The Bar

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:40 pm

GuinivereElise wrote:*downs three shots*
now you.
DO IT!
(I feel like I've just spent the last three years banging my head against the wall)

Well, just two for me, but, yeah... head against wall (repeat as necessary)

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:42 pm

Fish,

questions...

was the bucket a unique creeative expression? was it skillfully executed?

a mathematical proof can absolutely chack all the boxes of my 'is it art' test

when you say this bucket was perhaps marvelous and transformative that was a subjective statement. You imparted a value on the object that might not have been there in the context of the objects creation.

I don't think the property of antiquity automatically qualifies something as art. A stamped coin from ancient rome is a good example.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:44 pm

1 2 3

deep breath

I don't think you were banging your head against the wall. I found one of your deconstructions to be rather helpful.

GuinivereElise · Post by **GuinivereElise** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:45 pm

you're apparently the only one.

*sigh*

4 Women of the Apocalypse · Post by **4 Women of the Apocalypse** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:49 pm

* grabbing all nine cases of Pete's *

this is ours now. the fish can have as many as she can drink before we do.

and we'll need several of those shots.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:49 pm

hey, fuck!

somewhere along the way you passed me in posts!

I am shamed.

Let's toast to it!

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:50 pm

as a matter of fuck

you just might clip 3K tonight

woohooo

another round of shots

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:53 pm

stuart wrote:Fish,

questions...

was the bucket a unique creeative expression? was it skillfully executed?

a mathematical proof can absolutely chack all the boxes of my 'is it art' test

when you say this bucket was perhaps marvelous and transformative that was a subjective statement. You imparted a value on the object that might not have been there in the context of the objects creation.

I don't think the property of antiquity automatically qualifies something as art. A stamped coin from ancient rome is a good example.

I guess that I think all definitions of art are subjective. And that many of them are disengenous about that and about the fact that there can be great deals of mindless predjudice encoded in the subjective definitions. (Note, I'm not saying this about yours--I haven't thought about it deeply enough, perhaps because of my bias.) I guess I see "art" as inherently a political definition, as the old tribal names of self as "the People" or "those who speak" as essentially political definitions designed to exclude "what I don't like."

All that said, I don't think perfumeirs are artists. But then their works are likely to cause me discomfort--not of my smug assumptions, but on a simple bodily level. And I wonder just how self-serving that is of me.

(By the way, I don't find coins to be artistic, because of the multiple impressions. Yet, you could persuade me--I have two or three austrailian coins--one with a frilled lizard, simply because they delight me. And you could go to the old roman coins and say "Look, pressing of ad34" and "See the difference when they were adulterating the copper in x devaluation." Sometimes, I'm so inclusive that all human activity is potentially art.)

GuinivereElise · Post by **GuinivereElise** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:55 pm

okay Stuart: more shots!

DO IT!

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:55 pm

She passed me too, Stuie... fuck...

*raising glass*... here's to Guinivere... may she post forever.... *downs shot, slams glass on bar* Next...

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:57 pm

sputnik wrote:If you care, here is an example of my craft:

Well it ilicits an emotional reaction in that I'm jelous, I ahven't been near a glory hole in years.

But then there's the smug, bucause I'm so much a colorist.

Sure, probably a good idea to do introductory work in clear, but dang, I love color.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:57 pm

here here!!!!!

gulp

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:58 pm

Well shit, where does that leave me in post count?

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:00 pm

I think that if you call everyone an artist the definition becomes useless and untestable. Same thing applies to calling all handmade objects art.

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:01 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:
sputnik wrote:If you care, here is an example of my craft:

Well it ilicits an emotional reaction in that I'm jelous, I ahven't been near a glory hole in years.

But then there's the smug, bucause I'm so much a colorist.

Sure, probably a good idea to do introductory work in clear, but dang, I love color.

I am a slave to light and shadow... which, for me, translates into form. I'm not lost on color, but the 'flow' of an object touches me deeply. Van Gogh drives me up the wall (he did the same to himself) as does Mozart (listening to Piano concerto #21 right now!)... but, my wiring is to follow the path (I am a hunter, as opposed to a gatherer), and the path of form fascinates me... I find that 'pitcher' to be very beautiful... graceful. It flows in a way that I wish my prose would...

helitack · Post by **helitack** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:01 pm

All I know is that my Mac is so much faster in photoshop now that I gots lots more memory. Yes!

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:02 pm

DVD Burner wrote:Well shit, where does that leave me in post count?

top of the pile...

do you want us to pat you on the back until you lose consciousness? We could, you know...

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:10 pm

would anyone consider NeXT to be art?

How about B&O systems?

I do.

But what do I know about art!

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:17 pm

Well, can there be such a thing as mass produced art? The Volkswagon springs to mind, as does the Mercedes Gullwing

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:22 pm

samtzu wrote:Well, can there be such a thing as mass produced art? The Volkswagon springs to mind, as does the Mercedes Gullwing

Yes, IMHO. Despite what I said about coins. It might mean really getting to the guts of mass production, designing so that the endless copies are all "fresh" so that they say as much about the means of production as they do about the designer. Or something lke that.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:22 pm

How about B&O systems

certainly their designs are. Certainly their accoustic qualities are not.

same goes for other mass produced art. The design can be art, the process of creation, not.

GuinivereElise · Post by **GuinivereElise** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:23 pm

hmmmm...
more shots, please...

I'm entirely tooo sober right now.

maybe if I drink enough, i'll black out, and I won't have to think about the asshole on the work thread...

theCryptofishist · Post by **theCryptofishist** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:23 pm

stuart wrote:I think that if you call everyone an artist the definition becomes useless and untestable. Same thing applies to calling all handmade objects art.

I'm possibly in a Dada state where I'm tearing definitions down. I don't think everything is "art." I do think everyone is capable of producing "art."

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:25 pm

GuinivereElise wrote:hmmmm...
more shots, please...

I'm entirely tooo sober right now.

maybe if I drink enough, i'll black out, and I won't have to think about the asshole on the work thread...

Have some scotch... Macallen... twice as old as you... guaranteed to get you where you need to be...

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:26 pm

GuinivereElise wrote:hmmmm...
more shots, please...

I'm entirely tooo sober right now.

maybe if I drink enough, i'll black out, and I won't have to think about the asshole on the work thread...

I think you guys are taking that Force thing in the work thread way too far outta wack.

But hey that's me.

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:26 pm

I'm entirely tooo sober right now.

pick up your goddamned drink and DO IT!

stuart · Post by **stuart** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:27 pm

I think you guys...

I think you are missing the point

samtzu · Post by **samtzu** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:27 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:
stuart wrote:I think that if you call everyone an artist the definition becomes useless and untestable. Same thing applies to calling all handmade objects art.
I'm possibly in a Dada state where I'm tearing definitions down. I don't think everything is "art." I do think everyone is capable of producing "art."

In the end, art is what as defined as art... Van Gogh sold two paintings in his life, and now he is the highest dollar artist.... who knows what anyone thought of the weird neanderthal that left his or her mark on the caves in France, but those drawings are art now.... so, to me, art is defined by time and taste. Art lasts...

GuinivereElise · Post by **GuinivereElise** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:28 pm

DVD: if it were you and Joel, would you think differently??

Stuart: you're doing shots with me, baby...

3 of em...

cheap, lame assed vodka. Guaranteed to burn all the hair out of your nose...

DVD Burner · Post by **DVD Burner** » Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:29 pm

stuart wrote:
I think you guys...
I think you are missing the point

Na,

I got it.

You guys missed his point. In so many words he said sorry and I know Force is a really nice guy and loves women. Just ask his wife.

But like I said, that's just me.