Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.
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some seeing eye
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Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by some seeing eye » Wed Jul 08, 2015 5:47 pm

The event each year only happens with a complex mating dance between the BMORG and the BLM. Here is a little slice of that dance:

It is not a game or an Internet message board game. It is a peek into what the BMORG deals with without bothering us burners. Most of this happens at the upper layers of the BLM, but we can help supporting them on playa and not creating statistics.

(Interestingly I was just discussing the event with a very experienced professional 'make it happen anywhere event' friend. This person's paid job is to project anything anywhere on the globe fast, safe, cost managed with unlimited resources and zero notice. The context was what would it take to put in an air traffic control center for a week? This individual noted that BM death and injury statistics are far far below expected for a week at BM population numbers. Let's keep it that way ePlayans and burners!)
Last edited by some seeing eye on Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by TT120 » Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:02 pm

It ain't easy being Larry.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Dr. Pyro » Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:19 pm

Even less easy being Larry's dentist.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by GreyCoyote » Wed Jul 08, 2015 6:35 pm

TT120 wrote:It ain't easy being Larry.
Dr. Pyro wrote:Even less easy being Larry's dentist.
Methinks both positions pay exceptionally well and have a "Golden Parachute" clause... :mrgreen:
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by digital » Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:05 pm

Welp, looks like we are NOT authorized to stop runners.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by maladroit » Wed Jul 08, 2015 7:35 pm

Not authorized to write reports and tickets about it, anyway.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by chuckularone » Thu Jul 09, 2015 4:49 am

That was a very interesting read. It leads to me believe that the future of the burn may be in jeopardy.

After all, HOW DARE people be having a good time before the gates open and after they complete their early entry tasks. I mean doesn't everyone hit the playa with a detailed Gantt Chart of the assembly (including exactly how much time the will spend on unforeseeable problems) of their individual projects.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Simon of the Playa » Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:11 am

it is my personal opinion that the VAST majority of BLM agents assigned to BM have come to appreciate the way we do things.

we are a "safe" city especially when you compare it to any city of comparable size over a similar time period.

i think they are learning from us.

i think many govt agencies are learning by sending scouts to observe, document and analyze.

NASA comes to mind.

there are good govt officials, who work to serve, and then there are some who work to serve themselves.

happens all the time and at all levels.

my personal dealings with BLM have always been handled with professionalism and respect.

and i was arrested.


so, in conclusion, do not hate the guy in the trenches, because his boss may be an asshole...

i think this applies in defaultia life too.

just my Opinion, nothing more, nothing less.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by GreyCoyote » Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:20 am

SSE: That Scrib'd document was an eye-opener. Among other things, its pretty clear as to why BMORG sacked HGH: HGH was vocal about its concerns for our safety. The BLM agreed, and thus was the messenger shot.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Sham » Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:24 am

All my interactions with BLM have been positive. I've made friends with several of the officers and see the same people year after year. Last year, we were camped directly next door to them and found them to be good neighbors. It was humorous to overhear them talk during the rainstorm about not being able to give out tickets for getting water on the playa.

I am pretty sure that if we all keep things positive and happy with the cops on the street, things will be fine.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by VultureChow » Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:49 am

Just started reading and it shows how the increase in safety standards is pushed by BLM and not the Org. But, if anything, it shows that the Org is willing to work and ask for help when needed. $4 million in fees should be more than enough to cover Burning MAN officials asking BLM to help with crowd control on burn night. That's the type of interaction you WANT. You don't want the organizers to fear that asking for intervention will jeopardize the event in the future. They saw a potential hazard, asked for help, got it, and no one was hurt. That is a success, not a failure.
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some seeing eye
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by some seeing eye » Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:12 am

The last point, medical seeing more burners for GBH, reenforces concerns myself and other ePlayans have expressed about "bad club behavior" becoming more prevalent at the event. I have never heard of someone consuming GBH voluntarily.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by VultureChow » Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:16 am

some seeing eye wrote:The last point, medical seeing more burners for GBH, reenforces concerns myself and other ePlayans have expressed about "bad club behavior" becoming more prevalent at the event. I have never heard of someone consuming GBH voluntarily.
According to Wikipedia, it's a club drug not just a rape drug.

But it really should be a wakeup call to the org that if it continues to foster the festival vibe/ edm scene, it could endanger the whole event.
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some seeing eye
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by some seeing eye » Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:27 am

VultureChow wrote: But it really should be a wakeup call to the org that if it continues to foster the festival vibe/ edm scene, it could endanger the whole event.
A few years ago, I was at a 2 o'clock large sound camp when I came across a friend who had been involuntarily dosed with that type drug. Checked her vitals, got her hydrated and gathered about a half dozen of our friends to stay with her in a safe place while it wore off. So preventing that is personal.

On a lighter note "Party in the D-lot" would be an excellent music video, and since outside the event, BM intellectual property-free, right?
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:11 am

Some more info...................

•All appropriate HAZMAT procedures were followed during the handling of bodily fluids following the fatal accident.

•Emergency medical services vehicles were available at all times during the event, though Humboldt General Hospital did report a sustained 11 minutes during which time five of eight vehicles were dispatched and three were "idle." Burning Man organizers are uncertain as to why the idle vehicles were not available for use during those 11 minutes.

•Vehicles were not stranded during the delay, but instead were parked on the side of the road. Burning Man organizers at the time told participants that they had the option of going home, though most decided to wait until the weather and conditions improved.

•Pyrotechnic effects, which usually include fireworks or explosive displays, are not allowed on art cars, though Burning Man does allow flame effects, which are automated fire features.

Burning Man also took issue with Kornze's statement Wednesday that the San Francisco-based nonprofit had not addressed enough of the agency's concerns, saying Burning Man staff have been working with a number of agencies to improve its operations.

Burning Man created a new emergency operations chief position, according to Graham, and hired a new medical services management provider, replacing Humboldt General Hospital.

The BLM Winnemucca office has issued the Burning Man permit since 1991 and usually does so by early August. BLM officials are threatening Burning Man's permit this year because of Burning Man's non-compliance with requests for a VIP compound and gourmet food.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Molotov » Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:10 am

If they refuse to issue a permit, they should be prepared for a massive show of civil disobedience that will make the Cliven Bundy standoff look tiny. Folks have tickets in hand (valid or not), they have been prepping since last year, and they ARE coming. What are they gonna do?

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Token » Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:27 am

I like where this is going.

All mobile raves and mobile rave vehicles should provide a bank of JOTS!

SWAT teams as fire safety perimeter so they can tackle folks proper and subdue them with efficiency only trained law enforcement can deliver.
Heck, should just use troops and call it training for middle-east deployment.

Fucking Fantastic!

The BLM sure did fuck it up with their Luxury Resort and Ice-cream social demands though. I really want to like them, I do.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jul 09, 2015 12:18 pm

I want to treat them like I would any other burner.

Be all inclusive an shit until they fuck with my burn.

Then get a ranger to talk to them about their unburny behavior. :roll:
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Ano » Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:24 pm

This is interesting to read. It looks like Burning Man doesn't scale very well upwards as the population gets higher.

Some of these appear to be solvable by certain participants being better participants... like, don't try to come and find a ticket in Gerlach or the staging lot or the will call lot. Some of these appear to be petty, but could be deeper... like, art cars apparently driving in the city. How else do they get out? Some of these appear to be slightly entitled... like theme camps complaining about their private potties not getting pumped... but that one's just me.

Just one outsider perspective. Still soaking it up. Not sure this was a good document to leak to the general public.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by maladroit » Thu Jul 09, 2015 7:33 pm

Eh, some of their complaints made the event seem like more fun, actually. Good Lord, who wants to see flame effects banned on art cars, or making the walkers dress up like road crew (Foxfur excepted...where is that reflective pyro these days?), or the "Fun Police" making sure that everyone is working seriously during early entry?

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by DrYes » Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:33 pm

maladroit wrote:Eh, some of their complaints made the event seem like more fun, actually. Good Lord, who wants to see flame effects banned on art cars, or making the walkers dress up like road crew (Foxfur excepted...where is that reflective pyro these days?), or the "Fun Police" making sure that everyone is working seriously during early entry?
I think the BLM might actually want to do that, and from their point of view I get it.

I've never had much sympathy for the "let's move it to private land" argument until I read that document. My mind is changed. The BLM is right - the things they cite are all real dangers, particularly the fuel storage (both in-camp and on mutant vehicles) and the lack of any real evacuation plan in particular.

I think it's a bit of a miracle and a testament to the goodwill and high competence of Burners that Burning Man has never experienced some kind of either large-scale structure collapse while it's loaded down with people (think the recent tragic collapse of a deck in Berkeley, killing 6 kids) or some kind of nasty explosion and/or fire. 3 years ago I watched an RV down the street from us go up in a huge ball of smoke and fire. If that'd been packed in with a bunch of other fuel-filled RVs, rather than kind of off by itself (it was, if I recall, Sunday, and not crowded yet) it would have been really bad.

Now imagine a rainstorm that goes on for 24 hours, combined with 70 mph winds like 4th of Juplaya got gusts of this weekend. It's a real, legitimate threat to public safety.

But so what. Few to none of us want a completely sanitized event. I don't speak government so I'm not sure what real intention is represented by the concerns the BLM laid out and how thoroughly they expect those concerns to be addressed, but they were a bit scary to me, because they were reasonable and because satisfying some of them might not be possible without some pretty serious restrictions on things like fire the culture of mutant vehicles.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by FIGJAM » Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:57 pm

"DON'T RESCUE ME!!!!!!!!!!"
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Jovankat » Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:05 pm

some seeing eye wrote: I have never heard of someone consuming GBH voluntarily.
It was super popular in the gay club scene in Sydney in the earl 2000's. I know plenty of people who've taken it deliberately.

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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Eric » Fri Jul 10, 2015 12:36 am

DrYes wrote:3 years ago I watched an RV down the street from us go up in a huge ball of smoke and fire. If that'd been packed in with a bunch of other fuel-filled RVs, rather than kind of off by itself (it was, if I recall, Sunday, and not crowded yet) it would have been really bad.
We were on the same street as that as well (6:30) - it was either Sun or early Mon, during daytime. Scary as fuck. Older RV, and it was destroyed down to the base.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by SageV » Fri Jul 10, 2015 1:14 am

Simon of the Playa wrote: i think many govt agencies are learning by sending scouts to observe, document and analyze.

NASA comes to mind.
Also, there's a handful of Fortune 500's that send "brand experience managers" with Ph.d's to research Burners. As one mentioned to me "I hope you aren't going to bust my balls or punch me in the face now that I told you that we want to replicate the relationship burners have with the Burning Man brand for our brand."

Also the Department of Defense...yes I'm serious.
Simon of the Playa wrote: there are good govt officials, who work to serve, and then there are some who work to serve themselves.

happens all the time and at all levels.

my personal dealings with BLM have always been handled with professionalism and respect.

and i was arrested.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by GreyCoyote » Fri Jul 10, 2015 4:24 am

Really odd how we as a society have gone from having every expectation that law enforcement must stay the hell out of law-abiding citizens business, to being gratified when they actually do.

Why do we need armed federal agents toting fully automatic weapons and body armor, while half the civilian populace isnt even wearing clothes? :roll: Its just silly. And risky as hell, too. Can you imagine the civic response to BLM actually using this firepower? (Shaking head)
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Simon of the Playa » Fri Jul 10, 2015 6:24 am

any trip to a NYC subway will bring you face to face with body armor and automatic weapons being sported by the police.


the militarization of our numerous "protective" agencies is the real problem.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by some seeing eye » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:24 am

I stand corrected on the recreational use of GHB. You never know what you are going to learn on ePlaya!
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by ygmir » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:31 am

Simon of the Playa wrote:any trip to a NYC subway will bring you face to face with body armor and automatic weapons being sported by the police.


the militarization of our numerous "protective" agencies is the real problem.
but, but,......you have to know that there is a very real chance a cop standing in said subway could get stabbed or attacked in some, random way. I see the body armor as an ok thing. Now, are the weapons "full auto", or semi auto? And or, if full auto, they have selectors for function. A semi auto is standard carry, and the best configuration, for what they may well have to do.
If you understand military strategy, "full auto" is a "last resort" situation, since control is so difficult.
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Re: Hug a BLM and don't mess up

Post by Simon of the Playa » Fri Jul 10, 2015 7:37 am

a cop standing in said subway could get stabbed or attacked in some, random way.

that applies to EVERYONE...and


by that skewed logic, should we all be walking around looking like a post apocalyptic warrior ninja covered in kevlar scales while toting large rifles?


because i can do that.

if i'm allowed to.....but last i checked, the closure order says i gotta keep mr. blasty at home... 8)


i mean, i want to be ready when ISIS shows up in gerlach....i'm just thinking ahead...
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