Bike Builders Unite

captain voltaveus · Post by **captain voltaveus** » Sat Jan 31, 2015 6:25 am

Navi_Keef wrote:
captain voltaveus wrote:Would a small coleman camping bottle really generate enough pressure to blast any real poof? I tried using one of those for my Ruben's tube and it didn't generate enough pressure to fully prime the system.

Could one easily modify the weed burners that are commercially available at HD for trike mounted fire effects?
if you watch the first video i posted and look at the tutorial he is using one of the 4-5oz propane bottle. honestly i would be completely content with a poof that size. keep in mind that your rubens tube also has multiple ports of exit and is constantly flowing. this fire effect would only be delivering short burst

Are you planning on using those little cans without an accumulator? What size pipe will you use? Are you envisioning a striaght shot right up out of the tank through a solenoid? I like the idea of a smaller set up on the bike.

Navi_Keef · Post by **Navi_Keef** » Mon Feb 02, 2015 4:15 am

captain voltaveus wrote:
Are you planning on using those little cans without an accumulator? What size pipe will you use? Are you envisioning a striaght shot right up out of the tank through a solenoid? I like the idea of a smaller set up on the bike.

not those small ones, i was just saying that is the size that they use in the video on the rc poofer i posted. im going to use the ones that are about twice that size, the green 1lb camping tanks you buy I do not plan on using an accumulator tank. instead i am using one tank for the pilot and a separate one for the effect. I plan on using a somewhat flexible tubing to the solenoid then a straight shot from the solenoid.

Captain Goddammit · Post by **Captain Goddammit** » Mon Feb 02, 2015 4:46 pm

So here's the other vintage BMX restoration project, 1976 Yamaha Moto-Bike.
These were only made 1974-1976, sold at Yamaha motorcycle dealers. They were built like a little motorcycle, with the same front shocks as the YZ80 motorbike.

Navi_Keef · Post by **Navi_Keef** » Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:13 am

wish i would of seen this before i bought my crusher, although it is lacking style

efatbike for under $500

Post by **Elderberry** » Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:25 am

Navi_Keef wrote:wish i would of seen this before i bought my crusher, although it is lacking style

efatbike for under $500

Nice.

captain voltaveus · Post by **captain voltaveus** » Thu Feb 05, 2015 12:28 am

Navi_Keef wrote:
captain voltaveus wrote:
Are you planning on using those little cans without an accumulator? What size pipe will you use? Are you envisioning a striaght shot right up out of the tank through a solenoid? I like the idea of a smaller set up on the bike.
not those small ones, i was just saying that is the size that they use in the video on the rc poofer i posted. im going to use the ones that are about twice that size, the green 1lb camping tanks you buy I do not plan on using an accumulator tank. instead i am using one tank for the pilot and a separate one for the effect. I plan on using a somewhat flexible tubing to the solenoid then a straight shot from the solenoid.

It looks like the requirements are that flame effects are 10 ft above the ground, yes? Are you thinking a flexible tube up to the solenoid and then the straight shot up? I am curious which size solenoid you were going to go for? Do you think cannister > safety off valve > 6ft of flexible tubing > 1/4 inch solenoid > 2 feet of pipe > POOF! would do it? Would a 1/2 or 3/4 inch solenoid be better or just lead to a quicker draining of the cannister? I'll be mounting mine off the back of the trike, so that should put me at roughly 10ft.

Navi_Keef · Post by **Navi_Keef** » Thu Feb 05, 2015 5:39 am

captain voltaveus wrote:
It looks like the requirements are that flame effects are 10 ft above the ground, yes? Are you thinking a flexible tube up to the solenoid and then the straight shot up? I am curious which size solenoid you were going to go for? Do you think cannister > safety off valve > 6ft of flexible tubing > 1/4 inch solenoid > 2 feet of pipe > POOF! would do it? Would a 1/2 or 3/4 inch solenoid be better or just lead to a quicker draining of the cannister? I'll be mounting mine off the back of the trike, so that should put me at roughly 10ft.

I have not checked requirements and was going to do that as soon as i started ordering materials. I was thinking a regulator valve with whichever necessary adapters. something like this
http://www.lowes.com/pd_600130-48443-LP ... facetInfo=

then to the solenoid and yes probably about 2 feet of pipe after the solenoid. keep in mind this is my first time building something like this but i feel that it shouldnt be too crazy to figure out and i have good people around me to give me advice.

Molotov · Post by **Molotov** » Thu Feb 05, 2015 7:16 am

Even if you ran a straight pipe with valve direct from the small cylinder, I think your limiting factor will be how fast the liquefied gas in the cylinder vaporizes. You may have an initial "poof" but once that gas is gone, it will take a bit of time for the remaining liquid in the cylinder to boil and vaporize into something combustible. I think that's why you see a lot of flame effect operators using cylinder warmers with accumulators to gather a considerable amount of gas prior to release.

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Thu Feb 05, 2015 3:45 pm

Navi_Keef wrote:wish i would of seen this before i bought my crusher, although it is lacking style
efatbike for under $500

I stopped by for a drive-by. Saw this.

Not credible.
And $180 for a battery to extend your range by 30-50 miles?
And the bike weighs 45 lbs?
Given the limiting physics of batteries and motors: at that price, it can't be that range or that weight. On top of that, it's got the extra weight and rolling resistance of a fat bike. From photos, I'm seeing the same low-level quality of components as are on the beast & dolo, so the price is credible. The capabilities you're supposed to get are not.

So a google showed I'm not alone.
https://www.yahoo.com/tech/a-500-ebike- ... 04619.html

Indiegogo charges credit cards or Paypal accounts immediately once people make a contribution. There’s no changing your mind and getting money back.
As with other crowdfunding platforms, Indiegogo is under no obligation to refund contributions if the owner of the campaign fails to deliver the goods as promised.

The company’s original website, Storm-ebikes.com, redirects to the Indiegogo campaign. Neither site lists a physical address or contact information besides an info@ email address. The domain name information for its websites is masked.

Some of the prototype photos with people with the bike show an adult mountain bike sized object.
In others, it's clearly youth sized.
So are the rims on the bike that will be delivered, 26", 24" or 20"?

Canoe · Post by **Canoe** » Thu Feb 05, 2015 9:25 pm

And someone sourced some of the parts.
http://www.treehugger.com/bikes/500-sto ... looks.html

chuckularone · Post by **chuckularone** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 6:40 am

I have a (new to me) Hill Topper electric front wheel, but no battery pack or controller. Does anyone know the pinout for this beast?

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 7:50 am

chuckularone wrote:I have a (new to me) Hill Topper electric front wheel, but no battery pack or controller. Does anyone know the pinout for this beast?

Controllers and such can be found on line...Damn you sober enough to post on eplaya?? Took awhile huh??

chuckularone · Post by **chuckularone** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:11 am

Thanks, Unjohn. I found those, I just want to avoid buying what can be built.

Edited to add: And I don't even know if the thing works!

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:14 am

chuckularone wrote:Thanks, Unjohn. I found those, I just want to avoid buying what can be built.
Edited to add: And I don't even know if the thing works!

Jump it with your car.. It wont run full speed.. It a way to test run..

chuckularone · Post by **chuckularone** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:21 am

That's what I need the pinout for. I don't want to cook it.

Navi_Keef · Post by **Navi_Keef** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:52 am

chuckularone wrote:That's what I need the pinout for. I don't want to cook it.

your car battery should be a 12volt. these motors run 26-48 volt. from what i understand, you should be just fine.

chuckularone · Post by **chuckularone** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:11 am

There is a 5 or 6 pin connector. I am looking for a pinout so I don't accidentally hook something up wrong. I don't know if two of the leads are a speed (or other) sensor.
I know two of the leads are power, I just don't know which two.

chuckularone · Post by **chuckularone** » Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:16 am

Nevermind, after much googling I found this:

This is the "magic box" between your battery and your motor. Regular 24V DC electricity goes into the two controller battery wires and "pulse width modulated" 24V DC electricity comes out the three motor power wires to power the motor.

This is not AC, but in certain basic terms has a similar function. This is the reason many electric bike motors have three power wires coming out of them, even though they are called brushless "DC" motors. You may be familiar with simple DC electric motors that only have two wires. These motors are also technically DC motors, but the pulse modulation split up over three power wires has advantages of making them more efficient.

More work than just hooking it up to power.

Ratty · Post by **Ratty** » Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:10 pm

So I wanted 2 free tires and had to take the whole bike. You tell me. can I just keep the tires and leave the rest out for the scavengers?

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:30 pm

Methinks it depends on whether you have scrap metal collectors working your neighborhood.
You can also search for a recycling yard in your area, and maybe drop it off there.

Ratty · Post by **Ratty** » Fri Feb 13, 2015 4:35 pm

Thanks Elliott. Yes I have scrap metal people and bike people that will take it. But it's so pretty. (Shiny aluminum). I'll just keep the tires, pedals and the seat. Maybe the front rim. I gave away all my spare parts last year while we were installing padded seat covers. Thanks

captain voltaveus · Post by **captain voltaveus** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:35 pm

Trike Progress!

Thanks for all the advice on getting my fatty trike project off the ground. I am fondly naming this project "Two steps forward - One step back"

First I started with a Mongoose Dolomite that I ordered promptly upon returning to the default world last year. I was so prideful about my furry cruiser with banana seat, only to find my self coveting my campmate's fat wheeled bike, which was so smooth to ride over the ruts and plow through the drifts.

I then bought a trike kit off of ebay, only to find that the kit was too narrow for the Dolo's wide rear triangle, so I found a $20 frame at a local co-op here in Portland, "The Bike Farm" which had a mount for the disc brake. Then, the trike kit mounts were too narrow for the frame which is aluminum and not really tweakable. So, I ended up having to cut off the stays from the kit and re-welding them slightly wider.

I next found a trike hub at the "Community Cycling Center" in Portland - who were really cool and didn't seem to mind trouble shooting the project with me. I want to be able to retain some gearing with this trike, anticipating that it will be heavy even without the propane tank I hope to mount , not to mention the trailer I plan to pull hauling the LED TRON PONG table I built as my gift for this year's Burn. They had a trike hub that would accept a freewheel cassette as well as a disc brake mount.

Then, the axel for that trike hub was too short and I needed to build one out of 3/4 axel thread that I found at Tacoma screw. Finally it all came together power train wise.

I found two steel 4 inch rims on ebay, which of course came with hubs that needed to be relaced with trike hubs. This proved to be somewhat challenging as even in as bike friendly town as Portland, no one seemed to know how to calculate the spoke length for off-set fatty rims. Some shops were helpful, while others were really unhelpful. Too busy to help me trouble shoot this? Seriously? Its pouring rain outside and is Super Bowl Sunday and you have no time for someone who is looking for anything other than buying a new bike or getting a winter tune up? No more business from me for those bastards.

Luckily I was SAVED by the wheel whisperer, Judy at "Sugar Wheels" who has a retail and on-line store where she builds custom high end wheels. She was really cool and helped me out in about 30 minutes no sweat. Next I had to do some you-tube learning and laced up the wheels to the trike hubs. Seems to have worked out pretty good!

THEN, the bearings in the trike hubs didn't match the axel width on the trike kit, giving me the opportunity to learn about industrial bearing supply stores in Portland, which was actually pretty cool.

Today I got her assembled and put some brake and derailer cables on and took her out for a spin. Lots of smiles and waves in the neighborhood for sure!

Next I plan to weld a basket for the back where I hope to mount two 5 foot tall flags shamelessly copying the center camp flags, and in the center a propane effect with a large metal lightning bolt as the nozzle. I've got some rattle cans of holographic paint ready to paint the frame and rear cage once I weld it up.

BOOM! Almost ready to go, except for next I think I need to weld a custom bike rack as my Yakima rear rack ain't gonna hold this baby plus any other bikes. Two forward and one back

Captain Goddammit · Post by **Captain Goddammit** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 7:02 pm

100% awesome!!! I hope we find each other on the playa (my boat is easy to spot, and there's the Meet&Greet) I wanna check it out and maybe take it for a test ride! I'll be bringing my mostly stock Dolomite and a Torker trike with wimpy little 2.4" wide tires.
That's a bad ass trike.

Meat Hunter · Post by **Meat Hunter** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 9:01 pm

What an almost perfect trike.

All you need now to make it absolutely perfect is to add a side car and Elliot's reverse gear steering system that attaches to the front steering bar hub and then it would be super-absolutely perfect and almost dumb-rider theft proof.

With me and my Schwinn Meridian trike (with it's dysfunctional rear brake and no gearing a'tall) I am envious..... I want one - and I want one NOW........

All joking aside. You have done a great job and a not so easy job to be proud of.

Tiahaar · Post by **Tiahaar** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 9:20 pm

Outstanding Capt V! That's a real from-the-ground-up trike, luv it. Capt GD yours is gonna have tire envy, lol, but it may have that cool nexus-7 hub right? This is apparently the year of the Trikes!

A note about the Beasts and Dolos...unsealed bottom brackets, so if you take yours swimming, as I did mine Saturday, it will need repacking. Heh, there was a 100 foot stretch of bedrock beach I had to walk the bike across with 2 foot waves washing over and the darn Dolo wanted to float. Sand and water in the bearings gah. Playa dust will get in there as well of course.

There's a crowdfunding thing going on at the moment for an interesting 3-speed front internal gear crank for square bottom bracket axles. Would be great for a cruiser bike but kinda pricey. This weekend I put a bmx kit in the bottom bracket of the trike I'm making so now I can use real cranks instead of the one-piece.

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Mon Feb 16, 2015 10:01 pm

Tiahaar wrote:...
This weekend I put a bmx kit in the bottom bracket of the trike I'm making so now I can use real cranks instead of the one-piece.

Hey! Perhaps ya oughta know my middle name is Ashtabula!

Edit to add: By the way, there are adapters for installing fall-apart cranks in Ashtabula shells.

Captain Goddammit · Post by **Captain Goddammit** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 5:34 am

I always wanted 3-piece cranks for my old-school Mongoose, just so they could be blue anodized ones, but I just couldn't give up my indestructible one piece Ashtabula!

Tiahaar · Post by **Tiahaar** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 1:21 pm

Ya, the real deal Ashtabula cranks are certainly long lasting and perfect for cruiser bikes still. I do swap outs when I have to change crank arm length or need to run 9/16" thread pedals. A properly set-on square crank arm will stay tight, but many are not put on tight by the store and nobody checks them...till they fall off ala one of Elliot's pet peeves heheheh, huh Elliot! Snug them up, mallet them, then tighten again, repeat, and they will stay on. Found this site with some Ashtabula history: http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vinta ... ranks.html So maybe powder coat blue an Ashtabula Capt. GD?

Cranky · Post by **Cranky** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 3:58 pm

I've found that wrapping a strip of soft aluminum (cut from a beer can) around the square taper before pounding on the crank will make the crank stay on for days instead of just hours. I maintain that a piece cut from a Fat Tire Ale can works best, but #1 Son insists on PBS. Go figure...

Cranky

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 4:47 pm

Manufacturers vary, but 310 to 390 inch-pounds is ballpark, with one brand going as high as up to 520 inch-pounds(!).
So let's call it 350 to 400 inch-pounds, which converts into 30 to 35 foot-pounds.

That's from a different thread. And that's a lot of force -- the highest torque anywhere on a bicycle, by far.

Not that I doubt your success with the aluminum foil trick, Cranky, but how much torque are you using? If you use the built-in wrench with the puller that Park Tool sells, which is 6" long, that's 60 to 70 pounds on the very end of that wrench.

I keep hearing about banging on the crank-arm with a mallet, but I worry about the bearings.

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