Music is crap

All things outside of Burning Man.
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Magikal
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Music is crap

Post by Magikal » Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:30 pm

...or at least it seems to be. I got thinking about this when another guy and I were discussing dreams on the Psyche forum and I brought up "Dreams" by Fleetwood Mac. I kept discussing it (and Stevie Nicks) in the past-tense, because I think they have pretty well done their thing, and I simply don't see anything near as good as what they had coming along to replace them. Britney Spears is very easy on the eyes, but she just doesn't have any talent. Not to say it was all Stevie, as evinced by her solo career; she was much better as part of the group. That was the classic case of "the whole being greater than the sum of the parts".

Of course, not everyone will agree with my assessment of "great music". For example, another group I think of as being great is ELO, at least in their early years. Fan-TAS-tic stuff, a true fusion of classical and rock and roll. But then the years went by, and they became more and more pop. A disease that seems to afflict them all.

Except Floyd. My God, that was a group (IMHO) that not only turned out epochal work, but never went crap/commercial. Their stuff was (and is! They haven't lost their edge, mostly) breath taking. And while I'm certainly no Beetles fan, even I, a non-musician, can appreciate the raw talent in that group.












Where is all the talent like that today?












Moedumba - erm, Madonna made her fame on conical breastpieces and questionable choices of sperm donors (a blonde Jerry Springer?).

Feces music, or Crap, or Rap, or whatever you call that toneless garbage, is little more than stomach noises and brutish, boring threats, as evinced by the number of them proudly displaying their rap sheets & bullet wounds.

Metal is just hoarse screaming and taking a hammer to guitar strings.

This is supposed to be music?

Maybe I'm just getting to be an old fart, gumming my metamucil as I complain about my digestion. But God, it sure did seem like there used to be a lot better music out there. Or is it the record company execs figure that the 'Mercan public wants crap, so let them eat crap! They only hire tone-deaf talent scouts, and they bring back new "talent" that doesn't even know how to tune a guitar, and the "publicity machine" springs into action to promote them far beyond their natural abilities (Green Day springs to mind :roll:).

Now, to be sure, there are oasis of talent in the barren desert of modern musical entertainment (U2 and their bastard stepchildren Coldplay, Thomas Dolby, Nirvana, Telepop Musik, Enya), but where is all the true talent? What the hell happened to The Hooters? It really shocked me when I learned the guys from Guns n' Roses had been trained in classical music. Did they take a cold, hard look at the 'Mercan music scene and decide the most money to be made was in heavy metal? Or was that really the music they wanted to play? Is this trash really what the people of America really want to hear? Am I, again, out of step?

For now, I survive by listening to smooth jazz (which my jazz live instructor sneeringly refered to as "elevator music" :D ) and desperately scanning the airwaves, like a starving man searching for a buffet, in hopes of finding that etherial bliss I had known once before.

*Sob!* :cry: Thanks for letting me slobber on your shoulder...

*Goes off to blow his nose*
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jimbobby
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Post by jimbobby » Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:22 pm

I'm just getting to be an old fart
you got it
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rodent
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Post by rodent » Mon Feb 21, 2005 2:31 pm

There hasn"t been any real music since Mosart passed...

:)

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Post by LeChatNoir » Mon Feb 21, 2005 4:21 pm

Start by tuning into an NPR station with a music format. This is the tip of the iceberg. There’s more good music out there at this very moment (that rarely, if ever gets air time) than you could ever listen to in your whole life. You just gotta seek it out and quit listening to the top 40 stations only. I’ve not listened to one myself in oh... 4, maybe 5 years. Then scroll through the “What are you listening to?” thread for some very good recommendations.
Magikal wrote:Moedumba - erm, Madonna made her fame...
Feces music, or Crap, or Rap, or whatever you call that...
And ouch, ouch... easy now. While it’s true that sterotypes exist because people exist who fit them, I gotta say that it seems that most of what you are using as a gage is what the Megalo-maniacal media giants tell you is Rap/Metal/Jazz/Whatever. And Madonna did more to advance Electronic music (aka to the general public “Dance Music”) in the conscious of the masses in the 80's than any other pop star of that time, in my opinion. Her “You Can Dance” album still sounds good and it's almost 20 years old.

I’m thinkin’ that you’ve just not dug deep enough yet. Need more? Maybe you could start a “Share with me your music library by Genre and Description” thread

I'm thinking that this is perhaps the most musically vibrant time to date, even. One thing I've found with music is the more I seek, the bigger and better it gets.

Now start diggin!!!
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Magikal
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Post by Magikal » Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:26 am

Whew! Thot this thread was gonna pass off the bottom of the screen w/o comment...

To Jimbobby, thank you, young man. Perhaps when you grow up, you'll understand.

Rodent, you may have a point there.

Yon Cat of Black, you are correct, my friend. NPR is one of my faves. Indeed, there is good stuff out there; local station FM 94.9 plays Big Sonic Chill every nite after 10, wherein I get to hear really good, cutting-edge stuff. I guess the point of my rant was that the top 40 stations rarely, if ever, play such stuff and I HAVE to search it out. Again, I fear they are, like good business people, only playing what the bulk of the public wants to hear. Isn't that a scary thot?

And my apologies for "dissing" (much as I hate to use "gangsta" terminology) Madonna & rap as a whole. I have always been rather harsh in my judgements (if ya hadn't already picked up on that!!! :P ). Perhaps it is simply that they are capable of so much more, and yet disappoint so :cry:.
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Post by LeChatNoir » Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:51 am

I guess the point of my rant was that the top 40 stations rarely, if ever, play such stuff and I HAVE to search it out.
Yeah, it used to bug me too, but now I like that I have to search it out. It’s like an adventure and I get to reap the rewards of it... then share it with others.
Again, I fear they are, like good business people, only playing what the bulk of the public wants to hear. Isn't that a scary thot?
Hmmm You, know... I think they play what the general public thinks it wants to hear. Since they don’t’ know anything else exists, they accept the stuff they hear as the best there is.
Perhaps when you grow up, you'll understand.
Speaking for myself... I'm never growing up. I refuse.
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Post by Ranger Genius » Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:59 am

We call it the "Top 40 Syndrome:" A song somehow sneaks into the top 40, so all the stations start playing it. Everyone assumes it must be popular, since the stations are playing it and it's in the top 40, so they buy the album and pretend to like it. It becomse popular because everyone assumes it's popular.

And by the way, Magikal, most of the stuff you mentioned as "Great," is stuff I file under "Pretentious Crap."

There is a LOT of great music being made today, more than ever before (because of how easy it is to produce and distribute it) You just have to find it, because the Top40 stations aren't going to play it for you.
“We cross our bridges when we come to them and burn them behind us, with nothing to show for our progress except a memory of the smell of smoke, and a presumption that once our eyes watered.”

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Post by robotland » Tue Feb 22, 2005 6:03 am

I had the fortune to be able to run a small, weird record store in Ann Arbor in the early '80s- I could sample anything I was curious about, and discovered some AMAZING things that I would NEVER have paid good money for as well as being very disappointed by things that I expected to be awesome.......I have decided that at least 90% of all music of any genre is CRAP, but that the rest is so good that you could get by on just that for the rest of your life. I've also threatened at various times to stop buying/listening to any "new" music and just "working backwards"....my assertion is that there's enough good stuff that you've either never heard or never heard OF that you'd be fine to the end. A difficult project to implement, though, and good new stuff keeps coming out and screwing me up.
STUFF I DISCOVERED BY ACCIDENT:
The Moving Sidewalks (Billy Gibbons from ZZ Top's first group)
Robyn Hitchcock
E. Power Biggs (organist)
The Lyres
Yard Trauma
Plan 9
The Fuzztones
....and about a thousand others.
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Post by unjonharley » Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:01 am

The music died when the Beattles brought (" beat you to death with thee words ") into this country. Just like English ivy or that damn bird. You can't seem to kill any of them.
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Post by robotland » Tue Feb 22, 2005 8:50 am

Come back, Herman's Hermits! All is forgiven!!
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Post by jimbobby » Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:44 am

A song somehow sneaks into the top 40...
there is no 'somehow'. It's called payola. And this 'Young Man' learned about it in the 'biz' about two decades ago. Songs get on commercial radio via a lagalized system of bribery. This is no secret.
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Post by robotland » Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:11 am

Recommended listening- "Payola Blues" by Neil Young.
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hmm

Post by swampdog » Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:53 am

ok, here comes my screed. There are vast vast amounts of good music out there. I am also an old fart (my first pop concert was Bachmann Turner Overdrive) but I have made a strong effort to keep tuned in to new music as it arrives. Here's the "problem" as I see it. Back in the halcyon 60s (before my time, mostly), there was basically one single massive feed where you might hear Jimi followed by Sugar Sugar. Later in the 60s and into the 70s this started to separate, you had rock stations and pop stations, but the "horrible 70s" that people have often enjoyed bitching about were not all about David Cassidy and the Bay City Rollers. It was the decade that brought us (as you note) Fleetwood Mac (in their pop incarnation, post-Blues, post-Peter Green) and Pink Floyd. It was the decade of Springsteen, Tom Waits' first albums. We had musicians in the mainstream who would have been shuffled off to the "country" ghetto today, like the Eagles, who never would have been able to make Hotel California in today's climate. Can you imagine Joe Walsh signing up with a country band? We "discovered" reggae, we had punk, we had new wave, we had funk, we had disco, funk's bastard child. We had southern rock, the Stones made Exile on Main Street, we had glam, there was progressive, I could go on. As time has progressed, this diversion has just increased. Rock, pop, R&B have blossomed into more genres and subgenres than I could list. The least common denominator is nearly always what sells the best, so it's what is most visible. If your perception of "music of today" is Britney Spears, then you are not even trying. My 11 year old lover of the poppiest pop music knows that Britney is over, was over 2 years ago.

So the "problem" is, 1) that there are too many good choices 2) popular culture is going to feed you the worst of those choices.

My recommendation to you - sign up for an online music service (I use Rhapsody by Real, others I'm sure are as good or better) or if you don't have a place where you can plug into a high speed connection and listen while you work, maybe a satellite radio. Start with what you know and love and branch out from there, try new things.

Some names you might enjoy: Norah Jones, Alicia Keys, Diana Krall, Harry Connick Jr., Santana, Ricky Fante. Bob Marley.

On the pink floyd side, try radiohead - it might be a little dense for you yet, but Kid A makes me feel high even quicker than dark side of the moon.

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Post by Ranger Genius » Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:57 am

Feh. Kid A is just about the worst Radiohead album, second only to Amnesiac. Try OKComputer or (especially) The Bends.
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Post by unjonharley » Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:05 pm

swambog said: a lot<snip>
_
Yes I too like the 7ds. I come a point in when we got to stay up late Sat. nite and listen to radio.
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Post by unjonharley » Tue Feb 22, 2005 12:10 pm

damn_____ from a point in time
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Post by theCryptofishist » Wed Feb 23, 2005 10:42 am

LeChatNoir wrote:
Hmmm You, know... I think they play what the general public thinks it wants to hear. Since they don’t’ know anything else exists, they accept the stuff they hear as the best there is.
My understanding is that they play 15-20 second excerpts of songs over the phone and ask to rate on a scale of 1-6. 1 is love it and 6 is will kill myself running to the radio to change the station when it comes on. (or vice versa) Since "real" music will create a strong reaction either way, they actually play 3s and 4s since people wont bother to turn it off cause it's not toxic enough. Except to me. I can't stand bland inoffensive stuff.

*shiver*
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Post by Magikal » Thu Feb 24, 2005 4:17 am

Great responses, a veritable gold mine of stuff to pursue. Radiohead? OK, I'll check that out. Norah Jones & Santana? Roger that, love 'em. So much to listen to, an embarrassment of riches, mayhap I spoke too soon. The music "biz" has no taste, save for profit, and the tin-eared teeny-bopper (dating myself here) with their allowance money is god.
Ranger Genius wrote:And by the way, Magikal, most of the stuff you mentioned as "Great," is stuff I file under "Pretentious Crap."
Hmm. Well, I confess I don't have a great deal of technical knowledge about music, "I just know what I like". Maybe I like the pretentiousness. Reaching for the sky & all that poobah.
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Post by Ranger Genius » Thu Feb 24, 2005 5:37 am

There's enough diversity out there to fill all tastes. Incidentally, if you really like pretension, I'd suggest you get to know TOOL a little better. Pretentious as all hell. A bit like me. Music has changed, and you're certainly not going to find stuff just like the stuff you used to love. But there's more music now, and not all of it is reliant on major distribution companies for its survival, so there's more good music now. You just have to find it and learn to appreciate it.
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Post by CoworkerLurker » Thu Feb 24, 2005 6:01 am

I recommend the following radio station (commercial-free), if you're looking for good, different, non-pop new music:

www.kexp.org

Try the variety mix shows during the day. Not bad. It's where I go when I need to run away from the pop stuff.

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