How Do You Feel About Go-Peds / Gas Scooters?

blackrockcitydreams · Post by **blackrockcitydreams** » Sun Sep 11, 2005 7:31 pm

For those of you who have not had the pleasure of meeting unjohn..he had the fabulous red scooter that looked like a ride from coney island. He takes time as I do to pick up trash along the way that others just watch blow by. He under admits the pain he is in to walk or use pedal power. Its a shame that these idiot lookyloo yahoos spoil it for people who need a little help out on the playa..I have been looking forever to find one of those electric carts like you see at the grocery store so mama Rudy can get out and see more too!

DVD · Post by **DVD** » Sun Sep 11, 2005 7:43 pm

blackrockcitydreams wrote:I have been looking forever to find one of those electric carts like you see at the grocery store so mama Rudy can get out and see more too!

I saw two fantastic vehicles made from chopped elelctric wheelcharis and those plastic turtles that double as a children's sandbox. This guy had setup two of these things with saddles and one had ATV sized knobby inflatable tires. Joystic steering from the knob of the saddle.

Amazing.

I thought that elelctric wheel chairs might be easir to find than a used Rascal(which is what I think you are looking for).

mickle · Post by **mickle** » Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:44 pm

After 6 BM's of riding a recumbent bicycle, this year I brought
an electric skateboard. I had a ton of fun riding it around,
and a number of people thanked me for not having a gas engine.
It had front and rear lighting for night time use. I felt a bit
"closer" to pedestrians than when on a bike.

As it is pretty darn flat, there is really no way to turn it into
an "art" car. The best you can do is dress up in a costume
and be the art yourself. I would not want to see a future rule
exclude these vehicles.

DVD · Post by **DVD** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 4:31 pm

mickle wrote:After 6 BM's of riding a recumbent bicycle, this year I brought an electric skateboard.

Where did you find that? I loved the gas ones but electric sounds way cooler. How is the torque? Can you spin the wheels

Playadancer · Post by **Playadancer** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 4:43 pm

First time burner and I didn't expect scooters at a human power only event, I didn't expect any vehicles, the bus's are cool and the moving sofa & furniture are great

BUT

The scooters have to go, I almost got hit three times, Please we are not talking more rules.... its sticking to the original rule.

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 5:50 pm

Playadancer wrote:The scooters have to go, I almost got hit three times, Please we are not talking more rules.... its sticking to the original rule.

http://www.burningman.com/on_the_playa/ ... iving.html

......Vehicles Allowed to Drive in Black Rock City
All motorized vehicles must remain parked and stationary for the duration of the Burning Man event, with the following exceptions:

Agency vehicles (Pershing Co. Sheriffs, BLM, WCSO, etc.)
BRC staff vehicles (DPW, theme camp placement, etc.)
Licensed Mutant Vehicles
Vehicles for any disabled individual
Emergency services vehicles
Wind-powered vehicles that meet certain criteria
Go-peds (stand-up, one-person scooters)
Vehicles entering Black Rock City and on their way to camp, including motorcycles that are a participant’s means of transportation to the event.....

Notice what I highlighted in red. Stand up Go Peds are legal. If it has a seat it simply shouldn't be out there. And while I didn't post it there are some clear operating rules already in place. So instead of advocating new rules let's use what we have and use something else. An open mouth to tell the offenders to slow down and follow the rules. And if you sit down on a scooter with a seat and don't have a handicap or DMV sticker, park the thing.

KnowMatterWhat · Post by **KnowMatterWhat** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 8:46 pm

Kinetic IV wrote:So instead of advocating new rules let's use what we have and use something else. An open mouth to tell the offenders to slow down and follow the rules.

K4 ~ That sounds simple but it doesn't work. It's the yahoos who have no desire to be considerate who are abusing the scooters. When a citizen asks them to slow down, if they acknowledge the request at all, they smirk and wave back with the one finger salute ...

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 8:52 pm

I'm bringing my scooter next year, fully muffled, both intake and exhaust...this year I could only get the exhaust side muffled. I also plan to bring a bullhorn and have some fun with the re-education of the scooter folks. Yeah, it might fall short but it's easy enough to do to make it worth a shot.

I could also see a re-emphasis on the stand up vs. sit down rule put in the survival gude for next year too. It wasn't in this year's guide. I don't know how to go about petitioning for additions to the guide but I'll be finding out soon enough.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:02 pm

Now mind you, I not encouraging any thing here.

.
Some years ago while on vacation with the family. At a days end we were foced to camp in a small town park. The next camp site was miles away. So there were maybe a hundred campers with us. Guess this happened every night in this small town. About nine o'clock the mayors kid started riding around and around the park on the city streets. It was a mo-ped and very loud in the night. I saw this guy with a large stick. I said to another camper. What's he doing with that....CuRCUCH Oh. and I went to bed. And slept very peacefuly.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:15 pm

Kinetic IV wrote:I'm bringing my scooter next year, fully muffled, both intake and exhaust...this year I could only get the exhaust side muffled. I also plan to bring a bullhorn and have some fun with the re-education of the scooter folks. Yeah, it might fall short but it's easy enough to do to make it worth a shot.

I could also see a re-emphasis on the stand up vs. sit down rule put in the survival gude for next year too. It wasn't in this year's guide. I don't know how to go about petitioning for additions to the guide but I'll be finding out soon enough.

~
I just today installed a large PA speaker under the platform of the three wheeled bike. An old CB for a amp. I was just going to use it for peaceful things. Like stating my objections to drivers trying to kill me. ( In Salem bike riders are targets ) And on the playa to get another cup of tea. I could find time to speak to unrulely scooter folks. Like" come back here you little son-of-a-bitch".

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 7:02 am

I'm tired of bitching about problems so I've moved from just bitching to figuring out what I can do about them....even if it's incremental things. I have a 10% discount off anything at Radio Sluts...I'm going down there and see what kind of megaphones they have and buy one. I wished I had one to counter Fred Phelps and his merry band of ignorant followers in the past, and talking to Robbidobbs about potty ettiquette and not using wetwipes just about sealed the decision. The scooter issue pushed it over the top. Get the damn thing and go out there and try to address the problems. Yeah, it may not accomplish much but nobody can say I didn't do something except bitch.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:11 am

HF have bull horns for cheap. Forgot to pack ours this year. But the extra large coffee filter worked out very well. Rigging your ride is another way.

Lassen Forge · Post by **Lassen Forge** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:47 am

Or build an art car. Ain't that hard, and there's only, what, 350 days until the next burn or thereabouts??

Already got one on the board. Hopefully to be started by new years.

BB

Janka · Post by **Janka** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:25 am

My 2 cents: if it is not man-powered, it should be decorated. And 2 ribbons trailing a golf cart or a couple of light-sticks on a scooter do not count as decoration enough to make your bloody motorized vehicle an art car, thank you very much. If you are not willing to put the effort into your motorized bike, car, or whatever, use a damn bike or walk like everyone else. Also, the 5 mph / raise-no-dust speed limits applies to you too.

People with actual disabilities are excused - though most of them did have decorated carts and wheelchairs anyway.

Lassen Forge · Post by **Lassen Forge** » Tue Sep 13, 2005 2:22 pm

Cheers to you, Janka... I saw a lot of those gopeds out there, very few were either decorated or operated at the citywide speed limit of 5 MPH.

I never knew they were exempt from those rules...

bb

Kinetic IV · Post by **Kinetic IV** » Tue Aug 15, 2006 2:03 pm

Consider this a reminder post: This year's Survival guide says that one of the changes involving motorized scooters for 2006 is they MUST BE ILLUMINATED AT NIGHT. This includes a headlamp on the front (the driver can be wearing a headlamp instead of attaching it to the scooter) and a taillight on the rear. Law Enforcement can write tickets for failure to comply....

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Tue Aug 15, 2006 4:24 pm

Kinetic IV wrote:Consider this a reminder post: This year's Survival guide says that one of the changes involving motorized scooters for 2006 is they MUST BE ILLUMINATED AT NIGHT. This includes a headlamp on the front (the driver can be wearing a headlamp instead of attaching it to the scooter) and a taillight on the rear. Law Enforcement can write tickets for failure to comply....

/
It may be a suprise to you. BUt the law can ticket bikes for the same reason. And theey should.

ibdave · Post by **ibdave** » Tue Aug 15, 2006 6:18 pm

I like it when the loud and driven to fast go by and hit the Piano wire that someone stings across the road.....

MrMullen · Post by **MrMullen** » Tue Aug 15, 2006 8:38 pm

I have to admit, I would totally get a gas power scooter if I was not a nice guy. I have to admit, when I am humping my ass home at night, seeing a guy fly by on a gas scooter makes me jealous as hell.

Although, I might invest in a eletric one first.

skygod · Post by **skygod** » Wed Aug 16, 2006 8:53 am

KnowMatterWhat wrote:often without regard for others.

People who have no regard for others can be annoying no matter how they get about.

DJKultleader · Post by **DJKultleader** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:51 am

I am bringing a scooter this year.... With so many dissenting voices I just want to say that I promise to be a good citizen, obey the speed rule and be obnoxious with my megaphone, not with my transport.... (I have a great muffler)... But I have a Seat.... The No seat rule is dumb and irresponsible because the scooter is harder to control when standing and thereby creates a safety hazard... I also have a bum knee and so does my wife....
I believe and of course I am biased, that if you turn your scooter into a work of art

[quote]
Sound control devices for gas powered scooters
- Enforcement of the no seat, stand up rule. The idea behind this if I recall correctly, a person on a stand up scooter won't tend to travel as fast, decreasing the amount of kinetic energy displaced in an accident.
- Night time lighting. Do you have a workable solution for lighting the bike up at night?
- Artistic merit. Have you made any kind of effort to decorate the scooter?[/b][/quote]

Post by **AntiM** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 3:20 am

I posted a reply in the introduce yourself section but here's the new info from the survival guide:

Scooters and Go-Peds

Small motorized scooters (two-wheeled, lightweight, standup, off-street type), and go-peds are allowed in Black Rock City, but they are subject to the same rules as any other motorized vehicles - drive 5 MPH and have front and rear lights at night. BLM Rangers will issue citations for non-compliance.

Large, seated, street-legal "Vespa" type scooters, like motorcycles, are not allowed to drive in our pedestrian and bicycle city.

If you have a state handicapped plaque you can get a handicapped sticker from the DMV. I have a bum back and hips but not a handicapped thingy. we ride a four wheeled bike instead.

Archantael · Post by **Archantael** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 6:17 am

The BM ORG policy on not allowing seats on Go-Peds is arbitrary and capricious. But it's definitely too late to do anything about it prior to the event this year...so yep, you're stuck standing up. It sucks.

That being said post event make sure to take advantage of the ORG's request for feedback and give them some on why this is wrong. Some disabled people don't like having to make a Broadway production out of it to get reasonable accomodations and take care of their basic transport needs. If the rules were to allow sit down, 25cc or smaller scooters IMHO it would appease quite a few people who silently grumble about this.

I also admit that when it comes to scooters I have a second angle to push. Art Cars as they are currently defined have become expensive to build and operate in BRC and I feel that cost is keeping some creative and innovative ideas from making it onto the playa. What I'd like to see is the rules modified to let people build small, sit down art vehicles that are limited to 5 mph, that are illuminated for night use, and that have to be radically altered. But they could have a choice of powerplant ranging from a small 25cc or smaller gas engine, or maybe an electric motor that is powered by a battery cart / solar panel type setup either on the vehicle or towed behind it. In short, think mini-art car. No golf carts either...those are too big. Think steel tube frames. Scooter frames or bicycle frames that are the source and modified from there as a starting point.

I don't know how this idea is going to be accepted but everything at BM seems to be focused on bigger, badder, better, and of course the mo' money, mo' money, we need mo' money mindset. I'd like to see another avenue for participation on a smaller scale opened up...something that offers the builder a chance at high visibility and challenges their creativity...and can be done for a relatively low cost. The idea might encourage reuse of bicycle frames and get people to pick up a welder and learn a new skill. It could cause people to seek out and find sources for more efficient solar panels that are vibration tolerant...on and on it goes.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 6:42 am

couple of years ago, every one that could get ant millys disable tag was on the playa.. there were 8000$ atv with disabled on them.. the DMV had to eat it that year.. now they ask to match you drives lic with the tag.. i have an od looking electric wheel chair.. it has no seat.. some stores question me.. Or. DMV sticker is the ansewer.. even with that the gate made me unload grampas little motor trike one year.. it s getting better each year.. this year i have a trike, a bike and electric (ZAP) scooter.. grandfather has a bike and a zap scooter.. yes he is 87, all crippled up and rides a bike..

Archantael · Post by **Archantael** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 6:59 am

Unjun, have you made any changes or modifications to that Zappy scooter you mentioned? I have one and the batteries have maybe 20 minutes of runtime in them if I'm lucky. I'd like to find a way to run it off a marine battery or do something to increase the runtime without making it weigh 300 lbs in the process.

MikeVDS · Post by **MikeVDS** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:16 am

This gives me an idea. Large dust cannons mounted on the side of roads. The purpose of these is to blast those who are kicking up a bunch of dust.

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:26 am

Archantael wrote:Unjun, have you made any changes or modifications to that Zappy scooter you mentioned? I have one and the batteries have maybe 20 minutes of runtime in them if I'm lucky. I'd like to find a way to run it off a marine battery or do something to increase the runtime without making it weigh 300 lbs in the process.

\/
i don t know, my machine is a 07.. it runs out at 15or so and about 22 mile per charge..the power drop starts about 12 miles into the charge.. is yours a Zap pro w/two sets of batteries?.. i have added a stud to put a seat post on and considered a litte trailer..
the trailer idea at first waas for a seat and bigger batteries.. now tho i want to frame a stack of 36v packs over the top of the battery cover..

for a trailer i used hard plastic wheelbarrow. changed the wheels and now looking anohter matching wheelbarrow for a cover..

planing to put the batteries, wires and controller in a suitable dry container that will fit under the little hood.. Also i have a form to build a chariot style cab (of lite plastic) for rainy weather..

can you tell i love my little machine?? I run all over the city wth it.. beats the hellout of 3$ a gallon or the city busses.. speaking of.. disable with scooter ride free on busses..

the Zap will be with me on the playa.. it s going to be a bitch to clean after..

gyre · Post by **gyre** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:28 pm

There are indeed small art cars.
I am not aware of any drivetrain restrictions.

katherineburdekin · Post by **katherineburdekin** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:34 pm

hi yall. im a first time burner so i really dont want to be pissing people off but my bike was just stolen with the lock and i have a electric zappy scooter sitting in my moms garage that i was thinking about bringing. what do people think?

unjonharley · Post by **unjonharley** » Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:45 pm

katherineburdekin wrote:hi yall. im a first time burner so i really dont want to be pissing people off but my bike was just stolen with the lock and i have a electric zappy scooter sitting in my moms garage that i was thinking about bringing. what do people think?

\/
they don t like sit down type.. takes 6 hours to charge a zappy.. have you planed on that.. i d bring it.. i have one i use as a disablled scooter..

How Do You Feel About Go-Peds / Gas Scooters?

scooter yes scooter no

Re: scooter yes scooter no

electric skateboard

Re: electric skateboard

Say No To Scooters

Re: Say No To Scooters

Re: Say No To Scooters

Re: How Do You Feel About Go-Peds / Gas Scooters?

Sit or Stand...

electric scooters

Re: electric scooters