Is this canopy frame safe for the playa?

[morfojin]

This seems like an pretty easy way to bring a lot of shade to the playa:
http://mpcanopies.com/index.php?dispatc ... uct_id=157

Should I be worried about this thing in high wind? From what I've read on this forum, it sounds like I should use 8 10x10 tarps instead of one 20x40 so it wont act like a huge sail, right?

Bonus questions:
Should I use lag screws the secure the footpads directly to the playa?

Thanks for any and all advice! ==:-{D>

[Ratty]

I'm scared already. Last year I thought up a new camp carnival ride. Handholds on a huge tarp. The wind was so fierce on Saturday before the gates opened that I could have rode the neighbors tarp. Very relaxing watching it. Just like waves crashing on rocks.

[Captain Goddammit]

Yes you should use lags to screw it down but that's not enough, you ought to tie it with guy lines. Strong ones, and a lot of them.

[morfojin]

I'm scared already. Last year I thought up a new camp carnival ride. Handholds on a huge tarp. The wind was so fierce on Saturday before the gates opened that I could have rode the neighbors tarp. Very relaxing watching it. Just like waves crashing on rocks.

The sounds of the tarp blowing in the wind must have added to the waves crashing feeling. Nice! just like sleeping in a beach bungalow.

[morfojin]

Yes you should use lags to screw it down but that's not enough, you ought to tie it with guy lines. Strong ones, and a lot of them.

So like, do you think I could get away with 4 guy lines at the corners, going out diagonally, and 2 at the peaks of the roofs, going out straight? Maybe 2 more in the middle?

How far out should they stretch?

Also, how about the wide orange strap looking things? Those look pretty heavy duty! What are those called?

Thanks again!

[Joeln]

Yes you should use lags to screw it down but that's not enough, you ought to tie it with guy lines. Strong ones, and a lot of them.

What he said.
Saturday morning there was so much blowing dust, I couldn't see my car until I was 6 feet away from it.
Saw some folks who had gotten in late on Friday and didn't use guy lines. There were about 6 of them trying to keep their shelter from blowing away while they secured it better. Later I saw they had managed to keep things in one piece. Lucky for us, the wind backed off some in the afternoon and we got our shelters up.

[Joeln]

Yes you should use lags to screw it down but that's not enough, you ought to tie it with guy lines. Strong ones, and a lot of them.

So like, do you think I could get away with 4 guy lines at the corners, going out diagonally, and 2 at the peaks of the roofs, going out straight? Maybe 2 more in the middle?

How far out should they stretch?

Also, how about the wide orange strap looking things? Those look pretty heavy duty! What are those called?

Thanks again!

Ratchet straps, get the ones rated higher than 150 pounds.
I'd put 4 on each side and 3 on each end - that's a big sail you'll have there.

[morfojin]

Yes you should use lags to screw it down but that's not enough, you ought to tie it with guy lines. Strong ones, and a lot of them.

So like, do you think I could get away with 4 guy lines at the corners, going out diagonally, and 2 at the peaks of the roofs, going out straight? Maybe 2 more in the middle?

How far out should they stretch?

Also, how about the wide orange strap looking things? Those look pretty heavy duty! What are those called?

Thanks again!

Ratchet straps, get the ones rated higher than 150 pounds.
I'd put 4 on each side and 3 on each end - that's a big sail you'll have there.

Great thanks! so something like this?
http://www.uscargocontrol.com/Ratchet-S ... Aqx98P8HAQ

They're rated at 3,000 pounds!

or just these, rated at 500

[The Rod]

Put the big ass straps on the corners and the 500 #ers on the sides.

Use lag bolts. Read the lag bolt thread for ideas on guylines.

Think about using a combination of smaller tarps instead of one big ass tarp, or better yet use shade cloth.

[Captain Goddammit]

You really need to NOT skimp out on the tie downs. The least you can get away with is the wrong way to build things in BRC.
You can have 70MPH winds out there, and you're surrounded by other people camping that your flying structure will clobber.

Here's all you need to know: if that thing clobbers my wife, there will be an epic problem.

This shit is one of the reasons I won't sleep in a tent out there.

[morfojin]

You really need to NOT skimp out on the tie downs. The least you can get away with is the wrong way to build things in BRC.
You can have 70MPH winds out there, and you're surrounded by other people camping that your flying structure will clobber.

Here's all you need to know: if that thing clobbers my wife, there will be an epic problem.

This shit is one of the reasons I won't sleep in a tent out there.

Aye aye, Cap'n!

[morfojin]

Put the big ass straps on the corners and the 500 #ers on the sides.

Use lag bolts. Read the lag bolt thread for ideas on guylines.

Think about using a combination of smaller tarps instead of one big ass tarp, or better yet use shade cloth.

Hmm, there are a few different threads about lag bolts, but not much about guylines, can tell me which one you're thinking of?

[Roundabout]

Ratchet straps, get the ones rated higher than 150 pounds.
I'd put 4 on each side and 3 on each end - that's a big sail you'll have there.

If you use ratchet straps, be sure they go all the way over the ridge pole and over the sides. You may need to use some heavy gage rope to extend the reach of the ratchet straps this far. Attach the ratchets to 18"X1/2 lag screws. Properly attached in this way, there is no need to use guy lines, because the entire structure is bolted to the ground. Lag screws in the feet is nice to keep the legs from walking, but by themselves will NOT keep your structure from flying. Use 12" lags for the feet.

[Token]

10 foot span of 18 ga pipe ... I'd be nervous.

I'd only use a shade cloth or aluminet with this frame.

Ratcheting this down doesn't fix the weak point mid-10-foot span, and there is lots of those.

Pricy too.

[morfojin]

10 foot span of 18 ga pipe ... I'd be nervous.

I'd only use a shade cloth or aluminet with this frame.

Ratcheting this down doesn't fix the weak point mid-10-foot span, and there is lots of those.

Pricy too.

If you have a cheaper/safer solution, I would love to learn about it!

[morfojin]

Ratchet straps, get the ones rated higher than 150 pounds.
I'd put 4 on each side and 3 on each end - that's a big sail you'll have there.

If you use ratchet straps, be sure they go all the way over the ridge pole and over the sides. You may need to use some heavy gage rope to extend the reach of the ratchet straps this far. Attach the ratchets to 18"X1/2 lag screws. Properly attached in this way, there is no need to use guy lines, because the entire structure is bolted to the ground. Lag screws in the feet is nice to keep the legs from walking, but by themselves will NOT keep your structure from flying. Use 12" lags for the feet.

How many of those over-the-ridge straps would you suggest are needed here?

[Token]

Everywhere you have a leg going down you need to strap in from both sides. The apex of the vertical to base of the next leg both left and right.

You make an X in the wall with the straps.

That way you create a down force on each leg and lateral forces cancel out by the straps on each side.

The problem again is the horizontal span is 10 but leg height is ~ 8.

Maybe an anchor in the ground mid-point at 5 feet to covert the X to an M would be better. Better vertical- horizontal load ratio. Fewer anchors needed too.

[Token]

If you have a cheaper/safer solution, I would love to learn about it!

Costco Carports. Come with sides and roof, proven.

If you equip that frame with equivalent panels, would be close in cost.

Two Carports, 40 x 20 of shade cloth, few 1" conduit pipes to prop up the shade cloth sag ...

I'd go that way because it is 3 separate systems that provide redundancy should one fail.

Tarp is absolutely the most annoying material used in playa due to the noise and failure rate.