Is this enough stake for my Costco carport?

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 12:25 pm

Planning on only 4 guy lines for my carport. Would this 12" stake be sufficient (x4).

vic · Post by **vic** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 12:42 pm

I would recommend longer stakes. How about 2 foot long rebar?

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 1:43 pm

vic wrote:I would recommend longer stakes. How about 2 foot long rebar?

That would be great. Where do I get it and where do I get a hook-eye put in it?

ibdave · Post by **ibdave** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 2:02 pm

Dallas,
Good stake but as I have said b-4..7 years running now I have used 2-3 foot rebar and or form stakes and drive them down about 12" right next to the pole and then duct tape the hell out of them.. Not a problem yet.. Still could happen but so can many other things.. I like my way cuz you have no guy wires to deal with.....................

diane o'thirst · Post by **diane o'thirst** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 2:33 pm

I locked mine down with four 18" rebar kandykanes. This setup survived the winds of the 2001 Burn (Temple Burn Sunday, Monday and Tuesday).

Get 18" 1/2" thick rebar and bend it over into a kandykane. You insert one end into a strong pipe, brace the other end against a stairstep or sidewalk curb and crankcrankcrank it over into a candy cane shape using the pipe as a lever.

Post by **AntiM** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 2:36 pm

That looks like the stakes we use on the bigger tents, art, etc., but we do use rebar for the guys on our carport. Ours have a"T" welded top, courtesy our neighbor, I imagine you could find someone in your area to do cheap welding. We had candy canes, but they bent and rolled when hammered. A closed loop may be better than the T, but our little plastic construction caps do away with the pointy ends.

Rebar is available at most larger hardware stores. They may even cut it to size.

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 3:20 pm

I have some of the best stakes going. Mine are about 1 foot long rebar stakes. They were certainly professionally bent by a very elite crew, they have been tested under severe heat conditions, and I treat these pieces of rebar as special works of art...which they are. The stakes I use were found in a very large pile of ashes and coals that was located directly in the middle of Black Rock City. I've taken 2 each year, usually on Sunday mornings at sunrise where others have done the same.

My stakes helped support the man! If my stakes were good enough to hold the man, then they are good enough for my tent. And the rest of the year they stay quite visible here at home as a reminder of the event itself. DPW made, burn tested, definitely Black Rock City approved.

phil · Post by **phil** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 5:22 pm

Please see Bob Stahl's page at
http://www.geocities.com/potatotrap/tec ... m#building
and read the section on stakes. He recommends at least 2 feet, although playa conditions vary. The issue is that the first foot of so down, the playa is dry and crumbly; it would be similar to driving a stake into gravel. You may have some purchase because of the shape of the stake, but that soil may not hold the stake under vibration from wind. Deeper than a foot or so, the playa gets moist enough to hold a stake. Again, playa conditions vary, and we are told that this is a good year for playa:
http://www.cieux.com/bm/alerts.html
and scroll down to the section on playa conditions.

Louise and I don't have anything on the tops of our rebar like rings or candy canes. We just pound the suckers in and tie off to them, but we're using rope rather than straps. Ridged rebar holds knots way well. Solar lights on top of a plastic tube over the rebar helps keep people off the metal. (Uh, that's ridged, not rigid. Rebar has ridges. :->)

We have a variety of rebar from 18 to 24 inches, and a couple of different diameters. Vice grips help get it all out, with maybe a hammer whack along the way. I've forgotten where we get our rebar; big box hardware stores usually have an assortment. I'll try trash picking the burn site this year, as someon else has suggested.

shitmouse · Post by **shitmouse** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 6:12 pm

hey DP,

here is a link (just in case) for rebar stakes that will insure the securing of your shade structure.

http://store.yahoo.com/deerbusterscom/dee-8032.html

they ship fast.
-b
p.s. edit: didn't read the above post before my post.

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 6:43 pm

Thanks for all the info!

So what's the opinion on using 4 guylines vs. using 8 guylines vs. using 8 stakes duct-taped or otherwise secured to the actual verticals? Because we're a public camp and 8 guylines would screw up our layout, I'd love to not have any guylines. And I really don't want to use duct tape so what's a good alternative to that for the last idea?

Post by **AntiM** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 7:09 pm

Criss-cross some of your guy lines inside the legs of the structure. We haven't tried it yet, but I think unjonharley's idea is brilliant. Of course, you can't put all the guys inside sideways in all the legs or no one could get in or out.

Larry and I are firmly in the 8 guys no exceptions camp. Being ex-sailors, we like rope and splicing and knots and such.

Duct tape is for wussies (kidding! Humor! kidding!).

ibdave · Post by **ibdave** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 8:36 pm

AntiM wrote:

Duct tape is for wussies (kidding! Humor! kidding!).

Hey...........................

Tiahaar · Post by **Tiahaar** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 9:53 pm

ibdave wrote:
AntiM wrote:

Duct tape is for wussies (kidding! Humor! kidding!).
Hey...........................

Heheh, real boys use Gaffers Tape. (but that new clear duct tape is way cool too)

Stakes and lines on my setup: Two at the corners, 18" of 1/2" rebar pounded down to 4", a third also if the hammock is on that corner, and the tarp has 12" of 3/8" rebar every 18". Holds a 20x30 tarp on the upwind side of the vehicle that diverts wind up and over. Overkill for most of the time but there's always that rogue big dust devil or wind gust.

geekster · Post by **geekster** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:50 pm

Dallas, tell me how many you need, there is a place here local that sells some good stakes, I will pick some up for you.

Also, anyone in the SF Bay area that needs bungie balls for their shade cover, South Bay Canopy has them in bulk.

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 1:15 am

geekster wrote:Dallas, tell me how many you need, there is a place here local that sells some good stakes, I will pick some up for you.

Also, anyone in the SF Bay area that needs bungie balls for their shade cover, South Bay Canopy has them in bulk.

I appreciate it, geeks, but I don't want to be having to hunt you down to be able to setup our carport (besides, I still have to do a dress rehearsal HERE). I'll find sumptin soon.

By the way, what's the opinion of auger (screw-in) anchors? Seems the past threads have gone both ways on auger vs. non-auger.

vic · Post by **vic** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 8:09 am

Screw in anchors do a great job. We have used them to hold down large shade structures for the past three years. One big advantage of anchors is that you can screw them in directly below the stucture and run you guy lines straight down. The downsides are cost and the time and the effort it takes to put them in the ground. We used a 36 inch form stake as a lever to help srew them in.
You can get them at farm supply places and we have also been able to get them as a special order from our local chain hardware store. That special order took about 5 days.
If you want to use rebar for a straight vertical pull, try 2 or three bars driven at crossing angles - tie off at the cross. We have had good results with 12 inch nails "spikes" crossed right at the surface. Our camp strong man was unable to pull them out with a straight-up pull. I would still prefer longer pieces of rebar, or better yet form stakes, but I like to over build.

Steven bradford · Post by **Steven bradford** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 2:00 pm

Has any one tried the ranch style steel fence posts usually used for barbed wire or grid wire fences? You know, the type they use for the trash fence? You drive them in with a 2" diameter pipe with an end cap and handles welded to it. Seems they'd be great for staking down a carport, and lashing the poles directly to the posts.

ibdave · Post by **ibdave** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 3:28 pm

[quote="Steven bradford"]Has any one tried the ranch style steel fence posts usually used for barbed wire or grid wire fences? ]

Steven, Yes Our camp use themevery year.. A real bitch to get out tho.. Lots of wiggling back and forth. ect.. Just be carful to not drive them to far down. Not past the fins on the bottom... It's what DPW use on the trash fence..

phil · Post by **phil** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 3:42 pm

By the way, what's the opinion of auger (screw-in) anchors? Seems the past threads have gone both ways on auger vs. non-auger.

I'll chime in in the anti-auger. I brought a set one year and was completely unable to get them started so that I could screw them in. I gave up and went back to rebar. Someone (I think it was Bob Stahl) posted how to get them started, but I've already thrown them out. Also re-read that post in this thread about how to get them screwed in. The kind of auger I'm talking about are shown in a photo on his page at
http://www.geocities.com/potatotrap/tec ... m#building
and see the photo of the auger stakes on the pallette.

safetythird · Post by **safetythird** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:47 pm

ibdave wrote: Steven, Yes Our camp use themevery year.. A real bitch to get out tho.. Lots of wiggling back and forth. ect.. Just be carful to not drive them to far down. Not past the fins on the bottom... It's what DPW use on the trash fence..

I think you are talking about TPosts. If so they make a great puller for it.

http://tinyurl.com/a3luz

Makes removal a whole lot easier. Pulls rebar stakes too.

S3

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 1:51 pm

phil wrote:
By the way, what's the opinion of auger (screw-in) anchors? Seems the past threads have gone both ways on auger vs. non-auger.
I'll chime in in the anti-auger. I brought a set one year and was completely unable to get them started so that I could screw them in. I gave up and went back to rebar. Someone (I think it was Bob Stahl) posted how to get them started, but I've already thrown them out. Also re-read that post in this thread about how to get them screwed in. The kind of auger I'm talking about are shown in a photo on his page at
http://www.geocities.com/potatotrap/tec ... m#building
and see the photo of the auger stakes on the pallette.

Yeah, I can imagine they'd be a bitch to start.

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 3:09 pm

OK, so, how about 24" plastic form stakes tied to each leg with zip ties? I figure I'll try this and if it doesn't hold or is too noisy I can switchover to using the eight 15' ratchet ties I have and the form stakes as guy anchors...

dapete · Post by **dapete** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 6:02 pm

The last 4 years we've used 8 2' rebar kandykanes pounded straight through the holes in the plastic bases of the poles. no guy wires. no problems.

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 7:08 pm

dapete wrote:The last 4 years we've used 8 2' rebar kandykanes pounded straight through the holes in the plastic bases of the poles. no guy wires. no problems.

Thanks. I'm going to bring the carport "foot" piece up to Home Depot tomorrow to see what I can work out.

dapete · Post by **dapete** » Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:04 pm

My campmate pointed out that we don't use kandykanes™ but rather plain old straight rebar. It seems we tried them but they kept to turning into spirals when you pound them in. Maybe it was us but I think you have to use ½" for Kanes™ to hold up. Unfortunately, to fit through the holes in the pole bases you need either 1/4 or 3/8". I can't remember which but whatever it is, it's a tight fit. Drive them in at different angles, cap them and you should be good to go.

Oh, and watch your toes. Even tho they're capped, I stub my toe at least once every year on those damned things. You'd think I'd learn.

HughMungus · Post by **HughMungus** » Wed Aug 17, 2005 3:34 pm

I found some 16" plastic stakes at Home Depot I'm going to try. What's cool about them is that the little hook on the top of the stake fits perfectly into the little hole on the foot of my carport leg. I figure 8 of them will be plenty. If not, I have 4 more for guylines.

phil · Post by **phil** » Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:38 pm

Hey, Dallas, let me make a suggestion: Bring a variety of stakes and try them all over a series of Burns. I've pretty much given up on plastic stakes on the playa because they don't always go in when they get below the dry surface, but this year may be different. I've had plastic stakes suddenly start angling off from where they should be; pulling them out showed the point bent into an arc. If it rains, 16 inches may not hold, no matter what the stake is made of. Or maybe it will.

Try everything, but check all your stakes every day (morning or evening as you see fit) and after every wind event. :-> I use rebar on my tent fly, but regular stakes on my tent under the fly, and I regularly find a tent stake that's loose or popping up on me. The rebar is solid, though.

BM is for experimentation, so go for it all -- but consider having a back up in case something fails.

Is this enough stake for my Costco carport?

Is this enough stake for my Costco carport?

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Re: My story

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