv version of the same monitor, Hannspree. Once the sharpness was turned down, and each monitor calibrated, all was fine. (With linux, it identified them all and the monitors all had the same colour with the TV version ever so slightly off).

The cheap 4K TV versions are great if you want the real estate (as with using TVs as monitors, do turn the sharpness way down) and the 30hz refresh is good enough (keeps up with 11 stock charts with multiple indicators running 8 price ticks per second). If you want the pixel density, the seiki 39" was pretty good, and they're due to release a 4k monitor this year. And the 2nd gen 4K should be both DP and HDMI 2.0 capable (so full colour at 4K 60hz), but the 55" is expected at $1,200 to $1,800, not the $395 sale price I paid for a 1st gen. Surprisingly, The colour and contrast are very good - much better than I expected. I wasn't expecting to be able to photo-edit on it. Actually has a decent no-tint black too. So good I haven't calibrated yet. Had this planned for around a year. Just waiting for the price to fall on the 1st gen models.

My estimate was a little off. The actual screen is slightly larger than the physical estimate, but a great way to loose bevels and managing four monitors.

my six up vs. 4k 55 inch.png

robbidobbs · Post by **robbidobbs** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:18 am

I'm not awake enough for this.

Post by **AntiM** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:52 am

I agree.

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 7:23 am

*wanders in, makes CCC*
I'm totally lost on this tech talk.......but,carry on!! sounds fun!

fighting a dang cold.......hoping to over come this monster!!

well, the promised rain didn't happen here......looks like a Jan. with no precip! eek!

Thecatman · Post by **Thecatman** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 7:57 am

Mornin All!!
Hope you get better ygmir.
It's been about 5 years or so since I've had knockdown-drag out fight with a cold or the flu
According to channel 8 news, about 0.06" of rain at the airport in Reno
Leaving in a few minutes to go get my haircut. Theres a good barber in Carson City

robbidobbs · Post by **robbidobbs** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 8:05 am

Does he cut all the hairs?

Ok, more coffee.

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 9:54 am

ygmir wrote:...

fighting a dang cold.......hoping to over come this monster!!

Soon as you get your duct-work hogged out, you will have A LOT LESS of that -- says personal experience.

Post by **trilobyte** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:24 pm

Sorry for getting geeky, folks, if you can indulge me a bit I'll try to explain in plain english... otherwise just go ahead and skip the next paragraph...

Canoe, for me the issue with using a TV instead of a computer monitor is huge. I don't know about multiple screens full of stock tickers or news items, but when it comes to video production, 3D modeling and rendering, and doing serious design stuff the screen door effect alone is a dealbreaker. To see what I mean, put your face about 6 inches from the screen. On a TV (even a really nice one), you'll notice that it's a little like looking through a screen door. On a decent quality computer display, it isn't. That's because the gap between each pixel or dot on the screen is much smaller on a computer display than on a TV. Sure you normally sit a couple feet back...but it translates to significantly more strain on your eyes over time. Other factors like color accuracy, color calibration, and viewing angles are big for content creators too... but the screen door test has been the dealbreaker with every single TV I've looked at. I don't know if it's a video production thing (I spent a lot of years working in tv production environments), a designer thing (my gf and I both have been doing that kind of stuff for decades), or something else.. but for both our purposes it just doesn't work.

Anyhow, busy morning of playing with renders. The big one I started last night took several hours even with dozens of processor cores all working together, and came out pretty good but I think I can fine tune some stuff and make it even better. So now I'm tinkering around with minor changes and running some smaller tests before I render the really large format image again. It's tedious, but always seems to be a good learning process, and I'm really excited about the art project. We should have this piece, along with some of the others, done and ready to share soonish. Now it's time to go off and find a sammich.

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:00 pm

It's very much like you say, if you get a 1080 55" tv.
But when you're into the flat displays, depending on pixel density, it's not like that. We're not talking CRTs anymore. You have to look at the DPI, not be biased by the driving electronics (unless you can't turn off the "tv" image processing).
My 28" LCD in TV version is the identical "screen" to the LCD monitor. Only difference is the speakers and the driving electronics with a tuner and no DVI, just HDMI. I bought one of each in the 28" size to be sure. Then, for the various people who wanted one, (in the States, brought back to Canada) I bought ten of the TV version (hannspree) and six of the monitor version (hannsG) (monitor version had smaller bevels, so they'd mount in a 2x3 closer together). Calibrated, I could do adjustments and WYSIWYG when I printed at either of two shops for which I had their printer profiles. One such print (which was going to a dignitary), was a shot of a painting. I laid the life-sized pigmented ink-jet beside the original painting under 5000K with a high CRI, and I couldn't tell the colours apart (mind you I had the painting sitting to my right in natural light when I did the on-screen WYSIWYG adjustments).
I was a professional photographer for ten years, so I'm very picky in my imaging. These 'screens' are not equivalent to top of the line Dell, but while I pulled out the calibration puck and hung in the middle of each screen to calibrate the 2x6 array, I doubt I'm going to do that with the new 4K unless I need to do some precision printing again. It is that good. The colour, luminosity and smooth graduations, it's like printing on Cibachrome again, only without the contrast hassles. Going six inches from the screens, I'd say that the pixel density between the 28" and the 4K is so close, I'd have to get the calipers out to measure a spread-count.

magicmarty · Post by **magicmarty** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:16 pm

I don't do any of the fancy stuff that you guys do, just need a bigger screen so things are easier to see. A 32" TV with 1080 display is way less costly than a similar monitor and you get an extra TV to boot. So, to save my eyes, I'm going with the 32" TV.

Cheers

(((LF)))

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:26 pm

32" and 1080 will be fine at TV viewing distances, but for a monitor... maybe yes, maybe no. At 32" and 1080, you're pushing into the effect that trilobyte is talking about. The 28" monitors and TVs I had were 1920x1200, not 1080. You might find some available still. Better for monitor use, not as large a screen for TV use (but my daughter, sister, dad, nephew, etc., find the 28" 1200 fine for TV).

If you haven't bought it yet, take a laptop into the store and see it run the TV as a monitor at monitor use distance.

LED (pretty much all new models) is more even lighting, and much less power and heat. That bank of 2x3 array kicked out a lot of heat.

Joeln · Post by **Joeln** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:28 pm

Elliot wrote:Soon as you get your duct-work hogged out...

Haven't heard that phrase for years!

Elliot!

magicmarty · Post by **magicmarty** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:55 pm

Thanks for the info, Canoe. I will take your advice.

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 5:36 pm

Canoe wrote:... If you haven't bought it yet, take a laptop into the store and see it run the TV as a monitor at monitor use distance...

Make sure you're not using the PC type connection (analog).
TV models typically do not have DP (display port) nor DVI inputs. They should have HDMI inputs. See what your digital monitor output type is for your laptop, and have the appropriate cable with you, be it HDMI-to-HDMI, or DVI-to-HDMI.
And you'll likely have to go through the TV's menu and turn the image Sharpness down to 10, if not zero.

lucky420 · Post by **lucky420** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:26 am

Morning Bar...

It's way to early to be up but I am. Not really feeling sleepy. Anyone up for a cuddle?

Captain Goddammit · Post by **Captain Goddammit** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 4:07 am

I have to be up by 5 but I tend to wake up super early for no reason. Like now!

tatonka · Post by **tatonka** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 6:11 am

went to bed at eleven and was woke at 1:00 am with the cops banging on the door , they said someone called and said there was a herion overdose going on .
told them no problems here and go try and catch false reporter

mgb327 · Post by **mgb327** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 6:20 am

lucky420 wrote:Morning Bar...

It's way to early to be up but I am. Not really feeling sleepy. Anyone up for a cuddle?

Ummm....yes?

ygmir · Post by **ygmir** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 6:48 am

*wanders in, makes CCC*
drops "airborne" vit. C cap in coffee*

Hi gang!
snow survey today said 24% of normal snow pack.......eek! sure hope something happens soon!!

lucky420 · Post by **lucky420** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:18 am

mgb327 wrote:
lucky420 wrote:Morning Bar...

It's way to early to be up but I am. Not really feeling sleepy. Anyone up for a cuddle?
Ummm....yes?

Yes!

Ratty · Post by **Ratty** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:29 am

Hummmmmm. Was typing message in log-in box. Coffee me please. The message was about the Ukulele Orchestra from GB that we saw last night. Great fun. Today...not so much. Meeting with the solid waste authority at the City Hall. I really hate dressing up in grown-up clothes. Thanks. Flops down on the sofa in a puff of playa.

robbidobbs · Post by **robbidobbs** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:21 am

Good morning!!!
Here's a cup o coffee for me and one for you.
Solid waste Authority? I get to go to the junk yard today. I get to dress down for this too.
Sorry Ratty, gov'mint folks aren't impressed with tutus, no matter how much glitter they dribble.
(Edited because the pronoun "they" is either vaguely attached to tutus or gov'mint folks. Leaving it cause it's a funny visual...and kind of philosophical in a surreal sort of way.)

bedlamdoll · Post by **bedlamdoll** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:35 am

Morning all. *pours more coffee*
Sympathies on the grown-up clothes, Ratty. It's legislative session around here so I have to make an effort at adulting whenever I'm in the office just in case I have to go play agency expert (that those words get applied to me is terrifying). I'm rebelling by wearing funky socks/tights for now.

Post by **trilobyte** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 10:33 am

Good morning! I'm groggy, but cheerful. My giganto-render (155 megapixels, or about 10 times bigger than a digital camera) finished while I slept, and it looks great. Even with 50 cpu threads working on the render (about 25 times more power than my laptop), it takes a little over 8 hours to render with all the settings fine tuned the way we wanted... so I'm really glad this one's a keeper. When we're in the early stages we work at much lower resolutions and it takes no time at all to test things and get an idea where things are going, but as we get closer to the end we kick up all the various quality settings and render features, and each round takes longer and longer. Time to make brekkie!

^Rhino! · Post by **^Rhino!** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 11:12 am

Ratty wrote:Hummmmmm. Was typing message in log-in box. Coffee me please. The message was about the Ukulele Orchestra from GB that we saw last night. Great fun. Today...not so much. Meeting with the solid waste authority at the City Hall. I really hate dressing up in grown-up clothes. Thanks. Flops down on the sofa in a puff of playa.

**Turns green with envy**

The Ukelele Orchestra of Great Britain?

They are uke virtuosos! Memorable tune: Theme from "Shaft", or Theme from 'The Good the Bad, and the Ugly.'

[media]

The theme was by Italian composer Ennio Morricone, who also wrote the music for the rest of the Clint Eastwood 'sphaghetti westerns' that were directed by Sergio Leone. Clint did an homage to Sergio Leone in a later movie, 'High Plains Drifter'....Sergio Leone's name appears on one of the headstones in the cemetary.

Cool stuff to ponder on a Thursday. Thanks, Ratty!

^Rhino! · Post by **^Rhino!** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 11:15 am

robbidobbs wrote:
Good morning!!!
Here's a cup o coffee for me and one for you.
Solid waste Authority? I get to go to the junk yard today. I get to dress down for this too.
Sorry Ratty, gov'mint folks aren't impressed with tutus, no matter how much glitter they dribble.
(Edited because the pronoun "they" is either vaguely attached to tutus or gov'mint folks. Leaving it cause it's a funny visual...and kind of philosophical in a surreal sort of way.)

Robbi....speaking from personal experience as being a gov'mint geoscientist...only SOME of my fellow employees dribble. Mainly the inflexible ones.

Post by **trilobyte** » Thu Jan 29, 2015 2:17 pm

Man, that didn't last long. I got as far as getting food out of the fridge and thought of a little change I'd want to make. Rather than wait til after eating I figured I'd knock it out first so the re-do could get started sooner. Next thing I know I'm down the rabbit hole on a bunch of changes, when I got back to the fridge it was time for lunch. As soon as the test of this last little test finishes I'll bounce it off my better half, and then do the giganto-render one last time. Then hopefully by the time we get back from the neighborhood thing tonight, it should be ready.

Our neighborhood is doing a sort of open house thing tonight. A bunch of the shops and businesses are staying open later and participating in this evening hours event, designed to help people explore and check out the community after the workday. I think it's a great idea, our neighborhood has seen a ton of upheaval in the last couple years. There are lots of new businesses that have either started up or relocated, and it's a good way for long-time residents to see what's new or for the new folks to learn more about the place they live now.

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